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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter jpeace121
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charvik
Footballguy
Uber Football Fact @UberFootFact 3h
ON THIS DAY, exactly 3 years ago, Manchester United beat Arsenal 8-2 with this team.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwHgRXwIIAA1koW.jpg
ON THIS DAY, exactly 3 years ago, Manchester United beat Arsenal 8-2 with this team.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwHgRXwIIAA1koW.jpg
The Gator
Footballguy
The Gator
Footballguy
Not nearly close imo, but I barely play FIFA manager mode anymore. Sebowski will know more on FIFA manager mode
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charvik
Footballguy
I don't think 'Pool will win the CL, and the 20-1 odds are ridiculous (40-1 or 50-1 would be more accurate), but not surprising given peoples willingness to throw away money in the off chance of having a winning ticket in tournament play. For me, this season is all about getting the CL $$$ and the exposure of CL football to attract marquee signing(s) for the next transfer window, while reestablishing the club in Europe.
There's lengthy discussion elsewhere breaking down the financials and a CL knockout round place, even if you go out in the first round, is worth more money than winning the Europa League.
There's lengthy discussion elsewhere breaking down the financials and a CL knockout round place, even if you go out in the first round, is worth more money than winning the Europa League.
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
It's not nearly as deep, but it's probably deep enough for someone who's just learning the game. In some ways, a neophyte might like it better. The difference is that tactical changes, although still important, are somewhat blunted when you're making every pass.
charvik
Footballguy
Don't forget Andros Townsend...soon to be with Southampton, fine young international player that he is...
Bonzai
Footballguy
lol @kingkenny_7
Liverpool boards must be hoppin' lately with all the spillover we're getting here.
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
I'd be very happy this year if they get out of the group stage of the CL, finish 4th in the league and make a deep FA Cup run. Basically just consolidate last year's step forward and figure out which of the new signings are CL-class players.
Feels far from a sure thing though.
shader
Footballguy
I'm reading as much Mario Balotelli propaganda as possible, so I've convinced myself he's about to become the world's premier striker and lead Pool to a Championship.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Ignoring all Torres noise until I see a picture of him in Milan holding the shirt. Even then, I'll probably be skeptical for a few days.Torres to Milan on a two year deal? Agent talking "severance" package with Chelsea to get him off the books? All transfer betting now cancelled?
Is this really happening? Our long national nightmare might finally come to an end?
Native
Footballguy
Its like an accident scene - cant look away.Ignoring all Torres noise until I see a picture of him in Milan holding the shirt. Even then, I'll probably be skeptical for a few days.Torres to Milan on a two year deal? Agent talking "severance" package with Chelsea to get him off the books? All transfer betting now cancelled?
Is this really happening? Our long national nightmare might finally come to an end?
If Costa is really injured we may have to keep Torres which is like a double punch in the gut.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
I don't think it's that outlandish (fwiw bodog has them at 25-1). Unless they draw PSG from Pot 2 they'll be favored to advance with a 50/50 shot of being the favorite to qualify as #1 (based on odds they'd be favored over Athletic, Porto, Benefica). If they do in fact win the group, they'd get a #2 who'd they'd presumably be favored over. It would only be when they'd reach the final 8 that they'd face someone seemingly better than them. Granted that would probably be one of Bayern, RM, Barca, or PSG, but at that point you take your chances.
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charvik
Footballguy
Yeah, this is where I am at as well. I think those are the minimum expectations on the team from management too.
This is a long project IMO. We can't compete with the rich(er) clubs on financials anymore, and getting back to the top echelon is not a quick fix. After H&G almost left us in ruins, we had to start over, and it's only been 4 years. Since that coincided with Hodgson (*shudder*), it made the situation extra dire, and at least we are on the right path IMO. Pretty crazy that we were in danger of going bankrupt, to this, with 100+m signings in a window, books back in black, and finally plans in progress for expanding Anfield. Last season was clearly well over expectations, but the manager and management has a good plan in place IMO.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
This will all come good imo. Its going to be a fun ending to the transfer window with Arsenal and Chelsea both looking for a CF.Its like an accident scene - cant look away.Ignoring all Torres noise until I see a picture of him in Milan holding the shirt. Even then, I'll probably be skeptical for a few days.Torres to Milan on a two year deal? Agent talking "severance" package with Chelsea to get him off the books? All transfer betting now cancelled?
