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The Lawyer Thread Where We Stop Ruining Other Threads (2 Viewers)

The assailant is presently being back by his insurance, but realistically at any time they could try to indemnify themselves because I'm his insurance coverage doesn't cover this type of behavior (although I've talked to the insurance company and they want to back the assailant as much as they can for good faith business purposes).
I've read this several times and don't understand what you're trying to say here.
Tortfeasor's insurance company is currently providing a defense, but of course almost certainly has an intentional tort exclusion. I have no idea what the indemnity issue could possibly be, or how one indemnifies ones self.
that's the part I'm baffled by. I can see them defending under a ROR, but I don't know what that part means about indemnifying themselves or who would be doing that (whatever it means).
He's using "indemnify" the way I use "literally," apparently.
Yep. I'm an idiot. Completely wrong word there (had it on the brain) - in fact, probably the most opposite word possible. I meant to use "exclude."

HF's initial impression is correct. The insurance company right now is covering the tortfeasor's potential liability, but could likely stop doing so at any moment. I spoke to a rep from the insurance company when we tried to settle pre-filing. He hinted that tortfeasor and tortfeasor's company are big customers and they would have the tortfeasor's proverbial back to x amount of dollars. Unfortunately, my client isn't willing to settle for x amount of dollars.

 
The assailant is presently being back by his insurance, but realistically at any time they could try to indemnify themselves because I'm his insurance coverage doesn't cover this type of behavior (although I've talked to the insurance company and they want to back the assailant as much as they can for good faith business purposes).
I've read this several times and don't understand what you're trying to say here.
Tortfeasor's insurance company is currently providing a defense, but of course almost certainly has an intentional tort exclusion. I have no idea what the indemnity issue could possibly be, or how one indemnifies ones self.
that's the part I'm baffled by. I can see them defending under a ROR, but I don't know what that part means about indemnifying themselves or who would be doing that (whatever it means).
He's using "indemnify" the way I use "literally," apparently.
Yep. I'm an idiot. Completely wrong word there (had it on the brain) - in fact, probably the most opposite word possible. I meant to use "exclude."HF's initial impression is correct. The insurance company right now is covering the tortfeasor's potential liability, but could likely stop doing so at any moment. I spoke to a rep from the insurance company when we tried to settle pre-filing. He hinted that tortfeasor and tortfeasor's company are big customers and they would have the tortfeasor's proverbial back to x amount of dollars. Unfortunately, my client isn't willing to settle for x amount of dollars.
Wait, the assailant is an employee? Did I miss that? To hell with it. Seize the liquor license if they default on the judgment. Those things are worth money, right? Or is that just in LA?

 
The assailant is presently being back by his insurance, but realistically at any time they could try to indemnify themselves because I'm his insurance coverage doesn't cover this type of behavior (although I've talked to the insurance company and they want to back the assailant as much as they can for good faith business purposes).
I've read this several times and don't understand what you're trying to say here.
Tortfeasor's insurance company is currently providing a defense, but of course almost certainly has an intentional tort exclusion. I have no idea what the indemnity issue could possibly be, or how one indemnifies ones self.
that's the part I'm baffled by. I can see them defending under a ROR, but I don't know what that part means about indemnifying themselves or who would be doing that (whatever it means).
He's using "indemnify" the way I use "literally," apparently.
Yep. I'm an idiot. Completely wrong word there (had it on the brain) - in fact, probably the most opposite word possible. I meant to use "exclude."HF's initial impression is correct. The insurance company right now is covering the tortfeasor's potential liability, but could likely stop doing so at any moment. I spoke to a rep from the insurance company when we tried to settle pre-filing. He hinted that tortfeasor and tortfeasor's company are big customers and they would have the tortfeasor's proverbial back to x amount of dollars. Unfortunately, my client isn't willing to settle for x amount of dollars.
Wait, the assailant is an employee? Did I miss that? To hell with it. Seize the liquor license if they default on the judgment. Those things are worth money, right? Or is that just in LA?
I'm not sure that's how I read it. Maybe the tortfeasor was a ****faced Mark Zuckerberg or something.

Ah, I see now. Ongoing work feud.

 
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So wait, are these guys off work and just drinking at the bar at the time? Or is the assailant on the clock? Are you suing under respondeat superior or some independent form of liability?

 
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I had a court-appointed client once who was charged with stealing jugs of Tide from a grocery store. A couple of years ago it became a thing that Tide was being used basically as currency in various deals in the hood. It was disappearing off the shelves to the point stores were starting to put it behind the counter. So my guy was charged with stealing something like 5 of the big bottles of it. He swears up and down it wasn't him, man, it wasn't him. He stole from that store before, man, but this time he didn't do it. They're always out to get him and this time they screwed up, man, because he wasn't there that day and he can prove it.

So I get the security footage and there he is, plain as day, shoving jug after jug inside of his giant Triple Fat Goose. I turn off the video and he just looks at me and says "man, I guess I forgot about that one."

I love indigent misdemeanor defense for a lot of reasons, but the main one is that it's basically Night Court.

 
On a call pitching financial services to a potential client some years ago and I'm answering a question and go into my spiel about how our approach relates to the clients boards Revlon duties and, as I'm babbling on, I remember that the potential client is ... Revlon. So I'm lecturing a team from Revlon about my view on its Revlon duties. It was awkward.

 
This week I've got a guy wanting two of my company's employees to give non-party witness depositions on a job they did last year and I say sure, send me a subpoena and we'll set it up. So he starts talking about a trial subpoena for later this year, and we haven't got a dog in the case, and I realize I might have an issue to research. We're well over 200 miles from the trial court if you drive, but if you fly, directly over Lake Michigan, it could be within the 100 mile rule. So I don't know what leverage I have. I'm too old to be researching issues like this.

