P.S.A. For Your Job - Air Conditioner Information (1 Viewer)

[Van Dyman]

The roofing video guy's theory does make some sense. With the vents at the top of the house the hot air build up should lesson in the attic space above.

And really, that's the only thing that has changed, since the roof composition itself sounds like about the same.

If the AC tech found that the system is operating normally than to me that explanation makes sense.

@ChiefD

Ok...I'm getting pretty worried. Inside humidity has been 70-75% all day. AC guy only checked the upstairs (split) unit since the humidity was noticed upstairs. Now I'm thinking the main downstairs unit might be the issue.

I have a a cheapo hygrometer but it seems fairly accurate (within a few percent of the fancy one the AC guy had). I put the hygrometer on two of the downstairs registers both show 80%. I'm not sure if that's a good/bad way to check it but seemed worth a shot. What could this be? The downstairs unit is keeping the temp we selected on the thermostat. I know nothing about these things and am about to go into the crawlspace to see if the return duct looks ok (not that I know what to look for).

Any ideas?

FWIW the roofers covered the AC units with plastic tarp and the indoor temp reached 95 before I turned off the AC and got them to uncover the units. I don't know if running the units under those conditions could have damaged them, or if the roofers could have done something (falling debris, accidentally kicked a copper tube, etc.). Roofing company's response was "no roofing components on any roofing system affect indoor humidity".

Were the units running while covered?

Humidity that high is very bad if it stays that way for more than a day or two. If it stays like that for a week you’re going to have mold everywhere.

Yeah. They didn't warn me they were going to cover them so I had no reason to turn them off until it got so hot I complained and they said to turn them off. I'm kinda freaking out at this point.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

The roofing video guy's theory does make some sense. With the vents at the top of the house the hot air build up should lesson in the attic space above.

And really, that's the only thing that has changed, since the roof composition itself sounds like about the same.

If the AC tech found that the system is operating normally than to me that explanation makes sense.

@ChiefD

Ok...I'm getting pretty worried. Inside humidity has been 70-75% all day. AC guy only checked the upstairs (split) unit since the humidity was noticed upstairs. Now I'm thinking the main downstairs unit might be the issue.

I have a a cheapo hygrometer but it seems fairly accurate (within a few percent of the fancy one the AC guy had). I put the hygrometer on two of the downstairs registers both show 80%. I'm not sure if that's a good/bad way to check it but seemed worth a shot. What could this be? The downstairs unit is keeping the temp we selected on the thermostat. I know nothing about these things and am about to go into the crawlspace to see if the return duct looks ok (not that I know what to look for).

Any ideas?

FWIW the roofers covered the AC units with plastic tarp and the indoor temp reached 95 before I turned off the AC and got them to uncover the units. I don't know if running the units under those conditions could have damaged them, or if the roofers could have done something (falling debris, accidentally kicked a copper tube, etc.). Roofing company's response was "no roofing components on any roofing system affect indoor humidity".

Were the units running while covered?

Humidity that high is very bad if it stays that way for more than a day or two. If it stays like that for a week you’re going to have mold everywhere.

Yeah. They didn't warn me they were going to cover them so I had no reason to turn them off until it got so hot I complained and they said to turn them off. I'm kinda freaking out at this point.

They shouldn’t be covering your stuff without talking to you first. This is one of those details that get lost between the sales/office and the crew.

What’s the humidity outside? If it’s less than inside, open the windows. This is called burping the house. (Works a lot better in the winter with cooler/dryer temps/humidity)

Turn some fans on in the humid areas.

Not sure you want the air on at all right now.

Do the outside fans turn on when the inside thermostat is on cool?

 

[ChiefD]

Are your thermostats meeting their set temps?

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

I’d consider turning the unit off cool mode and set to fan mode on.

This will prevent the excessive humidity and allow the airflow to dry out the ducts

 

[ChiefD]

A lot to unpack here.

So, them covering your AC's and the AC's still running is bad. Now, if the systems start to overheat or something like that the air conditioner usually has limit switches that trigger so the compressor will turn off and save the compressor.

So it's possible that your limit tripped at some point, but now that you are a few weeks away from the install you would know if your air conditioner just wasn't working. So you would have had a repairman out by now.

As far as the humidity is concerned, your air conditioner is obviously a dehumidifier. What temp are you setting your thermostats? You may want to consider going down a couple of degrees on each one for a day or two to draw out that extra humidity.

