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The Official "Luck vs. RG3" dynasty league thread (1 Viewer)

Where does RG3 end up?


  • Total voters
    155

Sabertooth

Footballguy
These guys will be compared for their careers. It's a simple fact. Just like Leaf-Manning, Rivers-Manning, Rodgers and Smith. So who do you think will have a bigger fantasy football impact? This would be a great time on the eve of the draft to get your opinion out there for posterity. We could be talking about how close these guys are some time in 2022. Or we could be saying that at was obvious that one was Leaf to the other's Manning. But this is often done with the benefit of hindsight, which is kind of a copout. So get your opinion down now, on the eve of their NFL careers and let's see where the chips fall in the first few years, and then throughout their careers. Should be fun to bump this topic from time to time just to see how perfectly reasonable things today may seem outlandish, and dare I say blasphemous in the future.

 
For the record, I like RG3 in the short term and long term over Luck as a fantasy quarterback. The only thing that scares me is the potential for injury that is raised with increased rushing attempts. I think his physical skills are going to be the best we've ever seen in the NFL, that includes Vick, Favre, and Young. He's a whole different beast.

From a situational standpoint, assuming Luck goes to the Colts and Griffin to the Skins, I like Griffin better. Yeah the Skins are a laughingstock because of some of the FA busts. But at least Snyder tries to win. He's not there just to fill the seats, he wants to win. They have superior receivers currently with Garcon, Moss, Hankerson and Davis. The Colts are a mess, new coach and GM, the owner is running the show like a crazier Jerry Jones down there. They Reggie Wayne, but for how long and how effective can he continue to be. After him you have who? Collie? Can you even count on him to finish the season let alone have a meaningful career?

 
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Here is a nice little "Tale of the Tape" article I found. I prefer to look at these things pre-draft before situation really plays too much of a role (although with these two their teams are all but locked in already).

Athlon Sports takes a look at the tale of the tape, pitting Luck vs. RG3 in every measurable and intangible attribute necessary to be a franchise quarterback at the next level.

PEDIGREE

LUCK: Born Sept. 12, 1989 in Washington, D.C., to Oliver and Kathy Luck. Father played quarterback at West Virginia and in the NFL for five years with the Houston Oilers, and is currently the athletic director at WVU.

RG3: Born Feb. 12, 1990 in Japan, where Robert Jr. and Jacqueline Griffin were stationed. Both parents are retired sergeants in the U.S. Army. Griffin is also recently engaged to Baylor’s Rebecca Liddicoat.

EDGE: Both have stable, two-parent homes and are essentially the same age. But LUCK comes from NFL bloodlines, which is always an advantage.

STATURE

LUCK: 6’4”, 234 pounds, 32 5/8” arms

RG3: 6’2”, 223 pounds, 32 1/4” arms

EDGE: Both have the frame necessary to play quarterback in the NFL, where quarterbacks range from defensive end-sized Cam Newton (6’5”, 248 pounds, 33 3/4” arms) to barely big enough Drew Brees (6’0”, 209 pounds, 31 1/4” arms). LUCK has prototypical size.

FOOTBALL IQ

LUCK: Raised by a former quarterback father and coached by 15-year NFL veteran signal-caller Jim Harbaugh. The NFL Coach of the Year and current San Francisco 49ers boss, “Captain Comeback” was instrumental in Luck’s development at Stanford, where Harbaugh coached from 2007-10.

In his final season at Stanford, Luck did his best Peyton Manning impression at the line of scrimmage. “We put the formation out there and let Andrew call the play. It’s 100 percent up to him to get us in the right play,” explained Cardinal coach David Shaw, who was Luck’s offensive coordinator prior to taking over the top spot.

RG3: Orchestrated Art Briles’ spread offense to perfection. Not to imply RG3 is a “system quarterback,” but Kevin Kolb (2003-06) and Case Keenum (2007) also put up video game gaudy numbers in Briles’ quick-strike attack when he coached at Houston.

EDGE: LUCK ran a pro-style offense in which he was the centerpiece play-caller and playmaker, a la Manning.

LATE-GAME LEADERSHIP

LUCK: Showed the heart of a champion in 2011 during a triple-overtime win over USC (56–48). Luck threw a costly pick-six to give the Trojans the lead with 3:08 remaining in regulation before marching the Cardinal downfield to tie the game with 38 ticks on the clock — before leading three TD drives in the overtime win. In 2010, Luck led a nine-play, 62-yard drive in the final 1:08 to set up a game-winning FG to beat USC (37–35) as time expired, and had a fourth-quarter comeback to take down Arizona State (17–14).

RG3: Proved to be a winner of the highest order in 2011, pulling off four come-from-behind wins in the fourth quarter or overtime — against TCU (50–48) in the season’s Friday night opener; at Kansas (31–30) after a three-TD fourth-quarter rally to force overtime; against No. 5 Oklahoma (45–38) on a thrilling 34-yard TD pass with eight seconds to play, resulting in Baylor’s highest-ranked upset win since 1985; and in his final collegiate contest in the Alamo Bowl against Washington (67–56). In 2010, Griffin came from behind at Texas (30–22) for Baylor’s first win in Austin since 1991.

EDGE: Both have had late-game heroics. Luck had fewer shining moments in the fourth quarter — due in large part to the talented BCS bowl (Orange in 2010, Fiesta in 2011) teams he played on. At times, RG3 seemingly was a one-man show, willing the Bears to victory.

ACCURACY

LUCK: Owns the Pac-12 records for both single-season (71.3 percent) and career (67.0 percent) completion percentage.

RG3: Ranks third all-time in single-season (72.4 percent) and sixth all-time in career completion percentage (67.1 percent) in Big 12 history.

