RB TreVeyon Henderson, NE (1 Viewer)

[Harjiran]

I though pass protection was supposed to be one of Henderson's strong suits coming out of college. Is McDaniel's scheme more complex than others in this area?

 

[Insein]

I though pass protection was supposed to be one of Henderson's strong suits coming out of college. Is McDaniel's scheme more complex than others in this area?

It is one of his strong suits which is why season long, Henderson hopefully figures it out by week 6-7.

 

[Smack Tripper]

We'll see what has hierarchy in the doghouse ranking. Fumbles or Pass Protection.

Fumbles are the most overrated thing and an excuse.

They're not good per se, but they also seem to matter when convenient among coaches.

 

[Largent]

I have a trade offer out to the Benson owner, straight up for Henderson. Going for guaranteed volume

 

[ponchsox]

We'll see what has hierarchy in the doghouse ranking. Fumbles or Pass Protection.

As someone who desperately needs Henderson to come in and light the world on fire immediately, IMO keeping the QB upright is priority #1.

Seeing Stevenson out there in the final drive makes me think you're right. They'll keep working the kid in but anyone thinking he becomes a bell cow may be bummed for a while

I don’t think Henderson will ever be a bell cow. What we’re looking for is > 50% of the backfield touches.

 

[kyoun1e]

We'll see what has hierarchy in the doghouse ranking. Fumbles or Pass Protection.

As someone who desperately needs Henderson to come in and light the world on fire immediately, IMO keeping the QB upright is priority #1.

Seeing Stevenson out there in the final drive makes me think you're right. They'll keep working the kid in but anyone thinking he becomes a bell cow may be bummed for a while

I don’t think Henderson will ever be a bell cow. What we’re looking for is > 50% of the backfield touches.

He's a lot more sturdier than many thought. Tough runner.

With Rhamandre and Gibson fumbling, who knows.

And the CAR rush D could be a nice entry point this week.

 

[RaidersAreOne]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

 

[Proteus]

It's insanely puzzling given McDaniel's past with James White, Kevin Faulk, et al.

As for the pass pro piece, maybe it's the scheme or maybe he's just a bit overwhelmed.

Anecdotally--and surprisingly imo--a lot of NFL players say the gap between high school and D1 college is nothing compared to the gap between D1 college and pro.

The game has to slow down for him, as it were. I think.

On the other hand, I bet if Vrabel just lets him take his lumps for awhile, he'd figure it out. On the other hand still, witnessing those growing pains a la Ashton Jeanty is really ugly and discouraging. Most of all for the player I would imagine.

 

[stillfeelme]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

I think it is still wait and see mode. I am wondering if he is going to start this week and be given something of the order of 60-70% of the touches.

 

[Chaka]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

RoS? Absolutely IMO.

This week... maybe?

The Pats frustration with Rhamondre's fumbles is palpable and Gibson did himself no favors.

For this week I don't think Henderson gets the full playbook but, it's a plus matchup and an opportunity to get him more experience. Realistically, I think Rhamondre will still get the start but, that is probably more for ego management reasons. I think Henderson's snap share and touches to increase but, maybe in more obvious running situations, play action passes and for designed screens. After that it really depends on how the defense handles it when Henderson is in the game.

If he locks down his protections, I fully expect him to be the lead back from that point forward.

 

[LawFitz]

If he locks down his protections, I fully expect him to be the lead back from that point forward.

If and when are different here, except that both are complete mysteries. Otherwise, I agree with this take.

 

[ponchsox]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

Of course he does. Omarion Hampton’s value was in the toilet before Najee went down. All it takes is Henderson getting > 50% of the backfield and we’re off to the races.

 

[menobrown]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

Got to see what they do with Rhamondre and his fumbling.

What's been really unexpected in this backfield is Henderson was lauded for his pass pro but he's not been that great and even AFTER Rhamondre's dual fumbles last week the one role they still had him do was playing third down/passing situations. The expectation is at minimum Rhamondre keeps that role, what else they do with the RB roles this week due to the fumbling issues of Rhamondre and Gibson to a lesser extent is one of the bigger mysteries heading into week 4.

One thing for sure is Rhamondre's fumbling is a major issue which if it's not reached a breaking point yet it's getting close, as in he can't put the ball on the ground much more before they just can't play him anymore. It's maddening he's still doing it after last year, no excuse for it IMO even if Vrabel keeps offering them up.

But to your question, it would be shocking due either to attrition, fumbling or just his role organically growing if Henderson was not someone of high value at some point this year.

 

[Harjiran]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

If you have room on your bench in redraft, you have to hold this guy for several more weeks at a minimum, to see how things shake out in that backfield. The upside is huge, league-winning if Henderson figures it out and becomes the guy.