I would also check, as stupid as this sounds, and make sure all windows are shut in the house. Maybe someone opened one and simply forgot to close it. Check all of them.

In the meantime, check your filters. Check your condensers outside and see if they are dirty. Filthy condensers and filters are a culprit for systems not running efficiently.

And finally, call your AC tech and have them come out and check both systems.

 

[Van Dyman]

Thanks @STEADYMOBBIN 22 and ChiefD. The condensers probably are dirty. A ton of crap rained down during the roof replacement. I'm not sure which part is the condensers but can google that. I had replaced filters already...first thing I did, and checked drains to make sure both were draining properly.

I figured out the hygrometer had lost it's ever-loving mind, probably because I placed it directly on a floor vent. It was reading 20% higher than two others, so actual humidity wasn't as high as I thought. Noticeably higher than before, but below 60%. I lowered the temp settings on both units and humidity is now staying below 55% so we're ok, though I will get that main downstairs unit checked. Thanks again, guys.

 

[matttyl]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

 

[ChiefD]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

 

[matttyl]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

Thanks, and I was afraid of that. With a heat pump, you can replace just the outside unit, assuming the air handler is working fine, correct?

I was expecting/planing on replacing both units while the tax credits are available. May have to do the first one shortly.

 

[ChiefD]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

Thanks, and I was afraid of that. With a heat pump, you can replace just the outside unit, assuming the air handler is working fine, correct?

I was expecting/planing on replacing both units while the tax credits are available. May have to do the first one shortly.

Depends. If you have the R410a refrigerant you can just replace the outdoor unit.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

@ChiefD

We had a "Nest" for a little while and I hated it for a lot of reasons but most of all it felt like I wasn't in control of my AC Unit. And those Nest reports....so I went MoP on that little Nest one day and now we have a plain old Emerson type, just set the thermostat for 74, I'm down in South Florida, air runs all the time.

We have a local AC repair man, also works on most kitchen appliances, he installed our dishwasher, kinda helped me pick out a very basic old school Maytag Fridge with the freezer on the top, no ice machine, virtually nothing that can break on this thing but its basic and not for everyone. I've had him clean our AC coils once, that was a disgusting job. Whenever the AC Unit decides to give way, almost 100% sure I'm hiring him to install a new one, mostly because I trust him.

We try and change the filter about once a month, but nobody's perfect

 

[FatMax]

We try and change the filter about once a month, but nobody's perfect

Pretty sure that's a bit of overkill. Assuming of course that you don't live in a dirt floor pueblo with sixteen kids.

 

[matttyl]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

Thanks, and I was afraid of that. With a heat pump, you can replace just the outside unit, assuming the air handler is working fine, correct?

I was expecting/planing on replacing both units while the tax credits are available. May have to do the first one shortly.

Depends. If you have the R410a refrigerant you can just replace the outdoor unit.

Ballpark, won’t hold you to it, what’s a 15 seer heat pump, 2.5 ton run these days? Have trane now and would be happy to stay with that brand (as both indoor air handlers are also trane).

 

[ChiefD]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

Thanks, and I was afraid of that. With a heat pump, you can replace just the outside unit, assuming the air handler is working fine, correct?

I was expecting/planing on replacing both units while the tax credits are available. May have to do the first one shortly.

Depends. If you have the R410a refrigerant you can just replace the outdoor unit.

Ballpark, won’t hold you to it, what’s a 15 seer heat pump, 2.5 ton run these days? Have trane now and would be happy to stay with that brand (as both indoor air handlers are also trane).

Depends on the efficiency you get, but I'd say around 7K just for the outdoor heat pump. That probably gets you within a thousand bucks either way.

 

[matttyl]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

Thanks, and I was afraid of that. With a heat pump, you can replace just the outside unit, assuming the air handler is working fine, correct?

I was expecting/planing on replacing both units while the tax credits are available. May have to do the first one shortly.

Depends. If you have the R410a refrigerant you can just replace the outdoor unit.

Ballpark, won’t hold you to it, what’s a 15 seer heat pump, 2.5 ton run these days? Have trane now and would be happy to stay with that brand (as both indoor air handlers are also trane).

Depends on the efficiency you get, but I'd say around 7K just for the outdoor heat pump. That probably gets you within a thousand bucks either way.

Well, looks like it will max out the tax credit. Thanks for info!

 

[beer 30]

One of my units is in the attic. There are two cupolas in the attic but no fans. Can I just set a box fan up to get some air movement up there to help the unit with heat & humidity?

