Kwai Chang Caine
Footballguy
He doesn't look special at all. Lousy average too along with a too cute play caller. I don't like the idea of playing him at all. Can't afford 3.6 points.
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RB Jordan Howard , NO (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Borden
- Start date
Wise Old Owl
Footballguy
I love this guys talent but I need to get him off my team. Coaching staff is unwilling or incapable of using him correctly.
Kwai Chang Caine
Footballguy
Straight cutting him. He's the biggest bust of the year considering he's not missed any games.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
[scooter]
Footballguy
I just cut him in my 12-team league. It feels pretty good.
I thought about waiting until Tuesday to cut him, but I'm really going to need a kicker to cover Janikowski's BYE, and Robbie Gould was just sitting there on the waiver wire and I didn't want to risk losing out on him.
I thought about waiting until Tuesday to cut him, but I'm really going to need a kicker to cover Janikowski's BYE, and Robbie Gould was just sitting there on the waiver wire and I didn't want to risk losing out on him.
[scooter]
Footballguy
And yet he ripped off two huge runs on the final OT drive.RBM said:
If Howard doesn't fumble at the goal line, he finishes with 70 and a TD and we're all breathing a sigh of relief.
Look I'm not saying he's been great. Once Breida is back healthy he will likely supplant Howard as my RB2. But I think panic-dropping him is a short-sighted move you will live to regret. He's been losing snaps to Cohen because Cohen is finally producing the way we all thought he would -- it was the first few games of the season that were anomalies. I drafted Howard assuming he'd be a usable RB2 and he mostly has been.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Fwiw if you give him the TD I think you have to back out the 34 yards in OT because Chicago probably wins the game outright. Then he'd have likely 30 yards at ~2.5 ypc and a TD.
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
One thing drives me crazy about Howard is that Cohen was always an expensive backup, not a true handcuff. Cohen was drafted pretty regularly, he has his fans and he's not easy to get, for good reason, so it's always been difficult to own the position and hedge against Howard losing his share of the offense. If you have Cohen and Howard both, congrats.
Cohen's success isn't exactly going to discourage his further use. He's a good runner too and they get him in space. Watching the game it's clear they're using Howard to pound the line, which isn't exactly the most efficient model FF-wise.
Cohen's success isn't exactly going to discourage his further use. He's a good runner too and they get him in space. Watching the game it's clear they're using Howard to pound the line, which isn't exactly the most efficient model FF-wise.
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jm192
Footballguy
I think he's still sell-able. People will think they're buying low. Get some value. But I agree it looks like he will keep trending down while Cohen trends up. Cohen won't be a 300 touch guy, but we never expected that. The bigger issue is Howard also won't be a 300 touch guy.
I mean, at that point you're dealing with a completely different game. Maybe the Bears are up late and pound him more. Who knows? My point is still that he had one bad play that was an eight-point swing. Other than that he was so-so, but not terrible.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
I've never been a Cohen fan to be honest. I think the future solution at CHI RB is a player yet to be named
ETA: Yeldon may be a candidate in free agency. Wouldn't cost Chicago too much and he can do it all- contrary to what everyone seems to say about him. I've been proven right so far this year on Yeldon. Big fan of him in dynasty. Unfortunately just sold him - traded for Sutton in one league and combo with Lockett for a 2019 1st.
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Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
In the limited sample size of the Bears which I have watched I have found Howard to be at least of average to above-average effectiveness.
cloppbeast
Footballguy
Howard is signed thru 2019, but he's not much of a cap hit if released or traded. Plausible he's not with the Bears after this year; but imo, he's unlikely to get the work of 2016-2017. Career RBBC from here on.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Rumor was they tried to trade him prior to the draft (rumor was Miami). It didn't work out so they did damage control and Nagy came out and said Howard is their RB. All kinds of positive stuff about Howard. It's clear Howard doesn't fit the scheme and/or isn't working out for Chicago. So I don't think it's unreasonable to consider that Howard could be traded. He's an attractive trade piece for the sole reason of the first sentence you said. I don't think he'd cost a team too much either. With a 2019 RB class that is a little thin, I could see Howard having a lot of interest from a few teams. One problem for Howard is that he fits a RB mold that isn't used as often in today's NFL.
cloppbeast
Footballguy
cloppbeast
Footballguy
I little hyperbole. I agree more in PPR. He was drafted as RB2 but he's performed as a RB3. In a redraft done today he's somewhere around an 8th round pick. So yeah I'd say he's a bust. Massive? I don't know. You could have picked Freeman. Plus, other than Mixon, which RB2 in 2nd-5th has lived up to the hype?
Really? I don't know what his ADP was, but I took him in the 3rd round of a 14-team 0.5 PPR draft (33rd overall). I haven't been thrilled, but I can't say he's been a huge disappointment. More importantly, I look at who was drafted around him. Because as much as I know you were totally ready to take Michel, Lindsay and Breida there, that's a good indication of who the options really were at the time.
Tate has been OK, but with Golladay's emergence it's far from clear he'll be a consistent producer. Other than that, everyone else has been some level of disappointing. Also, the RBs who went in the following round were Ajayi, Henry, McCoy and RFreeman.
What this basically comes down to is that RB2 has been a wasteland all season. Relative to that baseline, I think Howard has been fine so far. Now, it may be that he'll continue to decline. Or he may turn it around as the Bears find their offensive identity. Or, most likely, he may be up and down all year, like all the other RB2s. But unless you drafted him as your RB1, I don't think there's any basis to say he's been a massive disappointment.
The Captain
Footballguy
He’s still young and has been a workhorse the past two years. His production and durability cannot be denied. If he goes to a team that isn’t looking for their version of Tyreek Hill at RB he will be fine. Buy low and sit on him until Chicago dumps him after this season.
He’s a good player.
ETA: this opinion based on performance in standard leagues. In PPR he’s obviously not as valuable so I’d be less inclined to buy low.
He’s a good player.
ETA: this opinion based on performance in standard leagues. In PPR he’s obviously not as valuable so I’d be less inclined to buy low.
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Pigskin Fanatic
Footballguy
initially I was going to quote the second one here in agreement, but i just talked myself out of it. howard is being used as the thunder to Cohen's lightning. howard can be both and a pretty good 3 down back imo, but he just won't get the chance short of a cohen injury or something. not sure replacing him with another back would change anything for the Bears, it would still be that other guy and Cohen. could be good for us howard owners in fantasy. there is a realistic scenario if something was to happen to cohen where howard proves me right and all is right with the (fantasy) world. well, not for cohen owners.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
I think Cohen and Howard work well together as a successful NFL backfield. To do what Nagy wants to do long term, I don't think they work. He's fitting square pegs into round holes like he's on Apollo 13; it's good enough for now
FBG continue to rank him worth a start albeit at a Flex RB level. With other options like Edelman, DThomas and Breida what is your take? Yet another juicy matchup w/ NE this weekend at least until it's 50-0 but all I ever see is <3 YPC and minimal usage. How many 1 yard carries can a starting RB actually have before the team goes elsewhere?
I'm strongly leaning toward sitting him for Lindsay and John Brown in a 0.5 PPR league (also have Breida and Crowell; if I didn't have Lindsay I would lean Howard over both of those guys). Mostly comes down to match-ups; NE isn't a terrible one, but I could easily see gamescript going away from Chicago, and meanwhile Lindsay gets the AZ run D and Brown the NO pass D, both top match-ups.
I also worry about Howard's floor if he doesn't score. Not predicting this, but would anyone be totally shocked if he put up a 7/30/0?
I also worry about Howard's floor if he doesn't score. Not predicting this, but would anyone be totally shocked if he put up a 7/30/0?
Stompin' Tom Connors
Footballguy
One of the things that might mean a better gamescript for Howard this week is that I distinctly remember from last year after the Patriots got smoked 42-27 in the opener last year, with Hunt racking up 5/98/2 in the air (in addition to 148/1 on the ground) there was a lot of narrative that NE has historically had problems with covering pass catching backs.
I didn't look at how that team fared the rest of the 2017 season, but this year, they seemed to have stiffened up a little.
WK1 v HOU: Miller 1/11 receiving.