 

[RaidersAreOne]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

If you have room on your bench in redraft, you have to hold this guy for several more weeks at a minimum, to see how things shake out in that backfield. The upside is huge, league-winning if Henderson figures it out and becomes the guy.

I was moreso asking as a buy-low candidate. I don't feel comfortable making him the center piece of a return but as a complimentary piece then maybe.

 

[Chaka]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

If you have room on your bench in redraft, you have to hold this guy for several more weeks at a minimum, to see how things shake out in that backfield. The upside is huge, league-winning if Henderson figures it out and becomes the guy.

I was moreso asking as a buy-low candidate. I don't feel comfortable making him the center piece of a return but as a complimentary piece then maybe.

In redraft I paid, what I consider to be a small premium in a package deal for him last week.

I gave Ladd & Swift and got Zay & Henderson

Zay was the "prize" but, I held out for Henderson in the deal as the throw in. I have Rhamondre already and I love his upside.

It probably won't pan out because, none of my trades have panned out yet. But, I keep swinging.

 

[Harjiran]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

If you have room on your bench in redraft, you have to hold this guy for several more weeks at a minimum, to see how things shake out in that backfield. The upside is huge, league-winning if Henderson figures it out and becomes the guy.

I was moreso asking as a buy-low candidate. I don't feel comfortable making him the center piece of a return but as a complimentary piece then maybe.

If I could land him this week for someone whose value spiked Week 3 - Tory Horton, Jaxson Dart, Tre Tucker, Luther Burden, etc - or some combo of these players for Henderson and another piece, I'd probably pull the trigger, but given the fumbles by Rhamondre and Gibson, there may be an impression that NE will give Henderson a crack at the starting gig soon, so is the buy window right now or maybe next week assuming the team thinks Henderson isn't ready, or if he falters, lowering his perceived value even more? I really don't know but it's certainly possible that he blows up against the Panthers and then we can just forget about it. If you really want him, now is probably a good time to go for it. I probably would not give up Benson in Largent's trade scenario above.

 

[Harjiran]

Sooo does this dude have much value in a redraft league? What is the deal in NE?

If you have room on your bench in redraft, you have to hold this guy for several more weeks at a minimum, to see how things shake out in that backfield. The upside is huge, league-winning if Henderson figures it out and becomes the guy.

I was moreso asking as a buy-low candidate. I don't feel comfortable making him the center piece of a return but as a complimentary piece then maybe.

In redraft I paid, what I consider to be a small premium in a package deal for him last week.

I gave Ladd & Swift and got Zay & Henderson

Zay was the "prize" but, I held out for Henderson in the deal as the throw in. I have Rhamondre already and I love his upside.

It probably won't pan out because, none of my trades have panned out yet. But, I keep swinging.

I like it!

 

[ponchsox]

It’s happening? First RB out in ball drills.

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[Largent]

if he goes off, will be the most talked about thread on here come Sunday night.

 

[Chaka]

It’s happening? First RB out in ball drills.

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After speaking with Anarchy99 about the issue, I no longer think this is as big a deal as most will think it is.

Mike Reiss tweeted that Henderson got the first touch in a drill today. IMO, that doesn't say much of anything. That's far different from being the guy in the backfield for actual live snaps with Stephenson on the sideline for plays at a time in practice. Maybe Henderson gets some more snaps in this week's game. Maybe they cut back on some of Stephenson's touches. Maybe they give Rhamondre a shot across the bow as a warning this week. But in Stevenson's time in NE, they have never actually ceded anything to anyone else other than him "losing" his starting role for the first series of a game.

The current snap breakdown is in alignment to what I suggested to start the season. I had RS at 55%, TH at 30%, and AG at 15%. They are currently at RS 55%, TH at 38%, and AG at 17%. The math doesn't add up as they have been playing some two back sets. Henderson has been getting about the number of touches I expected. Stephenson has seen fewer touches than in the past. But that's hard to gage as he was coming off an injury at the end of training camp and then got sat down after his two fumbles this past week. But the other thing I thought would happen played out. That if Stephenson was out of the game, they would turn to Gibson and Henderson wouldn't necessarily get a huge workload.

Henderson hasn't exactly lit the world on fire. He only has a 3.4 ypc average, and other than his 2 fumbles, Stephenson had outpaced Henderson in pretty much everything, most importantly in pass protection. Maybe if Henderson was getting chunk play after chunk play and drives were getting extended because of him, then they would give him a much bigger role. But we haven't seen him do much so far.