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

One of my units is in the attic. There are two cupolas in the attic but no fans. Can I just set a box fan up to get some air movement up there to help the unit with heat & humidity?

I was going to suggest an attic fan but then read this:

Attic Fan​

Modern building science has proven that an attic fan is more detrimental to your overall comfort than it is beneficial. Most attic floors are very leaky with many penetrations (can lights, plumbing, stacks, conduit, etc.). Therefore the air that is pulled from the attic is mostly from the inside of your home. This air has to be made up by bringing in unwanted hot air from outside (this process is called infiltration). This will now introduce particulates, contaminants and humidity into the house. This explains why many homes are always dusty even though the doors and windows are closed while the A/C is running.

Attic Ventilation​

Attic ventilation is a code requirement but is more of a wintertime concern due to humidity escaping from the home. Passive ventilation is more than adequate to vent the attic and prevent any building degradation.

 

[ChiefD]

One of my units is in the attic. There are two cupolas in the attic but no fans. Can I just set a box fan up to get some air movement up there to help the unit with heat & humidity?

I probably wouldn't worry about it. There are hundreds of thousands of units in attics and they work normally. If you have normal roof vents you should be fine.

 

[tri-man 47]

@ChiefD or others:

So when our A/C runs, but sometimes just with the fan on, we have a spot in the duct work where there's a knocking sound. It's single knock (like the sound of a light rap on a door) about every 30-40 seconds or so ...not echo-y, I've gone in our crawl space and located the approximate spot where it's occurring. In our ranch house, a long, rectangular duct runs from the furnace across the crawl space to the area under the bedrooms. At the end of that wide duct, smaller circular ducts branch off to feed the bedroom vents. The knocking sound is somewhere up around the end of that rectangular duct. I can't figure out what it is. I don't feel anything vibrating when the sound occurs. Any thoughts?

 

[ChiefD]

@ChiefD or others:

So when our A/C runs, but sometimes just with the fan on, we have a spot in the duct work where there's a knocking sound. It's single knock (like the sound of a light rap on a door) about every 30-40 seconds or so ...not echo-y, I've gone in our crawl space and located the approximate spot where it's occurring. In our ranch house, a long, rectangular duct runs from the furnace across the crawl space to the area under the bedrooms. At the end of that wide duct, smaller circular ducts branch off to feed the bedroom vents. The knocking sound is somewhere up around the end of that rectangular duct. I can't figure out what it is. I don't feel anything vibrating when the sound occurs. Any thoughts?

Could be the ductwork is resting up against a floor joist somewhere - as it expands and contracts that duct will rub against the wood (oh yeah baby...) and make that sound. I have a duct run that does it in my bedroom during the winter when the furnace kicks on.

My money is on that's what is happening.

 

[tri-man 47]

@ChiefD or others:

So when our A/C runs, but sometimes just with the fan on, we have a spot in the duct work where there's a knocking sound. It's single knock (like the sound of a light rap on a door) about every 30-40 seconds or so ...not echo-y, I've gone in our crawl space and located the approximate spot where it's occurring. In our ranch house, a long, rectangular duct runs from the furnace across the crawl space to the area under the bedrooms. At the end of that wide duct, smaller circular ducts branch off to feed the bedroom vents. The knocking sound is somewhere up around the end of that rectangular duct. I can't figure out what it is. I don't feel anything vibrating when the sound occurs. Any thoughts?

Could be the ductwork is resting up against a floor joist somewhere - as it expands and contracts that duct will rub against the wood (oh yeah baby...) and make that sound. I have a duct run that does it in my bedroom during the winter when the furnace kicks on.

My money is on that's what is happening.

I have considered that, so good to hear that that's your thinking as well! I've thought I addressed it - I cut small carpet pieces (~ 1" x 6") and, where it looked like the duct was close to the wood, I pushed down enough on the top of the duct so I could slide in that little carpet piece and create a bit of a barrier. I did that in a number of spots, but not the key one as described above. After identifying the spot of the knock yesterday, I tried to slide a carpet piece in. However, it was very tight with the duct right up against the wood. I'll go back into the crawl space and see if can create a gap and get a bit of buffer ..maybe loosen the supporting bracket just enough to give a half-inch of gap or so. Fingers crossed. Thanks, GB!

 

[Osaurus]

I feel pretty lucky having my new Trane AC this summer in Florida. Between its efficiency and new windows, it seems like my electric bills are the cheap outlier and not the norm.

 

[Poke_4_Life]

Hey @ChiefD , thanks for this thread.