 
This week I've got a guy wanting two of my company's employees to give non-party witness depositions on a job they did last year and I say sure, send me a subpoena and we'll set it up. So he starts talking about a trial subpoena for later this year, and we haven't got a dog in the case, and I realize I might have an issue to research. We're well over 200 miles from the trial court if you drive, but if you fly, directly over Lake Michigan, it could be within the 100 mile rule. So I don't know what leverage I have. I'm too old to be researching issues like this.
http://jenner.com/system/assets/assets/4592/original/04_12_1999__20Subpoenas.pdf?1320181476

EDIT: I don't have a way to Shepardize SCM here, but I imagine if there's any authority in your Circuit, it will analyze it. Should give you the lay of the land.

 
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Stupid question: Do courtrooms have some sort of sound deadening material that prevents you from hearing softly spoken words between attorneys and clients? I just got seated on a jury in Superior Court this afternoon and I was in the front row of the courtroom during voir dire, no less than 10 feet from where the attorneys sat. The defendant and his lawyer were having an animated discussion at one point that appeared to be above whisper level and I couldn't hear a thing.

 
The assailant is presently being back by his insurance, but realistically at any time they could try to indemnify themselves because I'm his insurance coverage doesn't cover this type of behavior (although I've talked to the insurance company and they want to back the assailant as much as they can for good faith business purposes).
I've read this several times and don't understand what you're trying to say here.
Tortfeasor's insurance company is currently providing a defense, but of course almost certainly has an intentional tort exclusion. I have no idea what the indemnity issue could possibly be, or how one indemnifies ones self.
that's the part I'm baffled by. I can see them defending under a ROR, but I don't know what that part means about indemnifying themselves or who would be doing that (whatever it means).
He's using "indemnify" the way I use "literally," apparently.
Yep. I'm an idiot. Completely wrong word there (had it on the brain) - in fact, probably the most opposite word possible. I meant to use "exclude."HF's initial impression is correct. The insurance company right now is covering the tortfeasor's potential liability, but could likely stop doing so at any moment. I spoke to a rep from the insurance company when we tried to settle pre-filing. He hinted that tortfeasor and tortfeasor's company are big customers and they would have the tortfeasor's proverbial back to x amount of dollars. Unfortunately, my client isn't willing to settle for x amount of dollars.
Wait, the assailant is an employee? Did I miss that? To hell with it. Seize the liquor license if they default on the judgment. Those things are worth money, right? Or is that just in LA?
No, and this is my fault for probably not distinguishing the two groups of defendants very well.

1) The assailant/tortfeasor is high up in a company which rivals the one my client worked for (assailant, his company, and assailants wealthy in-laws are all customers of insurance company a). It's a small town where everyone knows everyone and my client apparently may have dated assailant's wife and assailant's brothers gf. Naturally, with booze mixed into the equation, he didn't take too kindly to my client putting his arm around his wife and saying hello. I listed wife and brother as defendants under the theory that they aided in battery by helping to chase after my client. Also, I wanted them listed in the off chance my client's then company wanted to interplead (?) in on some business tort/contract theory (wife and brother both work for the business).

2) The bar, which is made up of of multiple corporate ownerships, its statutory agent, and the two bouncers make up the second set of defendants which we have sued for negligence under two theories: lack of security and Dram Shop Act.

 
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So wait, are these guys off work and just drinking at the bar at the time? Or is the assailant on the clock? Are you suing under respondeat superior or some independent form of liability?
I'm going to Hipple the hell out of Woz's story. You're suing the wife and brother? I'm flummoxed.
Yeah, there's a lot that doesn't make sense here.
I believe I clarified above...

I do also have to rant about my continuing idiocy on this case. I spent the bulk of yesterday preparing our responses to the interrogatories because yesterday was the deadline (a second deadline set, which of course I got permission to extend from one of the defense lawyers but didn't realize I didn't from the other - the quotation guy). This morning I get a sarcastic response from "quotation guy" asking why only about 1/3 of the non-uniform interrogatories were done. I look back at what we sent and it turns out my paralegal (who is the keystone of our office and makes a mistake about as often as it snows here) accidentally prepped, and I then accidentally signed, a previous rough draft I filled out with the bare bones obvious answers instead of the completed response. So this is the third time on this case I looked like an incompetent ####tard to this opposing counsel. My only solace at this point is that I am picturing this guy to be -fish- and that he has concluded I'm a giant moron and will be pushing his clients to settle just so he doesn't have to deal with me anymore.

 
So wait, are these guys off work and just drinking at the bar at the time? Or is the assailant on the clock? Are you suing under respondeat superior or some independent form of liability?
I'm going to Hipple the hell out of Woz's story. You're suing the wife and brother? I'm flummoxed.
Yeah, there's a lot that doesn't make sense here.
I believe I clarified above...

I do also have to rant about my continuing idiocy on this case. I spent the bulk of yesterday preparing our responses to the interrogatories because yesterday was the deadline (a second deadline set, which of course I got permission to extend from one of the defense lawyers but didn't realize I didn't from the other - the quotation guy). This morning I get a sarcastic response from "quotation guy" asking why only about 1/3 of the non-uniform interrogatories were done. I look back at what we sent and it turns out my paralegal (who is the keystone of our office and makes a mistake about as often as it snows here) accidentally prepped, and I then accidentally signed, a previous rough draft I filled out with the bare bones obvious answers instead of the completed response. So this is the third time on this case I looked like an incompetent ####tard to this opposing counsel. My only solace at this point is that I am picturing this guy to be -fish- and that he has concluded I'm a giant moron and will be pushing his clients to settle just so he doesn't have to deal with me anymore.
If I may overstep my bounds and offer some unsolicited advice -

never ever sign something you haven't read fully at the time that you're signing it.