Is this really happening? Our long national nightmare might finally come to an end?
If Costa is really injured we may have to keep Torres which is like a double punch in the gut.
Imagine how Lukaku feels. He forced his way out last year because he didn't want to compete with Eto'o or Ba. Now he's in Everton with Eto'o, and Chelsea are desperate for a striker.
Bonzai
Footballguy
There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
The Gator
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I was just looking at some MLS attendance data and some of it is staggering the improvement in the details.
In 2005, 30% of the games played in front of a crowd under 10k. 15% were played in front of a crowd over 20k
In 2014, 6% of the game are played in front of a crowd under 10k. 40% are played in front of a crowd of over 20k
And the 6% under 10k in 2014 is almost entirely due to the Chivas USA mess.
MLS is on pace to have both its best average and best median attendance ever.
In 2005, 30% of the games played in front of a crowd under 10k. 15% were played in front of a crowd over 20k
In 2014, 6% of the game are played in front of a crowd under 10k. 40% are played in front of a crowd of over 20k
And the 6% under 10k in 2014 is almost entirely due to the Chivas USA mess.
MLS is on pace to have both its best average and best median attendance ever.
charvik
Footballguy
I agree with this. I don't think SAF is to blame for the current issues. Maybe you can criticize him for the state of the youth system, but even that is dubious, since it's really hard to predict how youngsters develop. How many of the hundreds of players at La Masia have turned out to be stars? If it was that "easy" Barca wouldn't have had to spend 75m on bringing in Suarez, or RM wouldn't have had to spend hundreds of millions the last 5 years.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
I think one of SAFs obvious strengths was on the tactical side, and how to make the most out of what was given him. He also had the benefit of many many years of instilling his way of playing in the team. For anyone to come in afterwards and try to change things, it is going to take time.
ETA: I do not agree on Woodward though. I think he is a major issue for United, along with the current ownership group.
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Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
It's a boring cliche, but the answer has to be in the middle. Yes, he won the league. In part because of performances from Vidic, and Ferdinand in the back (with Evans as a capable third choice CB which appears to be his big club ceiling). SAF bought a next wave of CBs. He picked Jones and Smalling and he has to share some blame for the fact that neither appear to be good enough to start at CB for any other team in the top 4.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
On the other side of the coin, Carrick played great for SAF (of course, Carrick is always going to be an injury risk). Cleverly seemed adequate under Ferguson as well. So even though everyone said that United had a giant hole in CM under Ferguson, maybe we can see why he felt he had cover there.
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
Do you happen to have these by year? If not, no worries -- just thought it was a good way to look at it and was curious. Would be interesting to see it ex-Chivas too.
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Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Important update: Jay wears a red Umbro Three Lions shirt throughout most of The Inbetweeners 2.
charvik
Footballguy
Champions League preview
This is obviously very Liverpool centric, but it's a good introduction to the teams for somebody new to European football IMO.
This is obviously very Liverpool centric, but it's a good introduction to the teams for somebody new to European football IMO.
Bonzai
Footballguy
Yeah, the bolded was a huge part of his success imo.I agree with this. I don't think SAF is to blame for the current issues. Maybe you can criticize him for the state of the youth system, but even that is dubious, since it's really hard to predict how youngsters develop. How many of the hundreds of players at La Masia have turned out to be stars? If it was that "easy" Barca wouldn't have had to spend 75m on bringing in Suarez, or RM wouldn't have had to spend hundreds of millions the last 5 years.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
I think one of SAFs obvious strengths was on the tactical side, and how to make the most out of what was given him. He also had the benefit of many many years of instilling his way of playing in the team. For anyone to come in afterwards and try to change things, it is going to take time.