Bought a new (to us) home last year. Everything seems to be working great with the Heat/AC. One thing I've noticed this summer is moisture under the outside AC unit. It is hot AF here and it seems to have started even growing some moss on the concrete pad under the unit. I've had homes for nearly 25 years in this same environment (w/in 20 or so miles) and never noticed constant water under the outside AC unit. Is this something I should get checked out? Like I said it works great, just never seen this before. I understand condensation and I'm sure that is the source of the problem, but do you think there's a drain line somewhere that could be clogged?

If it matters, it is a Carrier unit. Manufactured in June 2017. I can't tell the size from the outside labels and it's too hot outside right now for me to care enough take off the access panel.

 

[matttyl]

I feel pretty lucky having my new Trane AC this summer in Florida. Between its efficiency and new windows, it seems like my electric bills are the cheap outlier and not the norm.

What unit did you get? Did you do both new AC and windows at the same time? If not, which do you think helped you more?

 

[ChiefD]

Hey @ChiefD , thanks for this thread.

Bought a new (to us) home last year. Everything seems to be working great with the Heat/AC. One thing I've noticed this summer is moisture under the outside AC unit. It is hot AF here and it seems to have started even growing some moss on the concrete pad under the unit. I've had homes for nearly 25 years in this same environment (w/in 20 or so miles) and never noticed constant water under the outside AC unit. Is this something I should get checked out? Like I said it works great, just never seen this before. I understand condensation and I'm sure that is the source of the problem, but do you think there's a drain line somewhere that could be clogged?

If it matters, it is a Carrier unit. Manufactured in June 2017. I can't tell the size from the outside labels and it's too hot outside right now for me to care enough take off the access panel.

It's so effing hot and humid here right now that nothing surprises me. I've gotten a ton of condensation calls this week.

That sounds normal to me. The dew point and humidity is astronomical right now, and it's been a long time since we've had a stretch of THIS.

 

[Dezbelief]

Hey @ChiefD , thanks for this thread.

Bought a new (to us) home last year. Everything seems to be working great with the Heat/AC. One thing I've noticed this summer is moisture under the outside AC unit. It is hot AF here and it seems to have started even growing some moss on the concrete pad under the unit. I've had homes for nearly 25 years in this same environment (w/in 20 or so miles) and never noticed constant water under the outside AC unit. Is this something I should get checked out? Like I said it works great, just never seen this before. I understand condensation and I'm sure that is the source of the problem, but do you think there's a drain line somewhere that could be clogged?

If it matters, it is a Carrier unit. Manufactured in June 2017. I can't tell the size from the outside labels and it's too hot outside right now for me to care enough take off the access panel.

It's so effing hot and humid here right now that nothing surprises me. I've gotten a ton of condensation calls this week.

That sounds normal to me. The dew point and humidity is astronomical right now, and it's been a long time since we've had a stretch of THIS.

One of those fall days when the weather is perfect I would clean under the unit as best as you can. Use a waterhose, a leaf blower, a stick or whatever you can think of.

 

[Poke_4_Life]

Hey @ChiefD , thanks for this thread.

Bought a new (to us) home last year. Everything seems to be working great with the Heat/AC. One thing I've noticed this summer is moisture under the outside AC unit. It is hot AF here and it seems to have started even growing some moss on the concrete pad under the unit. I've had homes for nearly 25 years in this same environment (w/in 20 or so miles) and never noticed constant water under the outside AC unit. Is this something I should get checked out? Like I said it works great, just never seen this before. I understand condensation and I'm sure that is the source of the problem, but do you think there's a drain line somewhere that could be clogged?

If it matters, it is a Carrier unit. Manufactured in June 2017. I can't tell the size from the outside labels and it's too hot outside right now for me to care enough take off the access panel.

It's so effing hot and humid here right now that nothing surprises me. I've gotten a ton of condensation calls this week.

That sounds normal to me. The dew point and humidity is astronomical right now, and it's been a long time since we've had a stretch of THIS.

Thanks. We usually get a stretch like this in Oklahoma every summer. My KC coworkers act like they are all dying. It's funny how soft ya'll up in KC are...

 

[ChiefD]

Hey @ChiefD , thanks for this thread.

Bought a new (to us) home last year. Everything seems to be working great with the Heat/AC. One thing I've noticed this summer is moisture under the outside AC unit. It is hot AF here and it seems to have started even growing some moss on the concrete pad under the unit. I've had homes for nearly 25 years in this same environment (w/in 20 or so miles) and never noticed constant water under the outside AC unit. Is this something I should get checked out? Like I said it works great, just never seen this before. I understand condensation and I'm sure that is the source of the problem, but do you think there's a drain line somewhere that could be clogged?