I still think for fantasy purposes, NE will struggle to have consistent fantasy producers. Someone will have a big week and then disappear for 4-5 weeks. And they will rotate who the flavor of the week was. One week it was Boutte. Last week it was Stevenson. This week it was Henry. IMO, NE players are flex options, bye week fill-ins, or injury replacements. At least for now. Maybe someone will get established more as the season goes, but I haven't seen anyone that screams "this is the guy."

 

[psychobillies]

I think that with the longer season now, these coaches don't want to burn the rookies out. If they got 12-15 carries evey week starting in week 1, their legs would be completely dead by the time the playoffs started. Easing them in also helps with the learning curve. That's probably why all of these teams made sure to have a solid vet on the team to help take the load off.

 

[FarFromHome]

I think that with the longer season now, these coaches don't want to burn the rookies out. If they got 12-15 carries evey week starting in week 1, their legs would be completely dead by the time the playoffs started. Easing them in also helps with the learning curve. That's probably why all of these teams made sure to have a solid vet on the team to help take the load off.

That logically makes sense, but don't underestimate the pressure to win right now one week at a time. I'm not an NFL coach. I did help coach my kids 6th grade football team in 2001 though. You play to win the games. Ha ha

 

[ponchsox]

I think that with the longer season now, these coaches don't want to burn the rookies out. If they got 12-15 carries evey week starting in week 1, their legs would be completely dead by the time the playoffs started. Easing them in also helps with the learning curve. That's probably why all of these teams made sure to have a solid vet on the team to help take the load off.

Harbaugh (LA) mentioned this week that they didn’t want to lean on Omarion Hampton this heavily early in the season, but they have no choice because of Harris going down. I think the Patriots coaches wanted to use all three backs and ease in Henderson, but the fumbling issues may tilt the workload in favor of Henderson. I don’t think they trust Stevenson at all near the goal line now.

 

[psychobillies]

I think that with the longer season now, these coaches don't want to burn the rookies out. If they got 12-15 carries evey week starting in week 1, their legs would be completely dead by the time the playoffs started. Easing them in also helps with the learning curve. That's probably why all of these teams made sure to have a solid vet on the team to help take the load off.

That logically makes sense, but don't underestimate the pressure to win right now one week at a time. I'm not an NFL coach. I did help coach my kids 6th grade football team in 2001 though. You play to win the games. Ha ha

It's probably a delicate balancing act. How did y'all finish that year?

 

[Ray_T]

We'll see what has hierarchy in the doghouse ranking. Fumbles or Pass Protection.

Fumbles are the most overrated thing and an excuse.

They're not good per se, but they also seem to matter when convenient among coaches.

a fumble lost is worth 40 yards. thats what my old coach used to tell me. at the pro level I'd say its worth 50 yards. and I agree with that analysis. sure, you net 40 yards on a punt, but you also give up momentum as well. I figure thats worth another 10 (at least)

so if a player is getting 75 total yards with one fumble lost, hes helping, but not all that much.

personally if I was a coach, I'd have absolutely no time for players who cannot hold onto the football.

in my opinion, fumbling IS a deal breaker for any RB or QB just because of the sheer number of times they touch the ball.

I dont think you will find a whole lot of competitive coaches out there who feel differently.

there are coaches who think you can coach this sort of thing out of a player. and in some cases they are right. if you hold the ball in an odd way it can lead to this kind of problem. but some people just dont have that ability. from what I can tell you can coach fumblers out of their fumbling ways around 40-50% of the time. but if you cant overcome this at the Pro level, you dont stay in the pros very long.

 

[Smack Tripper]

We'll see what has hierarchy in the doghouse ranking. Fumbles or Pass Protection.

Fumbles are the most overrated thing and an excuse.

They're not good per se, but they also seem to matter when convenient among coaches.

a fumble lost is worth 40 yards. thats what my old coach used to tell me. at the pro level I'd say its worth 50 yards. and I agree with that analysis. sure, you net 40 yards on a punt, but you also give up momentum as well. I figure thats worth another 10 (at least)

so if a player is getting 75 total yards with one fumble lost, hes helping, but not all that much.

personally if I was a coach, I'd have absolutely no time for players who cannot hold onto the football.

in my opinion, fumbling IS a deal breaker for any RB or QB just because of the sheer number of times they touch the ball.

I dont think you will find a whole lot of competitive coaches out there who feel differently.

there are coaches who think you can coach this sort of thing out of a player. and in some cases they are right. if you hold the ball in an odd way it can lead to this kind of problem. but some people just dont have that ability. from what I can tell you can coach fumblers out of their fumbling ways around 40-50% of the time. but if you cant overcome this at the Pro level, you dont stay in the pros very long.

But in that metric, what is an INT worth?

