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Ran a 10k in June (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter GStrot
- Start date
beer 30
Footballguy
FUBAR
Footballguy
Master's swim team is both worthwhile and frustrating as hell.
There were 6 of us in the pool today. 4 of them swam in college, two of those guys are a world ahead of me (I think they're still in their early 20s). another routinely finishes first (age group) out of the water in HIM and IMs. The fourth is just behind him (and is female). Then the 5th only swims 4-5 times per week and has for the past year plus. All of them except the tri-guy probably weigh 50 lbs more than I do, which doesn't really hurt for swimming. Needless to say, it's a humbling experience. I'm practically getting lapped in sets of 200-300.
But, I figure the training will do me some good if I stay with it.
There were 6 of us in the pool today. 4 of them swam in college, two of those guys are a world ahead of me (I think they're still in their early 20s). another routinely finishes first (age group) out of the water in HIM and IMs. The fourth is just behind him (and is female). Then the 5th only swims 4-5 times per week and has for the past year plus. All of them except the tri-guy probably weigh 50 lbs more than I do, which doesn't really hurt for swimming. Needless to say, it's a humbling experience. I'm practically getting lapped in sets of 200-300.
But, I figure the training will do me some good if I stay with it.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Week 2 of my 7 week cycle of including some intensity in my training, with my 2nd attempt at 1/2 mile repeats on the track today. I pushed the warmup up from 1 to 2 miles, then did the same 1/2 mile on, 1/4 mile recovery for four repeats, goal of 160-165 HR, that I did last week.
Last Week This Week
7:53 pace, 161 HR 7:30 pace, 157 HR
8:22 pace, 162 HR 7:51 pace, 155 HR (guess I should have pushed that harder)
8:44 pace, 164 HR 7:45 pace, 158 HR
9:04 pace, 165 HR 7:40 pace, 161 HR
Now obviously I don't think I improved that much in a week - it just goes to show how jacked my body was last week with all of the non-training stresses going on at the time, including just coming off an illness. I also feel like I don't really know how to run these things - with the HR as the guide it's hard, especially early, to get the HR up above 160. Doing so in those first two intervals had me pushing so hard that my breathing changed to the point there was a little audible gasp/wheeze with each breath. That seemed a little too hard so I dialed it back to just below that point. By interval 4 I was able to get to 160 pretty quickly and stay there.
My thinking is that over the next couple of weeks I'll add additional intervals, as well as push them out a bit longer. Maybe do 6 x 1/2 mile next week, 4 x 3/4 mile the following week, 8 x 1/2 mile the next, etc. But I'm kind of guessing here as I just haven't done this type of training before.
I will be doing a second workout weekly of intensity as well, and I'm still trying to determine the best plan for those. I do want to mix in hill repeats, with my initial thought finishing an easy run with a workout with really hard up (170 HR) for 90 seconds-2 minutes, then jog back down for 4-8 repeats. I also want to try some "tempo" runs where I'm at 155-160 (so just over my crossover point of 156) for 3 miles, that kind of thing, but based on the above I'm not sure I'll try that for a couple of weeks.
Any thoughts or suggestions?
Last Week This Week
7:53 pace, 161 HR 7:30 pace, 157 HR
8:22 pace, 162 HR 7:51 pace, 155 HR (guess I should have pushed that harder)
8:44 pace, 164 HR 7:45 pace, 158 HR
9:04 pace, 165 HR 7:40 pace, 161 HR
Now obviously I don't think I improved that much in a week - it just goes to show how jacked my body was last week with all of the non-training stresses going on at the time, including just coming off an illness. I also feel like I don't really know how to run these things - with the HR as the guide it's hard, especially early, to get the HR up above 160. Doing so in those first two intervals had me pushing so hard that my breathing changed to the point there was a little audible gasp/wheeze with each breath. That seemed a little too hard so I dialed it back to just below that point. By interval 4 I was able to get to 160 pretty quickly and stay there.
