Shooting At Aurora, Colorado Movie Theater (2 Viewers)

[Apple Jack]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

completely by this.. Is it in memory of the victims??? If so, then OK.. but still seems strange to me..But if it is because we want to prevent this from happening elsewhere It was not the movie that caused this psycho to kill people.. It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people .. It was the psycho..

Actually, it was the guns.

 

[[icon]]

The death penalty would be too quick for this individual. Very sad situation for the families.

Put him in the prison yard and let the worst of the worst have turns with him. Give them an extra hour of yard time for every bone they break without killing him.

 

[NCCommish]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

completely by this.. Is it in memory of the victims??? If so, then OK.. but still seems strange to me..But if it is because we want to prevent this from happening elsewhere It was not the movie that caused this psycho to kill people.. It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people .. It was the psycho..

My guess is they are squeamish about showing a bunch of violent imagery in the wake of the shooting. Lots of shooting and explosions in the ads including Batman pointing what looks like a huge gun right into the camera. Plus Warner Bros is pushing for it. I saw somewhere they are one of the biggest TV advertisers spending almost a billion a year on movie ads. Stations listen when that kind of money talks.

 

[snogger]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

completely by this.. Is it in memory of the victims??? If so, then OK.. but still seems strange to me..But if it is because we want to prevent this from happening elsewhere It was not the movie that caused this psycho to kill people.. It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people .. It was the psycho..

Actually, it was the guns.

Point missed

 

[Rayderr]

I would just like to say that I hate Michael Bloomberg with the fury of a billion women scorned.

I like him quite a bit. And I think he strikes a chord here, even if I disagree with his specifics- the majority of Americans would like to see something done about gun violence. The question is what? I wouldn't be against more gun laws if they worked. But they don't work.

Well there you go. He's the ultimate does as I say, I know what's best for you guy. He's a narcissist and megalomaniac. I consider him quite dangerous to freedom.

I just read the whole transcript of what he said today. Can you explain to me what part was so outrageous and anti-freedom?

I haven't. I just heard a clip on the radio asking what Obama and/or Romney was going to do about this. It isn't so much about guns, hell I haven't shot one in 15 years at least, it's his whole M.O. as I stated above. Just can't stand the guy. I'll make my own decisions, thanks.

Well here's the whole part that clip is from:

Mayor Bloomberg: You know, soothing words are nice, but maybe it’s time that the two people who want to be President of the United States stand up and tell us what they are going to do about it, because this is obviously a problem across the country. And everybody always says, ‘Isn’t it tragic,’ and you know, we look for was the guy, as you said, maybe trying to recreate Batman. I mean, there are so many murders with guns every day, it’s just got to stop. And instead of the two people – President Obama and Governor Romney – talking in broad things about they want to make the world a better place, okay, tell us how. And this is a real problem. No matter where you stand on the Second Amendment, no matter where you stand on guns, we have a right to hear from both of them concretely, not just in generalities – specifically what are they going to do about guns? I can tell you what we do here in New York. The State Legislature passed the toughest gun laws – some states may say no. That’s okay, what do you want to do? And maybe every Governor should stand up. But in the end, it is really the leadership at a national level, which is whoever is going to be President of the United States starting next January 1st – what are they going to do about guns?

Now the mayor and I have big differences but that's pretty hard to get worked up about for me. I mean we average 20 mass shootings a year. That's horrendous. Something does need to be done don't you think?

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

The Brady Bill currently prohibits gun purchases by people who:1. Has been convicted in any court of a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year;

2. Is a fugitive from justice;

3. Is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance;

4. Has been adjudicated as a mental defective or committed to a mental institution;

5. Is an alien illegally or unlawfully in the United States;

6. Has been discharged from the Armed Forces under dishonorable conditions;

7. Having been a citizen of the United States, has renounced U.S. citizenship;

8. Is subject to a court order that restrains the person from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner or child of such intimate partner, or;

9. Has been convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence.

10.Has a record of being a felon

Let's change #4 to anyone who a Psych professional deems potentially dangerous, and #8 to just people who had a court order regarding harassing, stalking, etc., regardless of who that person is. Expand #9 to include threats.