ETA: I do not agree on Woodward though. I think he is a major issue for United, along with the current ownership group.
As far as Woodward goes, he was able to get one of the greatest players in the world without the promise of CL football. That's got to count for something. Let's see what he can do in the next few days...
Sammy3469
Footballguy
SAF was also trotting Giggs and Scholes at the end there as well. I don't know who was responsible for transfers in that 2007-13 timeframe, but whoever it was has to shoulder most of the blame. They basically went the entire time without a meaningful signing for the club. They tried to cheap out and buy mid tier talent hoping to hit and it never did.It's a boring cliche, but the answer has to be in the middle. Yes, he won the league. In part because of performances from Vidic, and Ferdinand in the back (with Evans as a capable third choice CB which appears to be his big club ceiling). SAF bought a next wave of CBs. He picked Jones and Smalling and he has to share some blame for the fact that neither appear to be good enough to start at CB for any other team in the top 4.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
On the other side of the coin, Carrick played great for SAF (of course, Carrick is always going to be an injury risk). Cleverly seemed adequate under Ferguson as well. So even though everyone said that United had a giant hole in CM under Ferguson, maybe we can see why he felt he had cover there.
shader
Footballguy
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
SAF's method was to overpay in the middle of the market, IMO. Which worked pretty well when City and even Chelsea were still coming to terms with how to use their money correctly. But City in particular doesn't really miss all that often anymore. Even players who don't really make it with them (like, say, Milner) don't necessarily play badly. The competition is just super steep. Once City and Chelsea started hitting much more often than missing, United (and Arsenal) lost the luxury of just "buying smart." To compete in the BPL, you have to shop in the luxury stores a bit.SAF was also trotting Giggs and Scholes at the end there as well. I don't know who was responsible for transfers in that 2007-13 timeframe, but whoever it was has to shoulder most of the blame. They basically went the entire time without a meaningful signing for the club. They tried to cheap out and buy mid tier talent hoping to hit and it never did.It's a boring cliche, but the answer has to be in the middle. Yes, he won the league. In part because of performances from Vidic, and Ferdinand in the back (with Evans as a capable third choice CB which appears to be his big club ceiling). SAF bought a next wave of CBs. He picked Jones and Smalling and he has to share some blame for the fact that neither appear to be good enough to start at CB for any other team in the top 4.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
On the other side of the coin, Carrick played great for SAF (of course, Carrick is always going to be an injury risk). Cleverly seemed adequate under Ferguson as well. So even though everyone said that United had a giant hole in CM under Ferguson, maybe we can see why he felt he had cover there.
Bonzai
Footballguy
They won the Champions League and 5 league titles during that time.SAF was also trotting Giggs and Scholes at the end there as well. I don't know who was responsible for transfers in that 2007-13 timeframe, but whoever it was has to shoulder most of the blame. They basically went the entire time without a meaningful signing for the club. They tried to cheap out and buy mid tier talent hoping to hit and it never did.It's a boring cliche, but the answer has to be in the middle. Yes, he won the league. In part because of performances from Vidic, and Ferdinand in the back (with Evans as a capable third choice CB which appears to be his big club ceiling). SAF bought a next wave of CBs. He picked Jones and Smalling and he has to share some blame for the fact that neither appear to be good enough to start at CB for any other team in the top 4.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
On the other side of the coin, Carrick played great for SAF (of course, Carrick is always going to be an injury risk). Cleverly seemed adequate under Ferguson as well. So even though everyone said that United had a giant hole in CM under Ferguson, maybe we can see why he felt he had cover there.
El Floppo
Footballguy
great stuff, andy- thanks for sharing that.
given a couple of teams' high attendance, it's easy to think that they skew the numbers in MLS's favor. The numbers you just posted show the reality far better, IMO. For me, it's those games under 10k that are the best part of this improvement.
El Floppo
Footballguy
stillSlappy, if it makes you feel better I LOVE the Rayo Vallecano stadium #wall. Watching the Vallecano/Atletico game now...