My thinking is that over the next couple of weeks I'll add additional intervals, as well as push them out a bit longer. Maybe do 6 x 1/2 mile next week, 4 x 3/4 mile the following week, 8 x 1/2 mile the next, etc. But I'm kind of guessing here as I just haven't done this type of training before.
I will be doing a second workout weekly of intensity as well, and I'm still trying to determine the best plan for those. I do want to mix in hill repeats, with my initial thought finishing an easy run with a workout with really hard up (170 HR) for 90 seconds-2 minutes, then jog back down for 4-8 repeats. I also want to try some "tempo" runs where I'm at 155-160 (so just over my crossover point of 156) for 3 miles, that kind of thing, but based on the above I'm not sure I'll try that for a couple of weeks.
Any thoughts or suggestions?
Ned
Footballguy
Awesome stuff, Duck! As you found out, it's hard to get that engine revving until you're good and warmed up. I'd keep doing what you're doing, and let the pace/effort dictate it. Just use the HR as a confirmation of what you're doing. I think as you work your way through this, you'll get better at pushing the effort. What's your max HR?
I'd treat the hill repeats just like today's track workout... 2mi warmup to your hill, then hammer out the hills at the same effort level as today. Then a 2mi cooldown.
For the intervals, I'd look at 400m intervals too. If you're feeling frisky, go for some 200's at 3200m race pace. Ladders are also a great workout. Something along the lines of 6x200, 4x400, 2x800, 4x400, 6x200.
I'd stretch the tempo mileage out longer as you get used to that effort level. 3mi is good to start, but wrap another 4mi of warmup/cooldown mileage to the run. I'm a huge fan of these runs (Pfitz inspired).
Any thoughts on.......................... racing a 5K? There's no better workout for speed than actually racing.
I'd treat the hill repeats just like today's track workout... 2mi warmup to your hill, then hammer out the hills at the same effort level as today. Then a 2mi cooldown.
For the intervals, I'd look at 400m intervals too. If you're feeling frisky, go for some 200's at 3200m race pace. Ladders are also a great workout. Something along the lines of 6x200, 4x400, 2x800, 4x400, 6x200.
I'd stretch the tempo mileage out longer as you get used to that effort level. 3mi is good to start, but wrap another 4mi of warmup/cooldown mileage to the run. I'm a huge fan of these runs (Pfitz inspired).
Any thoughts on.......................... racing a 5K? There's no better workout for speed than actually racing.
MAC_32
Footballguy
level one is recovery speed, greater than eight minute miles, if longer than four miles somewhere between nine and ten minute miles. Level two barely breaks a sweat if less than seventy degrees. Heart rate normalizes almost immediately. Closer to eight minute miles than seven. Close to nine minute miles on runs longer than six miles.Level three is uncomfortable but not stressful. Sometimes the last few minutes if I didn't pace properly i get fatigued. That's it though. Takes a few minutes after to normalize heart rate but I can carry on a conversation.
Level four is just short of hell. I get to my max threshold but ins t ead of pushing through like race day that's when I'll take the foot off the gas. Cannot carry a conversation for a good few minutes after and heart rate takes a while to normalize.
Ned
Footballguy
I think you fall into the typical trap of too many so-so/stuck-in-between workouts. Slow down your long/easy runs, and speed up your hard workouts. All of your long runs should be Level 2. If you're effort is uncomfortable at all during a long run, you're going too fast.
While I think there's a place for fartlek runs (the short on-off runs you have at 5K pace), I don't think they should be a staple. They're good to mix things up every once in a while, but I think intervals are a much more efficient workout. 800m intervals @ 5K race pace would serve you well there.
Be careful stacking a hill workout and a speed workout back to back. You're essentially doing the same thing 2 days in a row (6/2 and 6/3 as an example). Would you bench press 2 days in a row?