If it matters, it is a Carrier unit. Manufactured in June 2017. I can't tell the size from the outside labels and it's too hot outside right now for me to care enough take off the access panel.

It's so effing hot and humid here right now that nothing surprises me. I've gotten a ton of condensation calls this week.

That sounds normal to me. The dew point and humidity is astronomical right now, and it's been a long time since we've had a stretch of THIS.

Thanks. We usually get a stretch like this in Oklahoma every summer. My KC coworkers act like they are all dying. It's funny how soft ya'll up in KC are...

I don't mind it. Extreme temps are my friend. Makes my yearly bonus that much better.

 

[Osaurus]

I feel pretty lucky having my new Trane AC this summer in Florida. Between its efficiency and new windows, it seems like my electric bills are the cheap outlier and not the norm.

What unit did you get? Did you do both new AC and windows at the same time? If not, which do you think helped you more?

Trane 4 ton 16 seer heat pump. It’s awesome. I got new windows about a year ago. It’s hard to figure out the exact savings between windows and the new AC (electric rate hikes have an impact too), but I’m fairly certain the efficiency of the new AC has helped my electric bills more.

 

[Osaurus]

Hey @ChiefD , thanks for this thread.

Bought a new (to us) home last year. Everything seems to be working great with the Heat/AC. One thing I've noticed this summer is moisture under the outside AC unit. It is hot AF here and it seems to have started even growing some moss on the concrete pad under the unit. I've had homes for nearly 25 years in this same environment (w/in 20 or so miles) and never noticed constant water under the outside AC unit. Is this something I should get checked out? Like I said it works great, just never seen this before. I understand condensation and I'm sure that is the source of the problem, but do you think there's a drain line somewhere that could be clogged?

If it matters, it is a Carrier unit. Manufactured in June 2017. I can't tell the size from the outside labels and it's too hot outside right now for me to care enough take off the access panel.

It's so effing hot and humid here right now that nothing surprises me. I've gotten a ton of condensation calls this week.

That sounds normal to me. The dew point and humidity is astronomical right now, and it's been a long time since we've had a stretch of THIS.

Yep. Getting kind of a fern garden near my condensate line. I’ve kept a splash block there which helps.

 

[Hawks64]

@ChiefD Just got a quote from a guy who works at the same HVAC/Electrical company my son does and does HVAC on the side.

I would love your thoughts on the below in terms of the quality of the equipment. We have a tri-level built in 68 and is about 1700 sqft.

80% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 14 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set.
$4,950 OTD

90% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 90%
$5,900 OTD


96% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 96%
$6,200 OTD

He also mentioned that if we go higher than a 15SEER we get into two-stage units. Thoughts on that?

 

[ChiefD]

@ChiefD Just got a quote from a guy who works at the same HVAC/Electrical company my son does and does HVAC on the side.

I would love your thoughts on the below in terms of the quality of the equipment. We have a tri-level built in 68 and is about 1700 sqft.

80% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 14 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set.
$4,950 OTD

90% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 90%
$5,900 OTD


96% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 96%
$6,200 OTD

He also mentioned that if we go higher than a 15SEER we get into two-stage units. Thoughts on that?

What part of the country do you live in?

 

[gianmarco]

@ChiefD Just got a quote from a guy who works at the same HVAC/Electrical company my son does and does HVAC on the side.

I would love your thoughts on the below in terms of the quality of the equipment. We have a tri-level built in 68 and is about 1700 sqft.

80% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 14 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set.
$4,950 OTD

90% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 90%
$5,900 OTD


96% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 96%
$6,200 OTD

He also mentioned that if we go higher than a 15SEER we get into two-stage units. Thoughts on that?

A/S/L?

 

[Hawks64]

@ChiefD Just got a quote from a guy who works at the same HVAC/Electrical company my son does and does HVAC on the side.

I would love your thoughts on the below in terms of the quality of the equipment. We have a tri-level built in 68 and is about 1700 sqft.

80% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 14 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set.
$4,950 OTD

90% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 90%
$5,900 OTD


96% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 96%
$6,200 OTD

He also mentioned that if we go higher than a 15SEER we get into two-stage units. Thoughts on that?

What part of the country do you live in?

In the Chicago burbs, so hot humid summers.