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.

 
Ok, so here's my Fabio story:

About 7 years ago I'm defending a noise nuisance case involving neighbors right on the Venice Beach boardwalk. I've got a noisy neighborhood dive bar/greasy spoon restaurant with an upstairs outdoor patio that's been there forever - I think the building was pre-war. It's held together with duct tape and bailing wire.

The plaintiff was an older (late-50's) Persian Jewish guy who is a real estate investor who bought the property next door and renovated it into downstairs office space and a residence for himself upstairs. It's a little hard to explain, but the back of his building is towards the bar even though they're side-by-side as you are facing them from the boardwalk. He's got some (3rd story) windows in his bedroom that open up above the bar's upstairs (2nd story) patio and, if you know Venice Beach, they're right on top of each other - there's maybe four feet between the two buildings, no exaggeration.

As background, Venice is a classic rough-around-the-edges LA beach town, but as with all such places it's getting gentrified. The plaintiff neighbor is part of the gentrification. The bar is most definitely not, and yet such places are very much part of the fabric of Venice Beach. But trying to take down these sorts of bars in Venice is ludicrous - it's like complaining about the Hollywood sign being an eye sore or something.

I said the plaintiff was a Persian Jew because if you know Persian Jews, they are ####### brutal when it comes to business and legal matters. The phrase "no quarter" comes to mind. They'll argue with you over a penny if they think they can use it to screw you one more way on a business deal. Even regular Jews hate Persian Jews in LA. In short, this guy's a complete #####.

But he's also a savvy #####. Practically every night over the course of more than a year during the lawsuit he called to complain to some enforcement agency to come visit my client's property. One night it's the fire marshal to check whether there's too many people in there in violation of the fire code. Another night it's Building & Safety to complain about exposed wires. He complained to the cops repeatedly about sound. He complained to the Health Board about the client's disposal of waste. And on and on and on.

Sometimes my client was cited (hey, it was a noisy-assed beach bar in an old-as hell building after all) and sometimes he wasn't, but it's always an interruption. And my client, a brawling little red-faced Kiwi who most certainly liked his drink, was about ready to beat his neighbor's brains in. I mean that literally - he actually threatened his neighbor on at least one occasion and we had to talk him down. You talk about two people being oil and water, it was those two.

But there's nothing we can do legally about his harassing complaint calls. Even if he calls with a completely fabricated complaint, he's statutorily protected in CA under the "Anti-SLAPP" statute. The protections are so broad (and rooted in the 1st Amendment) that at trial we can't even mention that the neighbor is the one calling all of these enforcement agencies when we're getting cited. Of course the jury is potentially left with the very prejudicial impression that calls are coming from many people and our establishment really is a nuisance - essentially the community has spoken.

This has been an ongoing problem in this neighborhood. Other restaurants are getting complaints and they're not out of hand. Some of these are pretty nice places, so don't get the idea that this is the Star Wars cantina scene or something (though my guy's bar was closer to that than most others). Residential neighbors are teaming up and making complaints. Anyway, the bar/restaurant owners are pissed off.

We go to trial, which lasted about two weeks. They're putting on testimony from an acoustical engineer who's measuring sound. We're of course in violation but trying to point out that a one-size-fits-all city-wide sound ordinance doesn't make any sense in a city a varied as Los Angeles. 80 decibels outside your bedroom window in Brentwood or Sherman Oaks isn't the same thing as 80 decibels outside on the Venice boardwalk. But we also can't argue the old "moved to the nuisance" standard because that's no longer allowed, so we can't really even get before the jury the theme that the gentrified neighbors are conspiring against the Venice beach establishments in a way that's "un-Venice".

Enter this chick. I'm avoiding writing her name to make this less searchable. She's a Venice legend. You talk about a brassy ball-breaker, this is your gal. She used to march around Venice's alleyways with a flashlight and roust gang members and drug users. She talks loud, and regularly speaks over you. She acts like she's hopped up on something, but that's just caffeine and her natural mania. She actually looks more normal in that video than she was in person.

We put her on our witness list because she hated the gentrification and particularly ####### hated the plaintiff - she's a classic, rough Venice Beach character, and the plaintiff is your typical West Side patent leather businessman ruining Venice. Her attitude was that she wanted crime out but keep Venice as it is otherwise. She also had some information about how some other property owners (who were on plaintiff's witness list) were exaggerating some of the things they were saying about our client.

I was the lead trial counsel; the attorney who brought me into the case was the guy with the connection to the restaurant, and he was second chairing. We debated for weeks, even before the trial started, about whether to call her. The problem is this: yes, she sides with our client and she's got some favorable things to say, but she's a completely loose cannon. Good luck explaining how there's a pre-trial ruling prohibiting reference to the plaintiff's serial complaints to enforcement agencies and getting her to not say anything, especially when she thinks it's all bulls h i t.

The trial's going ok and I feel like we're scoring some points, but there's also some evidence against us and we finally decide that we need to throw the Hail Mary. If nothing else she'll be memorable. My co-counsel was the one who had the relationship with her and because I felt like she was uncontrollable and I felt I'd established good credibility in front of the jury* (and I had plenty of other things to look after in the trial), I had him do the examination meet with her and prepare to prepare her. My thinking was that if this went all wrong, at least I wouldn't be the one who called her and examined her, and maybe during closing I can roll my eyes and shrug it off and then argue my case. Also, the actual questions we would pose to her were pretty limited.

Sure enough she barges into the courtroom when she's called.

"Where do I go? Is this where I go? Oh great." (speaking of decibels)

The clerk tries to swear her in, but she interrupts the clerk with some comment or question or something.