Ideally, you shouldn't have more than 1 tempo and 1 speed work session per week. The remainder should be Level 1 or Level 2 running, with the obvious long run somewhere in there at Level 2. Level 3 sounds close to tempo pace, but it should be a bit more uncomfortable. As grue put it best - 'comfortably uncomfortable'. You should be working a bit, but be able to quickly recover from it during your cool down. If you're gassed during the cooldown, you likely pushed it too hard. Like I said to Duck, the Pfitz tempo runs are fantastic for this - 8 mi with 4LT (level 3). 2 mi warmup, 4LT miles, then 2 mi cooldown.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Thanks for the feedback, Ned. Remember that my goal isn't necessarily to get faster on the short stuff and develop 5K speed, my races are typically 4+ hours after all. I'm looking to develop my woefully underdeveloped anaerobic system a bit, in the hopes that it'll help me push my aerobic paces up a bit through the plateau I've been stuck at. I'd like to take my 156 HR ME crossover point from a 10:10 pace to a 9:00-9:30 pace while maintaining my metabolic efficiency. Plus I know intensity will help with running economy, strength, and mentally by re-calibrating my RPE scale a bit.Awesome stuff, Duck! As you found out, it's hard to get that engine revving until you're good and warmed up. I'd keep doing what you're doing, and let the pace/effort dictate it. Just use the HR as a confirmation of what you're doing. I think as you work your way through this, you'll get better at pushing the effort. What's your max HR?
I'd treat the hill repeats just like today's track workout... 2mi warmup to your hill, then hammer out the hills at the same effort level as today. Then a 2mi cooldown.
For the intervals, I'd look at 400m intervals too. If you're feeling frisky, go for some 200's at 3200m race pace. Ladders are also a great workout. Something along the lines of 6x200, 4x400, 2x800, 4x400, 6x200.
I'd stretch the tempo mileage out longer as you get used to that effort level. 3mi is good to start, but wrap another 4mi of warmup/cooldown mileage to the run. I'm a huge fan of these runs (Pfitz inspired).
Any thoughts on.......................... racing a 5K? There's no better workout for speed than actually racing.
I agree on the tempo mileage - as I get used to these intensities, ideally I'd like to be doing 10 mile runs with 7 at tempo, that kind of thing. But I know that's going to be a while before I get there.
To answer your final question - yes, I'd love to do a 5K sometime. But with everything pointed at my 100 miler in September that's going to have to wait for awhile.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Good stuff Ned. Going to tweak some things. Thanks a lot.
One guppy question about long run intensity. I think I have a good idea how to categorize each level under five or six miles but nothing over an hour. Except for this past Sunday because it was hot my level three long runs have gone like this - very easy first two or three miles, mix tempo a little more once on the trails but always try to keep my heart rate near level two intensity. Legs fatigue before the last two or three miles, so my pace slows some, trying to keep heart rate controlled though. When I get done my legs are fatigued, but not toast, and I can carry on a conversation almost immediately. Except Sunday when it was hot.
How close am I?
One guppy question about long run intensity. I think I have a good idea how to categorize each level under five or six miles but nothing over an hour. Except for this past Sunday because it was hot my level three long runs have gone like this - very easy first two or three miles, mix tempo a little more once on the trails but always try to keep my heart rate near level two intensity. Legs fatigue before the last two or three miles, so my pace slows some, trying to keep heart rate controlled though. When I get done my legs are fatigued, but not toast, and I can carry on a conversation almost immediately. Except Sunday when it was hot.
How close am I?
tri-man 47
Footballguy
My 
:
MAC - given the number of hard/intense workouts (as Ned discussed), I'd suggest that on some of the hilly runs, you go easy on the flats and focus on hard hills ...hard up as well as hard down. Maximize the hill portions and recover in between.
Duck - I like the idea of building up the number of intervals. My ideal is to push as many as 16 400m or 10-12 800m. You really learn about your level of fitness (and self-discipline) when you get to the double digits. It might help to do some of the interval work (a bit cautiously) after a longer run when you're otherwise fatigued. In general, I believe you'll benefit by pushing your muscles harder and faster than you'll need for the endurance races.
:MAC - given the number of hard/intense workouts (as Ned discussed), I'd suggest that on some of the hilly runs, you go easy on the flats and focus on hard hills ...hard up as well as hard down. Maximize the hill portions and recover in between.