EDGE: Both LUCK and RG3 have shown touch on short and intermediate routes; the difference is negligible.



ARM STRENGTH

LUCK: Was famously criticized by Super Bowl-winning quarterback and CBS analyst Phil Simms. “The one thing I don’t see, I just don’t see big-time NFL throws. I don’t care what anybody says. I’ve watched a lot of him. He never takes it and rips it in there. And you can say what you want but, man, you’ve got to be able to crease that ball every once in a while,” said Simms. “There’s not a lot of rotation on the ball and there’s not a tremendous amount of power.”

RG3: Was able to utilize vertical deep threat — and likely NFL first-round pick — receiver Kendall Wright, who had at least one catch of 40 or more yards in six games and nine scoring grabs covering 30 or more yards last year.

EDGE: RG3 showed the ability and willingness to grip-it and rip-it downfield on a consistent basis. In fairness, Luck might have done the same if he had been fortunate enough to play with an NFL-caliber wideout with high-end speed.



HAND SIZE

LUCK: 10”

RG3: 9 1/2”

EDGE: Protecting the football in the NFL can never be undervalued. It only helps to have big mits when trying to hold on to the ball in sloppy conditions or when being blindsided by a 300-pounder. LUCK has hands in the Drew Brees (10 1/4”) or Brett Favre (10 3/8”) range, while RG3 is in fringy Daunte Culpepper (9 1/2”) or Alex Smith (9 3/8”) territory.



MEDICAL HISTORY

LUCK: Missed a Sun Bowl loss to Oklahoma (31–27) as a redshirt freshman following the 2009 season due to surgery on his broken right index finger.

RG3: Granted medical redshirt after suffering a season-ending knee injury in the third game of his true sophomore season in 2009.

EDGE: LUCK only missed one game during his Stanford career; RG3 missed most of the 2009 season.

ATHLETICISM

LUCK: Ran a 4.67 in the 40-yard dash, had a 36” vertical leap and a 10’4” broad jump at the Scouting Combine.

RG3: Ran a quarterback-record 4.41 in the 40, had a 39” vertical and 10’ broad jump at the Scouting Combine.

EDGE: Although Luck’s numbers were eerily similar to Cam Newton’s (4.59 in the 40, 35” vertical, 10’6” broad), RG3 dazzled the crowd in Indianapolis. Both are elite athletes compared to the majority of their quarterback peers.

COLLEGE PRODUCTION

LUCK: Passed for 9,430 yards, 82 TDs and 22 INTs. Rushed for 957 yards and seven TDs. Posted a 31–7 career record (1–1 in bowls). Won Walter Camp Foundation Player of the Year, Maxwell Trophy, Johnny Unitas Golden Arm Award and Pac-12 Offensive Player of the Year.

RG3: Passed for 10,366 yards, 78 TDs and 17 INTs. Rushed for 2,254 yards and 33 TDs. Posted a 23–18 career record (1–1 in bowls). Won Heisman Trophy, Davey O’Brien Award, Manning Award and Big 12 Offensive Player of the Year. Graduated with degree in political science.

EDGE: RG3 barely edges Luck in terms of complete body of work; the Heisman Trophy poses as a powerful tiebreaker.

MARKETABILITY

LUCK: Signed with Nike; first ad explains that Andrew’s hard work “Makes His Luck.” Since shaving his 2011 offseason neck beard, Luck has been as clean cut as any college kid in the country.

RG3: Signed with adidas; wore gold adizero 5-Star shoes at the Combine and a “No Pressure, No Diamonds” adidas t-shirt while working out at his Pro Day and as a spectacled fan at the Baylor-Kentucky NCAA Tournament matchup in Atlanta. Also famously wore Superman socks to the Heisman Trophy ceremony in New York.

EDGE: LUCK probably has a higher Q Score due to his extended time in the spotlight, but RG3 has quickly established himself as a stylish brand to be reckoned with.

Both are extremely polished dealing with media and fans, understand exactly what is expected of them on and off the field, and appear to be mature enough to handle the responsibility of being the face of a nine-figure franchise.

VERDICT

Although the race to No. 1 is closer than anyone would have predicted at this time last year, LUCK remains the top quarterback in the 2012 NFL Draft. In the areas where RG3 has a clear edge, the gap is not significant enough to surpass Luck as the top passer available. The whole is greater than the sum of its parts where Luck is concerned; he is a worthy heir to Manning and deserves to be the No. 1 pick of the Indianapolis Colts on April 26.

by Nathan Rush
 
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I like RGIII, and I think he will have a good, perhaps even great NFL career (I'm a fan regardless), but I think Luck is a very rare talent at the QB position; Luck is the clear pick here imo.

Look forward to seeing what players Indy and Wash draft at WR/TE this week? I'll likely be putting extra weight on these players in round two of rookie drafts.

 
Purely speaking fantasy and assuming 4 point passing TD's, RG3 on everything. His rushing numbers should easily let him outproduce Luck even if Luck passes for 30 TD's.

 
For the record, I like RG3 in the short term and long term over Luck as a fantasy quarterback. The only thing that scares me is the potential for injury that is raised with increased rushing attempts. I think his physical skills are going to be the best we've ever seen in the NFL, that includes Vick, Favre, and Young. He's a whole different beast.

From a situational standpoint, assuming Luck goes to the Colts and Griffin to the Skins, I like Griffin better. Yeah the Skins are a laughingstock because of some of the FA busts. But at least Snyder tries to win. He's not there just to fill the seats, he wants to win. They have superior receivers currently with Garcon, Moss, Hankerson and Davis. The Colts are a mess, new coach and GM, the owner is running the show like a crazier Jerry Jones down there. They Reggie Wayne, but for how long and how effective can he continue to be. After him you have who? Collie? Can you even count on him to finish the season let alone have a meaningful career?
Someone never watched Randall Cunningham play. He was a top 4 QB in 5 out 6 straight years and the number fantasy player in two of those years. It likely would have been 6 straight if he hadn't been injured.
 
