Uh, that's one time and not a regular basis.Uh, try a couple weeks ago when he got carted off and then came back and crushed it.
Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
And you talk about me falling for trolling...Uh, that's one time and not a regular basis.Uh, try a couple weeks ago when he got carted off and then came back and crushed it.
And you talk about me falling for trolling...Uh, that's one time and not a regular basis.Uh, try a couple weeks ago when he got carted off and then came back and crushed it.
This is the best post I've ever seen.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
Here's some evidence... Total QBR rankings the last 5 years (most recent year first):Rodgers - 2, 5, 4, 1, 3Rodgers is playing head and shoulders above everyone else, statistically, right now, so his claim for top billing is, at the very least, as good as anyone playing right now (including Manning and Brady). You might be able to make an argument that there are other QBs from the past who "have played at the same high level and done it longer," but that's a pretty extraordinary claim and you would have to come up with some evidence. For example, can you name anyone else in the Super Bowl era who was in the top 5 in the league in QB rating, yards per attempt, and TD% six years in a row? Montana and Elway never came close to that, and even Marino didn't manage it. That's relative to peers, so adjusts for era.Different rules, different eras. It isn't as clear as you think.Considering that Rodgers is #1 in career QB rating, it's clear that there aren't many QBs who have played at the same high level. Also #1 in yards/attempt in the Super Bowl era by a couple of notches, #1 in TD percentage in the Super Bowl era by a long way, #1 in career interception percentage by a long way.I think a Rodgers claim for top billing is laughable as well... He is very good but there are many QBs who have played at the same high level and done it longer.
You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
Wilson - 12, 12, 6Here's some evidence... QBR rankings the last 5 years (most recent year first):Rodgers - 2, 5, 4, 1, 3
Manning - 3, 1, 1, dnp, 2
Last year he was the 5th ranked QB (by Total QBR) and two years ago he was ranked 4th. That's not quite elite in my book, not when guys named Foles, Rivers and Ryan are ranked better.Sorry, but if you want to claim someone is playing the best QB of all-time, at least be in the top 3 last year or the year before.You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
So I'm guessing you think QBR is the end all, be all for ranking QBs?Last year he was the 5th ranked QB (by Total QBR) and two years ago he was ranked 4th. That's not quite elite in my book, not when guys named Foles, Rivers and Ryan are ranked better.Sorry, but if you want to claim someone is playing the best QB of all-time, at least be in the top 3 last year or the year before.You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
Total Quarterback Rating (abbreviated as Total QBR or simply QBR) is a proprietary statistic created by ESPN Inc. in 2011 to measure the performance of quarterbacks in American football. It was created to be a more meaningful alternative to the passer rating but has been met with criticism amongst fans and commentators alike.
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According to ESPN, QBR was developed to measure the degree to which a quarterback contributed to scoring points for the team, and also to a win by the team. For example, completing a pass to earn a first down at the quarterback's own 20-yard-line with 30 seconds left in the game is unlikely to lead to any points for his team, but if they are already leading it increases the probability of winning, as it usually enables the leading team to run out the clock. This second criterion is quantified using a "win probability" function which ESPN developed by analyzing data for each play of NFL games over the previous decade.
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ESPN claims QBR is a more meaningful alternative to the passer rating, which remains the official NFL measure of passing performance. The calculation of the NFL passer rating is much simpler than the QBR, as it depends only on aggregate statistics rather than an analysis of each play a quarterback is involved in. Passer rating is calculated using each quarterback's passing attempts, completions, yards, touchdowns and interceptions, and has a maximum value of 158.3 and minimum value of 0.