Duck - I like the idea of building up the number of intervals. My ideal is to push as many as 16 400m or 10-12 800m. You really learn about your level of fitness (and self-discipline) when you get to the double digits. It might help to do some of the interval work (a bit cautiously) after a longer run when you're otherwise fatigued. In general, I believe you'll benefit by pushing your muscles harder and faster than you'll need for the endurance races.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Yeah some of you boo hoo over fitness lost over a few weeks.
Try being off for basically 2-3 months without really running and still just being stuck on the treadmill for another few days til I can get out on some hills and on the pavement.
Losing fitness...and getting old does suck.
Try being off for basically 2-3 months without really running and still just being stuck on the treadmill for another few days til I can get out on some hills and on the pavement.
Losing fitness...and getting old does suck.
tri-man 47
Footballguy
It'd be great to see you getting out on the roads again ...it's been a looong layoff for ya. T&P over the fact that you're getting old.
CGRdrJoe
Footballguy
I'm sure Beer and I could easily do 2-3 months without #####ing, we'd be too drunk to care
FUBAR
Footballguy
Had somewhat of a breakthrough session on the bike this morning.
Plan was to go 28 miles broken into 5 miles hard, 3 easy. Due to some roads being better than others, I went 5 hard(ish), 3 easy, 5 hard, 2 easy, 5 hard, 2 easy, 3 hard, 3 cool down.
First 5 - 14:15 / 21 mph
Next 5 - 12:50 / 23.4 mph (I think this was wind-aided, but flat)
Next 5 - 13:50 / 21.6 mph (turned around into the wind)
Next 3 - 8:08 / 22.2 mph
Felt pretty good throughout.
I'm thinking my goal / plan for Raleigh will be to take whatever happens in the swim pushing some but not destroying myself. Then the bike I'll risk a blow up and try for under 2:30. Push the run. I'd love to go sub 5 but honestly don't feel like I can quite get there right now.
Plan was to go 28 miles broken into 5 miles hard, 3 easy. Due to some roads being better than others, I went 5 hard(ish), 3 easy, 5 hard, 2 easy, 5 hard, 2 easy, 3 hard, 3 cool down.
First 5 - 14:15 / 21 mph
Next 5 - 12:50 / 23.4 mph (I think this was wind-aided, but flat)
Next 5 - 13:50 / 21.6 mph (turned around into the wind)
Next 3 - 8:08 / 22.2 mph
Felt pretty good throughout.
I'm thinking my goal / plan for Raleigh will be to take whatever happens in the swim pushing some but not destroying myself. Then the bike I'll risk a blow up and try for under 2:30. Push the run. I'd love to go sub 5 but honestly don't feel like I can quite get there right now.
Hang 10
Footballguy
Check out these "old" guys age group winners times from my recent 10K:It'd be great to see you getting out on the roads again ...it's been a looong layoff for ya. T&P over the fact that you're getting old.
58 years old - 37:04 (5:57 pace)
63 years old - 41:20 (6:39 pace)
65 years old - 42:55 (6:54 pace)
71 years old - 46:39 (7:30 pace)
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Amazing bike numbers and a huge improvement for you. I like your aggressive race plan. You have been training harder than anyone here and it's paying off.
FUBAR
Footballguy
FUBAR
Footballguy
Check out these "old" guys age group winners times from my recent 10K:It'd be great to see you getting out on the roads again ...it's been a looong layoff for ya. T&P over the fact that you're getting old.
58 years old - 37:04 (5:57 pace)
63 years old - 41:20 (6:39 pace)
65 years old - 42:55 (6:54 pace)
71 years old - 46:39 (7:30 pace)
ChiefD
Footballguy
That's amazing. And I'm slow.Check out these "old" guys age group winners times from my recent 10K:It'd be great to see you getting out on the roads again ...it's been a looong layoff for ya. T&P over the fact that you're getting old.