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I like RGIII, and I think he will have a good, perhaps even great NFL career (I'm a fan regardless), but I think Luck is a very rare talent at the QB position; Luck is the clear pick here imo.Look forward to seeing what players Indy and Wash draft at WR/TE this week? I'll likely be putting extra weight on these players in round two of rookie drafts.
Depending on scoring for rushing, don't you think RG3 could put up 500-800 yards per season pretty consistently? I mean, if he takes off with defenders covering downfield, he could literally score before you had a chance to catch him and get an angle.
 
For the record, I like RG3 in the short term and long term over Luck as a fantasy quarterback. The only thing that scares me is the potential for injury that is raised with increased rushing attempts. I think his physical skills are going to be the best we've ever seen in the NFL, that includes Vick, Favre, and Young. He's a whole different beast.

From a situational standpoint, assuming Luck goes to the Colts and Griffin to the Skins, I like Griffin better. Yeah the Skins are a laughingstock because of some of the FA busts. But at least Snyder tries to win. He's not there just to fill the seats, he wants to win. They have superior receivers currently with Garcon, Moss, Hankerson and Davis. The Colts are a mess, new coach and GM, the owner is running the show like a crazier Jerry Jones down there. They Reggie Wayne, but for how long and how effective can he continue to be. After him you have who? Collie? Can you even count on him to finish the season let alone have a meaningful career?
Someone never watched Randall Cunningham play. He was a top 4 QB in 5 out 6 straight years and the number fantasy player in two of those years. It likely would have been 6 straight if he hadn't been injured.
Oh I certainly watched him. And not the retread that played for Minnesota. He is the best comp for RG3. And as you state, he was a fantastic fantasy QB. And RG3 is faster.
 
RG3 has smallish hands. That doesn't sound like a big deal, but it really was a problem for Culpepper. And I really think in the cold weather this could be an issue. Favre had huge hands and I think this is why he was able to grip the ball in those sloppy games. Washington has been known to have to ill weather late in the season.

 
Interesting trend happening. The majority think Luck will be the better long term guy, but that RG3 will be better in years 1-3. Isn't Luck the more polished guy? He's the one that ran the pro-style offense and called his own plays. Not sure why RG3 would have the advantage early on, but not late.

 
Interesting trend happening. The majority think Luck will be the better long term guy, but that RG3 will be better in years 1-3. Isn't Luck the more polished guy? He's the one that ran the pro-style offense and called his own plays. Not sure why RG3 would have the advantage early on, but not late.
I don't think its as much a knock on Luck as it is his situation. Might take a few years for the Colts to rebuild. Whereas Washington has more pieces in place for RGIII to succeed right away, plus his rushing ability should give him an advantage while they both adjust and develop. At least that seems to be how I'm interpreting what I'm hearing.
 
Interesting trend happening. The majority think Luck will be the better long term guy, but that RG3 will be better in years 1-3. Isn't Luck the more polished guy? He's the one that ran the pro-style offense and called his own plays. Not sure why RG3 would have the advantage early on, but not late.
I voted that way because right now Griffin has the better supporting cast and his rushing stats will help make up for the typical rookie struggles learning to pass in the NFL that each will have whether they are polished or not. I do think people are over-rating Griffin's rushing ability a bit though - not that I don't think he's a talented runner, but I do think Washington will try to limit the number of rushes he makes - he's on the smaller side and you don't want you franchise QB on the sideline for 3-4 games a season. Also while he's extremely fast, he's not as shifty as Vick or as strong as Cam so his rushing totals are likely not on their level.
 
Interesting trend happening. The majority think Luck will be the better long term guy, but that RG3 will be better in years 1-3. Isn't Luck the more polished guy? He's the one that ran the pro-style offense and called his own plays. Not sure why RG3 would have the advantage early on, but not late.
I don't think its as much a knock on Luck as it is his situation. Might take a few years for the Colts to rebuild. Whereas Washington has more pieces in place for RGIII to succeed right away, plus his rushing ability should give him an advantage while they both adjust and develop. At least that seems to be how I'm interpreting what I'm hearing.
Yeah, but what if they completely hose the rebuilding process? Nobody in that front office has any chops at building a team. We could be looking at an Archie Manning type of situation here. Where he's a great player but just doesn't get any help. They are damn near expansion team level right now in terms of talent.
 
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Luck to me is much safer pick to produce above average to even great results. RGIII is very good prospect, but his pedigree and pro potential is not as good a Luck's.

 
Luck to me is much safer pick to produce above average to even great results. RGIII is very good prospect, but his pedigree and pro potential is not as good a Luck's.
I'm not really worried about pedigree so much. Not even really sure what that means as Stanford hasn't exactly been a powerhouse for a long time. But as far as potential goes, I have RG3 squarely above Luck. I think Luck will top out as an Eli Manning type of guy. Very good player. But just under the top guys in fantasy terms. I think RG3 tops out as a faster John Elway but playing by 2012 rules and no 1993 rules. I have the first pick in a 2qb dynasty and right now I'd select Griffin and shoot for the moon. Better athlete, equal drive, better surrounding cast, better coaching staff (at least until proven otherwise)
 