WK2 v JAX: Yeldon was held to 2/13, but Grant had 6/56 for a combined 8/69
WK3 v DET: Riddick, their pass catching back, was 3/36, with other backs contributing for a total 7/62
WK4 v MIA: Gore and Drake with a combined 3/29 with a receiving TD
WK5 v IND: Hines had 7/45
WK6 v KC: Hunt ripped them again for 5/105/1 through the air.
So while they have faced some quality backs with good hands (Miller, Yeldon, Riddick, Hines, Hunt), they seemed to have shored up this area of their game.
On the flip side, NE is allowing 110 rush yards per game, ranking a middling 18 in the league. A downside for Howard is that NE is fairly good at limiting rush TDs, however, ranking third in the league with 0.2/game.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
They're 18th overall but move up to 15th in yards per game - some teams that have had their bye are ahead of them overall but are worse run defenses. They have also only allowed one rushing TD all season - which you point out. I wouldn't necessarily call it a favorable matchup - especially if the Bears fall behind.
JIMGET
Footballguy
Valid point, it also appears that Howard is now the backup...Cohen fit's the scheme better, Howard is touchdown dependent now.
shadrap
Footballguy
hey Dr. going to start a thread on hamstring injuries & need your input. This is the best way to notify you.
Also regarding this thread: Howard is a very good back but the present scheme they are using in not good for him or us in FF. IMO
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Eh. If he doesn't fumble on the damn goal line I wonder how everyone feels about Howard this week.
He looked good grinding out the clock at the end too.
Something tells me this story isn't quite over. I'm not playing him right now, but I'm sure as hell not dropping him.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
It is way too early to drop Howard. He is a good RB that gets touches every week and could more at any time.
I think this is one of those games where you game-plan more with Howard. NE has not been great against the run and you have a decent offensive line to get it done, just have to decide on Kush or Daniels at LG. Makes sense to me to keep Brady off the field... Amukamara is likely out and Albert Wilson tore up Kevin Toliver. You know Belichick will target him, and will also sustain drives with Edelman/White who should be able to beat Callahan and the LBs.
Wonder if Gronk is going to block more if Mack plays, should be a great game.
Wonder if Gronk is going to block more if Mack plays, should be a great game.
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thecardiackid
Footballguy
tackle for loss
Footballguy
He finished as RB11 in every league of mine last year standard and ppr.
That put him as a RB1 in 12 team leagues.
If thats a massive bust to you, how can I evaluate your opinion in future postings?
This year he is a bust, but that has nothing to do with last year in whch he wasnt a bust running for over 1100 yards rushing and 9TDs.
That put him as a RB1 in 12 team leagues.
If thats a massive bust to you, how can I evaluate your opinion in future postings?
This year he is a bust, but that has nothing to do with last year in whch he wasnt a bust running for over 1100 yards rushing and 9TDs.
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thekidd2009
Footballguy
Going forward I prefer backs like Kerroyon Johnson and Marlon Mack over Howard. Howard is not very explosive so he rarely rips off long runs and he has limited redzone opportunities due to playcalling and Trubiskys scrambling. He's really a weak flex play imo.
ATB
Footballguy
While I agree with this and it's why i'm starting Howard as my RB2 this week (Collins as my flex), I can't help but feel like Nagy will abandon the run after a few short gains and stuffs at the line. He just wants to call tricky plays, for whatever reason. It's his M.O. He wants sweeps and dump-offs that get his players in space. He doesn't want to use his Oline to get a few yards at a time.pbandy1 said:
He's like a real-life 10 year old throwing bombs in Madden when all you need is first downs.
zoonation
Footballguy
he is not even startable. If you have this guy in your lineup you;re not winning games. He was a second round pick. BUST.
TwinTurbo
Footballguy
Howard is definitely a bust at this point, but there is no way Cohen makes it through the season as a heavily utilized RB. At some point, he's going to take a big hit and that's going to be it. He's tough and talented, but it's simple physics. Guy is like half the size of an average linebacker.
thekidd2009
Footballguy
I don't think anyone is arguing that Cohen is going to take over the backfield. It's turned into a 50/50 split and the problem is Howard can't do enough with 15 touches due to has limited play making ability to be anymore than a flex play. Cohen is dynamic enough to have an impact with 15 touches. Even in redraft Cohen is the more valuable of the 2 going forward and I don't think it's going to change.