58 years old - 37:04 (5:57 pace)
63 years old - 41:20 (6:39 pace)
65 years old - 42:55 (6:54 pace)
71 years old - 46:39 (7:30 pace)
Hang 10
Footballguy
Yeah, it's humbling to know that as good as shape as I think I'm in, I can get absolutely destroyed by a guy who eats his dinner at 4:30 PM.That's amazing. And I'm slow.Check out these "old" guys age group winners times from my recent 10K:It'd be great to see you getting out on the roads again ...it's been a looong layoff for ya. T&P over the fact that you're getting old.
58 years old - 37:04 (5:57 pace)
63 years old - 41:20 (6:39 pace)
65 years old - 42:55 (6:54 pace)
71 years old - 46:39 (7:30 pace)
It is also encouraging to see what's possible though.
FUBAR
Footballguy
I'm contemplating transferring IMs from Louisville to Cambridge. it's in late September so the weather should be much more conducive to the long race and it's a few hours closer.
The race is a new IM - they bought out Chesapeake Man. Course sounds better to me, the timing is slightly better, and the HEAT will be less severe.
Do any of you have experience with the Chesapeake Man?
The race is a new IM - they bought out Chesapeake Man. Course sounds better to me, the timing is slightly better, and the HEAT will be less severe.
Do any of you have experience with the Chesapeake Man?
sho nuff
Footballguy
Well, old is a relative term.It'd be great to see you getting out on the roads again ...it's been a looong layoff for ya. T&P over the fact that you're getting old.
Was going through some things in my closet cleaning up last week and looking at an old article from my senior year of HS that was talking about my school's track team and specifically the 3 of us running the 400m and how our results typically brought us back in front in most meets as we had great chances of going 1-2-3 in most meets. I was usually the 2 or 3...with a very talented runner being the 1.
Then one from the meet where I ran the :51 flat 400m and Im thinking...Id die if I even attempted to get around a track like that anymore...much less after a decent warm up...and also running the 200 or 800m, or a 4X200 relay...then recover from that to run the 3rd or anchor leg of the 4x400m relay and try and duplicate that time. (also saw a picture of very skinny me that had me ready to go run.
Just realizing that I can do all the elliptical and weight work I want...but there is no real simulation for getting out there on the road and running.
, not real certain what my goal is but would like to hear how it goes for you. Good luck.
chauncey
Footballguy
Fell off for 2 weeks but got back in the saddle this week. Today's run was one of those where you feel the squirts approaching in the first half mile but gut out the 6 without stopping just to get that practice of running when you are about to shart yourself. Figured it may come in handy some race day when I'm gunning for a PR and don't want to stop at the porta potty.
tri-man 47
Footballguy
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Got back to it this evening. Surprisingly my hamstrings are very sore from the "speed" work. 88 mi no problem, 8 x 200s and I'm beat to heck.
It was a warm evening so I went to my go to positive split workout.
1 - 9'03 / 137
2 - 9'27 / 148
3 - 9'52 / 151
4 - 9'41 / 155
5 - 9'50 / 153
6 - 9'42 / 154 downhill
7 - 10'02 / 153 downhill
8 - 11'05 / 158 (big uphill)
9 - 10'37 / 158
10 - 10'17 / 157 downhill
That's some huge cardiac drift. Hoping to get somewhat acclimated eventually.
So here's a question for you guys. This was basically a significant tempo workout for me based solely on hr, but not on pace. Did I put a dent in my glycogen stores? My best guess is that cardiac drift due to heat does not impact glycogen stores and I'm choosing my recovery fuel accordingly until someone says otherwise.
It was a warm evening so I went to my go to positive split workout.
1 - 9'03 / 137
2 - 9'27 / 148
3 - 9'52 / 151
4 - 9'41 / 155
5 - 9'50 / 153
6 - 9'42 / 154 downhill
7 - 10'02 / 153 downhill
8 - 11'05 / 158 (big uphill)
9 - 10'37 / 158
10 - 10'17 / 157 downhill
That's some huge cardiac drift. Hoping to get somewhat acclimated eventually.