 

[Drifter]

I would just like to say that I hate Michael Bloomberg with the fury of a billion women scorned.

I like him quite a bit. And I think he strikes a chord here, even if I disagree with his specifics- the majority of Americans would like to see something done about gun violence. The question is what? I wouldn't be against more gun laws if they worked. But they don't work.

Well there you go. He's the ultimate does as I say, I know what's best for you guy. He's a narcissist and megalomaniac. I consider him quite dangerous to freedom.

I just read the whole transcript of what he said today. Can you explain to me what part was so outrageous and anti-freedom?

I haven't. I just heard a clip on the radio asking what Obama and/or Romney was going to do about this. It isn't so much about guns, hell I haven't shot one in 15 years at least, it's his whole M.O. as I stated above. Just can't stand the guy. I'll make my own decisions, thanks.

Well here's the whole part that clip is from:

Mayor Bloomberg: You know, soothing words are nice, but maybe it’s time that the two people who want to be President of the United States stand up and tell us what they are going to do about it, because this is obviously a problem across the country. And everybody always says, ‘Isn’t it tragic,’ and you know, we look for was the guy, as you said, maybe trying to recreate Batman. I mean, there are so many murders with guns every day, it’s just got to stop. And instead of the two people – President Obama and Governor Romney – talking in broad things about they want to make the world a better place, okay, tell us how. And this is a real problem. No matter where you stand on the Second Amendment, no matter where you stand on guns, we have a right to hear from both of them concretely, not just in generalities – specifically what are they going to do about guns? I can tell you what we do here in New York. The State Legislature passed the toughest gun laws – some states may say no. That’s okay, what do you want to do? And maybe every Governor should stand up. But in the end, it is really the leadership at a national level, which is whoever is going to be President of the United States starting next January 1st – what are they going to do about guns?

Now the mayor and I have big differences but that's pretty hard to get worked up about for me. I mean we average 20 mass shootings a year. That's horrendous. Something does need to be done don't you think?

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I own guns and am an avid recreational shooter. I have some very non-NRA friendly ideas about how gun transactions among private parties should be handled that would never get passed because of the paranoia among many in the gun crowd that the government just wants to know what guns you have because tomorrow they are coming to your door to collect them all.

That said, I can't think of anything that prevents what happened last night from happening. The guy had no criminal background - nothing at all to indicate that he shouldn't be allowd to own guns. Maybe you say he shouldn't have an "evil black rifle", but he could do the same with a rifle in a hunting/sporting configuration. Heck, the ammo he was shooting was even lower caliber than what you'll find in a most hunting rifles. Maybe you want to limit the magazine capacity, but that doesn't stop him from doing this either.

Bottom line: looking at this case alone, no law short of an all out ban on all guns would have prevented this from happening and that could not and should not happen.

 

[Rayderr]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

completely by this.. Is it in memory of the victims??? If so, then OK.. but still seems strange to me..But if it is because we want to prevent this from happening elsewhere It was not the movie that caused this psycho to kill people.. It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people .. It was the psycho..

Actually, it was the guns.

Actually it was the bullets. And if you want to get really technical, it was probably the blood loss or trauma to the organs.

 

[Apple Jack]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

completely by this.. Is it in memory of the victims??? If so, then OK.. but still seems strange to me..But if it is because we want to prevent this from happening elsewhere It was not the movie that caused this psycho to kill people.. It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people .. It was the psycho..

Actually, it was the guns.

Point missed

Yes, you are missing the point. Good thing he didn't have a tank and only had a drum magazine. It could have been bad.