I just hope this is better than Leaf/Manning and not more like Harrington/Carr

 
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Luck to me is much safer pick to produce above average to even great results. RGIII is very good prospect, but his pedigree and pro potential is not as good a Luck's.
I'm not really worried about pedigree so much. Not even really sure what that means as Stanford hasn't exactly been a powerhouse for a long time. But as far as potential goes, I have RG3 squarely above Luck. I think Luck will top out as an Eli Manning type of guy. Very good player. But just under the top guys in fantasy terms. I think RG3 tops out as a faster John Elway but playing by 2012 rules and no 1993 rules. I have the first pick in a 2qb dynasty and right now I'd select Griffin and shoot for the moon. Better athlete, equal drive, better surrounding cast, better coaching staff (at least until proven otherwise)
Surrounding casts change pretty quickly in the NFL so from my perspective that is the last thing I'm looking at for these 2 in dynasty. Redraft, I'd say it's opposite. From a talent standpoint, these guys are neck and neck IMO. These very little about either guy I don't like. For RG3 my least favorite thing is that he comes from the spread. I hate evaluating QBs from the spread. It's a pain in the neck. He's clearly the highest rated QB I've ever seen come from that offense though. The thing I like least about Luck is how everyone is overreacting to his NFL readiness due to his read progression. We hear regularly that Luck would get to his 3rd or 4th option in his read progression. I won't disagree with that. What I find interesting though is that he most often did that out of 2 TE or more sets. This is not the same as doing it from a Pro set offense where you are scanning the enter field. Am I splitting hairs? Perhaps so. With guys this qualified you kind of have to though. In the end I give the edge to Luck because I just don't trust the spread offense and think it leaves a much larger gray area in evaluation. I know RG3 has the better supporting cast right now but I love the fact that Indy went out and got 2 top level TEs in this draft to match up with him. This is a strong indication to me that they plan to implement a lot of the offensive schemes that Luck is comfortable with based on the Stanford 2 TE sets. They seem to be building around him. Who knows, in next years draft Indy could be adding a WR like K. Allen or R. Woods, giving them a true #1 for Luck to also throw to. One move like that and suddenly Luck's got the far superior surrounding cast IMO.
 
RG3 for me. Shanny does well with QBs with his skill set. I'll take a Steve Young, Randell Cunningham, Mike Vick hybrid any day! I do think Luck will be great too, but I'm on the RG3 bandwagon. :thumbup:

 
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Luck to me is much safer pick to produce above average to even great results. RGIII is very good prospect, but his pedigree and pro potential is not as good a Luck's.
I'm not really worried about pedigree so much. Not even really sure what that means as Stanford hasn't exactly been a powerhouse for a long time. But as far as potential goes, I have RG3 squarely above Luck. I think Luck will top out as an Eli Manning type of guy. Very good player. But just under the top guys in fantasy terms. I think RG3 tops out as a faster John Elway but playing by 2012 rules and no 1993 rules. I have the first pick in a 2qb dynasty and right now I'd select Griffin and shoot for the moon. Better athlete, equal drive, better surrounding cast, better coaching staff (at least until proven otherwise)
Surrounding casts change pretty quickly in the NFL so from my perspective that is the last thing I'm looking at for these 2 in dynasty. Redraft, I'd say it's opposite. From a talent standpoint, these guys are neck and neck IMO. These very little about either guy I don't like. For RG3 my least favorite thing is that he comes from the spread. I hate evaluating QBs from the spread. It's a pain in the neck. He's clearly the highest rated QB I've ever seen come from that offense though. The thing I like least about Luck is how everyone is overreacting to his NFL readiness due to his read progression. We hear regularly that Luck would get to his 3rd or 4th option in his read progression. I won't disagree with that. What I find interesting though is that he most often did that out of 2 TE or more sets. This is not the same as doing it from a Pro set offense where you are scanning the enter field. Am I splitting hairs? Perhaps so. With guys this qualified you kind of have to though. In the end I give the edge to Luck because I just don't trust the spread offense and think it leaves a much larger gray area in evaluation. I know RG3 has the better supporting cast right now but I love the fact that Indy went out and got 2 top level TEs in this draft to match up with him. This is a strong indication to me that they plan to implement a lot of the offensive schemes that Luck is comfortable with based on the Stanford 2 TE sets. They seem to be building around him. Who knows, in next years draft Indy could be adding a WR like K. Allen or R. Woods, giving them a true #1 for Luck to also throw to. One move like that and suddenly Luck's got the far superior surrounding cast IMO.
Good posting. The thing about surrounding cast though is that the Colts are going to be starting off with a rookie head coach, a rookie GM, a rookie QB, a rookie TE tandem. That's a lot of unknowns. At least we know what type of offense Shanahan emplows. Lots of rollouts and pocket movement will play to RGs strengths. But I agree, both these guys could be staring at complete different rosters in two seasons than what they have now. So that is the least important thing for dynasty. But I see absolute nothing to indicate that Luck fell into a good situation. Reminds me of Cincinatti last season but without AJ Green and Cedric Benson....and a defense...and an experienced coach with an inexperienced GM. Wait, nevermind. May the Chris Palmer Browns is a better comp. Tim Couch was a good prospect too.
 