So here's a question for you guys. This was basically a significant tempo workout for me based solely on hr, but not on pace. Did I put a dent in my glycogen stores? My best guess is that cardiac drift due to heat does not impact glycogen stores and I'm choosing my recovery fuel accordingly until someone says otherwise.
ChiefD
Footballguy
tri-man 47
Footballguy
With all due respect, I'm not sure Otis could drive 88 miles without taking a break.
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
Ned
Footballguy
I don't have the science to back me up, but I almost always bounce back the next day with an awesome workout after having a tough one like you just had. I wouldn't adjust recovery at all, IMO.
Ned
Footballguy
Good job guys. Now his java scripts are going to alert him to this thread since you mentioned his name 3x and he'll be here in no time flat.
parasaurolophus
Footballguy
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Let's make a couple of assumptions here: an 1:40 at a tempo pace, which should have you at or above your crossover point (let's assume with the long stuff you run you have one), so burning more glycogen than fat. Looking at my lab results if I'm in the HR zone right over my COP I'm burning over 900 calories an hour, with 500+ being from glycogen. Let's assume you're burning a few more calories than me since you're a little bigger - so 1000 calories, 600 glycogen an hour. The body can store somewhere around 2000-2500 calories worth of glycogen, so let's assume (in only this one instance) that you're somewhat normal. So that workout should have you using up close to half of the glycogen you had floating around in your blood, muscles, and liver.
Again, a lot of assumptions built into that.
Cardiac drift is due to a combination of increased core temp and dehydration (both lead to lower blood plasma volume so the heart has to work harder), not increased effort, so nothing really changes metabolically.
worrierking
Footballguy
Just checking in to say hello. Busy week with relatives in town. Hard to get my miles in, especially since we've had major thunderstorms.
Good to see Grue in here again, and very happy to see he didn't need surgery.
Good to see Grue in here again, and very happy to see he didn't need surgery.
ChiefD
Footballguy
So, what is a good age to start taking your kids running with you? I have an 8 year old son who has been begging to go. This kid has a motor that just won't quit, so I have a hunch running may be his sport. He's not the most gifted kid athletically, but he can sure run. All day.
What's a good way to get him started? I know taking him with me, but what's a good plan of attack from a distance standpoint. My thoughts are to just run lots of slow distances. Start with maybe 1 mile, see how he does, and progress from there.
Any ideas?
What's a good way to get him started? I know taking him with me, but what's a good plan of attack from a distance standpoint. My thoughts are to just run lots of slow distances. Start with maybe 1 mile, see how he does, and progress from there.
Any ideas?
Ned
Footballguy
That's exactly what I did with my (then) 6yr old son. Took him for a mile at a pace he thought was nice and easy and just went for it. He surprised the hell out of me.So, what is a good age to start taking your kids running with you? I have an 8 year old son who has been begging to go. This kid has a motor that just won't quit, so I have a hunch running may be his sport. He's not the most gifted kid athletically, but he can sure run. All day.
What's a good way to get him started? I know taking him with me, but what's a good plan of attack from a distance standpoint. My thoughts are to just run lots of slow distances. Start with maybe 1 mile, see how he does, and progress from there.
Any ideas?
I will never forget the first 1.5mi kids fun run we did (my wife had our 4yr old son with her, I took the 6yr old). "Daddy, why is my chest burning?"
MAC_32
Footballguy
Our4 year old did a quarter mile run three times at a picnic last weekend. Event organizers scheduled one for all the kids but after he was done he just did it again. He has ran a mile with my wife a few times too. Last time he only stopped twice to catch his breath. Might let him do one on his own at the park this summer sometime if he wants. We'll just stay in seeing eye distance.
sho nuff
Footballguy
My son is just now interested in running with me some again.
Hopefully some of my morning runs I will finish up at home and go out for about a half mile cool down with him and then up that to a mile as he gets used to it more.
He wants to do it to keep in shape for soccer.
Hopefully some of my morning runs I will finish up at home and go out for about a half mile cool down with him and then up that to a mile as he gets used to it more.
