The Western Thread: Live from the Great Western Forum (2 Viewers)

[Ilov80s]

There are two more Westerns following these. Doc, a 1971 revisionist telling of the Doc Holliday legend starring Stacey Keach and written by famed NYC columnist Pete Hammill, and
Dodge City, a 1939 oater with Erroll Flynn miscast as a cowboy cleaning up a lawless town.  Dodge City was shot in gorgeous three-strip Technicolor and features one of the greatest bar room brawls on film.

I saw but figured that might be too deep of a cut. I’m going to skip Doc but will record Dodge City. I like the Flynn movies and that’s one I haven’t seen. They just had Captain Blood and Sea Hawk earlier in the week which remind me of being a kid. My dad would often rent those kids of movies for me when I was young. He didn’t rent Dodge City though because he hated technicolor. 

 

[Eephus]

I saw but figured that might be too deep of a cut. I’m going to skip Doc but will record Dodge City. I like the Flynn movies and that’s one I haven’t seen. They just had Captain Blood and Sea Hawk earlier in the week which remind me of being a kid. My dad would often rent those kids of movies for me when I was young. He didn’t rent Dodge City though because he hated technicolor. 

Doc was on another cable channel last week in an early AM timeslot.  I was having problems sleeping that night so I turned it on since it was the only movie that was just starting.  It was very dark and mumbly but I fell back asleep so

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I was a Bacteriology major so I didn't get a lot of liberal arts electives to play with.  One I took was a film history course taught by the very opinionated neoformalist critic David Bordwell.  He taught a few weeks on a structuralist text called "Sixguns and Society" about the Western genre.

The author, the Westerly named Will Wright broke down the plots of the most popular Westerns (by US box office) from 1931 to 1972.  He divided all films into only four mythical plot structures:  The Classical Plot, Transition Theme, Vengeance Variation and Professional Plot.  It was an interesting book although Wright did go on with his examples to illustrate his argument.  It stayed with me though (more than the Bacteriology courses) because I still consciously categorize Westerns when I'm watching them.  If anybody's interested, the Google Books preview includes the pages where he defines the four plot types and the list of the 64 films analyzed grouped by category.

Shane was one the last cases and purest distillations of the Classical Plot, where a lone stranger rides into the story to save society.  Almost all the Westerns prior to 1950 followed this structure.  The fifties were a mix with the growth of The Vengeance Variation.  Rio Bravo was the first Professional Plot, which began to dominate the genre in the 60s.

I studied the same book in my film genres class in college.

I even thought of it while watching Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, which is, IMO, a far more successful Tarantino "Western" than The Hateful Eight.  The ending of OUATIH is right out of The Searchers.  Brad Pitt's character, who really has no place in "modern society" sacrificing so that Leo can move on and prosper in society.  Culminating with Leo being invited over by Sharon Tate and presumably cementing his place in the young and up and coming Hollywood she represents.  

 

[Ilov80s]

@Eephus I just watched Dodge City 

- gorgeous technicolor as you promised

- the Max Steiner score has some hints of Gone with the Wind which he also scored this year 

-  the barroom brawl was incredible but unrealistic- there was a whole massive bar brawl and Errol Flynn wasn’t involved in it? I can’t buy that.

- also there’s one of the funniest moment I’ve ever seen in the brawl. A guy who was thrown through a window, gets up and all on his own runs himself headfirst into a pole. Its so random. 

 

[Eephus]

the Max Steiner score has some hints of Gone with the Wind which he also scored this year 

The movies Flynn made for Warners in the late 30s had some of the greatest music.  Erich Wolfgang Korngold's score for The Adventures of Robin Hood is magnificent.

 

[Ilov80s]

The movies Flynn made for Warners in the late 30s had some of the greatest music.  Erich Wolfgang Korngold's score for The Adventures of Robin Hood is magnificent.

Curtiz and Korngold teamed up for a nice series of 30s/40s adventure movies: Robin Hood, Capain Blood, Sea Hawk and Sea Wolf.  I guess that was the Spielberg/John Williams of the era. 

 

[Eephus]

I was looking for something mindless last night so I watched the 1986 remake of Stagecoach on Amazon Prime.  This made-for-TV version casts The Highwaymen (Johnny Cash, Waylon Jennings, Kris Kristofferson and Willie Nelson) as the marshall, the gambler, Ringo and Doc respectively.  It's follows the plot of the original but takes the occasional liberty.  One of the biggest is turning Doc into Doc Holliday who is a liberal when it comes to Indians..

The stunt casting is fun for a music fan like me and everybody gets a few good lines.  It was obviously shot on a low budget but director Ted Post (Hang 'Em High) is a pro who generally keeps things moving.  The 1939 John Ford version is also on Prime--I probably should have watched that instead but the remake is going off at the end of the month and how can you pass up Waylon and Willie and the boys.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

I watched The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance yesterday for the first time in a while. It gets better with every watch. 

 

[Cowboysfan8]

Gunsmoke marathon on INSP channel til 4am tomorrow

 

[Mr. Mojo]

I watch The Big Country again yesterday.  Great cast, good score, though probably more of a drama than an action western.

I think it was the last time that Heston played a supporting part instead of a lead.

Burl Ives won Best Supporting Oscar for it and he was pretty memorable.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

LOVE Westerns.

Some that have not been shared yet in this thread that deserve a mention:

Duel in the Sun (1946)  <<  The scene of Jenifer Jones on her hands and knee scrubbing the floor when Lute walks in....  Hmnnn.

The Westerner (1940)  <<  Hysterical scene with Brennan and Cooper that you have to see.

 ***   Yellow Sky (1948)  <<  One of my favorite westerns

***  Jubal (1956)  <<  Another great one

One-Eyed Jacks (1961)  <<  Sad backstory to this one where Brando broke the heart of his leading lady.  She killed herself over him and she was gorgeous.

Angel and the Badman (1947)  <<  About the only movie John Wayne actually was good at his craft

Cowboy (1958)  <<  Jack Lemmon is thee ####.

Appaloosa (2008)  <<  I can see where the others I listed above weren't mentioned because they are older but no one mentioned Appaloosa?  Come on.

Wyatt Earp (1994)  <<  Liked it much better seeing it again the other night.

I don't consider it a western per se but Last of the Mohicans is excellent.

Add, Outland is basically High Noon in outer space.

I'll have to make my top western list but no way in hell could I only list ten movies.

 

[Eephus]

***  Jubal (1956)  <<  Another great one

Jubal looks interesting.  Delmer Daves is one of the great directors of the genre.  Rod Steiger is always a great villain.

I've never seen it but found a decent stream with minor aspect ratio and sync issues.

 

[Ilov80s]

Jubal looks interesting.  Delmer Daves is one of the great directors of the genre.  Rod Steiger is always a great villain.

I've never seen it but found a decent stream with minor aspect ratio and sync issues.

It’s really good. For me it has one flaw that keeps it out being top shelf western of the era but it’s a must see.

 

[prosopis]

I was looking for something mindless last night so I watched the 1986 remake of Stagecoach on Amazon Prime.  This made-for-TV version casts The Highwaymen (Johnny Cash, Waylon Jennings, Kris Kristofferson and Willie Nelson) as the marshall, the gambler, Ringo and Doc respectively.  It's follows the plot of the original but takes the occasional liberty.  One of the biggest is turning Doc into Doc Holliday who is a liberal when it comes to Indians..

The stunt casting is fun for a music fan like me and everybody gets a few good lines.  It was obviously shot on a low budget but director Ted Post (Hang 'Em High) is a pro who generally keeps things moving.  The 1939 John Ford version is also on Prime--I probably should have watched that instead but the remake is going off at the end of the month and how can you pass up Waylon and Willie and the boys.

I may check this out. It sounds interesting.

 

[prosopis]

I was looking for something mindless last night so I watched the 1986 remake of Stagecoach on Amazon Prime.  This made-for-TV version casts The Highwaymen (Johnny Cash, Waylon Jennings, Kris Kristofferson and Willie Nelson) as the marshall, the gambler, Ringo and Doc respectively.  It's follows the plot of the original but takes the occasional liberty.  One of the biggest is turning Doc into Doc Holliday who is a liberal when it comes to Indians..

The stunt casting is fun for a music fan like me and everybody gets a few good lines.  It was obviously shot on a low budget but director Ted Post (Hang 'Em High) is a pro who generally keeps things moving.  The 1939 John Ford version is also on Prime--I probably should have watched that instead but the remake is going off at the end of the month and how can you pass up Waylon and Willie and the boys.

I did end up watching the 1986 remale of Stagecoach. It was a fun flick that got even more entertaining as I quickly realized it was filmed in my backyard. I recognized, hike, and still hike most of where this was filmed. Filmed in Old Tucson, Tucson Mountains and other local areas. The Tucson Mountains are my go to for hiking as I am 20 mins away. Made the flick even more enjoyable.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

I'll have to make my top western list but no way in hell could I only list ten movies.

Here it is.  I'm sure I'm forgetting or missing some.

   My Top Westerns   

1. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969) - George Roy Hill directing a William Goldman script create GOAT bud/bud flick
   
2. Tombstone (1993) - Secret came out in 2013, Kurt Russell actually directed the movie 
   
3. Dances With Wolves (1990) - epic
   
4. The Ox-Bow Incident (1942) - look into the history of this film and how the war kept it from being released 
   
5. Unforgiven (1992) - Clint bought the rights and waited a decade before he felt he was old enough to play the part.
   
6. Open Range (2003) - Best kill shot of ANY western.
   
7. The Long Riders (1980) -Belle Starr: How come I wasn't invited? Cole Younger: 'Cause you're a whore, Belle.
   
8. Yellow Sky (1948) - Scene of the horses slogging through death valley lake under sand stays with you.
   
9. McCabe & Mrs. Miller (1971) - Stark snow swept western beautifully shot through a heavy filter.
   
10. 3:10 to Yuma (2007) - Tremendous remake.
    
11. Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (1969) - Susan Clark's Liz is one of the most complex female characters ever seen on screen.
    
12. My Darling Clementine (1946) - Fonda leaning back on his chair, Linda Darnell's eyes, John Ford's shots, magnificent. 
    
13. TRUE GRIT (2010) - Coen's don't get enough screenplay credit.  Their dialogue is sensational.
    
14. Red River (1948) - Monty Cliff leaps off screen.
    
15. The Westerner (1940) - Walter Brennan steals every scene.
    
16. Support Your Local Sheriff (1969) - Walter Brennan steals but Bruce Dern asking what that red spot is takes cake
    
17. Appaloosa (2008) - Viggo and Ed Harris at the top of their game.
    
18. The Magnificent Seven (1960) - That score, Eli Wallach and gang, Steve McQueen and Yul trying to top each other.
    
19. Rio Bravo (1959) - Walter Brennan steals every scene.  (I'm sensing pattern here)
    
20. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962) - Its really good.
    
21. 3:10 to Yuma (1957) - Glenn Ford.
    
22. Jubal (1956) - Glenn Ford
    
23. SILVERADO (1985) - Barry Levinson Western with Kevin Kline.
    
24. The Gunfighter (1950) - Peck was soo good in so many films.
    
25. Pale Rider 1985 
    
26. Cowboy (1958)
    
27. The Wild Bunch (1969) - Robert Ryan is one of my favs.
    
28. The Missouri Breaks 1976 - HIGHLY UNDER RATED
    
29. Little Big Man (1970)
    
30. Angel and the Badman (1947)
    
31. One-Eyed Jacks (1961) - Great scene of multiple guys toting shotguns filmed from waste down walking in unison.
    
32. Winchester '73 (1950)
    
33. Tom Horn (1980) -  Really liked this one.
    
34. Will Penny (1967)
    
35. The Outlaw Josey Wales (1976)
    
36. Westworld (1973) 
    
37. DEAD MAN (1995)
    
38. Jesse James (1939) - Ty and Fonda in prime.  Sad note.  Horse was killed when thrown off cliff and made it in movie.
    
39. A Man Called Horse (1970) - Brutal depiction of the Sun Ceremony 
    
40. Barbarosa (1982) - Willie Nelson wasn't half bad.
    
41. Nevada Smith (1966)
    
42. The Ballad of Lefty Brown 2017 - Interesting take of side kick's POV as lead
    
43. Destry Rides Again (1939)
    
44. HOSTILES (2018)
    
45. Seraphim Falls 2007
    
46. The Covered Wagon (1923) - Loved their depiction of covered wagon train.
    
47. THE HOMESMAN (2014)
    
48. Duel in the Sun (1946)
    
49. The Missing 2003
    
50. The Hateful Eight 2015 - What the hell is it with Tarantino and anal raping of men?
    
51. The Ballad of Buster Scruggs (2018) - Really liked a few scenes
    
52. SHANE (1953)
    
53. Slow West (2015)
    
54. STAGECOACH (1939)
    
55. The Tall T 1957
    

-------------------------------------------

I consider the following 'close' to westerns but not quite:   

Ruggles of Red Gap (1935) - Love this film

The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (1948) - top ten all time movies

Brokeback Mountain (2005)

JEREMIAH JOHNSON (1972)

THE REVENANT (2015)

The Rounders (1965) - Ford and Fonda?  I love this movie!

BLAZING SADDLES (1974)

 

[Ilov80s]

@Bracie Smathers your rankin' of Shane aughta get your ugly mug up on wanted signs in every cowtown in the West cuz that there is a criminal o-ffense

 

[Bracie Smathers]

@Bracie Smathers your rankin' of Shane aughta get your ugly mug up on wanted signs in every cowtown in the West cuz that there is a criminal o-ffense

Shane?

Convince me rather than threaten.

Ugly?

Why you sir are as handsome as Winston Churchill.

“(Exchange with Winston Churchill)
Churchill explains that having a woman in Parliament was like having one intrude on him in the bathroom, to which the Lady Astor retorted, "Sir, you are not handsome enough to have such fears".”

 

[Ilov80s]

Shane?

Convince me rather than threaten.

Ugly?

Why you sir are as handsome as Winston Churchill.

“(Exchange with Winston Churchill)
Churchill explains that having a woman in Parliament was like having one intrude on him in the bathroom, to which the Lady Astor retorted, "Sir, you are not handsome enough to have such fears".”

Yeah, Shane.

Gorgeous score

Stunning cinematography

Touching relationships we don't often see in Westerns

The recording of cannons to use for guns shots and the innovation of attaching actors to wires send them flying when shot. This level of violence was quite rare for the time. 

It's a movie that at it's heart is a class Hollywood Western: the hero with an unknown past who comes to save the day. However, it also helps usher in the next era of westerns with it's emphasis on the power of gun violence, the muddy frontier towns that we will see more in movies like McCabe and a cold sense of defeat even in victory. 

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Yeah, Shane.

Gorgeous score

Stunning cinematography

Touching relationships we don't often see in Westerns

The recording of cannons to use for guns shots and the innovation of attaching actors to wires send them flying when shot. This level of violence was quite rare for the time. 

It's a movie that at it's heart is a class Hollywood Western: the hero with an unknown past who comes to save the day. However, it also helps usher in the next era of westerns with it's emphasis on the power of gun violence, the muddy frontier towns that we will see more in movies like McCabe and a cold sense of defeat even in victory. 

First and foremost The Grand Teton backdrop puts it up their with Jubal, also Grand Tetons as backdrop as one of the most gorgeously shot movies of all time.

George Stevens directing and I love Alan Ladd was cast and the studios hated him for the part which he was not a natural with the firearms.

Ladd disliked and was uncomfortable with guns; Shane's shooting demonstration for Joey required 116 takes.[15] A careful review of Shane's gun skill demonstration to Joey shows Alan Ladd firing with his eyes closed. Later, in the saloon battle, Ladd's pistol is pointed well away from the man he shoots, especially the final scene where he kills Riker's brother.

I like Ladd.  Love This Gun For Hire and he paired nicely with Veronica Lake.

The audio you speak of put the levels five times higher than normal to the point that audiences jumped from their seats and many theater owners mistakenly thought the studio made a mistake and corrected the audio when shown.  It adds shock value and I have it on my all-time top Westerns so I think its all good and would have to re-see everything and probably a few more  before re-ranking but good take.

 

[Don Quixote]

I was just looking at TCM’s schedule for tomorrow.  John Ford films most of the day — prime time has My Darling Clementine, The Searchers, and Stagecoach.

 

[Ilov80s]

I still think it's possible to make a good movie out of Wild Wild West. The floor is set really low.

What was the last good western?

Since this thread was first posted, we've had 3 very good but non-traditional westerns:

The Ballad of Buster Scruggs, FIrst Cow and The Power of the Dog. The Hard They Fall tried but was just ok to me.

 

[Don Quixote]

I still think it's possible to make a good movie out of Wild Wild West. The floor is set really low.

What was the last good western?

Since this thread was first posted, we've had 3 very good but non-traditional westerns:

The Ballad of Buster Scruggs, FIrst Cow and The Power of the Dog. The Hard They Fall tried but was just ok to me.

Killers of the Flower Moon count?

 

[Ilov80s]

I still think it's possible to make a good movie out of Wild Wild West. The floor is set really low.

What was the last good western?

Since this thread was first posted, we've had 3 very good but non-traditional westerns:

The Ballad of Buster Scruggs, FIrst Cow and The Power of the Dog. The Hard They Fall tried but was just ok to me.

Killers of the Flower Moon count?

Oh interesting, I hadn’t thought of that. It’s Scorsese so I just naturally thought crime epic but it definitely has a lot of western qualities to it as well.

 

[Eephus]

I liked parts of Horizon Chapter 1 but I wish the script had provided a better climax after three hours. Hopefully Costner is able to finish it.

 

[Eephus]

I still think it's possible to make a good movie out of Wild Wild West. The floor is set really low.

What was the last good western?

Since this thread was first posted, we've had 3 very good but non-traditional westerns:

The Ballad of Buster Scruggs, FIrst Cow and The Power of the Dog. The Hard They Fall tried but was just ok to me.

Killers of the Flower Moon count?

Oh interesting, I hadn’t thought of that. It’s Scorsese so I just naturally thought crime epic but it definitely has a lot of western qualities to it as well.

It's set in the west but it's structured more like a crime story. I guess you could say the Jesse Plemons character rides in to clean up the town but he's not a classical western hero.

 

[Don Quixote]

I still think it's possible to make a good movie out of Wild Wild West. The floor is set really low.

What was the last good western?

Since this thread was first posted, we've had 3 very good but non-traditional westerns:

The Ballad of Buster Scruggs, FIrst Cow and The Power of the Dog. The Hard They Fall tried but was just ok to me.

Killers of the Flower Moon count?

Oh interesting, I hadn’t thought of that. It’s Scorsese so I just naturally thought crime epic but it definitely has a lot of western qualities to it as well.

Wikipedia calls it an “anti-western”, which is a subgenre of western.

 

[Ilov80s]

I liked parts of Horizon Chapter 1 but I wish the script had provided a better climax after three hours. Hopefully Costner is able to finish it.

I haven’t watched it yet because of all the lukewarm reviews. I’ll eventually get around to it. Just seems tough to invest that much time into something that I may never get to see the rest of. It feels a bit like starting a new TV with the knowledge it gets canceled after 3 episodes.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I thought both Red Dead Redemption games worked surprisingly well as Western narratives even with the open world and repetitive mission structure. Both got that elegiac feel of the end of an era happening as the West was modernizing and both played with the cycle of violence.

 

[Eephus]

I liked parts of Horizon Chapter 1 but I wish the script had provided a better climax after three hours. Hopefully Costner is able to finish it.

I haven’t watched it yet because of all the lukewarm reviews. I’ll eventually get around to it. Just seems tough to invest that much time into something that I may never get to see the rest of. It feels a bit like starting a new TV with the knowledge it gets canceled after 3 episodes.

Costner's Open Range (2003) is solid and has an ending.

 

[Eephus]

The Tubi Super Bowl commercial with the cowboy hat head was disturbing but I'm there if it signals a revival of the genre.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

I'll have to make my top western list but no way in hell could I only list ten movies.

Here it is. I'm sure I'm forgetting or missing some.

My Top Westerns

1. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969) - George Roy Hill directing a William Goldman script create GOAT bud/bud flick
   
   
2. Tombstone (1993) - Secret came out in 2013, Kurt Russell actually directed the movie
   
   
3. Dances With Wolves (1990) - epic
   
   
4. The Ox-Bow Incident (1942) - look into the history of this film and how the war kept it from being released
   
   
5. Unforgiven (1992) - Clint bought the rights and waited a decade before he felt he was old enough to play the part.
   
   
6. Open Range (2003) - Best kill shot of ANY western.
   
   
7. The Long Riders (1980) -Belle Starr: How come I wasn't invited? Cole Younger: 'Cause you're a whore, Belle.
   
   
8. Yellow Sky (1948) - Scene of the horses slogging through death valley lake under sand stays with you.
   
   
9. McCabe & Mrs. Miller (1971) - Stark snow swept western beautifully shot through a heavy filter.
   
   
10. 3:10 to Yuma (2007) - Tremendous remake.
    
    
11. Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (1969) - Susan Clark's Liz is one of the most complex female characters ever seen on screen.
    
    
12. My Darling Clementine (1946) - Fonda leaning back on his chair, Linda Darnell's eyes, John Ford's shots, magnificent.
    
    
13. TRUE GRIT (2010) - Coen's don't get enough screenplay credit. Their dialogue is sensational.
    
    
14. Red River (1948) - Monty Cliff leaps off screen.
    
    
15. The Westerner (1940) - Walter Brennan steals every scene.
    
    
16. Support Your Local Sheriff (1969) - Walter Brennan steals but Bruce Dern asking what that red spot is takes cake
    
    
17. Appaloosa (2008) - Viggo and Ed Harris at the top of their game.
    
    
18. The Magnificent Seven (1960) - That score, Eli Wallach and gang, Steve McQueen and Yul trying to top each other.
    
    
19. Rio Bravo (1959) - Walter Brennan steals every scene. (I'm sensing pattern here)
    
    
20. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962) - Its really good.
    
    
21. 3:10 to Yuma (1957) - Glenn Ford.
    
    
22. Jubal (1956) - Glenn Ford
    
    
23. SILVERADO (1985) - Barry Levinson Western with Kevin Kline.
    
    
24. The Gunfighter (1950) - Peck was soo good in so many films.
    
    
25. Pale Rider 1985
    
    
26. Cowboy (1958)
    
    
27. The Wild Bunch (1969) - Robert Ryan is one of my favs.
    
    
28. The Missouri Breaks 1976 - HIGHLY UNDER RATED
    
    
29. Little Big Man (1970)
    
    
30. Angel and the Badman (1947)
    
    
31. One-Eyed Jacks (1961) - Great scene of multiple guys toting shotguns filmed from waste down walking in unison.
    
    
32. Winchester '73 (1950)
    
    
33. Tom Horn (1980) - Really liked this one.
    
    
34. Will Penny (1967)
    
    
35. The Outlaw Josey Wales (1976)
    
    
36. Westworld (1973)
    
    
37. DEAD MAN (1995)
    
    
38. Jesse James (1939) - Ty and Fonda in prime. Sad note. Horse was killed when thrown off cliff and made it in movie.
    
    
39. A Man Called Horse (1970) - Brutal depiction of the Sun Ceremony
    
    
40. Barbarosa (1982) - Willie Nelson wasn't half bad.
    
    
41. Nevada Smith (1966)
    
    
42. The Ballad of Lefty Brown 2017 - Interesting take of side kick's POV as lead
    
    
43. Destry Rides Again (1939)
    
    
44. HOSTILES (2018)
    
    
45. Seraphim Falls 2007
    
    
46. The Covered Wagon (1923) - Loved their depiction of covered wagon train.
    
    
47. THE HOMESMAN (2014)
    
    
48. Duel in the Sun (1946)
    
    
49. The Missing 2003
    
    
50. The Hateful Eight 2015 - What the hell is it with Tarantino and anal raping of men?
    
    
51. The Ballad of Buster Scruggs (2018) - Really liked a few scenes
    
    
52. SHANE (1953)
    
    
53. Slow West (2015)
    
    
54. STAGECOACH (1939)
    
    
55. The Tall T 1957
    

-------------------------------------------

I consider the following 'close' to westerns but not quite:

Ruggles of Red Gap (1935) - Love this film

The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (1948) - top ten all time movies

Brokeback Mountain (2005)

JEREMIAH JOHNSON (1972)

THE REVENANT (2015)

The Rounders (1965) - Ford and Fonda? I love this movie!

BLAZING SADDLES (1974)

Have to find room for this movie.
WESTWARD THE WOMEN (1951)

 

[Joe Bryant]

I'll have to make my top western list but no way in hell could I only list ten movies.

Here it is. I'm sure I'm forgetting or missing some.

My Top Westerns

1. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969) - George Roy Hill directing a William Goldman script create GOAT bud/bud flick
   
   
2. Tombstone (1993) - Secret came out in 2013, Kurt Russell actually directed the movie
   
   
3. Dances With Wolves (1990) - epic
   
   
4. The Ox-Bow Incident (1942) - look into the history of this film and how the war kept it from being released
   
   
5. Unforgiven (1992) - Clint bought the rights and waited a decade before he felt he was old enough to play the part.
   
   
6. Open Range (2003) - Best kill shot of ANY western.
   
   
7. The Long Riders (1980) -Belle Starr: How come I wasn't invited? Cole Younger: 'Cause you're a whore, Belle.
   
   
8. Yellow Sky (1948) - Scene of the horses slogging through death valley lake under sand stays with you.
   
   
9. McCabe & Mrs. Miller (1971) - Stark snow swept western beautifully shot through a heavy filter.
   
   
10. 3:10 to Yuma (2007) - Tremendous remake.
    
    
11. Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (1969) - Susan Clark's Liz is one of the most complex female characters ever seen on screen.
    
    
12. My Darling Clementine (1946) - Fonda leaning back on his chair, Linda Darnell's eyes, John Ford's shots, magnificent.
    
    
13. TRUE GRIT (2010) - Coen's don't get enough screenplay credit. Their dialogue is sensational.
    
    
14. Red River (1948) - Monty Cliff leaps off screen.
    
    
15. The Westerner (1940) - Walter Brennan steals every scene.
    
    
16. Support Your Local Sheriff (1969) - Walter Brennan steals but Bruce Dern asking what that red spot is takes cake
    
    
17. Appaloosa (2008) - Viggo and Ed Harris at the top of their game.
    
    
18. The Magnificent Seven (1960) - That score, Eli Wallach and gang, Steve McQueen and Yul trying to top each other.
    
    
19. Rio Bravo (1959) - Walter Brennan steals every scene. (I'm sensing pattern here)
    
    
20. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962) - Its really good.
    
    
21. 3:10 to Yuma (1957) - Glenn Ford.
    
    
22. Jubal (1956) - Glenn Ford
    
    
23. SILVERADO (1985) - Barry Levinson Western with Kevin Kline.
    
    
24. The Gunfighter (1950) - Peck was soo good in so many films.
    
    
25. Pale Rider 1985
    
    
26. Cowboy (1958)
    
    
27. The Wild Bunch (1969) - Robert Ryan is one of my favs.
    
    
28. The Missouri Breaks 1976 - HIGHLY UNDER RATED
    
    
29. Little Big Man (1970)
    
    
30. Angel and the Badman (1947)
    
    
31. One-Eyed Jacks (1961) - Great scene of multiple guys toting shotguns filmed from waste down walking in unison.
    
    
32. Winchester '73 (1950)
    
    
33. Tom Horn (1980) - Really liked this one.
    
    
34. Will Penny (1967)
    
    
35. The Outlaw Josey Wales (1976)
    
    
36. Westworld (1973)
    
    
37. DEAD MAN (1995)
    
    
38. Jesse James (1939) - Ty and Fonda in prime. Sad note. Horse was killed when thrown off cliff and made it in movie.
    
    
39. A Man Called Horse (1970) - Brutal depiction of the Sun Ceremony
    
    
40. Barbarosa (1982) - Willie Nelson wasn't half bad.
    
    
41. Nevada Smith (1966)
    
    
42. The Ballad of Lefty Brown 2017 - Interesting take of side kick's POV as lead
    
    
43. Destry Rides Again (1939)
    
    
44. HOSTILES (2018)
    
    
45. Seraphim Falls 2007
    
    
46. The Covered Wagon (1923) - Loved their depiction of covered wagon train.
    
    
47. THE HOMESMAN (2014)
    
    
48. Duel in the Sun (1946)
    
    
49. The Missing 2003
    
    
50. The Hateful Eight 2015 - What the hell is it with Tarantino and anal raping of men?
    
    
51. The Ballad of Buster Scruggs (2018) - Really liked a few scenes
    
    
52. SHANE (1953)
    
    
53. Slow West (2015)
    
    
54. STAGECOACH (1939)
    
    
55. The Tall T 1957
    

-------------------------------------------

I consider the following 'close' to westerns but not quite:

Ruggles of Red Gap (1935) - Love this film

The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (1948) - top ten all time movies

Brokeback Mountain (2005)

JEREMIAH JOHNSON (1972)

THE REVENANT (2015)

The Rounders (1965) - Ford and Fonda? I love this movie!

BLAZING SADDLES (1974)

Love this. I don't know enough about movies to comment on the rankings - I just love that y'all love this so much.

 

[Ilov80s]

I'll have to make my top western list but no way in hell could I only list ten movies.

Here it is. I'm sure I'm forgetting or missing some.

My Top Westerns

1. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969) - George Roy Hill directing a William Goldman script create GOAT bud/bud flick
   
   
2. Tombstone (1993) - Secret came out in 2013, Kurt Russell actually directed the movie
   
   
3. Dances With Wolves (1990) - epic
   
   
4. The Ox-Bow Incident (1942) - look into the history of this film and how the war kept it from being released
   
   
5. Unforgiven (1992) - Clint bought the rights and waited a decade before he felt he was old enough to play the part.
   
   
6. Open Range (2003) - Best kill shot of ANY western.
   
   
7. The Long Riders (1980) -Belle Starr: How come I wasn't invited? Cole Younger: 'Cause you're a whore, Belle.
   
   
8. Yellow Sky (1948) - Scene of the horses slogging through death valley lake under sand stays with you.
   
   
9. McCabe & Mrs. Miller (1971) - Stark snow swept western beautifully shot through a heavy filter.
   
   
10. 3:10 to Yuma (2007) - Tremendous remake.
    
    
11. Tell Them Willie Boy Is Here (1969) - Susan Clark's Liz is one of the most complex female characters ever seen on screen.
    
    
12. My Darling Clementine (1946) - Fonda leaning back on his chair, Linda Darnell's eyes, John Ford's shots, magnificent.
    
    
13. TRUE GRIT (2010) - Coen's don't get enough screenplay credit. Their dialogue is sensational.
    
    
14. Red River (1948) - Monty Cliff leaps off screen.
    
    
15. The Westerner (1940) - Walter Brennan steals every scene.
    
    
16. Support Your Local Sheriff (1969) - Walter Brennan steals but Bruce Dern asking what that red spot is takes cake
    
    
17. Appaloosa (2008) - Viggo and Ed Harris at the top of their game.
    
    
18. The Magnificent Seven (1960) - That score, Eli Wallach and gang, Steve McQueen and Yul trying to top each other.
    
    
19. Rio Bravo (1959) - Walter Brennan steals every scene. (I'm sensing pattern here)
    
    
20. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962) - Its really good.
    
    
21. 3:10 to Yuma (1957) - Glenn Ford.
    
    
22. Jubal (1956) - Glenn Ford
    
    
23. SILVERADO (1985) - Barry Levinson Western with Kevin Kline.
    
    
24. The Gunfighter (1950) - Peck was soo good in so many films.
    
    
25. Pale Rider 1985
    
    
26. Cowboy (1958)
    
    
27. The Wild Bunch (1969) - Robert Ryan is one of my favs.
    
    
28. The Missouri Breaks 1976 - HIGHLY UNDER RATED
    
    
29. Little Big Man (1970)
    
    
30. Angel and the Badman (1947)
    
    
31. One-Eyed Jacks (1961) - Great scene of multiple guys toting shotguns filmed from waste down walking in unison.
    
    
32. Winchester '73 (1950)
    
    
33. Tom Horn (1980) - Really liked this one.
    
    
34. Will Penny (1967)
    
    
35. The Outlaw Josey Wales (1976)
    
    
36. Westworld (1973)
    
    
37. DEAD MAN (1995)
    
    
38. Jesse James (1939) - Ty and Fonda in prime. Sad note. Horse was killed when thrown off cliff and made it in movie.
    
    
39. A Man Called Horse (1970) - Brutal depiction of the Sun Ceremony
    
    
40. Barbarosa (1982) - Willie Nelson wasn't half bad.
    
    
41. Nevada Smith (1966)
    
    
42. The Ballad of Lefty Brown 2017 - Interesting take of side kick's POV as lead
    
    
43. Destry Rides Again (1939)
    
    
44. HOSTILES (2018)
    
    
45. Seraphim Falls 2007
    
    
46. The Covered Wagon (1923) - Loved their depiction of covered wagon train.
    
    
47. THE HOMESMAN (2014)
    
    
48. Duel in the Sun (1946)
    
    
49. The Missing 2003
    
    
50. The Hateful Eight 2015 - What the hell is it with Tarantino and anal raping of men?
    
    
51. The Ballad of Buster Scruggs (2018) - Really liked a few scenes
    
    
52. SHANE (1953)
    
    
53. Slow West (2015)
    
    
54. STAGECOACH (1939)
    
    
55. The Tall T 1957
    

-------------------------------------------

I consider the following 'close' to westerns but not quite:

Ruggles of Red Gap (1935) - Love this film

The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (1948) - top ten all time movies

Brokeback Mountain (2005)

JEREMIAH JOHNSON (1972)

THE REVENANT (2015)

The Rounders (1965) - Ford and Fonda? I love this movie!

BLAZING SADDLES (1974)

I notice other Budd Boeticher-Randolph Scott collabs missing. Anything thoughts on Ride Lonesome? Or others.

What’s your beef with The Searchers? Not putting it on a list of top 50 is a big statement.

Not many of the spaghettis on your list, not a big fan?

Love the list and even all these years later there’s many new ones on it I still need to see.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

I notice other Budd Boeticher-Randolph Scott collabs missing. Anything thoughts on Ride Lonesome? Or others.

You'd Do It for Randolph Scott
I have seen Ride Lonesome and a few other Randolph Scott Westerns, my fav would be Ride the High Country of his Westerns. Of his other genre flicks I like the comedy My Favorite Wife an obscure Sci-Fi cult classic called She that was nearly lost to time but Buster Keaton discovered a complete copy in his belongings, so it survived.
Scott came to his best Westerns long into his career when he was old and not the best age-fit for the parts he played. I know the Westerns that they made together but confess that I didn't recognize Budd Boeticher by name but know him best because I watched reruns of Maverick.

What’s your beef with The Searchers? Not putting it on a list of top 50 is a big statement.

It is my controversial take that it had great moments, but I have always felt it was overrated so I'm biased. John Wayne has made no bones that he put all of his effort into creating his archetypical character rather than work on his craft as an actor. I put in many of his films, but I feel that he actually tried and was great as an actor in one film. Many feel the Searchers is his best, not me I felt he was great in Angel and the Badman where he starred with the smoldering Gail Russell who you probably never heard of because she tragically died at age 36 of alcohol poisoning.

Not many of the spaghettis on your list, not a big fan?

I lived out West for years, stumbled upon historic true Wild West locations and read up on the lore and just love the real American West. A real Western IMHO is not filmed in Spain with European casts and over-dubbed dialogue. Everything about spaghetti Westerns grate my nerves like Quint's nails in Jaws

 

[Ilov80s]

I notice other Budd Boeticher-Randolph Scott collabs missing. Anything thoughts on Ride Lonesome? Or others.

You'd Do It for Randolph Scott
I have seen Ride Lonesome and a few other Randolph Scott Westerns, my fav would be Ride the High Country of his Westerns. Of his other genre flicks I like the comedy My Favorite Wife an obscure Sci-Fi cult classic called She that was nearly lost to time but Buster Keaton discovered a complete copy in his belongings, so it survived.
Scott came to his best Westerns long into his career when he was old and not the best age-fit for the parts he played. I know the Westerns that they made together but confess that I didn't recognize Budd Boeticher by name but know him best because I watched reruns of Maverick.

What’s your beef with The Searchers? Not putting it on a list of top 50 is a big statement.

It is my controversial take that it had great moments, but I have always felt it was overrated so I'm biased. John Wayne has made no bones that he put all of his effort into creating his archetypical character rather than work on his craft as an actor. I put in many of his films, but I feel that he actually tried and was great as an actor in one film. Many feel the Searchers is his best, not me I felt he was great in Angel and the Badman where he starred with the smoldering Gail Russell who you probably never heard of because she tragically died at age 36 of alcohol poisoning.