 

[snogger]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

completely by this.. Is it in memory of the victims??? If so, then OK.. but still seems strange to me..But if it is because we want to prevent this from happening elsewhere

It was not the movie that caused this psycho to kill people.. It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people .. It was the psycho..

Actually, it was the guns.

Point missed

Yes, you are. Good thing he didn't have a tank and only had a drum magazine. It could have been bad.

You might just want to go back and READ what I typed..

"It was not the guns that caused this psycho to kill people"

Notice the word "caused".. to make it clearer for you...

the guns didn't MAKE him kill people..

Better?

 

[Insein]

The only extra security that needs to be done is to make sure the damn emergency exit are serving the purpose and people aren't using it as an entrance. I would also recommend that anybody who is going to the movie as a Batman character should not be allowed. I don't care how much your comic book nerd friends will think it is awesome to dress line Bane act like a human being and don't do it.

Dude wasn't dressed as batman. He had police riot gear on. Bullet proof vest, mask and riot helmet. Looked nothing like any batman character.

 

[Smack Tripper]

Not sure if it's been posted yet, but ABC with egg on their face. The shooter is a 24 year old white male while the guy that was part of the Tea Party is a 52 year old Hispanic. Good job ABC. IMO, if I owned a news company and I had reporters make that kind of mistake that was easily verifiable, I'd immediately fire them. Horrible.

Good info here. Christ almighty.I need to clarify, because I was being sarcastic. I can't believe the potential political mischaracterization as the story was breaking is your takeaway here.

 

[Don Quixote]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

 

[jamny]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

 

[NCCommish]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

Good point.

 

[wikkidpissah]

no gun control will work but total prohibition of handguns & assault weapons and that aint going to happen. any discussion beyond that will be as fruitful as having a War on Drugs. kidding ourselves continues to surpass football or baseball as our National Pastime.

 

[Rayderr]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

 

[NCCommish]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

I believe the super size clip he used was banned.

 

[Don Quixote]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

I believe the super size clip he used was banned.

Yep. They tackled him when he had to reload. They could have tackled him a lot earlier if he did not have that clip.

 

[eoMMan]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

I believe the super size clip he used was banned.

Keep in mind that you can still get 17 shots off before reloading.

 

[Rayderr]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

I believe the super size clip he used was banned.

I'm not positive, but I think the 15 round magazine was ok under the original ban. I know there have been attempts to impose a 10 round limit. THink some states have that, but not nationwide IIRC.

 

[snogger]

The sad part is that, much like columbine, I'm sure people will mention "well he did this" and " he did that" and looking back I guess those were warning signs..I mean reading this part tells me he has been planning "something" for quite sometime:

Police Chief Dan Oates said today that police and bomb squads have found a large number of explosive devices and trip wires at Holmes' apartment and have not yet decided how to proceed without setting off explosions."The pictures we have from inside the apartment are pretty disturbing considering how elaborate the apartment is booby trapped," police said outside of the apartment complex today. The "flammable and explosive" materials could have blown up Holmes' apartment building and the ones near it, police said.

Sad to think this might have been prevented if people could have put 2 and 2 together. :(

 

[NCCommish]

The sad part is that, much like columbine, I'm sure people will mention "well he did this" and " he did that" and looking back I guess those were warning signs..I mean reading this part tells me he has been planning "something" for quite sometime:

Police Chief Dan Oates said today that police and bomb squads have found a large number of explosive devices and trip wires at Holmes' apartment and have not yet decided how to proceed without setting off explosions."The pictures we have from inside the apartment are pretty disturbing considering how elaborate the apartment is booby trapped," police said outside of the apartment complex today. The "flammable and explosive" materials could have blown up Holmes' apartment building and the ones near it, police said.

Sad to think this might have been prevented if people could have put 2 and 2 together. :(

Given other reports apparently this was a very smart, evil SOB.

 

[Smack Tripper]

no gun control will work but total prohibition of handguns & assault weapons and that aint going to happen. any discussion beyond that will be as fruitful as having a War on Drugs. kidding ourselves continues to surpass football or baseball as our National Pastime.