 

[ChiefD]

@ChiefD Just got a quote from a guy who works at the same HVAC/Electrical company my son does and does HVAC on the side.

I would love your thoughts on the below in terms of the quality of the equipment. We have a tri-level built in 68 and is about 1700 sqft.

80% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 14 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set.
$4,950 OTD

90% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 90%
$5,900 OTD


96% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 96%
$6,200 OTD

He also mentioned that if we go higher than a 15SEER we get into two-stage units. Thoughts on that?

What part of the country do you live in?

In the Chicago burbs, so hot humid summers.

OK thanks. So at my house in KC, I went pretty simple when I replaced my stuff in 2019. I went with a single stage AC and a two stage 95% furnace. In your climate if it's in the budget I would go to the 96% furnace. You will use your furnace way more than we do down here, but it will definitely save you money on your gas bill.

Tempstar is decent equipment - we put a lot of it in about 10 years ago. And a lot of people still do. It's an ICP product so parts are easily available should something break down. And Tempstar is pretty reliable stuff. For as much as we put in 10 years ago I don't get any more service issues with them than I do any other brand like Carrier or Lennox or Trane. I'd feel comfortable putting it in your house.

One of my techs who has been here for 30 years installed it in his own home. And he's a crusty old tech who knows his stuff.

Just make sure you register it so you can get the 10 year parts warranty. And the prices are very, very reasonable for what you are getting. I think you'll do well with any of those bids.

 

[Hawks64]

@ChiefD Just got a quote from a guy who works at the same HVAC/Electrical company my son does and does HVAC on the side.

I would love your thoughts on the below in terms of the quality of the equipment. We have a tri-level built in 68 and is about 1700 sqft.

80% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 14 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set.
$4,950 OTD

90% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 90%
$5,900 OTD


96% TempStar Horizontal Furnace
2.5 TON 15 SEER TempStar condenser w/ horizontal Evaporator coil
AC Pad, Electrical whip & Disconnect
R-11 Flush for existing R22 line set
New/routing PVC Flue for 96%
$6,200 OTD

He also mentioned that if we go higher than a 15SEER we get into two-stage units. Thoughts on that?

What part of the country do you live in?

In the Chicago burbs, so hot humid summers.

OK thanks. So at my house in KC, I went pretty simple when I replaced my stuff in 2019. I went with a single stage AC and a two stage 95% furnace. In your climate if it's in the budget I would go to the 96% furnace. You will use your furnace way more than we do down here, but it will definitely save you money on your gas bill.

Tempstar is decent equipment - we put a lot of it in about 10 years ago. And a lot of people still do. It's an ICP product so parts are easily available should something break down. And Tempstar is pretty reliable stuff. For as much as we put in 10 years ago I don't get any more service issues with them than I do any other brand like Carrier or Lennox or Trane. I'd feel comfortable putting it in your house.

One of my techs who has been here for 30 years installed it in his own home. And he's a crusty old tech who knows his stuff.

Just make sure you register it so you can get the 10 year parts warranty. And the prices are very, very reasonable for what you are getting. I think you'll do well with any of those bids.

Thanks GB!!

 

[matttyl]

If this is the place to get answers on HVAC stuff….

We have two heat pumps in a dual zone system in our house. One zone is the upstairs (bedrooms), and the other is main level and finished basement. Trane units - XR13 and XR14, like 15 years old or so each.

In winter (heating season), the outside unit for upstairs unit makes a pulsing sound, going in and out every 2-3 seconds. That unit is outside bedroom window, down about 20 feet, making it hard to sleep. Hasn’t made it this summer (cooling season), though. Being the DIYer that I am, I did some cleaning of the units this spring and digging around and saw that a capacitor was bad (top of it was domed), and replaced it, but not sure that was a cause of then pulsing noise.

By end of last heating season what we did was crank it a bit before bed, then leave upstairs unit off overnight and have downstairs unit on (as heat rises). That may not work a second winter with my wife…. Any thoughts?

Could be your compressor. The pulsing sound you are describing sounds like the compressor trying to pump the refrigerant.

The normal life span of a heat pump is about 12 years old, mainly because they are working 12 months out of the year. With (2) of them 15 years old I may think about replacement soon. And probably start with that one just to space them out so you don't have to do two systems at the same time.

I'd have someone check it out.

So still monkeying with this a bit. Finding that it’s actually the downstairs unit making more noise. Anyway, started with a few little DIY things - replaced original start run capacitor and original contractor. Neither gave me any indication of being a problem, aside from being 15 years old each and looking their age. Each less than $20 and kinda fun to learn how to replace (from YouTube).