Luck to me is much safer pick to produce above average to even great results. RGIII is very good prospect, but his pedigree and pro potential is not as good a Luck's.
I'm not really worried about pedigree so much. Not even really sure what that means as Stanford hasn't exactly been a powerhouse for a long time. But as far as potential goes, I have RG3 squarely above Luck. I think Luck will top out as an Eli Manning type of guy. Very good player. But just under the top guys in fantasy terms. I think RG3 tops out as a faster John Elway but playing by 2012 rules and no 1993 rules. I have the first pick in a 2qb dynasty and right now I'd select Griffin and shoot for the moon. Better athlete, equal drive, better surrounding cast, better coaching staff (at least until proven otherwise)
Surrounding casts change pretty quickly in the NFL so from my perspective that is the last thing I'm looking at for these 2 in dynasty. Redraft, I'd say it's opposite. From a talent standpoint, these guys are neck and neck IMO. These very little about either guy I don't like. For RG3 my least favorite thing is that he comes from the spread. I hate evaluating QBs from the spread. It's a pain in the neck. He's clearly the highest rated QB I've ever seen come from that offense though. The thing I like least about Luck is how everyone is overreacting to his NFL readiness due to his read progression. We hear regularly that Luck would get to his 3rd or 4th option in his read progression. I won't disagree with that. What I find interesting though is that he most often did that out of 2 TE or more sets. This is not the same as doing it from a Pro set offense where you are scanning the enter field. Am I splitting hairs? Perhaps so. With guys this qualified you kind of have to though. In the end I give the edge to Luck because I just don't trust the spread offense and think it leaves a much larger gray area in evaluation. I know RG3 has the better supporting cast right now but I love the fact that Indy went out and got 2 top level TEs in this draft to match up with him. This is a strong indication to me that they plan to implement a lot of the offensive schemes that Luck is comfortable with based on the Stanford 2 TE sets. They seem to be building around him. Who knows, in next years draft Indy could be adding a WR like K. Allen or R. Woods, giving them a true #1 for Luck to also throw to. One move like that and suddenly Luck's got the far superior surrounding cast IMO.
Good posting. The thing about surrounding cast though is that the Colts are going to be starting off with a rookie head coach, a rookie GM, a rookie QB, a rookie TE tandem. That's a lot of unknowns. At least we know what type of offense Shanahan emplows. Lots of rollouts and pocket movement will play to RGs strengths. But I agree, both these guys could be staring at complete different rosters in two seasons than what they have now. So that is the least important thing for dynasty. But I see absolute nothing to indicate that Luck fell into a good situation. Reminds me of Cincinatti last season but without AJ Green and Cedric Benson....and a defense...and an experienced coach with an inexperienced GM. Wait, nevermind. May the Chris Palmer Browns is a better comp. Tim Couch was a good prospect too.
Good point. Shanny is certainly a advantage for RG3. I should have included that.
 
10-15 years is a long time. If we are talking dynasty give me Luck.
I don't follow.
I think people assume because RG3 is faster and more dynamic on his feet (Luck is no slouch in this department) and see a Cam Newton-like rookie performance (or at the least more immediate FF results). I think over the course of their careers Luck will prove to be the better FF QB.
Looking at the voting this seems to be the overall feeling. I can certainly understand it.
 
10-15 years is a long time. If we are talking dynasty give me Luck.
I don't follow.
I think people assume because RG3 is faster and more dynamic on his feet (Luck is no slouch in this department) and see a Cam Newton-like rookie performance (or at the least more immediate FF results). I think over the course of their careers Luck will prove to be the better FF QB.
Looking at the voting this seems to be the overall feeling. I can certainly understand it.
I didn't vote yet but just did and it looks like I am in the majority in regards to my opinion.
 
Luck to me is much safer pick to produce above average to even great results. RGIII is very good prospect, but his pedigree and pro potential is not as good a Luck's.
I'm not really worried about pedigree so much. Not even really sure what that means as Stanford hasn't exactly been a powerhouse for a long time. But as far as potential goes, I have RG3 squarely above Luck. I think Luck will top out as an Eli Manning type of guy. Very good player. But just under the top guys in fantasy terms. I think RG3 tops out as a faster John Elway but playing by 2012 rules and no 1993 rules. I have the first pick in a 2qb dynasty and right now I'd select Griffin and shoot for the moon. Better athlete, equal drive, better surrounding cast, better coaching staff (at least until proven otherwise)
Pretty much agree with all of this. I was trying to think of QB comparisons for each, Eli is a decent one for Luck, Matt Ryan and Romo also come to mind. I think he's mortal lock to be a Top 10 FF QB for a decade plus, Top 5 Im not so sure of. Not only do you need to be in the right offensive system to put up Top 5 numbers annually, you typically need at least 2 very good-elite receiving talents. Considering Arians is the new OC in Indy his FF numbers may not be as high as you'd hope for, although at least short term I would expect Luck's to be passing more out of necessity, ie needing to comeback in games. In the current NFL, Luck strikes me as a 3900-4200 yds, 25-30 TD guy in a couple years with a ceiling higher than that if he's in the right offense.With RG3, I almost think the sky is the limit. I see some Elway in him, some Favre, and maybe more than anyone Rodgers. I think he could put up huge rushing numbers if he wanted to, but I dont think he'll be running as much as Vick or Cam do (100-130 attempts per yr) despite having almost 170 attempts per yr in his 3 full seasons. I think he'll have in the 75-85 ballpark in the NFL, although I could see more his first couple years as he adjusts to the speed of the game, quicker pass rush, etc. Either way, that many attempts is still huge for a QB in fantasy. I dont think has the weapons yet he needs to be a Top 5 QB, but I have no doubt Snyder will get him one, maybe as soon as next year, and think the rushing stats could make him a Top 10 QB as soon as this year. I think RG3 will go for 3300-3500 passing, 500 rushing, 18-22 TDs passing, 5-7 TDs rushing as soon as this year. Essentially, I see Luck as the safe bet to be a 2nd-3rd tier QB1 with 25% he becomes more than that. Id say Griffin has a lower floor (high end QB2), but a 66% chance to be a Top 5 fantasy QB in a few years.
 