Her ### is barely in the chair on the witness stand and I'm wishing I was on vacation in Tahiti or something. I'm trying to look like this is all routine as I've got an open depo transcript in front of me that I'm pretending to read, but I'm just thinking "#### #### #### #### ####".

Now, mind you we've both told her before about what she's not allowed to testify about. A whole list of don'ts. She's expressing frustration and we're sympathetic but we're telling her that we'll get in trouble and it will hurt the bar's case if she violates the court's orders. She promises to comply. I have about zero confidence she's going to hold true. I just want to be able to tell the judge that we did in fact inform her of the court's rulings and orders.

She does ok on direct examination, and is laying into the "lying" neighbor witnesses. She's a character and the jury's engaged, but it feels like we're walking in a minefield with snowshoes.

Then cross-examination starts. This is one of those witnesses who you have to consider strongly just dismissing rather than doing your cross. A loose cannon for one side is going to be a loose cannon for the other, but at least she likes us. This plaintiff's attorney was an old blow-hard who thinks he springs from Clarence Darrow's loins. He felt that he needed to show her bias so undercut her accusations against his witnesses, but you're poking a grizzly bear here.

He starts into her. Naturally, she starts to push back. He then makes the mistake of pointing out how the bar's been cited umpteen times for violations, (and I'm already thinking "Oh ####, here it comes!") and she blurts out, "Well that's because [plaintiff's] calling them every night making up new things to complain about! It's ridiculous! I can't even believe we're here!"

I'm just frozen trying to stifle a smile. Plaintiff's counsel is standing there with his arms apart pleading for help. The judge starts to admonish her, but he's stuck because he doesn't want to say in front of the jury what we're not supposed to say in front of the jury. The judge points out that she needs to comply with court orders and she cuts him off by saying, "But it's true!" :lmao:

The cross-examination continues, and there are a couple of more rough repeats of this until plaintiffs counsel finally figured out that he was bleeding to death by continuing. The funny thing was that by the end even the judge had given up trying to admonish her, probably on the not-unreasonable grounds that each admonition was only highlighting the problem testimony that he wanted to exclude.

When the cross ended, I grabbed my co-counsel's arm and told him do NOT under any circumstances ask her any more questions. He agreed. :lol:

On closing I referred to her as "a piece of work" but also pointed out that she's undeniably genuine and has the best interests of the community in mind. We ended up defensing the case.

*I just remembered that one of the jurors was a regular at our bar. The plaintiff's counsel screwed up and overused his peremptory challenges, using up his last one which caused that juror to go into the box as one of the 12. Realizing his mistake the plaintiff's counsel tried to get him removed for cause and, because the juror assured the court that he could be fair and impartial, he wasn't removed. He was the arrogant old attorney who thought I was young and stupid and yet he committed a rookie mistake on that one. :lol:

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.
You submit discovery responses to the court where you are?
Not anymore. I moved on from the law firm a few years ago. But I would submit an initial draft to the attorneys I worked for regularly. The pattern interrogatory responses weren't difficult in the construction defect cases I handled. Most of them wrote themselves after I had seen a few. I could answer about 90% of them and ask for further instructions on the ones I wasn't certain on.

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.
You submit discovery responses to the court where you are?
Not anymore. I moved on from the law firm a few years ago. But I would submit an initial draft to the attorneys I worked for regularly. The pattern interrogatory responses weren't difficult in the construction defect cases I handled. Most of them wrote themselves after I had seen a few. I could answer about 90% of them and ask for further instructions on the ones I wasn't certain on.
No, I mean in my jurisdiction those don't get filed - they only go to counsel.

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.
You submit discovery responses to the court where you are?
Not anymore. I moved on from the law firm a few years ago. But I would submit an initial draft to the attorneys I worked for regularly. The pattern interrogatory responses weren't difficult in the construction defect cases I handled. Most of them wrote themselves after I had seen a few. I could answer about 90% of them and ask for further instructions on the ones I wasn't certain on.
No, I mean in my jurisdiction those don't get filed - they only go to counsel.
Oh, gotcha. I was instructed to file and send to counsel.

 
So wait, are these guys off work and just drinking at the bar at the time? Or is the assailant on the clock? Are you suing under respondeat superior or some independent form of liability?
I'm going to Hipple the hell out of Woz's story. You're suing the wife and brother? I'm flummoxed.
Yeah, there's a lot that doesn't make sense here.
I believe I clarified above...

I do also have to rant about my continuing idiocy on this case. I spent the bulk of yesterday preparing our responses to the interrogatories because yesterday was the deadline (a second deadline set, which of course I got permission to extend from one of the defense lawyers but didn't realize I didn't from the other - the quotation guy). This morning I get a sarcastic response from "quotation guy" asking why only about 1/3 of the non-uniform interrogatories were done. I look back at what we sent and it turns out my paralegal (who is the keystone of our office and makes a mistake about as often as it snows here) accidentally prepped, and I then accidentally signed, a previous rough draft I filled out with the bare bones obvious answers instead of the completed response. So this is the third time on this case I looked like an incompetent ####tard to this opposing counsel. My only solace at this point is that I am picturing this guy to be -fish- and that he has concluded I'm a giant moron and will be pushing his clients to settle just so he doesn't have to deal with me anymore.
If I may overstep my bounds and offer some unsolicited advice -

never ever sign something you haven't read fully at the time that you're signing it.
Without a doubt. Seems obvious, yet one of those things you don't fully appreciate until it bites you. This ranks up there with the first and only time I've ever missed an appeal deadline (just simply calendared it wrong - I now double and triple check the timing and calendar in multiple places) and first and only time I advised a client he didn't need to be at a hearing because the JA told me ex parte that the hearing was continued (she was wrong, and of course later tried to tell the judge that she didn't tell me that - putting me in the fun position of deciding whether to tell the judge his JA was a liar or falling on the sword and claiming incompetence).