Still noise, but I think I’ve found out what/where - the line set going into the house, specifically the suction line (larger one). It vibrates. Noticeably more than the suction line of other unit. Now I don’t want to go digging into the walls of the house - so what can I do to reduce or eliminate the vibrations? I’ve seen that you can drive rebar into the ground and attach that to the line (with something like rubber in between rebar and copper line), but also heard not to do that as the vibrations could eat into suction line and cause huge problem. Read that putting weights on line could help?

Going to see if I can find where vibrations are originating- I’d imagine at the compressor itself, and see if anything can be done there. Also noticed that entire unit isn’t level - about and inch off both front to back and side to side - so going to try to level out unit this evening to see if that helps. Anything more DIY I could do, or just bite the bullet and replace unit that other than a bit of noise seems to work just fine? Thanks!

 

[ChiefD]

So still monkeying with this a bit. Finding that it’s actually the downstairs unit making more noise. Anyway, started with a few little DIY things - replaced original start run capacitor and original contractor. Neither gave me any indication of being a problem, aside from being 15 years old each and looking their age. Each less than $20 and kinda fun to learn how to replace (from YouTube).

Still noise, but I think I’ve found out what/where - the line set going into the house, specifically the suction line (larger one). It vibrates. Noticeably more than the suction line of other unit. Now I don’t want to go digging into the walls of the house - so what can I do to reduce or eliminate the vibrations? I’ve seen that you can drive rebar into the ground and attach that to the line (with something like rubber in between rebar and copper line), but also heard not to do that as the vibrations could eat into suction line and cause huge problem. Read that putting weights on line could help?

Going to see if I can find where vibrations are originating- I’d imagine at the compressor itself, and see if anything can be done there. Also noticed that entire unit isn’t level - about and inch off both front to back and side to side - so going to try to level out unit this evening to see if that helps. Anything more DIY I could do, or just bite the bullet and replace unit that other than a bit of noise seems to work just fine? Thanks!

I probably wouldn't put anything on those lines or rebar or anything like that. You don't want that rubbing through and potentially rubbing a hole in the copper lineset.

That lineset is probably touching one of your rim joists or floor joists or something in the house, so as it vibrates its vibrating against a solid surface which leads to you hearing it in the house.

I would see where it comes into the house. Is it touching the siding or something like that. Sometimes the sealant breaks down over time and you can replace that as an insulator.

This stuff. It's pliable and you use it to fill in that hole around where the lineset enters the house.

Leveling the AC can certainly help.

At this point you have two 15 year old heat pumps, so some planned replacement makes sense over the next few years so you don't get stuck replacing both in the same year.

 

[tri-man 47]

@ChiefD or others:

So when our A/C runs, but sometimes just with the fan on, we have a spot in the duct work where there's a knocking sound. It's single knock (like the sound of a light rap on a door) about every 30-40 seconds or so ...not echo-y, I've gone in our crawl space and located the approximate spot where it's occurring. In our ranch house, a long, rectangular duct runs from the furnace across the crawl space to the area under the bedrooms. At the end of that wide duct, smaller circular ducts branch off to feed the bedroom vents. The knocking sound is somewhere up around the end of that rectangular duct. I can't figure out what it is. I don't feel anything vibrating when the sound occurs. Any thoughts?

Could be the ductwork is resting up against a floor joist somewhere - as it expands and contracts that duct will rub against the wood (oh yeah baby...) and make that sound. I have a duct run that does it in my bedroom during the winter when the furnace kicks on.

My money is on that's what is happening.

I have considered that, so good to hear that that's your thinking as well! I've thought I addressed it - I cut small carpet pieces (~ 1" x 6") and, where it looked like the duct was close to the wood, I pushed down enough on the top of the duct so I could slide in that little carpet piece and create a bit of a barrier. I did that in a number of spots, but not the key one as described above. After identifying the spot of the knock yesterday, I tried to slide a carpet piece in. However, it was very tight with the duct right up against the wood. I'll go back into the crawl space and see if can create a gap and get a bit of buffer ..maybe loosen the supporting bracket just enough to give a half-inch of gap or so. Fingers crossed. Thanks, GB!

To close the loop on my issue: I did fuss around with the ductwork and create just a bit of spacing from the surrounding wood. It worked! No more 'knocking' sound.

I really appreciate the guidance, @ChiefD !!!