10-15 years is a long time. If we are talking dynasty give me Luck.
I don't follow.
I think people assume because RG3 is faster and more dynamic on his feet (Luck is no slouch in this department) and see a Cam Newton-like rookie performance (or at the least more immediate FF results). I think over the course of their careers Luck will prove to be the better FF QB.
Looking at the voting this seems to be the overall feeling. I can certainly understand it.
I didn't vote yet but just did and it looks like I am in the majority in regards to my opinion.
The section about the next 1-3 years is dominated by RGIII. Even if Luck ends up better in year four, by how much is he better? Let's say that in year four, Luck is the 2nd best QB and RGII is the 4th. Is this small future advantage worth more than the present value of RGIII?
 
Luck posted combine #'s comparable to Cam Newton. I am not writing that Luck is as dominating an athlete as Newton but he has demonstrated that he is nonetheless a very athletic qb in his own right. With his ability to read defenses and his experience running a pro-style offense, Luck is poised to himself be a upper echelon passer and fantasy point scorer. Lastly, Bruce Arians as offensive coordinator of the Steelers turned a run first offense into a pass first offense with Roethlisberger. That type of system bodes well for loads of fantasy scoring while playing from behind. If the Redskins had the first overall pick, they would take Luck.

 
Luck posted combine #'s comparable to Cam Newton. I am not writing that Luck is as dominating an athlete as Newton but he has demonstrated that he is nonetheless a very athletic qb in his own right. With his ability to read defenses and his experience running a pro-style offense, Luck is poised to himself be a upper echelon passer and fantasy point scorer. Lastly, Bruce Arians as offensive coordinator of the Steelers turned a run first offense into a pass first offense with Roethlisberger. That type of system bodes well for loads of fantasy scoring while playing from behind. If the Redskins had the first overall pick, they would take Luck.
Excluding 2010 when he only player 12 games, Roethlisberger played at least 15 games in the last 5 season's (which would begin with his 3rd season as a starter) and averaged 22.8 TDs and 3675 yards per season. Now, I agree you and also said in my post Luck will likely be passing more due to being from behind, but how much does that bump his stats? On the other hand, how long will it take him to be as good of a FF QB as Roethlisberger is (low end QB1)?I dont think Arians system is really a positive for Luck's FF prospects
 
I like em both. I much prefer the AFC South to the always-tough NFC East, though. I think the quality of competition RGIII will face will be much higher over the course of his career. I think the Eagles, Cowboys, and Giants are always going to be stiff competition.

So, go with Luck, who faces the Texans, Titans, and Jaguars.

 
I like em both. I much prefer the AFC South to the always-tough NFC East, though. I think the quality of competition RGIII will face will be much higher over the course of his career. I think the Eagles, Cowboys, and Giants are always going to be stiff competition.So, go with Luck, who faces the Texans, Titans, and Jaguars.
Makes sense, although assuming only 2 of the 3 other teams in your division is above average (fair assumption Id say), the Colts winning their division and having 3 games against the other 1st place winners vs the Skins finishing 3rd or 4th in the NFC East and playing the other division worst teams is probably a wash.Considering all the other teams in those divisions either have good QBs 30+ yrs old, or bums that are younger, I can see both Luck and RG3 being the face of their division in 5 years.
 
Who really knows? They played in completely different schemes with different supporting casts against different competition. If I needed a QB, I would be happy to get either of them. Having said that, I favor Luck (and just drafted him ahead of RG3) because of his elite mental talent. I watched a lot of his college games. In fact, I saw almost every throw of his college career, from his first game to his last.

When I think about a QB, one of the things I ask myself is, "When he gets the ball on his own 20 down 6 with 1:35 left, do you expect his team to win the game?" With most of the great ones, the answer is yes. I think Luck is one of those guys. He certainly was in college. It was great to watch the way he managed the offense and slowly grinded down the opposition. Death by a thousand paper cuts. That's not to say he can't make big plays, but what he does extremely well is kill you with those 8-15 yard gains. He'll just pick you apart all game. Very, very accurate when it counts. Rarely makes a bad read.

After his first year as a starter, I had a strong hunch that he would be great. You could just see it, but there were still some concerns. He had an awful game against Cal in the Big Game, and basically cost his team a win with a late pick. That left me with some doubts about his mental toughness and clutch ability, but he responded well in subsequent seasons. The USC games in 2011 and 2010 really stand out. So do the last two bowl games. The Orange Bowl and Fiesta Bowl were two of the biggest games he ever played in, and he was great.

I think he's the total package. RG3 may well end up being the better pro, but I think part of the reason people favor him is because he has a flashier game. Luck is not the most exciting QB. He's just methodical and deadly efficient. I expect that to continue.

 
Who really knows? They played in completely different schemes with different supporting casts against different competition. If I needed a QB, I would be happy to get either of them. Having said that, I favor Luck (and just drafted him ahead of RG3) because of his elite mental talent. I watched a lot of his college games. In fact, I saw almost every throw of his college career, from his first game to his last.

When I think about a QB, one of the things I ask myself is, "When he gets the ball on his own 20 down 6 with 1:35 left, do you expect his team to win the game?" With most of the great ones, the answer is yes. I think Luck is one of those guys. He certainly was in college. It was great to watch the way he managed the offense and slowly grinded down the opposition. Death by a thousand paper cuts. That's not to say he can't make big plays, but what he does extremely well is kill you with those 8-15 yard gains. He'll just pick you apart all game. Very, very accurate when it counts. Rarely makes a bad read.

After his first year as a starter, I had a strong hunch that he would be great. You could just see it, but there were still some concerns. He had an awful game against Cal in the Big Game, and basically cost his team a win with a late pick. That left me with some doubts about his mental toughness and clutch ability, but he responded well in subsequent seasons. The USC games in 2011 and 2010 really stand out. So do the last two bowl games. The Orange Bowl and Fiesta Bowl were two of the biggest games he ever played in, and he was great.