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.
Wasn't going to the "courts."
Hope they weren't verified.
There is with the original full completed copy which was snail mailed out (and genuinely verified by the client). The mistake was in the e-mailed copy my paralegal sent, which was a second draft she had me sign. So, thankfully, the original version is complete and verified.

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.
Wasn't going to the "courts."
Hope they weren't verified.
There is with the original full completed copy which was snail mailed out (and genuinely verified by the client). The mistake was in the e-mailed copy my paralegal sent, which was a second draft she had me sign. So, thankfully, the original version is complete and verified.
Well, that's fine. Just tell him "thank you" for telling you that your paralegal screwed up, and that you're done with her screw ups and firing her. And that you personally had put the correct version in the mail, so at least you know that one's right.

 
Always check your work when submitting to the courts. I know that probably isn't taught at 4th rate law schools but it is in the Paralegal 101 courses.
Wasn't going to the "courts."
Hope they weren't verified.
There is with the original full completed copy which was snail mailed out (and genuinely verified by the client). The mistake was in the e-mailed copy my paralegal sent, which was a second draft she had me sign. So, thankfully, the original version is complete and verified.
Well, that's fine. Just tell him "thank you" for telling you that your paralegal screwed up, and that you're done with her screw ups and firing her. And that you personally had put the correct version in the mail, so at least you know that one's right.
:lmao:

 
I got a moment so I'll try to (briefly) tell one of my favorite stories.

My 1L summer I got a job as a student attorney for a public defender's office in Minnesota. After two weeks or so of shadowing, my job every morning was to meet with the new misdemeanor clients and see if I could resolve their cases with a plea. If I couldn't, I'd just set the matter for the next pre-trial conference. The ethical rules on conflicts for PDs is/was pretty lax in Minnesota, so the process was essentially those wanting a PD got to court about 8:00 AM, filled out their financials, and would know whether they were approved by about 9:00. If they were, I would be given the actual case file, which included the complaint and the police report. I'd then meet with clients, then the prosecutor to negotiate, then back with the clients again if need be and ideally have those pleading out ready to see judge by 10:00. It's a quick process and since I am just seeing disclosure right there, I'd usually review the DR fresh with the client upon meeting him.

About my third client in of my first day doing this alone was just with disorderly conduct. These are generally a dime a dozen and usually are made up of someone doing something stupid while drunk or they got in a fight and the cop cut them a break and didn't charge assault. I figure no big deal and meet with the guy with the plan to just review the file together with him.

Now, attorney-client privilege probably prevents me from stating the best parts of this story, but I imagine a camera videotaping me speaking to this guy as I read over the DR and my subsequent reactions had to be priceless. Facts per the DR (public record) are thus: After a night of some good drinking client is walking along a highway from one town to another (about 20 miles) not breaking any laws. Even though it's late spring/early summer it's cold outside at night in Minnesota so a female cop sees this guy, pulls over, and offers him a ride into town. He takes her up on it and she seats him in the backseat (not arrested at this point, hasn't done anything wrong). In the next ten miles, this guy is somehow able to masturbate to completion three times. After the first time the office tells him to stop and not do it again. After the second time the officer warns him she will arrest him if he does it again. After the third time, the officer calls for backup and arrests this guy. Through what I can only imagine is a mixture kindness and embarrassment, she only charges the guy with a misdemeanor disorderly conduct.

Fortunately for my client, he had little to no criminal history and the report gave the prosecutor a good laugh and I was able to work out a favorable plea deal. I tell client the good news and take his case to the judge to do the change of plea and sentencing. I tell my client to speak as little as possible and to only answer yes or no. In that particular court a factual basis is provided by the defense attorney asking his client factual questions to which the defendant must admit to lay the basis for the judge to access. Given that this is essentially a cattle call misdemeanor calendar, factual bases are usually pretty brief and the judge may only be half-listening. I'm banking on this.

When it comes time for the factual basis, I try to lay the most generic factual basis I can. I asked my client something like "You'd agree at x time on y date within this jurisdiction of this court you engaged in a particular behavior which was seriously disruptive and reasonably disturbed the peace of the officer escorting you at that time?" My client mutters a quick yes. I watch the judge finish the standard colloquy and start to hand the file off to his clerk. I start to breathe a sigh of relief and turn to my client to tell him he's all good.

As fate would have it though, something about the purely generic FB I gave must have set off alarm bells in the judge's head. He pulls the file back from the clerk, opens it, and takes a few moments to read the report. His eyes slowly widen and his mouth drops. "You… you did what??," he asks my client. My client doesn't know what to say.

The judge follows up,"Sir, it says here you masturbated three times in front of this officer who was nice enough to give you a ride. I see now why your counsel gave such a vague factual basis. I guess, I guess all I want to know MR "X" is… WHY?"

My client blushed. "Well, judge, I was in a warm car, I felt pretty good, she was pretty, and… it just seemed like the thing to do."

At this point half the gallery, especially the awaiting defendants, are laughing hysterically. I'm biting my tongue with everything I've got, trying to remain professional. I can see the judge's clerk sitting there speechless. The judge stammers on, "I…. I don't even know what to say. I have so many questions, particularly how this is even possible, but…. sir, I guess I've already taken your plea and sentenced you, just get your paperwork and don't ever do this again." At this point the entire court room is laughing, the judge is chuckling, my eyes were watering from trying so hard not to laugh, and even the defendant couldn't help but smile.

Worth noting is that a year later, when I was back for my 2L summer, I got the same defendant back on a probation violation for having a little too much fun in a laundromat.

 
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I got a moment so I'll try to (briefly) tell one of my favorite stories.