What specifically about it do you not like?So I'm guessing you think QBR is the end all, be all for ranking QBs?Last year he was the 5th ranked QB (by Total QBR) and two years ago he was ranked 4th. That's not quite elite in my book, not when guys named Foles, Rivers and Ryan are ranked better.Sorry, but if you want to claim someone is playing the best QB of all-time, at least be in the top 3 last year or the year before.You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
I don't know but if Russell Wilson is ranking 12, 12, 6, I feel like it's a flawed stat. I honestly don't know how you can watch Rodgers play and not think he's an elite QB.What specifically about it do you not like?So I'm guessing you think QBR is the end all, be all for ranking QBs?Last year he was the 5th ranked QB (by Total QBR) and two years ago he was ranked 4th. That's not quite elite in my book, not when guys named Foles, Rivers and Ryan are ranked better.Sorry, but if you want to claim someone is playing the best QB of all-time, at least be in the top 3 last year or the year before.You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
I said he wasn't elite last year or the year before. He's a great QB, but how can you say he is playing the best QB of all time, when the most advanced metric out there for evaluating the effectiveness of a QB says he's not the best QB in any of the last 3 seasons. Someone asked for evidence and I provided it. {insert shrugging shoulder guy which I can't do on my phone}I don't know but if Russell Wilson is ranking 12, 12, 6, I feel like it's a flawed stat. I honestly don't know how you can watch Rodgers play and not think he's an elite QB.What specifically about it do you not like?So I'm guessing you think QBR is the end all, be all for ranking QBs?Last year he was the 5th ranked QB (by Total QBR) and two years ago he was ranked 4th. That's not quite elite in my book, not when guys named Foles, Rivers and Ryan are ranked better.Sorry, but if you want to claim someone is playing the best QB of all-time, at least be in the top 3 last year or the year before.You mean when he had a fractured collarbone on his non throwing side, a 4-6 week injury, and they wouldn't let him play for 8 weeks?Rodgers was elite this year and 3 years ago. The two years in between he wasn't all that. He's got to win s few more playoff games before I even consider him in the GOAT category.Let's not forget last season when he faked being hurt against the Bears and came back in two months later to oust the Bears and steal the division title from them.
He may be. But he's got a LONG way to go first. I mean really - the guy has a grand total of 5 playoff wins in his career. 5. That's 32nd all-time. Tom Brady has 19. To put that into perspective, Rodgers would have to run the table and win the Superbowl 5 times in a row to pass him - and that assumes Brady doesn't win one more game during that 5 year period. Rodgers hasn't played that well in the playoffs recently, either. In the last 3 years, he is 1-3 in the playoffs, with an average of 243 yards per game passing and 1.5 TD passes. And 3 out of those 4 games were at home.I'm just looking at what my eyes tell me. I agree that we can't call him the GOAT just yet but he can make any throw. I think when he retires, he will be in the conversation.
"Total QBR" isn't the most advanced metric for anything other than ESPN tooting its own horn. It has even less value than some of the Football Outsiders silliness, because not only does it output garbage, it's proprietary so you don't even know why.I said he wasn't elite last year or the year before. He's a great QB, but how can you say he is playing the best QB of all time, when the most advanced metric out there for evaluating the effectiveness of a QB says he's not the best QB in any of the last 3 seasons. Someone asked for evidence and I provided it. {insert shrugging shoulder guy which I can't do on my phone}
I'm not trying to discredit Rodgers. He is in his prime and playing in a pass happy NFL right now Rodgers is very good - so are Manning, Brees, Brady, etc (all past their prime). Not only is it difficult to compare across eras, each player plays under a different offensive philosophy and with different talent around them. Someone has to be blessed to be in the right situation. Give a good QB all day to throw and he'll pick you apart. A few injuries to the line and suddenly he isn't the same player. Put a good QB on a team with a bad defense and the picks will come as they throw from behind...Rodgers is playing head and shoulders above everyone else, statistically, right now, so his claim for top billing is, at the very least, as good as anyone playing right now (including Manning and Brady). You might be able to make an argument that there are other QBs from the past who "have played at the same high level and done it longer," but that's a pretty extraordinary claim and you would have to come up with some evidence. For example, can you name anyone else in the Super Bowl era who was in the top 5 in the league in QB rating, yards per attempt, and TD% six years in a row? Montana and Elway never came close to that, and even Marino didn't manage it. That's relative to peers, so adjusts for era.Different rules, different eras. It isn't as clear as you think.Considering that Rodgers is #1 in career QB rating, it's clear that there aren't many QBs who have played at the same high level. Also #1 in yards/attempt in the Super Bowl era by a couple of notches, #1 in TD percentage in the Super Bowl era by a long way, #1 in career interception percentage by a long way.I think a Rodgers claim for top billing is laughable as well... He is very good but there are many QBs who have played at the same high level and done it longer.
I'm not making the claim of Rodgers as the best ever. There are reasonable arguments for and against. I was taking issue with your statement, "I think a Rodgers claim for top billing is laughable...there are many QBs who have played at the same high level and done it longer." Rodgers clearly has a legitimate claim for #1 ever, and there aren't "many" QBs who have played at the same high level statistically--there might be two (Young and Manning). And only Manning has done it longer.There have been so many good QBs over the years. Each played in a distinct situation. The nature of the position is such that they get the credit for winning and the blame for losing. If the team is well balanced, the QB is labeled a game manager. If the team throws all day, the QB is a stud. In the end, do you judge them purely off individual statistics? Is a one yard TD run less effective than a pass TD? Is an INT always the QB's fault? Do you judge by wins and losses? Come backs? Championships? Play calling? The ability to elevate a mediocre team to greatness? Eyeball test?