I think he's the total package. RG3 may well end up being the better pro, but I think part of the reason people favor him is because he has a flashier game. Luck is not the most exciting QB. He's just methodical and deadly efficient. I expect that to continue.
:goodposting:
 
Luck posted combine #'s comparable to Cam Newton. I am not writing that Luck is as dominating an athlete as Newton but he has demonstrated that he is nonetheless a very athletic qb in his own right. With his ability to read defenses and his experience running a pro-style offense, Luck is poised to himself be a upper echelon passer and fantasy point scorer. Lastly, Bruce Arians as offensive coordinator of the Steelers turned a run first offense into a pass first offense with Roethlisberger. That type of system bodes well for loads of fantasy scoring while playing from behind. If the Redskins had the first overall pick, they would take Luck.
Saying Luck's combine #'s are comparable to Newton's is something I've heard parroted often the past couple months. First Newton is bigger than Luck by height(1")and weight(13lbs). Second, Newton's 40 time was quite a bit better than Luck's. And lastly, it just seems disingenuous. As you've said, Luck isn't as dominating as an athlete as Newton, then why bring up the comparison? Watch the two of them run the ball and tell me you see any similarities. Luck is athletic, yes, so let's just leave it at that...there's no need to insult Newton by comparing the two. 40 GIF

 
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Who really knows? They played in completely different schemes with different supporting casts against different competition. If I needed a QB, I would be happy to get either of them. Having said that, I favor Luck (and just drafted him ahead of RG3) because of his elite mental talent. I watched a lot of his college games. In fact, I saw almost every throw of his college career, from his first game to his last.

When I think about a QB, one of the things I ask myself is, "When he gets the ball on his own 20 down 6 with 1:35 left, do you expect his team to win the game?" With most of the great ones, the answer is yes. I think Luck is one of those guys. He certainly was in college. It was great to watch the way he managed the offense and slowly grinded down the opposition. Death by a thousand paper cuts. That's not to say he can't make big plays, but what he does extremely well is kill you with those 8-15 yard gains. He'll just pick you apart all game. Very, very accurate when it counts. Rarely makes a bad read.

After his first year as a starter, I had a strong hunch that he would be great. You could just see it, but there were still some concerns. He had an awful game against Cal in the Big Game, and basically cost his team a win with a late pick. That left me with some doubts about his mental toughness and clutch ability, but he responded well in subsequent seasons. The USC games in 2011 and 2010 really stand out. So do the last two bowl games. The Orange Bowl and Fiesta Bowl were two of the biggest games he ever played in, and he was great.

I think he's the total package. RG3 may well end up being the better pro, but I think part of the reason people favor him is because he has a flashier game. Luck is not the most exciting QB. He's just methodical and deadly efficient. I expect that to continue.
:goodposting:
:goodposting:
 
Andrew Luck, RG3 won't match Newton, says scout

By Marc Sessler

Writer

At some point here, we're going to reach the regular season. When we do, Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III will be scrutinized and picked apart by experts and fans alike.

Luck's career with the Colts and RG3's with the Redskins will be judged side by side, but former longtime NFL scout Greg Gabriel isn't waiting around to cast a few predictions.

"I expect Griffin to put up better numbers in 2012 but that doesn't mean that he will be the better player," Gabriel wrote on NationalFootballPost.com. "Don't expect either player to have the kind of stats that Cam Newton had last year. I would expect numbers more similar to what Andy Dalton had in Cincinnati."

Dalton's rookie outing netted 3,398 yards and 20 scores alongside just 13 interceptions. That should be considered a successful campaign for Luck, RG3 or any rookie passer, but Newton raised that bar skyward. His 4,051 rookie passing yards shattered Peyton Manning's mark. Cam threw for 21 touchdowns but don't forget he rushed for another 706 yards and 14 scores. Luck is cited as perhaps the top rookie passing prospect of the past 30 years, but who expects him to do what Cam did?

Besides, it's not about personal numbers. When we talk about success for today's quarterbacks, that discussion is invariably linked to where they lead their teams.

"I have no doubt that both players will be excellent NFL quarterbacks," Gabriel wrote, "but it remains to be seen who leads their team to better playoff success. At this time my money would be on Luck and only because of how he has prepared himself for an NFL career."
 
Robert Griffin III faces more pressure than Andrew Luck in 2012

By Daniel Jeremiah NFL.com

Analyst, NFL.com and NFL Network

Heading into his junior season at Stanford, it was already a foregone conclusion that Andrew Luck would be the top pick in the 2012 NFL Draft. In fact, he would've been the likely top pick had he elected to declare for the draft following his redshirt sophomore season. Several NFL evaluators were calling Luck the most "pro ready" quarterback prospect since Peyton Manning and it appeared he was going to face incredibly unrealistic expectations upon his arrival in the NFL.

Then something happened that changed everything.

During a nationally televised game on the opening weekend of the 2011 college football season, Baylor quarterback Robert Griffin III captured everyone's attention, torching No. 14 TCU for 359 yards passing and five touchdowns in a thrilling 50-48 win. That was the first of many remarkable moments for Griffin during his junior campaign. His rare combination of arm strength, accuracy and athleticism took Baylor football to new heights and earned him the 2011 Heisman Trophy.

When the 2012 draft rolled around, there was actually some talk that Griffin could replace Luck as the No. 1 pick. While that didn't come to fruition, Griffin did end up going second to the Washington Redskins. So, as we head into the 2012 NFL season, all eyes will be on two rookie quarterbacks instead of one.

With that in mind, I thought it would be interesting to take a look at both of their situations and determine which of them would be under more pressure in 2012. In most years, it's a slam dunk that the top pick will face more scrutiny. I don't believe that to be the case this year.