I wouldn't want them to be habit forming but they are not usually(rarely) treated the same as an INT. Now you can argue you're getting downfield yardage with an INT but I see it in the prism of the worst possible outcome of a fumble is 7 points.

 

[mrfrood]

Was he first in drills today?

 

[BlackCrowes]

 

[Dez]

Then Gibson scores next so that sucked still 3 headed monster

 

[Uncle Leo]

Yeah, he’s a bench warmer until he pulls a Woody Marks type of a game.

 

[ponchsox]

7 carries in a blowout game? Yikes

 

[Boston]

7 carries in a blowout game? Yikes

The 7 carries (Stevenson had 9 and Gibson 6) would not bother me if it was accompanied by five or six receptions instead of two.

 

[ohio#1eaglesfan]

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Seems like he’s pressing and needs to show some patience. He missed a couple creases and bounced when he should have cut inside and cut inside when he could’ve bounced. I think he’s close to hitting a big one he just needs to find that lane

 

[FantasyGuru24]

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Seems like he’s pressing and needs to show some patience. He missed a couple creases and bounced when he should have cut inside and cut inside when he could’ve bounced. I think he’s close to hitting a big one he just needs to find that lane

Close like this Sunday night?

 

[ohio#1eaglesfan]

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Seems like he’s pressing and needs to show some patience. He missed a couple creases and bounced when he should have cut inside and cut inside when he could’ve bounced. I think he’s close to hitting a big one he just needs to find that lane

Close like this Sunday night?

I’m thinking about starting him over Mason. Mason has the browns who shut down Montgomery this past week. Very similar runners and I could see them doing the same to Mason

 

[warpig33]

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Seems like he’s pressing and needs to show some patience. He missed a couple creases and bounced when he should have cut inside and cut inside when he could’ve bounced. I think he’s close to hitting a big one he just needs to find that lane

Close like this Sunday night?

I’m thinking about starting him over Mason. Mason has the browns who shut down Montgomery this past week. Very similar runners and I could see them doing the same to Mason

I've got this feeling that Mason will go off on the Browns as soon as you bench him. I have him as well and am leaning moving him to the bench. But I know if I do so, he's gonna have 100+ and 2 TDs.

 

[ohio#1eaglesfan]

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Seems like he’s pressing and needs to show some patience. He missed a couple creases and bounced when he should have cut inside and cut inside when he could’ve bounced. I think he’s close to hitting a big one he just needs to find that lane

Close like this Sunday night?

I’m thinking about starting him over Mason. Mason has the browns who shut down Montgomery this past week. Very similar runners and I could see them doing the same to Mason

I've got this feeling that Mason will go off on the Browns as soon as you bench him. I have him as well and am leaning moving him to the bench. But I know if I do so, he's gonna have 100+ and 2 TDs.

Yeah I’ve been going back and forth. Part of me is saying that the browns aren’t a very good football team so he’ll get plenty of chances even though they have a great defense

 

[JohnnyU]

Patience grasshoppers, patience.

 

[Yorthehunter]

Patience grasshoppers, patience.

My patience is running thin. Lost Benson, Kittle, Evans and traded away Skattebo for BTJ. Chase Brown and Henderson are my starting RB’s. I’m cooked

 

[JohnnyU]

Patience grasshoppers, patience.

My patience is running thin. Lost Benson, Kittle, Evans and traded away Skattebo for BTJ. Chase Brown and Henderson are my starting RB’s. I’m cooked

Sorry for your bad luck with injuries, but that aside, dynasty is a marathon, not a sprint. If it's redraft, then most of time rookies don't help a lot, especially early.

 

[BlackCrowes]

What’s it gonna take

 

[SayWhat?]

Seriously, if they don’t permanently pine Stevenson at this point in favor of…well, anyone…then Henderson’s clearly not their guy.

 

[Chaka]

What’s it gonna take

Seriously, if they don’t permanently pine Stevenson at this point in favor of…well, anyone…then Henderson’s clearly not their guy.

We'll find out on the next drive. I suspect Gibson is going to take this drive.

 

[BlackCrowes]

lol

 

[Smack Tripper]

Why would draft this guy if you're the pats?

 

[irish eyes]

Why do you waste that high if a pick of you're not going to use him. Especially rb, so dumb.

 

[Smack Tripper]

I didn't realize Henderson went pick 38, he was a first rounder in my mind.

So I guess they view that draft capital appropriately?

They prefer a journeyman 3rd down back over him

Maybe thats why Vrabel is on his second job.

 

[BlackCrowes]

Predicting a Gibson fumble, and the Stevenson gets the next carry

 

[phandango]

There are rumors on social media sites that Henderson got hurt on kickoff but the broadcast hasn't said anything.