That's where our opinions differ. Rodgers has played seven seasons on a very talented GB team (Driver, Nelson, Jennings, Jones, Cobb, etc). They also usually have a respectable defense, and seem to seldom play from behind (especially at home). Even with great numbers over that span, I think it is too soon to talk about best ever.I'm not making the claim of Rodgers as the best ever. There are reasonable arguments for and against. I was taking issue with your statement, "I think a Rodgers claim for top billing is laughable...there are many QBs who have played at the same high level and done it longer." Rodgers clearly has a legitimate claim for #1 ever, and there aren't "many" QBs who have played at the same high level statistically--there might be two (Young and Manning). And only Manning has done it longer.There have been so many good QBs over the years. Each played in a distinct situation. The nature of the position is such that they get the credit for winning and the blame for losing. If the team is well balanced, the QB is labeled a game manager. If the team throws all day, the QB is a stud. In the end, do you judge them purely off individual statistics? Is a one yard TD run less effective than a pass TD? Is an INT always the QB's fault? Do you judge by wins and losses? Come backs? Championships? Play calling? The ability to elevate a mediocre team to greatness? Eyeball test?
Rodgers definitely benefitted from sitting behind Favre, but other than that, his situation hasn't been at all conducive to generating QB numbers. He plays in Green Bay for heaven's sake.
Favre and Rodgers are the main reason for the prolific offense. Did you see what the Packers did with Matt Flynn last year?That's where our opinions differ. Rodgers has played seven seasons on a very talented GB team (Driver, Nelson, Jennings, Jones, Cobb, etc). They also usually have a respectable defense, and seem to seldom play from behind (especially at home). Even with great numbers over that span, I think it is too soon to talk about best ever.I'm not making the claim of Rodgers as the best ever. There are reasonable arguments for and against. I was taking issue with your statement, "I think a Rodgers claim for top billing is laughable...there are many QBs who have played at the same high level and done it longer." Rodgers clearly has a legitimate claim for #1 ever, and there aren't "many" QBs who have played at the same high level statistically--there might be two (Young and Manning). And only Manning has done it longer.There have been so many good QBs over the years. Each played in a distinct situation. The nature of the position is such that they get the credit for winning and the blame for losing. If the team is well balanced, the QB is labeled a game manager. If the team throws all day, the QB is a stud. In the end, do you judge them purely off individual statistics? Is a one yard TD run less effective than a pass TD? Is an INT always the QB's fault? Do you judge by wins and losses? Come backs? Championships? Play calling? The ability to elevate a mediocre team to greatness? Eyeball test?
Rodgers definitely benefitted from sitting behind Favre, but other than that, his situation hasn't been at all conducive to generating QB numbers. He plays in Green Bay for heaven's sake.
It gets cold in GB. As it does in a few cities but didn't Favre put up remarkable numbers? GB has had one of the most prolific offenses in the NFL for some time.
Maybe they would, but extending plays leads to more sacks and to more rushing yards.Rodgers throws very few interceptions. That is his strength and the thing that makes his metrics shine. Conversely, he takes too many sacks. Would he (and his team) be better off if he threw the ball away more? Maybe.
agree with thisThe Packers have scored at least 20 points in every playoff game led by Aaron Rodgers. His playoff numbers are outstanding.
His problem has been the defense he has played with. In his four playoff losses, his defense gave up 51, 45, 37 and 23 points. The Packer defense has been surrendering 27 points on average in the Aaron Rodgers era... As a result, the Packers are 5-4. With any kind of consistently good defense, he'd have a couple more rings.
Even this year, the Packer defense gave up 348 points and were mediocre at best.