 

[Hawks64]

@ChiefD Thoughts on this? I went with the Tempstar furnace and AC.

And now I am hoping I didn't screw up my new furnace. It was installed last week (while we were out of town), and I just swapped out my old nest thermostat to an ecobee thermostat (not a big Google house, have 90% Amazon and 10% Apple). Ran into a few issues because I had to use the ecobee PEK thing, since I only have 4 wires for the thermostat. Essentially, you take the thermostat wires off of the 24v terminal, connect the PEK and its 5 wires, and then connect the thermostat wire to the PEK. Everything powered up and seem to function, humidifier powers up, the furnace has power and is sitting at idle, thermostat works. I didn't run the furnace since the house was already warm. This AM the heat kicks on for the first time and it ignites and starts putting heat out and then it shuts down shortly after with an Open Main Pressure Switch (LPS) error. Cycles and starts over again. I dont' think there is anything I could have done wiring wise to cause it and I am not sure if it's even safe to run it like this, or if it will cause issues.

To be honest it seemed like it was cycling on Friday morning like this but it was early and I was in bed however I noticed the vents with airflow, then none, then airflow, rinse and repeat. But I didn't get up to check and it really hasn't run a ton since then so I don't know.

 

[ChiefD]

How does your filter look?

 

[Hawks64]

How does your filter look?

Fine, and it's a crappy fiberglass one. My old furnace couldn't use anything modern.

ETA - Swapped with a new one and no change. I did chat with him and he's coming out tomorrow to take a look but doesn't think it's anything I did.

 

[Jobber]

Since my Furnace and AC are about 24 years old, I like to poke around on this topic at least once a year. There’s a local Trane outfit I’ll hit up at some point for sure.

Is the new refrigerant standard something I should watch out for? I don’t want to get a AC installed that’s instantly deprecated and could be problematic to get serviced. Or maybe that’s not a concern.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

If any of you get your gas meter replaced, have them check/adjust the furnace flame.

 

[ChiefD]

Since my Furnace and AC are about 24 years old, I like to poke around on this topic at least once a year. There’s a local Trane outfit I’ll hit up at some point for sure.

Is the new refrigerant standard something I should watch out for? I don’t want to get a AC installed that’s instantly deprecated and could be problematic to get serviced. Or maybe that’s not a concern.

I wouldn't worry too much about it. They are just now starting to roll this out, and the units we are installing are still the most recent refrigerant (R410a).

The old R22 they started phasing out in 2010, and we can still get jugs of it now. So even if you replace with the 410A refrigerant you will be able to get supplies of it down the road. Definitely check locally to see what they are doing since it may be rolling out differently across the country.

But if your stuff is still working OK I might wait another year or two until the new stuff is fully engaged. That way you don't have to worry about it.

 

[beer 30]

Since my Furnace and AC are about 24 years old, I like to poke around on this topic at least once a year. There’s a local Trane outfit I’ll hit up at some point for sure.

Is the new refrigerant standard something I should watch out for? I don’t want to get a AC installed that’s instantly deprecated and could be problematic to get serviced. Or maybe that’s not a concern.

I wouldn't worry too much about it. They are just now starting to roll this out, and the units we are installing are still the most recent refrigerant (R410a).

The old R22 they started phasing out in 2010, and we can still get jugs of it now. So even if you replace with the 410A refrigerant you will be able to get supplies of it down the road. Definitely check locally to see what they are doing since it may be rolling out differently across the country.

But if your stuff is still working OK I might wait another year or two until the new stuff is fully engaged. That way you don't have to worry about it.

I just had two new ones installed last year, they are R410A. While I disagree with the DOE/EPA/Whoever is mandating this new refrigerant change, they did decide to handle the sunsetting of R410A in a much better way than when they stuffed R410A down everyone's throat. R410A won't be $800/lb 1/1/2025.

R410A will still be manufactured for existing systems for a number of years (not sure when it is stopped but sometime in the future). There just won't be any new R410A systems manufactured after 12/31/2024. The new R454B stuff takes over then and we start down the rabbit hole until the next new best thing that catches fire comes up.

 

[Rattle and Hum]

@ChiefD does your team install restaurant hoods by chance? Just looking for a ballpark figure for install. Getting some high figures here in W Michigan. 17 foot ceilings. Metal, strip mall exterior. I'm guessing a 10' distance to cover but not sure. Thanks either way!

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Very disappointed to learn this thread isn't about Kid C or mustachioed women.