My 1L summer I got a job as a student attorney for a public defender's office in Minnesota. After two weeks or so of shadowing, my job every morning was to meet with the new misdemeanor clients and see if I could resolve their cases with a plea. If I couldn't, I'd just set the matter for the next pre-trial conference. The ethical rules on conflicts for PDs is/was pretty lax in Minnesota, so the process was essentially those wanting a PD got to court about 8:00 AM, filled out their financials, and would know whether they were approved by about 9:00. If they were, I would be given the actual case file, which included the complaint and the police report. I'd then meet with clients, then the prosecutor to negotiate, then back with the clients again if need be and ideally have those pleading out ready to see judge by 10:00. It's a quick process and since I am just seeing disclosure right there, I'd usually review the DR fresh with the client upon meeting him.

About my third client in of my first day doing this alone was just with disorderly conduct. These are generally a dime a dozen and usually are made up of someone doing something stupid while drunk or they got in a fight and the cop cut them a break and didn't charge assault. I figure no big deal and meet with the guy with the plan to just review the file together with him.

Now, attorney-client privilege probably prevents me from stating the best parts of this story, but I imagine a camera videotaping me speaking to this guy as I read over the DR and my subsequent reactions had to be priceless. Facts per the DR (public record) are thus: After a night of some good drinking client is walking along a highway from one town to another (about 20 miles) not breaking any laws. Even though it's late spring/early summer it's cold outside at night in Minnesota so a female cop sees this guy, pulls over, and offers him a ride into town. He takes her up on it and she seats him in the backseat (not arrested at this point, hasn't done anything wrong). In the next ten miles, this guy is somehow able to masturbate to completion three times. After the first time the office tells him to stop and not do it again. After the second time the officer warns him she will arrest him if he does it again. After the third time, the officer calls for backup and arrests this guy. Through what I can only imagine is a mixture kindness and embarrassment, she only charges the guy with a misdemeanor disorderly conduct.

Fortunately for my client, he had little to no criminal history and the report gave the prosecutor a good laugh and I was able to work out a favorable plea deal. I tell client the good news and take his case to the judge to do the change of plea and sentencing. I tell my client to speak as little as possible and to only answer yes or no. In that particular court a factual basis is provided by the defense attorney asking his client factual questions to which the defendant must admit to lay the basis for the judge to access. Given that this is essentially a cattle call misdemeanor calendar, factual bases are usually pretty brief and the judge may only be half-listening. I'm banking on this.

When it comes time for the factual basis, I try to lay the most generic factual basis I can. I asked my client something like "You'd agree at x time on y date within this jurisdiction of this court you engaged in a particular behavior which was seriously disruptive and reasonably disturbed the peace of the officer escorting you at that time?" My client mutters a quick yes. I watch the judge finish the standard colloquy and start to hand the file off to his clerk. I start to breathe a sigh of relief and turn to my client to tell him he's all good.

As fate would have it though, something about the purely generic FB I gave must have set off alarm bells in the judge's head. He pulls the file back from the clerk, opens it, and takes a few moments to read the report. His eyes slowly widen and his mouth drops. "You… you did what??," he asks my client. My client doesn't know what to say.

The judge follows up,"Sir, it says here you masturbated three times in front of this officer who was nice enough to give you a ride. I see now why your counsel gave such a vague factual basis. I guess, I guess all I want to know MR "X" is… WHY?"

My client blushed. "Well, judge, I was in a warm car, I felt pretty good, she was pretty, and… it just seemed like the thing to do."

At this point half the gallery, especially the awaiting defendants, are laughing hysterically. I'm biting my tongue with everything I've got, trying to remain professional. I can see the judge's clerk sitting there speechless. The judge stammers on, "I…. I don't even know what to say. I have so many questions, particularly how this is even possible, but…. sir, I guess I've already taken your plea and sentenced you, just get your paperwork and don't ever do this again." At this point the entire court room is laughing, the judge is chuckling, my eyes were watering from trying so hard not to laugh, and even the defendant couldn't help but smile.

Worth noting is that a year later, when I was back for my 2L summer, I got the same defendant back on a probation violation for having a little too much fun in a laundromat.
You are an Outlaw Masturbation Lawyer?

 
. My only solace at this point is that I am picturing this guy to be -fish- and that he has concluded I'm a giant moron and will be pushing his clients to settle just so he doesn't have to deal with me anymore.
I've been a plaintiff's litigator my whole career. I would punish a floundering attorney with motion practice and discovery until his eyes bled.

Is this your first civil case as a plaintiff? Not meaning to be disparaging (this time) but you're doing some weird stuff.

How have you valued this case?

 
I got a moment so I'll try to (briefly) tell one of my favorite stories.

My 1L summer I got a job as a student attorney for a public defender's office in Minnesota. After two weeks or so of shadowing, my job every morning was to meet with the new misdemeanor clients and see if I could resolve their cases with a plea. If I couldn't, I'd just set the matter for the next pre-trial conference. The ethical rules on conflicts for PDs is/was pretty lax in Minnesota, so the process was essentially those wanting a PD got to court about 8:00 AM, filled out their financials, and would know whether they were approved by about 9:00. If they were, I would be given the actual case file, which included the complaint and the police report. I'd then meet with clients, then the prosecutor to negotiate, then back with the clients again if need be and ideally have those pleading out ready to see judge by 10:00. It's a quick process and since I am just seeing disclosure right there, I'd usually review the DR fresh with the client upon meeting him.

About my third client in of my first day doing this alone was just with disorderly conduct. These are generally a dime a dozen and usually are made up of someone doing something stupid while drunk or they got in a fight and the cop cut them a break and didn't charge assault. I figure no big deal and meet with the guy with the plan to just review the file together with him.

Now, attorney-client privilege probably prevents me from stating the best parts of this story, but I imagine a camera videotaping me speaking to this guy as I read over the DR and my subsequent reactions had to be priceless. Facts per the DR (public record) are thus: After a night of some good drinking client is walking along a highway from one town to another (about 20 miles) not breaking any laws. Even though it's late spring/early summer it's cold outside at night in Minnesota so a female cop sees this guy, pulls over, and offers him a ride into town. He takes her up on it and she seats him in the backseat (not arrested at this point, hasn't done anything wrong). In the next ten miles, this guy is somehow able to masturbate to completion three times. After the first time the office tells him to stop and not do it again. After the second time the officer warns him she will arrest him if he does it again. After the third time, the officer calls for backup and arrests this guy. Through what I can only imagine is a mixture kindness and embarrassment, she only charges the guy with a misdemeanor disorderly conduct.

Fortunately for my client, he had little to no criminal history and the report gave the prosecutor a good laugh and I was able to work out a favorable plea deal. I tell client the good news and take his case to the judge to do the change of plea and sentencing. I tell my client to speak as little as possible and to only answer yes or no. In that particular court a factual basis is provided by the defense attorney asking his client factual questions to which the defendant must admit to lay the basis for the judge to access. Given that this is essentially a cattle call misdemeanor calendar, factual bases are usually pretty brief and the judge may only be half-listening. I'm banking on this.

When it comes time for the factual basis, I try to lay the most generic factual basis I can. I asked my client something like "You'd agree at x time on y date within this jurisdiction of this court you engaged in a particular behavior which was seriously disruptive and reasonably disturbed the peace of the officer escorting you at that time?" My client mutters a quick yes. I watch the judge finish the standard colloquy and start to hand the file off to his clerk. I start to breathe a sigh of relief and turn to my client to tell him he's all good.

As fate would have it though, something about the purely generic FB I gave must have set off alarm bells in the judge's head. He pulls the file back from the clerk, opens it, and takes a few moments to read the report. His eyes slowly widen and his mouth drops. "You… you did what??," he asks my client. My client doesn't know what to say.

The judge follows up,"Sir, it says here you masturbated three times in front of this officer who was nice enough to give you a ride. I see now why your counsel gave such a vague factual basis. I guess, I guess all I want to know MR "X" is… WHY?"

My client blushed. "Well, judge, I was in a warm car, I felt pretty good, she was pretty, and… it just seemed like the thing to do."

At this point half the gallery, especially the awaiting defendants, are laughing hysterically. I'm biting my tongue with everything I've got, trying to remain professional. I can see the judge's clerk sitting there speechless. The judge stammers on, "I…. I don't even know what to say. I have so many questions, particularly how this is even possible, but…. sir, I guess I've already taken your plea and sentenced you, just get your paperwork and don't ever do this again." At this point the entire court room is laughing, the judge is chuckling, my eyes were watering from trying so hard not to laugh, and even the defendant couldn't help but smile.

Worth noting is that a year later, when I was back for my 2L summer, I got the same defendant back on a probation violation for having a little too much fun in a laundromat.
Sounds like the fuzz busted him...

(•_•)


( •_•)>⌐■-■


...and then he busted a nut.

(⌐■_■)
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

 
I got a moment so I'll try to (briefly) tell one of my favorite stories.

My 1L summer I got a job as a student attorney for a public defender's office in Minnesota. After two weeks or so of shadowing, my job every morning was to meet with the new misdemeanor clients and see if I could resolve their cases with a plea. If I couldn't, I'd just set the matter for the next pre-trial conference. The ethical rules on conflicts for PDs is/was pretty lax in Minnesota, so the process was essentially those wanting a PD got to court about 8:00 AM, filled out their financials, and would know whether they were approved by about 9:00. If they were, I would be given the actual case file, which included the complaint and the police report. I'd then meet with clients, then the prosecutor to negotiate, then back with the clients again if need be and ideally have those pleading out ready to see judge by 10:00. It's a quick process and since I am just seeing disclosure right there, I'd usually review the DR fresh with the client upon meeting him.

About my third client in of my first day doing this alone was just with disorderly conduct. These are generally a dime a dozen and usually are made up of someone doing something stupid while drunk or they got in a fight and the cop cut them a break and didn't charge assault. I figure no big deal and meet with the guy with the plan to just review the file together with him.

Now, attorney-client privilege probably prevents me from stating the best parts of this story, but I imagine a camera videotaping me speaking to this guy as I read over the DR and my subsequent reactions had to be priceless. Facts per the DR (public record) are thus: After a night of some good drinking client is walking along a highway from one town to another (about 20 miles) not breaking any laws. Even though it's late spring/early summer it's cold outside at night in Minnesota so a female cop sees this guy, pulls over, and offers him a ride into town. He takes her up on it and she seats him in the backseat (not arrested at this point, hasn't done anything wrong). In the next ten miles, this guy is somehow able to masturbate to completion three times. After the first time the office tells him to stop and not do it again. After the second time the officer warns him she will arrest him if he does it again. After the third time, the officer calls for backup and arrests this guy. Through what I can only imagine is a mixture kindness and embarrassment, she only charges the guy with a misdemeanor disorderly conduct.

Fortunately for my client, he had little to no criminal history and the report gave the prosecutor a good laugh and I was able to work out a favorable plea deal. I tell client the good news and take his case to the judge to do the change of plea and sentencing. I tell my client to speak as little as possible and to only answer yes or no. In that particular court a factual basis is provided by the defense attorney asking his client factual questions to which the defendant must admit to lay the basis for the judge to access. Given that this is essentially a cattle call misdemeanor calendar, factual bases are usually pretty brief and the judge may only be half-listening. I'm banking on this.