He wants to do it to keep in shape for soccer.
tri-man 47
Footballguy
Hey, we got active-poster furley in here some years ago, and our GB has turned into quite the runner. Let's work our magic on Otis, too.
Ned
Footballguy
My attention span sucks. I read this and forgot to respond.
Forget the the tempo stuff in the long run. You have 1 main goal during the long run - keep the HR/effort significantly down compared to your harder stuff. You're teaching your body a ton of useful things (granted this is written with the marathon in mind, but you'll get the drift). By pushing thru/out of that slow/easy effort, you're minimizing those 'lessons'.
To the bolded: you should be able to carry a conversation at any point during a long run. If you can only get out a sentence before needing some air, you're going too fast.
tri-man 47
Footballguy
andyjayhawker
Footballguy
Looking for a little advice is if anyone can offer perspective or share experiences:
I just ran a half over memorial day weekend in 1:29:31. I have run a handful of 10Ks all sub-40. Suppose my goal is to eventually qualify for Boston (I'd need a 3:05 marathon for now) -- I'm not sure if that is actually a realistic goal, but let's throw it out there. According to those silly distance conversion calculators, my half time correlates to a 3:06:38 marathon time, so I should be in the ballpark. My concern is that I've run three marathons, all in about 4:15 (extremely slow relative to my other races), and 2 of the 3 have resulted in significant pain/cramping/walking during the race. I suspect I just haven't trained adequately (~40 miles/week max with slow long runs with the lady), so I'm considering doing the Pfitz 18/55 or something like that this time around. Any advice on how to approach training would be really appreciated. I'm running Twin Cities in October and am thinking about training with a goal time of 3:30 in mind. This would be a huge improvement, but I feel it should absolutely be doable with adequate training. From there I would have confidence and a foundation to work toward that 3:05 time -- or more realistically the 3:10 time in a few years.
I just ran a half over memorial day weekend in 1:29:31. I have run a handful of 10Ks all sub-40. Suppose my goal is to eventually qualify for Boston (I'd need a 3:05 marathon for now) -- I'm not sure if that is actually a realistic goal, but let's throw it out there. According to those silly distance conversion calculators, my half time correlates to a 3:06:38 marathon time, so I should be in the ballpark. My concern is that I've run three marathons, all in about 4:15 (extremely slow relative to my other races), and 2 of the 3 have resulted in significant pain/cramping/walking during the race. I suspect I just haven't trained adequately (~40 miles/week max with slow long runs with the lady), so I'm considering doing the Pfitz 18/55 or something like that this time around. Any advice on how to approach training would be really appreciated. I'm running Twin Cities in October and am thinking about training with a goal time of 3:30 in mind. This would be a huge improvement, but I feel it should absolutely be doable with adequate training. From there I would have confidence and a foundation to work toward that 3:05 time -- or more realistically the 3:10 time in a few years.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
Congrats on your recent race!
I'm a strong believer in those calculators and I believe you have an excellent shot at qualifying within a few training cycles. I know some here disagree with this but I believe the vast majority of people should be able to get a marathon time within a few minutes of what the McMillian calculator predicts assuming the right training, having no major injury setbacks and getting favorable weather on race day.
My background is a little different than yours. I mainly ran marathons and ran my first Boston Qualifier before I ever ran a sub 1:30 half or a 10K. However, I used the Pfitz 18/55 when I qualified for the first time. Many others here have used it with success so it's certainly a great one to try. The increased weekly mileage will certainly help. However, nobody knows if it will work best for you. We all are different runners and respond and recover differently under different types of training runs. The best advice I can give is to try to figure out what works best for you -- particularly as it pertains to the amount of tempo runs and speed work, number of pace runs you'll need, the amount of recovery time you need after various types of hard workouts, etc.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
My update for tonight.
Very happy to break 5:30. I haven't tried this since last year when I ran a 5:33.
Very happy to break 5:30. I haven't tried this since last year when I ran a 5:33.
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