Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Please respect Joe's wishes.
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QB Anthony Richardson, IND (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
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massraider
Footballguy
I think it's as simple as, he hasn't played much. You gotta project, hope he develops.
He's not a polished, experienced passer, with 30 games of SEC starting experience. He's started 13 games, I think? He had 64 passes the previous season? As a true sophomore. He's raw. We have people trying to piece the mystery together of how his completion percentage went down from the previous season, when he had 64 attempts! Sorry, that's an investigation not worth having. And I think with any QB, comparing the downside with head cases isn't productive. Vince or JaMarcus, that's like saying the downside for Bryce Young as an undersized QB is Johnny Manziel. Not calling out you or @Penguin here, just saying that if Bryce Young develops a scorching cocaine habit, his downside is Johnny Manziel.
Maybe his downside is Jake Locker. Still a bust, without being a train wreck. So it's a massive projection. Well, I dunno, maybe not massive.
I think people evaluate QBs in one way only, meaning a QB must have this this this and this. Other positions get evaluated, and there are different types of WR, TE, DT, and DE. So if the 280 lb DT is an insane pass rusher, but gets pushed around on the goalline, no one cares, because he does this thing better than anyone, so we will deal with his deficiency in the running game, because he helps us win.
20 years ago, accuracy was #1 to me, and if they didn't have elite accuracy, I didn't think they could be a franchise QB. Mechanics can be improved, but accuracy like Marino, Montana, Rodgers, whoever---it's innate. Some guys can just flick it. Pocket passing stats, and their improvement over a couple seasons, that's what we wanted to see out of QBs.
The NFL is different, it's wide open, DBs cannot touch WRs really anymore, linemen are scared of getting flags for burying the QB. That's all good news for athletic QBs. I am not so sure that accuracy is as important as it used to be, or maybe lack of pinpoint accuracy isn't the death blow I used to think it was.
A mobile, less accurate QB can be a 280 lb DT (no analogy is perfect). Maybe he cannot Joe Montana his way down the field, lofting passes over the heads of LBs, in front of safeties, to his big TE. But he can miss a pass badly on 2nd and 8, then evade three pass rushers on 3rd down, scramble outside, and toss an easy bomb to the WR who shook coverage after 6 long seconds. The goal is to score, and win games, not have a 70% completion percentage.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Other than them both being black I cannot understand why you would link AR with Vince Young. I have not seen any indications he has a learning disability or lacks processing abilities. As an aside, I'm not implying the R word, just noting bias can sometimes creep in without us being fully aware we're doing it, know what I'm saying?
Don't have any quantifiable measures like Wonderlic, GPA, entrance exam scores, et al. But I know he graduated high school in December of his senior year and enrolled early at Florida. In my experience athletes who do that are generally very capable in the classroom and ambitious about pursing their degree.
Side note, when AR was in high school, he spent a lot of time at a local firehouse and completed EMS training in the fall of his senior year. He first began training at the Academy of Fire and Emergency Medical Services as a h.s. freshman. For Richardson , the firehouse was a respite from the pressures of being a highly recruited athlete. He learned about leadership in an environment where people weren't especially interested in what he could do with a football. That tells me a lot about what a well rounded person he is, and one who looks outside himself in trying to help others. That level of self-awareness is uncommon in teenagers.
WRT coaching - his first coach preferred to start the more experienced Kyle Trask, and the Tampa Bay backup threw for like 4400 yards and 43 TDs. Same coach opted to start the 2021 season with Emory Jones, a redshirt junior who is also a dual threat QB. Less accomplished of a runner, but marginally better at not turning the ball over. AR threw 5 interceptions in only 64 attempts (2 starts) - his interception rate was twice that of the starter. Seems those two years were a bit of a waste in terms of development. Florida fired their HC and Jones transferred to Arizona.
2022 was his first season as a starter. Remember, he had knee surgery December 2021, but played well in the Blue an Orange Spring game in April (18-24-207-2 + 1 rushing TD) to solidify his starting spot.
In my opinion - from afar, doing research because I don't pay attention to Gainesville - it seems like the issues are related primarily to time on task. Never easy to switch HC and systems. Then again, not beating out Jones his Sophomore year seems like a bit of a red flag, right?
Regardless, seems like a bright kid, grounded, has been slow to develop, but has enormous physical traits. Threw a touchdown 68 yards in the air in his high school championship game - the big arm has always been there. Statistically, ranked very good in throws that traveled over 15 yards during 2022. The accuracy and stats got worse and worse as you break them down to 11-15 and under 10 yards.
Chaka
Footballguy
I keep seeing Jamarcus Russell's name thrown out as a comp to Richardson and it makes zero sense.
Jamarcus was a statue who's accuracy actually improved significantly each year in college. Richardson is a highly mobile quarterback whose game is predicated on that mobility and putting pressure on defenses with his physicality. That wasn't JaMarcus's game at all he stood in the pocket and delivered and strikes.
Josh Allen and Terrell Pryor are much better comps for Richardson than Jamarcus.
Jamarcus was a statue who's accuracy actually improved significantly each year in college. Richardson is a highly mobile quarterback whose game is predicated on that mobility and putting pressure on defenses with his physicality. That wasn't JaMarcus's game at all he stood in the pocket and delivered and strikes.
Josh Allen and Terrell Pryor are much better comps for Richardson than Jamarcus.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Rotoworld is reporting that scouts have between a first and fourth round grade on him. I am firmly in the fourth round camp.
Birdie048
Footballguy
@BobbyLayne - thanks for the info. That EMS info is a good side note.
I was not making the implication but asking if he was uncoachable or lacks intelligence to learn an NFL playbook
It was my fault for asking the question in a poor manner.
I was not making the implication but asking if he was uncoachable or lacks intelligence to learn an NFL playbook
It was my fault for asking the question in a poor manner.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
all good brother man, and I def did not mean to offend in any way in my reply
as others have said, dude just hasn't had enough reps
massraider
Footballguy
These are the kinds of tweets I love, a little context added to the 'what I see on YouTube highlights'
Super interesting, and really the definition of boom/bust, no?
Super interesting, and really the definition of boom/bust, no?
massraider
Footballguy
That list also includes two guys that a LOT of people got wrong: Lamar/Allen
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
It’s almost like some are scouting him on physical attributes alone, monumentally discounting the need for football, IQ, experience, ability to read a defense, make check downs, and basically lead a team at the most important position on the field.
But but, but but he looks like Cam Newton!
Some team is going to hurt their franchise by drafting this guy in the first round. Lord, help them if they trade up to do so.
massraider
Footballguy
Kind of buried the lede there with that tweet, but ONLY 4 of 39 first round QBs were less than 60%.
Meaning RIchardson is in crazy outlier territory for success.
Meaning RIchardson is in crazy outlier territory for success.
The Frankman
Footballguy
-OZ-
Footballguy
last year many of these experts had Willis going to the lions high in the first.I think in today's NFL you have a small window to acheive success. Years ago teams allowed players in particular QB's more time to develop. After the top 15 there is a significant drop off. So the reast of the team's are desperately hoping for a player who can both quickly acclimate to the NFL level as well as having the physical attributes and other intangibles. It's tough when you add that teams defensive coordinators quickly see weaknesses as well. Good luck. But I think a players ability to quickly learn the cerebral part of the game is something that has been overlooked somewhat in my opinion. Just my two cents.I think it's as simple as, he hasn't played much. You gotta project, hope he develops.
He's not a polished, experienced passer, with 30 games of SEC starting experience. He's started 13 games, I think? He had 64 passes the previous season? As a true sophomore. He's raw. We have people trying to piece the mystery together of how his completion percentage went down from the previous season, when he had 64 attempts! Sorry, that's an investigation not worth having. And I think with any QB, comparing the downside with head cases isn't productive. Vince or JaMarcus, that's like saying the downside for Bryce Young as an undersized QB is Johnny Manziel. Not calling out you or @Penguin here, just saying that if Bryce Young develops a scorching cocaine habit, his downside is Johnny Manziel.
Maybe his downside is Jake Locker. Still a bust, without being a train wreck. So it's a massive projection. Well, I dunno, maybe not massive.
I think people evaluate QBs in one way only, meaning a QB must have this this this and this. Other positions get evaluated, and there are different types of WR, TE, DT, and DE. So if the 280 lb DT is an insane pass rusher, but gets pushed around on the goalline, no one cares, because he does this thing better than anyone, so we will deal with his deficiency in the running game, because he helps us win.
20 years ago, accuracy was #1 to me, and if they didn't have elite accuracy, I didn't think they could be a franchise QB. Mechanics can be improved, but accuracy like Marino, Montana, Rodgers, whoever---it's innate. Some guys can just flick it. Pocket passing stats, and their improvement over a couple seasons, that's what we wanted to see out of QBs.
The NFL is different, it's wide open, DBs cannot touch WRs really anymore, linemen are scared of getting flags for burying the QB. That's all good news for athletic QBs. I am not so sure that accuracy is as important as it used to be, or maybe lack of pinpoint accuracy isn't the death blow I used to think it was.
A mobile, less accurate QB can be a 280 lb DT (no analogy is perfect). Maybe he cannot Joe Montana his way down the field, lofting passes over the heads of LBs, in front of safeties, to his big TE. But he can miss a pass badly on 2nd and 8, then evade three pass rushers on 3rd down, scramble outside, and toss an easy bomb to the WR who shook coverage after 6 long seconds. The goal is to score, and win games, not have a 70% completion percentage.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
NFL Rookie Watch
@NFLRookieWatxh
Multiple NFL scouts reportedly believe Anthony Richardson “won’t” make it out of the Top-10.
Several scouts believe Richardson can follow in the same footsteps Josh Allen set 5 years ago.
The last time Florida had a QB selected in the Top-10 of the NFL Draft was 56 YEARS AGO
@NFLRookieWatxh
Multiple NFL scouts reportedly believe Anthony Richardson “won’t” make it out of the Top-10.
Several scouts believe Richardson can follow in the same footsteps Josh Allen set 5 years ago.
The last time Florida had a QB selected in the Top-10 of the NFL Draft was 56 YEARS AGO
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Kinda tough to avoid asking the QB to be in a position where he needs to hit the broad side of a barn.
Chaka
Footballguy
Willis doesn't seem like a great comp. For starters Willis was significantly more accurate coming out (62.8% to 54.7%).
And Richardson is a giant of a man compared to Willis (6'4", 236 lbs to 6'1", 215lbs).
The only similarity is they are both capable runners.
Josh Allen & Terrell Pryor seem like better comps for size, physicality and struggles with accuracy in college.
Chaka
Footballguy
Because of this thread I keep looking back at Terrelle Pryor's career and can't stop SMDH.
Man, if Pryor was coming out of college in 2023 he would have to be the consensus #1 overall pick, right? Great size, athleticism, overcame early issues with accuracy, tons of experience against top competition...etc.
Such a shame he came out when he did and landed with the team he did.
Man, if Pryor was coming out of college in 2023 he would have to be the consensus #1 overall pick, right? Great size, athleticism, overcame early issues with accuracy, tons of experience against top competition...etc.
Such a shame he came out when he did and landed with the team he did.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Elderly coaches and owners should reconsider because that much patience would exceed their life expectancy.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
If Josh Allen had been another bust no one would be interested in Richardson. But people are willing to give Richardson a pass because his profile and stats are so similar to Allen's. But Allen of course ended up succeeding IN SPITE of those things, not because of them.
As a lifelong Gators fan (and also Eastside high school alumni, Richardson's high school), Richardson is less accurate and less adept at reading defenses than Tim Tebow was in college.
He's a physical monster, but nothing close to anything resembling a good or even average football player currently.
5% chance Richardson turns into an NFL superstar. 95% chance he's a complete bust.
As a lifelong Gators fan (and also Eastside high school alumni, Richardson's high school), Richardson is less accurate and less adept at reading defenses than Tim Tebow was in college.
He's a physical monster, but nothing close to anything resembling a good or even average football player currently.
5% chance Richardson turns into an NFL superstar. 95% chance he's a complete bust.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Going from Wyoming to Buffalo, Allen obviously got an upgrade in coaching. It will be interesting to see what NFL team the Florida QB ends up with. I can't think of a position where landing spot means more.
I think it also has a lot to do with QB's like Mahomes and Cam.
Cam from a physical/experience standpoint and fwiw a lot of people were comping Allen to Cam when he came into the league.
Mahomes not due to passing ability but because I think he changed the way some scouts think, Allen as well, and that change was getting scouts to focus more on the "wow" plays a QB make in their valuation of them. To basically de-emphasize or not get as caught up in the negatives and accentuate the rare traits a player might have and what some development could make that QB become.
massraider
Footballguy
Bringing up Cam Newton, I'm seeing that as well.
That's where people are looking at a black guy, with that size, and he's the first name they have. Richardson should not even be mentioned in the same breath. Cam was as dominant a college QB for one season that you could find. Carried an SEC team on his back, and was pretty much able to do whatever he wanted.
Starting to feel like wishcastingby draft media regarding these QBs
That's where people are looking at a black guy, with that size, and he's the first name they have. Richardson should not even be mentioned in the same breath. Cam was as dominant a college QB for one season that you could find. Carried an SEC team on his back, and was pretty much able to do whatever he wanted.
Starting to feel like wishcastingby draft media regarding these QBs
jm192
Footballguy
He's a terrible passer. If it wasn't for the size and wheels, no one would be interested in the kid.
I agree with @FreeBaGeL , there's an Astronomical chance this kid busts.
I'm a life long Kentucky fan. Richardson looked so far below average in his game against them. And don't get me wrong--Kentucky's defense was actually pretty good. But to watch a guy go 14 of 35 and hear him talked about as a top 10 pick is wild.
That's not his only bad game. 9 for 27 vs FSU.
We need that Meme with Michael B Jordan saying "This is your king?!"
I agree with @FreeBaGeL , there's an Astronomical chance this kid busts.
I'm a life long Kentucky fan. Richardson looked so far below average in his game against them. And don't get me wrong--Kentucky's defense was actually pretty good. But to watch a guy go 14 of 35 and hear him talked about as a top 10 pick is wild.
That's not his only bad game. 9 for 27 vs FSU.
We need that Meme with Michael B Jordan saying "This is your king?!"
-OZ-
Footballguy
Being an NFL evaluator must be the easiest job in America. Other than “influencer” Except you don’t have to be attractive. That’s the easiest statement made.
-OZ-
Footballguy
AR is the most inconsistent player. Like maddeningly so. Dude has a few highlights but he never took over a game, never rose to the occasion, I don’t recall ever seeing a full game from him where he impressed.
I stand by my earlier comment - dude it’s closer to Malik Willis than Josh Allen.
I might change my mind if a coach like Sean Peyton got him.
More likely, Arthur smith gets to try.
NFL Rookie Watch @NFLRookieWatxh
Several NFL scouts reportedly believe Anthony Richardson has the “highest” ceiling of any QB in the Draft.
ESPN’s Matt Miller reported earlier that the Panthers seem to be “all in” on the Florida QB.
The Panthers currently hold the 9th overall pick in the NFL Draft
NFL Rookie Watch @NFLRookieWatxh
Some notable teams Anthony Richardson has met with at the NFL Combine:
Panthers, Giants, Lions, Falcons, Colts, Ravens, Raiders, Saints, Patriots.
The Florida QB is making his rounds
Anthony Richardson is said to be crushing the interview process at the Combine "I talked to a handful of scouts last night ... Every single one of them said 'Anthony Richardson is the best QB interview they've had this year.'" —
@nfldraftscout
He said the qbs this year and last year included
@nfldraftscout
He said the qbs this year and last year included
Capella
Footballguy
They’ll be fired because they drafted a third-string tight end with a top-10 pick?
massraider
Footballguy
Is Seattle not the perfect team to draft him?
Chaka
Footballguy
Depends on what happens with Geno.
ATM they need defensive help a lot more than a 2nd string QB.
Good luck to him answering every Gm's questions. He'll ace everything athletically and he'll be a nice guy n all, that's expected. This is like pass the final exam and we may make you our franchise's future and pay you millions.
I have no idea about this guy's ability to answer these but it reminds me of when the wonderlic tests were such a huge deal.
I have no idea about this guy's ability to answer these but it reminds me of when the wonderlic tests were such a huge deal.
Yeah Pete Carroll did a terrific job "making due." They need to fill holes on that roster
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