When it comes time for the factual basis, I try to lay the most generic factual basis I can. I asked my client something like "You'd agree at x time on y date within this jurisdiction of this court you engaged in a particular behavior which was seriously disruptive and reasonably disturbed the peace of the officer escorting you at that time?" My client mutters a quick yes. I watch the judge finish the standard colloquy and start to hand the file off to his clerk. I start to breathe a sigh of relief and turn to my client to tell him he's all good.

As fate would have it though, something about the purely generic FB I gave must have set off alarm bells in the judge's head. He pulls the file back from the clerk, opens it, and takes a few moments to read the report. His eyes slowly widen and his mouth drops. "You… you did what??," he asks my client. My client doesn't know what to say.

The judge follows up,"Sir, it says here you masturbated three times in front of this officer who was nice enough to give you a ride. I see now why your counsel gave such a vague factual basis. I guess, I guess all I want to know MR "X" is… WHY?"

My client blushed. "Well, judge, I was in a warm car, I felt pretty good, she was pretty, and… it just seemed like the thing to do."

At this point half the gallery, especially the awaiting defendants, are laughing hysterically. I'm biting my tongue with everything I've got, trying to remain professional. I can see the judge's clerk sitting there speechless. The judge stammers on, "I…. I don't even know what to say. I have so many questions, particularly how this is even possible, but…. sir, I guess I've already taken your plea and sentenced you, just get your paperwork and don't ever do this again." At this point the entire court room is laughing, the judge is chuckling, my eyes were watering from trying so hard not to laugh, and even the defendant couldn't help but smile.

Worth noting is that a year later, when I was back for my 2L summer, I got the same defendant back on a probation violation for having a little too much fun in a laundromat.
That guy should probably get some help.
Why, he seems quite capable going solo. He doesn't seem to need much help. I'd never lend him a hand for fear he would instantly slap his #### into it.

 
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. My only solace at this point is that I am picturing this guy to be -fish- and that he has concluded I'm a giant moron and will be pushing his clients to settle just so he doesn't have to deal with me anymore.
I've been a plaintiff's litigator my whole career. I would punish a floundering attorney with motion practice and discovery until his eyes bled.

Is this your first civil case as a plaintiff? Not meaning to be disparaging (this time) but you're doing some weird stuff.

How have you valued this case?
This. Want to freak out a defense attorney?

File a motion for partial summary judgment for each of those b.s. affirmative defenses they filed with their answer.

 
When I was a law clerk it was back in the days of dot matrix printers and Wordstar as a common word processing program. Lots of attorneys and paralegals would load common phrases in briefs, pleadings, or motions on macros on library keys, two simple keystrokes and the lengthy phrase was produced. This was way cool back in those days. You really had to know your way around the program to be aware of the feature. Yes it was the dark ages.

A woman living on the outskirts of a fairly small town kept two malnourished, pathetic male African lions penned up in her backyard. Lord knows why, but I understand there may be thousands of such folks around the country. Her pen was a century fence type of structure that may have been sufficient to restrain a black lab, but was inadequate to the task of restraining her lions.

One day the inevitable happened when her mailman was making his delivery. The lions got out and they mauled, but did not kill, the gentleman and a lawsuit ensued. Plaintiff's attorney, perhaps in an attempt to sound erudite, decided to refer to the big cats as Mrs. X's Africanized lions. Africanized rather than African. Whatever. Because Mrs. X actually had a very long name Counsel obviously determined to load that expression, "Mrs. x's Africanized lions" onto a macro for a library key so that he could hit two keystrokes and be home free on not having to type the lengthy phrase. He probably used that expression 25 times or more in his Complaint. Here's the thing. He mistyped the expression and did so in a way that he still typed out a word that would not alert spellcheck to find his problem and his misspelling made its way consistently throughout the Complaint. Whether he proofread the document and was dyslexic, or whether he was simply rushed and careless I do not know. What I do know is that his Complaint set forth in great detail how Mrs. X's Africanized loins escaped their enclosure, leapt upon, and mauled the postal carrier nearly to death.

At this point is should be noted that Mrs. X was an African-American.

What should have been a powerful Complaint was reduced to a source of merriment for those of us who read it.

 
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. My only solace at this point is that I am picturing this guy to be -fish- and that he has concluded I'm a giant moron and will be pushing his clients to settle just so he doesn't have to deal with me anymore.
I've been a plaintiff's litigator my whole career. I would punish a floundering attorney with motion practice and discovery until his eyes bled.

Is this your first civil case as a plaintiff? Not meaning to be disparaging (this time) but you're doing some weird stuff.

How have you valued this case?
This. Want to freak out a defense attorney? File a motion for partial summary judgment for each of those b.s. affirmative defenses they filed with their answer.
Texas has liberal pleadings amendment rules, so I never throw in a bunch of boilerplate affirmative defenses at the beginning of the case. I amend later after doing discovery to add only legitimate defenses. Works much better that way. In federal court, a few of the local federal judges in my town have a habit of asking the defense attorney to summarize the facts supporting his or her affirmative defenses at the scheduling conference. That has cut down on the use of boilerplate defenses quite a bit in our local federal courts.

That said, even were I faced with such a partial summary judgment motion, I doubt I'd freak out about it. I'd simply brief the legitimate defenses and not oppose dismissal of the BS ones. And I'd get paid for the time I spent on the brief (with the understanding that I'm not spending the client's money briefing the sure fire losers). But again, as a rule, I don't throw in a bunch of superfluous and bogus defenses like some lawyers do.

 
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Also, as a general matter, big firm civil defense lawyers are rarely bothered by motion practice as they typically have unlimited resources with respect to available attorneys and they get paid for all the work you create for them.

 

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