Eta, the bird on field for the pregame...
over "Slappy".
The Gator
Footballguy
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
No shame in throwing Scholes and Giggs out there for much of that 2007-13 period. At least until 2011 or so. When people say that United didn't find a replacement for Scholes (or that Arsenal never found a replacement for Viera) I always wonder why people think those players grow on trees. I like Rakitic a lot, but I suspect we'll hear more than a few times in the coming years that Barca "never found a replacement for Xavi." I think that says more about Xavi than about Barca.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I'd settle for a USL Pro team in Milwaukee. Other than my son's U10 team, I've got to make do with high school and Marquette games for a live fix.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Yeah, average attendance is likely the most meaningless stat to see how the league is doing as a whole.
The median attendance is the one to focus on since it helps remove the outliers of Seattle and Chivas.
The under 10k number might go to almost 0% if they sell Chivas and when SJ's new stadium opens next year.
charvik
Footballguy
ADM? The same guy that was forced out of RM? For 59.7m pound?Yeah, the bolded was a huge part of his success imo.I agree with this. I don't think SAF is to blame for the current issues. Maybe you can criticize him for the state of the youth system, but even that is dubious, since it's really hard to predict how youngsters develop. How many of the hundreds of players at La Masia have turned out to be stars? If it was that "easy" Barca wouldn't have had to spend 75m on bringing in Suarez, or RM wouldn't have had to spend hundreds of millions the last 5 years.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
I think one of SAFs obvious strengths was on the tactical side, and how to make the most out of what was given him. He also had the benefit of many many years of instilling his way of playing in the team. For anyone to come in afterwards and try to change things, it is going to take time.
ETA: I do not agree on Woodward though. I think he is a major issue for United, along with the current ownership group.
As far as Woodward goes, he was able to get one of the greatest players in the world without the promise of CL football. That's got to count for something. Let's see what he can do in the next few days...
Bonzai
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
That might be a long time. I never see them listed as an expansion site.
All the talk revolves around Sacramento, Las Vegas, San Antonio and Minnesota right now.
Miami is still up in the air because Becks is having problems getting a stadium deal done. If that falls through, it should open up a slot for some other city.
The best scenario for a city like Memphis is to get a USL Pro team and just really kill it off the field and make the case to move up. That is how Seattle, Orlando, Portland and Montreal all got into MLS.
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
I love how Monaco is offering Falcao on loan for the low, low price of 20 million euros. Doesn't hurt to ask, I guess.
The Gator
Footballguy
Yeah, the bolded was a huge part of his success imo.I agree with this. I don't think SAF is to blame for the current issues. Maybe you can criticize him for the state of the youth system, but even that is dubious, since it's really hard to predict how youngsters develop. How many of the hundreds of players at La Masia have turned out to be stars? If it was that "easy" Barca wouldn't have had to spend 75m on bringing in Suarez, or RM wouldn't have had to spend hundreds of millions the last 5 years. I think one of SAFs obvious strengths was on the tactical side, and how to make the most out of what was given him. He also had the benefit of many many years of instilling his way of playing in the team. For anyone to come in afterwards and try to change things, it is going to take time.There's a back and forth going on in the United related parts of the interweb about whether or not SAF is to blame for the current dip. Some saying that SAF didn't leave the team prepared. I think it's silly; the guy won the league his last year. He had "his guys" that played well for him, he can't help it if another coach can't get the same out of them. The team we point and giggle at now beat Arsenal 8-2 under him. How could he not think that the team was set?
Bottom line, I just don't see how it was possible to see any of this coming. Either way, it's clear that the traditional way of doing things is out the window and they need an overhaul. Woodward finally seems to be getting the hang of things, so hopefully they're well on their way.
ETA: I do not agree on Woodward though. I think he is a major issue for United, along with the current ownership group.
As far as Woodward goes, he was able to get one of the greatest players in the world
United paid over the odds despite being the only team bidding, he's on huge wages to help make the move.
Literally the only reason he's at United is because nobody else in the CL wanted to pay for him.
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