Jones? James Jones? Part of your argument for why Rodgers shouldn't be considered in the conversation for GOAT is that his play was elevated by playing with James Jones? Honestly, none of those guys would be that highly ranked among WRs all time, IMO. Maybe Jordy will get there, but a lot of his success has to do with Rodgers. Rodgers played just 2 years where Driver was really a factor.That's where our opinions differ. Rodgers has played seven seasons on a very talented GB team (Driver, Nelson, Jennings, Jones, Cobb, etc). They also usually have a respectable defense, and seem to seldom play from behind (especially at home). Even with great numbers over that span, I think it is too soon to talk about best ever.I'm not making the claim of Rodgers as the best ever. There are reasonable arguments for and against. I was taking issue with your statement, "I think a Rodgers claim for top billing is laughable...there are many QBs who have played at the same high level and done it longer." Rodgers clearly has a legitimate claim for #1 ever, and there aren't "many" QBs who have played at the same high level statistically--there might be two (Young and Manning). And only Manning has done it longer.There have been so many good QBs over the years. Each played in a distinct situation. The nature of the position is such that they get the credit for winning and the blame for losing. If the team is well balanced, the QB is labeled a game manager. If the team throws all day, the QB is a stud. In the end, do you judge them purely off individual statistics? Is a one yard TD run less effective than a pass TD? Is an INT always the QB's fault? Do you judge by wins and losses? Come backs? Championships? Play calling? The ability to elevate a mediocre team to greatness? Eyeball test?
Rodgers definitely benefitted from sitting behind Favre, but other than that, his situation hasn't been at all conducive to generating QB numbers. He plays in Green Bay for heaven's sake.
It gets cold in GB. As it does in a few cities but didn't Favre put up remarkable numbers? GB has had one of the most prolific offenses in the NFL for some time.
Aaron Rodgers completed 23-of-34 throws for 304 yards and three touchdowns in the Packers' Divisional Round win over the Cowboys.
Rodgers capped Green Bay's first drive with a four-yard dart to Andrew Quarless in the back of the end zone. The Packers' offense took a step back from there as Rodgers' mobility was clearly compromised by his injured calf, and also adversely affected his passing. He repeatedly missed his intended targets high. Rodgers settled down in the second half, carving up Dallas' defense on short throws. He hit Davante Adams for a 46-yard catch-and-run touchdown and rookie TE Richard Rodgers on an absolute bullet between several defenders for a 13-yard score. Rodgers still hasn't thrown an interception in a home game since December 2 of 2012. The Packers will head to Seattle for the NFC Championship Game next week.
Jan 11 - 4:11 PM
True...and people will forget that it happened with about 4:20 left...people will act as if it would have ended TY he game.It's sad that one of the gutsiest performances you'll ever see by a QB in a playoff game is getting overshadowed by that overturned Dez Bryant call.
This is the issue. QBR is flawed. Traditional passer rating is better, and I think there are likely quite a few advanced metrics. For example, ANY/A is a better advanced metric for evaluating the effectiveness of a QB. Rodgers is #1 all time in career ANY/A.General Tso said:the most advanced metric out there for evaluating the effectiveness of a QB
Regardless, they're all better than playoff W/L which tells us that guys like Eli, Flacco, and Sanchez are among the all-time greats. Sadly, that's the metric that many people choose to use.This is the issue. QBR is flawed. Traditional passer rating is better, and I think there are likely quite a few advanced metrics. For example, ANY/A is a better advanced metric for evaluating the effectiveness of a QB. Rodgers is #1 all time in career ANY/A.General Tso said:the most advanced metric out there for evaluating the effectiveness of a QB
You're 100% correct Ghost. It wasn't lost on me though. I'll remember that performance for a LONG time. He was outstanding, and he was clearly bothered by the ankle. Awesome game, with some beautiful, deadly accurate throws.It's sad that one of the gutsiest performances you'll ever see by a QB in a playoff game is getting overshadowed by that overturned Dez Bryant call.
I wish they had called it a catch. If Dallas scores there ... still about 4 minutes left in the game, and the packers would be down 1 or 3 (depending on the 2-point try).You're 100% correct Ghost. It wasn't lost on me though. I'll remember that performance for a LONG time. He was outstanding, and he was clearly bothered by the ankle. Awesome game, with some beautiful, deadly accurate throws.It's sad that one of the gutsiest performances you'll ever see by a QB in a playoff game is getting overshadowed by that overturned Dez Bryant call.
Aaron Rodgers (calf) remained limited on Thursday.
Rodgers suited up for the "second part" of practice. "He's getting ready to play," were the words of coach Mike McCarthy. Rodgers' mobility is going to remain limited against the Seahawks, but barring a setback, he'll be out there for every down.
Source: Packers on Twitter
Jan 15 - 2:45 PM
That's exactly what Seattle is doing this week. Love it. LOVE IT!Dallas will fall for the Rodgers drama. He does this on a regular basis. Acts more hurt than he is. Torches team when they buy into it
That is pretty amazing...Faust said: