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QB Deshaun Watson, CLE (1 Viewer)

A question regarding "corroborating evidence".............if each of the 22 people have their own story and nobody that can vouch for that is that considered corroborating evidence by the legal definition or is it just signaling a pattern and the jury is to weight it however they see fit?


Corroborating evidence means they all, individually, told the DA (or whomever they reported it to) that an assault occurred. 

If their stories match, it describes a pattern of behavior from Watson, for one. For another they could have described a specific behavior not publicly disclosed. They could have also identified a distinguishing physical trait. There are a number of other things that they could have seen, experienced or said. 

What makes it corroborating evidence is if they are all separately saying the same thing with details that match. 

I think this is where my disconnect is.  If these are totally separate instances each one is he-said/she said.  The multiple complaints then show a pattern but does that mean it is "corroborating evidence" since they aren't the same event?


See above. It certainly might. 

 
Corroborating evidence means they all, individually, told the DA (or whomever they reported it to) that an assault occurred. 

If their stories match, it describes a pattern of behavior from Watson, for one. For another they could have described a specific behavior not publicly disclosed. They could have also identified a distinguishing physical trait. There are a number of other things that they could have seen, experienced or said. 

What makes it corroborating evidence is if they are all separately saying the same thing with details that match. 


I am not a lawyer but it seems like you need to have the same story about the same event for it to be "corroborating evidence".  Having a similar/same story for two different events is just a pattern but not "corroborating evidence" of the first crime. 

 
I am not a lawyer but it seems like you need to have the same story about the same event for it to be "corroborating evidence".  Having a similar/same story for two different events is just a pattern but not "corroborating evidence" of the first crime. 


As long as relevant details match, it is considered "the same" - not every story will match identically. Maybe one of the incidents he was wearing boxers & put Mr Happy through the hole. Maybe another he was wearing tighty whiteys and stripped bare. We don't know what we don't know. 

But in this context, so long as many of the stories are similar, then it is indeed corroborating evidence. 

Also worth noting that sexual predators often escalate their behavior over time. So it's even possible that all 22 stories have different elements to them, each with a different type or level of assault. I'm not a psychologist, but I have read about this subject a bit. It's similar to serial killers. Sexual predators need to do this as they don't get off on the same behavior over and over again. I mean, some do, sure. But serial predators often get worse and worse. 

The point is that the stories don't have to match up perfectly.  

 
UPDATE: Houston Texans Star QB Deshaun Watson's Attorney Rusty Hardin read messages from one of the accusers.

Rusty Said, “I’m gonna read to you text messages that she sent Deshaun Watson the very day after the massage that she says so traumatized her.”

(Accuser) Lawson: “Hey Deshaun. Just wanted to say thank you for trusting me with your massage today. I’ll be here till January 3rd if you’d like to get another one.”

Another text message said, (Accuser) Lawson: “I hope all is well. I just want to say I apologize for my actions. That was not me and if I could take back that moment..I would. I really devalued my integrity and profession. My sessions have never went like that..I feel really horrible as a person.”

More of this case will present itself as Houston Police Department runs its own investigation.

 
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As long as relevant details match, it is considered "the same" - not every story will match identically. Maybe one of the incidents he was wearing boxers & put Mr Happy through the hole. Maybe another he was wearing tighty whiteys and stripped bare. We don't know what we don't know. 

But in this context, so long as many of the stories are similar, then it is indeed corroborating evidence. 

Also worth noting that sexual predators often escalate their behavior over time. So it's even possible that all 22 stories have different elements to them, each with a different type or level of assault. I'm not a psychologist, but I have read about this subject a bit. It's similar to serial killers. Sexual predators need to do this as they don't get off on the same behavior over and over again. I mean, some do, sure. But serial predators often get worse and worse. 

The point is that the stories don't have to match up perfectly.  


I know that stories don't have to matchup perfectly for either situation (pattern or corroboration) however I would think corroboration would have to pertain to the exact same crime........not different crimes.  Each count is a different crime (same charge but a different criminal event).  

 
I know that stories don't have to matchup perfectly for either situation (pattern or corroboration) however I would think corroboration would have to pertain to the exact same crime........not different crimes.  Each count is a different crime (same charge but a different criminal event).  
The same crime committed numerous times is the same crime. 

Bank robber robs 5 banks. Witnesses at each of the 5 banks independently report that he wore Haynes panties over his head & moreover, remembered the phrases he used & that he smelled of CC’s Obsession for Men. 

Pattern, witnesses, corroboration. 

 
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UPDATE: Houston Texans Star QB Deshaun Watson's Attorney Rusty Hardin read messages from one of the accusers.

Rusty Said, “I’m gonna read to you text messages that she sent Deshaun Watson the very day after the massage that she says so traumatized her.”

(Accuser) Lawson: “Hey Deshaun. Just wanted to say thank you for trusting me with your massage today. I’ll be here till January 3rd if you’d like to get another one.”

Another text message said, (Accuser) Lawson: “I hope all is well. I just want to say I apologize for my actions. That was not me and if I could take back that moment..I would. I really devalued my integrity and profession. My sessions have never went like that..I feel really horrible as a person.”

More of this case will present itself as Houston Police Department runs its own investigation.
Certainly seems unorthodox for the attorney to be making these text messages public. 🤔 

 
The same crime committed numerous times is the same crime. 

Bank robber robs 5 banks. Witnesses at each of the 5 banks independently report that he wore Haynes panties over his head & moreover, remembered the phrases he used & that he smelled of CC’s Obsession for Men. 

Pattern, witnesses, corroboration. 


That is a pattern and the individual evidence at each crime is corroborative.  .  Multiple witnesses at each crime can corroborate that particular bank robbery.  

This is a single witness of each crime.  The story can go to pattern but I don't think it can go to the other crime itself.  

Maybe an actual lawyer can chime in and actually clear this up?  @Zow help???  I have no idea if you can clear it up but you are at least in the law field....hahahah)

 
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That is a pattern and the individual evidence at each crime is corroborative.  .  Multiple witnesses at each crime can corroborate that particular bank robbery.  

This is a single witness of each crime.  The story can go to pattern but I don't think it can go to the other crime itself.  

Maybe an actual lawyer can chime in and actually clear this up?  @Zow help???  I have no idea if you can clear it up but you are at least in the law field....hahahah)
I think there’s very little distinction between multiple witnesses at the same crime and a single witness at each of the multiple (same) crimes. If a single witness at each of the 5 bank robberies identified the same assailant & gave details about them, that’s also corroboration. 

Your argument here could best be described as “splitting legal hairs”, is the term i’ve heard.  

but sure, I’m all ears if an attorney wants to weigh in on this. 

 
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Hot Sauce Guy said:
Certainly seems unorthodox for the attorney to be making these text messages public. 🤔 
Not at all actually. The way he's being assumed guilty already in the court of public opinion I think its pretty smart. 

 
Not at all actually. The way he's being assumed guilty already in the court of public opinion I think its pretty smart. 
Well of course, it’s an old trick to poison the potential jury pool.

it just doesn’t seem kosher if this is privileged information/private communication. 

but then I don’t know if TX is a “2-party state” when it comes to releasing private conversations. 

 
Well of course, it’s an old trick to poison the potential jury pool.

it just doesn’t seem kosher if this is privileged information/private communication. 

but then I don’t know if TX is a “2-party state” when it comes to releasing private conversations. 


google says Texas is a one-party consent state, which means you can record a conversation you are a part of without telling the other person in the conversation that you are recording them.

 
I worked in a state with the same law.  Not a horrible law.  Worked quite well.  Say what you mean, mean what you say.  

I understand things can be taken out of context, but there are ways to prove that.
It’s all good until it’s your conversation being recorded then released without your consent. 

there’s quite a bit more to it than “meaning what you say” - confidential conversations should remain so. If there’s no expectation of privacy it creates a much different situation regardless of whether business or personal. 

 
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It’s all good until it’s your conversation being recorded then released without your consent. 

there’s quite a bit more to it than “meaning what you say” - confidential conversations should remain so. If there’s no expectation of privacy it creates a much different situation regardless of whether business or personal. 
I worked with that for years so I am quite familiar with it.  

You don't have to teach/preach to me about its all good until its your conversation. I chose to always act with integrity and my words mean something.

 
I worked with that for years so I am quite familiar with it.  

You don't have to teach/preach to me about its all good until its your conversation. I chose to always act with integrity and my words mean something.
But you don’t know if the other party shares your level of integrity, or might exploit a private conversation for personal or professional gain. 

Fundamentally I agree with you, and do the same.  However, your own level of integrity is entirely irrelevant to why 1 l-party laws are terrible. 

I’m sure you ride to work on a white stallion, handing out 💰 to the poor every day. But just because you mean what you say & say what you mean doesn’t insulate you from someone who isn’t as wholesome and pure. 

 
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But you don’t know if the other party shares your level of integrity, or might exploit a private conversation for personal or professional gain. 

Fundamentally I agree with you, and do the same.  However, your own level of integrity is entirely irrelevant to why 1 l-party laws are terrible. 

I’m sure you ride to work on a white stallion, handing out 💰 to the poor every day. But just because you mean what you say & say what you mean doesn’t insulate you from someone who isn’t as wholesome and pure. 
I am not going to get into a debate with you about this, I have lived it and agree with it. 38 states have the same law.  You have a personal belief about it and threw out your opinion, "horrible law." Its not.

 
Gally said:
That is a pattern and the individual evidence at each crime is corroborative.  .  Multiple witnesses at each crime can corroborate that particular bank robbery.  

This is a single witness of each crime.  The story can go to pattern but I don't think it can go to the other crime itself.  

Maybe an actual lawyer can chime in and actually clear this up?  @Zow help???  I have no idea if you can clear it up but you are at least in the law field....hahahah)
Will try to address when I have some free moments. This scenario can be confusing and complicated. 

 
google says Texas is a one-party consent state, which means you can record a conversation you are a part of without telling the other person in the conversation that you are recording them.
The OP said this was a text message. If so, it's my understanding a text message is not the same as a phone call, and would not be subject to 1 or 2 party consent laws. Believe I read a text is the same as mailing a letter or leaving a voicemail, which are owned by its recipient. A sender has no reasonable expectation of privacy, unlike an individual having a verbal conversation using a phone. A text message is always "recorded."

 
Well of course, it’s an old trick to poison the potential jury pool.

it just doesn’t seem kosher if this is privileged information/private communication. 

but then I don’t know if TX is a “2-party state” when it comes to releasing private conversations. 
“Privileged information” is not applicable here. Generally that applies to communications between the attorney and their client.

I don’t like the attorneys trying the cases in public like this but I don’t think there’s any legal or ethical violations here (admittedly not 100% sure on that). Once you hit send on a text message you lose any expectations of privacy. Especially once you threaten legal action since it will certainly become part of the public record at some point.

 
I don’t like the attorneys trying the cases in public like this but I don’t think there’s any legal or ethical violations here (admittedly not 100% sure on that). 
It's nothing to like or dislike IMHO. Jane Doe #3 filed a public suit, publically alleging "Watson forced her to perform oral sex during a massage in December of 2020. She claimed she blacked out from fear and now suffers from panic attacks, anxiety and depression." Now, if unspeakable allegations in lawsuits are made to be confidential until trial, then we can have the debate whether it is right or wrong to present a defense publically. 

 
It's nothing to like or dislike IMHO. Jane Doe #3 filed a public suit, publically alleging "Watson forced her to perform oral sex during a massage in December of 2020. She claimed she blacked out from fear and now suffers from panic attacks, anxiety and depression." Now, if unspeakable allegations in lawsuits are made to be confidential until trial, then we can have the debate whether it is right or wrong to present a defense publically. 
It's something to dislike, imo. 

 
It's something to dislike, imo. 
Fair enough. JMHO, it's easier to have that stance when not subject to the consequences. If you were in Watson's shoes (same allegation, same text exchange), do you dislike it so much that you ask your attorney to sit on it for 14 months until trial? 

 
“Privileged information” is not applicable here. Generally that applies to communications between the attorney and their client.
I am aware of that term & how it applies to attorneys, yes.

but in this case it depends on the state and whether text messages are considered “1-party” or “2-party” consent.

that’s what I meant by that. Apologies for my poor choice of wording. 

I don’t like the attorneys trying the cases in public like this but I don’t think there’s any legal or ethical violations here (admittedly not 100% sure on that). Once you hit send on a text message you lose any expectations of privacy. Especially once you threaten legal action since it will certainly become part of the public record at some point.
texas is a 1-party state, but that’s generally about recording phone calls.

as @BigJim®pointed out, texts may be different. 

 
I am not a lawyer but it seems like you need to have the same story about the same event for it to be "corroborating evidence".  Having a similar/same story for two different events is just a pattern but not "corroborating evidence" of the first crime. 
generally, corroborating evidence is any evidence that makes one version of a story / testimony / statement more likely to be true than it would be without the corroborating evidence. Of course there may be, and often are, rules to prevent certain evidence from being admitted. And exceptions to those rules. 

Horrible law, but I’d assumed this was the case since the attorney is releasing the texts. 
horrible rule for sex, fine rule for recordings. (Video recordings of sex acts are a criminal act without the consent of both parties)  

Always assume your calls and texts, zoom meetings, etc are being recorded. 
there are probably exceptions but generally in one party consent states, texts can be released by one party. Some two party consent states allow one party to release the text. 

 
Always assume your calls and texts, zoom meetings, etc are being recorded. 
there are probably exceptions but generally in one party consent states, texts can be released by one party. Some two party consent states allow one party to release the text. 
I did some poking around (hey, it’s a Friday) and confirmed texts area not covered by one party/two party laws. The one narrow area protected today is revenge porn - new laws recently enacted that were needed because this is an otherwise unregulated area. These types of laws just don’t work for this technology. How in the world would one disclose to all possible unknown text senders residing in 2 party states that you will record their communication? You can’t receive a text and have it not be recorded. Remember, it is the act of recording that is regulated, not the act of sharing what you recorded. That’s just how people get caught.

Zoom and webex are untested (I think) but think most would agree they are the type of electronic communication covered by these laws. The technologies themselves think they are, as they have settings which prompt ‘This meeting is being recorded.’ Funny story, I was on one contract dispute on a webex hosted by another company where they did not prompt the message (Illinois and Texas employees only) and they had an oh crap moment and abruptly ended the call when they realized one employee on our side WFH out of a two party state. Very dangerous to assume no need to disclose when you have attendees from various states.

 
That is a pattern and the individual evidence at each crime is corroborative.  .  Multiple witnesses at each crime can corroborate that particular bank robbery.  

This is a single witness of each crime.  The story can go to pattern but I don't think it can go to the other crime itself.  

Maybe an actual lawyer can chime in and actually clear this up?  @Zow help???  I have no idea if you can clear it up but you are at least in the law field....hahahah)
Sorry, was busy the last couple of days. Additionally, since I frankly have my own cases concerning similar fact patterns and because I no longer own Watson in any dynasty leagues, I haven't been focusing on the Watson saga all that much so had to review. 

The issue being discussed here - whether prior bad acts can be admitted to prove a later in time allegation - is a complicated one with no easy answer. Frankly, both of your thought processes are not terribly off-base. Further, since this appears to be a Texas case and I'm not licensed in Texas, I am not going to try to interpret Texas law. This is important to note because Texas may have a particular law or a particular court case setting a legal precedent that I'm not aware of. 

In short, prior bad act evidence are generally inadmissible because prior bad acts likely are not relevant enough to outweigh the inherent prejudice they would have against a defendant in a trial. Also, courts tend to want to dissuade their admissions because it could create a trial within a trial (where a defendant would naturally have the desire and quite possibly the right) to defend himself against the prior alleged bad act and the trial goes longer than anticipated, juries may get confused, etc. Accordingly, usually courts will not admit prior bad act evidence because there is a loose correllation at best between the commission of a previous one and the state should not be alleviated of its burden to prove a subsequent offense beyond a reasonable doubt. 

However, at least in my jurisdiction, prior bad acts may be admissible for other purposes, such as proof of motive, opportunity, intent, preparation, plan, knowledge, identity, or absence of mistake or accident. Additionally, in my jurisdiction, there is a carve out exception for alleged sex offenses (whether criminal or civil) whereby prior bad acts could prove a character trait. Those bad acts must still be evaluated by a judge through a multi-factor analysis and, ultimately, the evidence must still be probative (meaningful) enough that it is not substantially outweighted by the prejudice to the defendant. 

Here, assuming the eyewitness accounts are so similar that Watson has a particular modus operandi (MO) for how he commits the crimes, I could see a very good argument for its admission and would think a judge would provide a jury instruction explaining to the jury that the evidence shows a pattern but the jury must still find that the state met its burden of proof for all of the elements of the alleged crime they are deciding about. That said, the defense will almost certainly raise the issue before trial and the matter will be argued about and decided by a judge beforehand. 

 
I did some poking around (hey, it’s a Friday) and confirmed texts area not covered by one party/two party laws. The one narrow area protected today is revenge porn - new laws recently enacted that were needed because this is an otherwise unregulated area. These types of laws just don’t work for this technology. How in the world would one disclose to all possible unknown text senders residing in 2 party states that you will record their communication? You can’t receive a text and have it not be recorded. Remember, it is the act of recording that is regulated, not the act of sharing what you recorded. That’s just how people get caught.

Zoom and webex are untested (I think) but think most would agree they are the type of electronic communication covered by these laws. The technologies themselves think they are, as they have settings which prompt ‘This meeting is being recorded.’ Funny story, I was on one contract dispute on a webex hosted by another company where they did not prompt the message (Illinois and Texas employees only) and they had an oh crap moment and abruptly ended the call when they realized one employee on our side WFH out of a two party state. Very dangerous to assume no need to disclose when you have attendees from various states.
This is pretty good input here. 

1. Per texts, I don't think and my experience hasn't shown that they fall under the recording statutes even if two-way. 

2. Even in two-way states, if party A unlawfully records party B it may not mean that party A cannot use the recording in litigation against party B. Generally, for evidence to be excluded because it was unlawfully obtained, the entity doing the investigating would need to be a state actor. In a messy divorce case, party A could still be charged criminally I suppose for recording party B but still be able to use the recording at a divorce trial. 

3. Because of the uncertainty of these laws and the remedy available to a victim, I advise all of my new clients to assume everything they say, write, videochat, blog, etc. could wind up in front of a judge but for communications with me and/or my office that are made in private. 

 
Sorry, was busy the last couple of days. Additionally, since I frankly have my own cases concerning similar fact patterns and because I no longer own Watson in any dynasty leagues, I haven't been focusing on the Watson saga all that much so had to review. 

The issue being discussed here - whether prior bad acts can be admitted to prove a later in time allegation - is a complicated one with no easy answer. Frankly, both of your thought processes are not terribly off-base. Further, since this appears to be a Texas case and I'm not licensed in Texas, I am not going to try to interpret Texas law. This is important to note because Texas may have a particular law or a particular court case setting a legal precedent that I'm not aware of. 

In short, prior bad act evidence are generally inadmissible because prior bad acts likely are not relevant enough to outweigh the inherent prejudice they would have against a defendant in a trial. Also, courts tend to want to dissuade their admissions because it could create a trial within a trial (where a defendant would naturally have the desire and quite possibly the right) to defend himself against the prior alleged bad act and the trial goes longer than anticipated, juries may get confused, etc. Accordingly, usually courts will not admit prior bad act evidence because there is a loose correllation at best between the commission of a previous one and the state should not be alleviated of its burden to prove a subsequent offense beyond a reasonable doubt. 

However, at least in my jurisdiction, prior bad acts may be admissible for other purposes, such as proof of motive, opportunity, intent, preparation, plan, knowledge, identity, or absence of mistake or accident. Additionally, in my jurisdiction, there is a carve out exception for alleged sex offenses (whether criminal or civil) whereby prior bad acts could prove a character trait. Those bad acts must still be evaluated by a judge through a multi-factor analysis and, ultimately, the evidence must still be probative (meaningful) enough that it is not substantially outweighted by the prejudice to the defendant. 

Here, assuming the eyewitness accounts are so similar that Watson has a particular modus operandi (MO) for how he commits the crimes, I could see a very good argument for its admission and would think a judge would provide a jury instruction explaining to the jury that the evidence shows a pattern but the jury must still find that the state met its burden of proof for all of the elements of the alleged crime they are deciding about. That said, the defense will almost certainly raise the issue before trial and the matter will be argued about and decided by a judge beforehand. 
Appreciate the detailed response. Interesting.

In this light, how do courts (in general, as I know states vary) handle a serial murderer or serial rapist? Those past acts seem to be a continuance of the same crime rather than “old acts”. 

Or do they prosecute each murder individually & focus on the ones with the most evidence to try to get a conviction? Or is it prosecuted as a group of crimes? 

 
Appreciate the detailed response. Interesting.

In this light, how do courts (in general, as I know states vary) handle a serial murderer or serial rapist? Those past acts seem to be a continuance of the same crime rather than “old acts”. 

Or do they prosecute each murder individually & focus on the ones with the most evidence to try to get a conviction? Or is it prosecuted as a group of crimes? 
Usually, the state will charge one separate crime at a time - or, at the very least, limit the crimes alleged to a particular date or nucleus of fact (e.g. each victim is a separate case for a serial killer). There are both evidentiary and strategy reasons for this. 

However, the above is not required and I have seen indictments - especially ones where the state maybe cannot pinpoint a particular date - where multiple allegations of a similar nature are made over a period of time (usually less than one year). In my experience, usually those indictments still all have the same victim in common (e.g. a sex abuse victim suffering multiple events of similar acts by a loved one over time) or stem from the same nucleus of fact (e.g. drug dealer selling drugs out of his home and caught during one single undercover operation). 

 
The Athletic's Aaron Reiss said QB Deshaun Watson could be a "healthy scratch" during the 2021 regular season. 

A bizarre and uncomfortable training camp could spill into the regular season if the NFL doesn't take action against Watson, who faces sexual assault allegations from 22 women. Watson has been present at Houston practices this month, often working with the third and fourth team offense, Reiss said on The Fantasy Authority podcast. The acrimony between Watson and head coach David Culley has been thick for months after Watson demanded a trade. As long as the criminal cases against Watson are active, the league can't interview him and therefore can't place Watson on the Commissioner's Exempt List. That would mean Watson could be on the Texans' roster this year, probably as a healthy scratch. Journeyman Tyrod Taylor will start the season under center for Houston. 

RELATED: 

Tyrod Taylor

SOURCE: The Fantasy Authority on Twitter 

Aug 26, 2021, 10:29 AM ET

 
Read the above and then got a twitter notification that Watson could soon be a Dolphin lol. Nobody knows

 
Read the above and then got a twitter notification that Watson could soon be a Dolphin lol. Nobody knows
Notification from who?

Searching for Watson and Dolphins on Twitter, I'm seeing some garbage from people I've never heard of that have a podcast, and are trying to grab some followers.

 
At this point, Watson is getting paid for this season and is getting no fines since he is not a holdout, so he is fine riding the bench and getting paid since he does not want to play for the Texans. Playing would also put him at injury risk which he does not want because it could limit the amount of teams interested in him if he got hurt.

The Texans were going to take the cap hit anyway, so they are fine with paying him, and playing him would put him at injury risk which could kill his trade value. Also, playing him could result in the Texans doing better this year which would result in a worst draft position which ultimately hurts the Texans rebuilding process. So the Texans are fine with him riding the bench and getting paid.

Deshaun is not scheduled to get deposed until February of 2022 so I don't think the legal cases get settled until the offseason or into next season. If Deshaun really wanted to settle, I think he would have done it already to get it out of the way. So yes, the likelihood at this point is Deshaun is on the roster this year but does not play.

 
at this point with a strong possibility that Watson could be charged/arrested criminally, the fact that he'll be a healthy scratch won't play for the Texans and if he's not charged criminally he'll likely be investigated and potentially suspended by the league why wouldn't the Texans just cut bait and deal to whoever will give them anything just to move on the from the distraction?

No team is going to give any real value with the potential cloud hanging over Watson so the Texans will just sit with him waiting for his value to go to zero.  It's a crappy situation for the Texans but sometimes you have to do what's best for the team and I can't see how holding onto that distraction all year benefits the team in any way.  Turn the page, move on and make him someone else's problem....

 
Banger said:
at this point with a strong possibility that Watson could be charged/arrested criminally, the fact that he'll be a healthy scratch won't play for the Texans and if he's not charged criminally he'll likely be investigated and potentially suspended by the league why wouldn't the Texans just cut bait and deal to whoever will give them anything just to move on the from the distraction?

No team is going to give any real value with the potential cloud hanging over Watson so the Texans will just sit with him waiting for his value to go to zero.  It's a crappy situation for the Texans but sometimes you have to do what's best for the team and I can't see how holding onto that distraction all year benefits the team in any way.  Turn the page, move on and make him someone else's problem....


So the owner McNair and his favorite lackey Easterby have moves on their resume that the fanbase holds against them: Trading away Clowney at the worst possible time so they got a poor return (plus they agreed to pay half his salary), Trading away Hopkins when they didn't have to and got pennies for the dollar in return, and releasing JJ Watt rather than try to trade him and get some minimal value. The last move really wasn't that bad but it represents another star player leaving with nothing to show for it. Now if they were to trade Watson for very little return right now, I think even they realize the fanbase may never come back. That doesn't mean it might not be the right move to make, just that they don't want that albatross around their necks. They are holding out hope that when all the legal stuff is decided, Deshaun will be cleared to play football and they can get reasonable value back for a top 5 QB under contract and relatively young. I still think there is a fairly good chance that either Deshaun isn't charged criminally or if he is charged, he is acquitted. Once the criminal stuff is decided I think he settles his civil cases and then the league will do whatever they feel they need to do. I think there is a reasonable chance that they can get reasonable value for Deshaun if they wait. 

 

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