Here are three reasons why RG3 will be under more pressure than Luck in 2012:



1. Griffin will be expected to lead his team to more victories.

Despite only winning three more games that the Indianapolis Colts last season, the Redskins are perceived as a far superior team heading into the 2012 campaign. Washington defeated the Super Bowl champion New York Giants in both of their meetings last year. The 'Skins finished the season with the NFL's No. 16 offense and No. 13 ranked defense. Five of their losses came by seven points or less. On the other hand, the Colts finished the 2011 season with the NFL's No. 30 offense and No. 25 defense. They lost their first 13 games of the season and had many declaring they were even worse than the Detroit Lions team that went winless in 2008.

Among Redskins fans, RG3 is viewed as the missing piece, while Andrew Luck is viewed as thefirst piece to Colts fans. Washington is entering its third season under two-time Super Bowl-winning head coach Mike Shanahan. This is must-win time. The Colts are entering their first season under first-time head coach Chuck Pagano. Pagano has zero career wins as a head coach. Shanahan has 276. After the decision was made to cut ties with Peyton Manning, the Colts weren't shy in proclaiming this season the start of a rebuilding effort.

For the purpose of this exercise, let's assume both the Redskins and the Colts go on to win seven games this season. How would each fan base react? Redskins fans would be very disappointed, while Colts faithful would be dancing in the streets.

2. The NFC East is far tougher than the AFC South.

Griffin is expected to lead his team to greater heights than Luck this season while competing in a much tougher division. In 2011, the Redskins were the only team in the NFC East to have a losing record. The Giants enter the 2012 season as the defending Super Bowl champs, while the Philadelphia Eagles and Dallas Cowboys are both legitimate title contenders.

Luck and the Colts face an easier road in the AFC South. The Houston Texans are the only team in the division capable of making a deep playoff run. The Tennessee Titans are a physical, well-coached bunch that won nine games last season, but they are likely to break in a new quarterback (Jake Locker) at some point this year. Meanwhile, the Jacksonville Jaguars will be hard-pressed to win more than 5-6 games.

3. RG3 is in a bigger media market.

There's a big difference between playing in Washington D.C. and Indianapolis. The media attention and fan intensity is far greater in the nation's capital. Last year, while heading to Indianapolis for the NFL Scouting Combine, I was on the same flight as Luck. When we landed, he grabbed his bag from the overhead compartment and pulled out a baseball cap. As he walked toward the baggage claim area, he pulled his hat down very low, seemingly trying to hide his identity from an awaiting throng of fans or local media. After a few minutes waiting for his bag, he realized there wasn't a single person who recognized him. I took this opportunity to go up to Luck and crack a joke about all the attention he was getting after arriving in town to replace one of the greatest quarterbacks in the history of the NFL.

Such is life in Indy.

On the other hand, every mistake that RG3 makes during the fall will be dissected by dozens of beat writers and radio talk show hosts in D.C. If the Redskins get off to a slow start, he's going to hear boos from the stands.

Statistical expectations for Luck and RG3

In my opinion, Robert Griffin III is the best thing that ever happened to Andrew Luck. Just nine months ago, it was widely thought that Luck would enter the NFL with more hype than any player in the last decade. Now, it's likely that he won't even receive the same attention in his rookie season as another quarterback in his own draft class. Sharing the spotlight with another player will help ease the pressure on Luck and allow him to focus on simply improving day by day.

While Griffin and the Redskins face more pressure to pile up wins this year, I believe Griffin and Luck face the same statistical expectations. What are those expectations? Neither player is likely to duplicate Cam Newton's incredible rookie season. (Newton completed 60 percent of his passes for 4,051 yards, 21 touchdowns and 17 interceptions, while rushing for an additional 706 yards and 14 scores.) Realistically, I expect both players to put up numbers similar to recent top-three selections Sam Bradford and Matt Ryan. I anticipate them to complete around 60 percent of their passes for 3,400 yards, 18 touchdowns and 14 interceptions. I'll be disappointed if either of them fails to post numbers in that range.
 
bump. Any more opinions on this debate now that we've seen them in "live" action. I will be able to lock up one of these guys for 4 years in a modified dynasty league and am really struggling with which one to choose. Probably can't go wrong either way but would like to hear more opinions.

 
bump. Any more opinions on this debate now that we've seen them in "live" action. I will be able to lock up one of these guys for 4 years in a modified dynasty league and am really struggling with which one to choose. Probably can't go wrong either way but would like to hear more opinions.
I'd take Luck. Don't overthink it. Nobody ever, in the whole process, thought RG3 was better including himself. Remember him not going to Indy for a workout because it was just a sham anyway? Take the guy named Luck, that wears the horseshoe on his helmet.
 
No one is factoring in the rush yards/TDS that RG3 will most likely get??

Wouldn't most take RG3 in fantasy (even though Luck is likely to be the better NFL QB)??

 
No one is factoring in the rush yards/TDS that RG3 will most likely get??Wouldn't most take RG3 in fantasy (even though Luck is likely to be the better NFL QB)??
Luck has similar numbers to Newton. I think people are underrating the rush yards/TDs that Luck will get. And I know RG3 gets compared to Cam/Vick alot, but he isn't in the same class they are as runners.
 
bump. Any more opinions on this debate now that we've seen them in "live" action. I will be able to lock up one of these guys for 4 years in a modified dynasty league and am really struggling with which one to choose. Probably can't go wrong either way but would like to hear more opinions.
I'd take Luck. Don't overthink it. Nobody ever, in the whole process, thought RG3 was better including himself. Remember him not going to Indy for a workout because it was just a sham anyway? Take the guy named Luck, that wears the horseshoe on his helmet.
is this sarcasm? I can't imagine RGIII would say Luck was better. I seem to recall a few NFL people liking RGIII more but the majority liked Luck.
 

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