Treat the disease, not the symptom. There will be pipe bombs, molotovs and the like for those bent on making mayhem, so that wouldn't even work. I would agree that we really need to take a hard look at automatic weapons, which I don't understand how we have under any pretense. That at least theoretically limits the possibilities of a shooter. But a shooter who becomes a bomber or a firebug or what have you results in no less havoc.

 

[ffldrew]

Saying he bought guns at Bass Pro and Gander Mtn.......not sure why those guys sell AR's

 

[netnalp]

The sad part is that, much like columbine, I'm sure people will mention "well he did this" and " he did that" and looking back I guess those were warning signs..I mean reading this part tells me he has been planning "something" for quite sometime:

Police Chief Dan Oates said today that police and bomb squads have found a large number of explosive devices and trip wires at Holmes' apartment and have not yet decided how to proceed without setting off explosions."The pictures we have from inside the apartment are pretty disturbing considering how elaborate the apartment is booby trapped," police said outside of the apartment complex today. The "flammable and explosive" materials could have blown up Holmes' apartment building and the ones near it, police said.

Sad to think this might have been prevented if people could have put 2 and 2 together. :(

It's not that simple. It's more like putting a mosaic together. Individually they look like an insignificant rock, put them together and you get a big picture.

 

[Charlie Frown]

The only extra security that needs to be done is to make sure the damn emergency exit are serving the purpose and people aren't using it as an entrance.

I would also recommend that anybody who is going to the movie as a Batman character should not be allowed. I don't care how much your comic book nerd friends will think it is awesome to dress line Bane act like a human being and don't do it.

Dude wasn't dressed as batman. He had police riot gear on. Bullet proof vest, mask and riot helmet. Looked nothing like any batman character.

except these guys

 

[wikkidpissah]

no gun control will work but total prohibition of handguns & assault weapons and that aint going to happen. any discussion beyond that will be as fruitful as having a War on Drugs. kidding ourselves continues to surpass football or baseball as our National Pastime.

Treat the disease, not the symptom. There will be pipe bombs, molotovs and the like for those bent on making mayhem, so that wouldn't even work. I would agree that we really need to take a hard look at automatic weapons, which I don't understand how we have under any pretense. That at least theoretically limits the possibilities of a shooter. But a shooter who becomes a bomber or a firebug or what have you results in no less havoc.

no "hard look" to it. i love a good debate, but it astounds me how little i can find on the gun issue anymore as an absolutist. not one person has ever made the sense to me of the existence of personal instruments entirely designed to pierce human flesh with hardware - that is, handguns & automatics (save me the "target practice" arguments). got nothing against hunting & guns - i would have no problem if, in exchange for a ban on assault machinery, a single-shot weapon was issued to every home in the land. but any argument that does not end our penile ideation & identification with ways to murder our personal impotence with weaponry is no more than rearranging deck chairs on a sinking ship.

 

[Kanil]

Apparently he set an alarm for midnight which started blaring techno music loud enough to wake the neighbors below him up. They're speculating that he was trying to get someone to open the booby trapped door and set the bomb off.

*edit*

That should read in his apartment. Also, it turned off exactly 1 hour after it started which seems like it has to be an alarm clock type thing to me.

 

[Sputnikv8]

Saying he bought guns at Bass Pro and Gander Mtn.......not sure why those guys sell AR's

They would sell an AR style rifle. They can't sell full auto. There are special licenses required *, etc. I haven't read anywhere that the one used was full auto. "AR" doesn't mean full auto, but, the media tends to strongly imply it. Semi-auto AR is what I'd consider the proper definition.* I seem to recall Louisiana being a little different on this? Not sure...

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them?

We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

 

[RBM]

Apologize if this was already discussed, but are there any details on the apprehension? Was it at the theatre? Somewhere else? What time? Did he just surrender?

 

[wikkidpissah]

Apologize if this was already discussed, but are there any details on the apprehension? Was it at the theatre? Somewhere else? What time? Did he just surrender?

he was pretty much waiting beside his car. it is speculated that this had something to do with Phase 2 (the rigged-up apt) of his plan.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Broadcast and cable stations pulling Dark Knight ads across the country. Warner Brothers has apparently asked some outlets to do it and others are doing it on their own.

Now that's just silly....

What impact if any will this have on the movie? Box office specifically.

 

[Mile High]

Apologize if this was already discussed, but are there any details on the apprehension? Was it at the theatre? Somewhere else? What time? Did he just surrender?

They police caught him within 2 minutes after they got there. He was outside the back door at his car. I'm sure they surprised him in how fast they found him.

 

[Don Quixote]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

I believe the super size clip he used was banned.

I'm not positive, but I think the 15 round magazine was ok under the original ban. I know there have been attempts to impose a 10 round limit. THink some states have that, but not nationwide IIRC.

Loughner had an extended 31 round magazine.

 

[comfortably numb]

Always amazed how many more people don't die in these scenarios.

 

[[icon]]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them? We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Idealists seem to think that we'll sign over our 2nd amendment rights and then POOF: all the guns will disappear and it will be gumdrops and rainbows going forward apparently.

 

[[icon]]

Always amazed how many more people don't die in these scenarios.

Me too. Shotgun in a room that densely packed should be good for at least one person per shot.... He had to have been soaking it in rather than just going for maximum kill rate.

 

[GDogg]

no gun control will work but total prohibition of handguns & assault weapons and that aint going to happen. any discussion beyond that will be as fruitful as having a War on Drugs. kidding ourselves continues to surpass football or baseball as our National Pastime.

This would prevent a psycho from killing people with guns, but won't stop him from being a psycho. Instead, he'd have gone into the theater with a bunch of homemade bombs and taken more people out.I'm against guns, but I don't think there's much you can do to prevent what happened last night from happening. Take away one weapon and all you do is change the instrument used.

 

[wikkidpissah]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them? We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Idealists seem to think that we'll sign over our 2nd amendment rights and then POOF: all the guns will disappear and it will be gumdrops and rainbows going forward apparently.

believing abolition to be the only possible answer is quite realistic; believing that can be achieved is idealism.

 

[[icon]]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them? We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Idealists seem to think that we'll sign over our 2nd amendment rights and then POOF: all the guns will disappear and it will be gumdrops and rainbows going forward apparently.

believing abolition to be the only possible answer is quite realistic; believing that can be achieved is idealism.

I can dig that.

 

[Rayderr]

no gun control will work but total prohibition of handguns & assault weapons and that aint going to happen. any discussion beyond that will be as fruitful as having a War on Drugs. kidding ourselves continues to surpass football or baseball as our National Pastime.

Treat the disease, not the symptom. There will be pipe bombs, molotovs and the like for those bent on making mayhem, so that wouldn't even work. I would agree that we really need to take a hard look at automatic weapons, which I don't understand how we have under any pretense. That at least theoretically limits the possibilities of a shooter. But a shooter who becomes a bomber or a firebug or what have you results in no less havoc.

no "hard look" to it. i love a good debate, but it astounds me how little i can find on the gun issue anymore as an absolutist. not one person has ever made the sense to me of the existence of personal instruments entirely designed to pierce human flesh with hardware - that is, handguns & automatics (save me the "target practice" arguments). got nothing against hunting & guns - i would have no problem if, in exchange for a ban on assault machinery, a single-shot weapon was issued to every home in the land. but any argument that does not end our penile ideation & identification with ways to murder our personal impotence with weaponry is no more than rearranging deck chairs on a sinking ship.

Personally, I'd rather see handguns be banned except for military and law enforcement personnel. Keeps rifles and shotguns available. Might not have helped in this case, but would help in countless more.

 

[Mile High]

Always amazed how many more people don't die in these scenarios.

Me too. Shotgun in a room that densely packed should be good for at least one person per shot.... He had to have been soaking it in rather than just going for maximum kill rate.

It is amazing more didn't die, over 70 people have gunshot wounds.

 

[GDogg]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them?

We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Because you can't shoot someone with a gun if you can't buy one?

 

[pantagrapher]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them? We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Idealists seem to think that we'll sign over our 2nd amendment rights and then POOF: all the guns will disappear and it will be gumdrops and rainbows going forward apparently.

This is certainly my argument.

 

[jamny]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them? We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Idealists seem to think that we'll sign over our 2nd amendment rights and then POOF: all the guns will disappear and it will be gumdrops and rainbows going forward apparently.

believing abolition to be the only possible answer is quite realistic; believing that can be achieved is idealism.

 

[jamny]

One witness said that he got up and stood in front of the crowd for about a minute and just stared at them. I hadn't heard that anywhere else and it probably wasn't a minute, but I bet it felt like it was. That's just creepy though.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Why when these events happen do folks immediately call for the ban of weapons/guns? Why should people who can legally buy them suddenly not be able to buy them?

We have a ban on drugs and I can get drugs almost anywhere anytime. Why would people assume that if these guns are illegal that the terrorist attacks would stop?

Because you can't shoot someone with a gun if you can't buy one?

What are you talking about? I live in Miami, I can buy a gun almost anywhere. Do you mean legally? Maybe you didn't comprehend the drug reference but marijauna is illegal and I can buy it everywhere. Making something illegal does not make something disappear. It didn't work during prohibition and it never works as long as the thrist for the product is there especially in AMERICA of all places. Too much in the way of resources in this country to truly ban something that there is a real market for.

 

[wikkidpissah]

no gun control will work but total prohibition of handguns & assault weapons and that aint going to happen. any discussion beyond that will be as fruitful as having a War on Drugs. kidding ourselves continues to surpass football or baseball as our National Pastime.

This would prevent a psycho from killing people with guns, but won't stop him from being a psycho. Instead, he'd have gone into the theater with a bunch of homemade bombs and taken more people out.I'm against guns, but I don't think there's much you can do to prevent what happened last night from happening. Take away one weapon and all you do is change the instrument used.

madness is a fact of life. spree-killing ideation may now also be a fact of life as a part of madness, because there is so much hardware and so many ways of supporting mortal fantasization. i dont have a problem with the loss of life among strangers - 40,000 people die each day from the simple inability to sustain life in this world and a few dead fanboys dont bother me any more than that - but i do have a problem with our direction as a species. our inability to agree that assault weaponry makes assault more likely is a very big indicator of the wrongness of our path.

 

[Rayderr]

All I heard was the first line. I agree with you.

However, what do you want done? You can't legislate crazy. Personally, I'm totally serious here, make prostitution legal. I'm guessing there is a good portion of these psychos that wouldn't do this if they could get laid.

I wish I had the answer. I just know what we are currently doing seems to be the suck. But hey let's start with your idea I'm down with that.

I know I've posted before in other threads, but they could re-enact the federal assault weapons ban. Primary weapon reportedly used here was banned under AWB. Same with the Giffords shooting. It would not have prevented this from happening, but the weapons used definitely made it easier to kill/injure many more people than otherwise.

A glock handgun counts as an assault weapon?

I believe the super size clip he used was banned.

I'm not positive, but I think the 15 round magazine was ok under the original ban. I know there have been attempts to impose a 10 round limit. THink some states have that, but not nationwide IIRC.

Loughner had an extended 31 round magazine.

Ok, but it still wouldn't have prevented the shooting, which I think is the more pressing issue. And as I pointed out in the original Loughner thread when Tim brought up the high capacity magazine ban, many of the top serial shooters reloaded several times. So the logic that reloading automatically stops the shooter is flawed.