Not many of the spaghettis on your list, not a big fan?

I lived out West for years, stumbled upon historic true Wild West locations and read up on the lore and just love the real American West. A real Western IMHO is not filmed in Spain with European casts and over-dubbed dialogue. Everything about spaghetti Westerns grate my nerves like Quint's nails in Jaws

Ok love the passion and answers even if I don’t agree. Ok next question, have you seen any westerns in the 5ish years since you’ve played the list that you think deserve a spot?

 

[Bracie Smathers]

have you seen any westerns in the 5ish years since you’ve played the list that you think deserve a spot?

I just amended the list a few days ago.

Have to find room for this movie.
WESTWARD THE WOMEN (1951)

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Ok next question, have you seen any westerns in the 5ish years since you’ve played the list that you think deserve a spot?

Just rewatched "My Darling Clementine" (1946) and realized that Tim Holt played Virgil Earp. Holt was also in Stagecoach and Treasure of the Seirra Madre. I only knew him from Treasure of the Seirra Madre. I looked up his IMBD profile and discovered his dad, Jack Holt was a well-known actor.
One of his films was 'San Francisco' (1939) Spencer Tracy, Clark Gable, and Jeanette McDonald who was part of the famous film singing duo with Nelson Eddy. Their signature tune that many would know was: Indian Love Call Jeannette MacDonald & Nelson Eddy
San Franciso is very good and deserving of a spot on any list of best Westerns of all time.

 

[Ilov80s]

Ok next question, have you seen any westerns in the 5ish years since you’ve played the list that you think deserve a spot?

Just rewatched "My Darling Clementine" (1946) and realized that Tim Holt played Virgil Earp. Holt was also in Stagecoach and Treasure of the Seirra Madre. I only knew him from Treasure of the Seirra Madre. I looked up his IMBD profile and discovered his dad, Jack Holt was a well-known actor.
One of his films was 'San Francisco' (1939) Spencer Tracy, Clark Gable, and Jeanette McDonald who was part of the famous film singing duo with Nelson Eddy. Their signature tune that many would know was: Indian Love Call Jeannette MacDonald & Nelson Eddy
San Franciso is very good and deserving of a spot on any list of best Westerns of all time.

Hmmm I mostly liked San Francisco but never thought of it as a Western. Though most of what I remember liking about it was how impressed I was with the portrayal of the earthquake. Those were some damn good effects, totally sold it.

 

[Eephus]

Ok next question, have you seen any westerns in the 5ish years since you’ve played the list that you think deserve a spot?

Just rewatched "My Darling Clementine" (1946) and realized that Tim Holt played Virgil Earp. Holt was also in Stagecoach and Treasure of the Seirra Madre. I only knew him from Treasure of the Seirra Madre. I looked up his IMBD profile and discovered his dad, Jack Holt was a well-known actor.
One of his films was 'San Francisco' (1939) Spencer Tracy, Clark Gable, and Jeanette McDonald who was part of the famous film singing duo with Nelson Eddy. Their signature tune that many would know was: Indian Love Call Jeannette MacDonald & Nelson Eddy
San Franciso is very good and deserving of a spot on any list of best Westerns of all time.

Holt made dozens of B Westerns in the late 40s and early 50s. B pictures were a carryover from the pre-WWII years where major and minor studios churned them out. They were usually short and filmed on tight budgets and shooting schedules. The genre died off because of television and the 1948 Supreme Court ruling that forced studios to divest themselves of their theater chains.

Holt also had a lead role in Welles' The Magnificent Ambersons.

 

[SWC]

my favorites are open range broken trail lonesome dove silverado the original magnificient seven which is really just seven samurai as a western dances with wolves and more recently the english was really good take that to the western bank brohans

 

[Bracie Smathers]

Holt made dozens of B Westerns in the late 40s and early 50s... Holt also had a lead role in Welles' The Magnificent Ambersons.

Most would recognize Holt from Treasure of the Serria Madre since it still gets played and holds up perfectly. It is amazing that he stands toe-to-toe with Bogart and Walter Houston in basically a three-lead movie. Holt leaps off the screen but stood no chance with John Houston directing, writing, and even playing a bit part as the imposed upon 'Fellow American' who crafted the role for his father who won Best Actor and then also having to share the screen with Bogart playing one of his most memorable characters.
I noticed Holt was in the Magnificent Ambersons and even though he got top billing I only remember Joseph Cotton from that film. Wells cut 22 minutes from the middle of the movie creating a technical glitch so many versions exist of a chopped-up film with bad editing. I found it a challenging watch, so it took me a few runs before I saw a complete version.

Hmmm I mostly liked San Francisco but never thought of it as a Western. Though most of what I remember liking about it was how impressed I was with the portrayal of the earthquake. Those were some damn good effects, totally sold it.

Ahh, you're right. I think I mashed up another Western that took place in the Barbary Coast era but can't remember the name with San Francisco that starred Clark Gable which is most lauded for the special effects from the 1906 earthquake.

 

[Ilov80s]

On a little Western kick this weekend, all rewatches

She Wore a Yellow Ribbon
Ride the High Country
Winchester '73
The Fasest Gun Alive

These are all B tier Westerns for me. Not B as in B movie but just a simple grading scale. Not the top shelf but movies all Wesrern fans should try at some point. I see only Winchester made @Bracie Smathers list

 

[Bracie Smathers]

On a little Western kick this weekend, all rewatches

She Wore a Yellow Ribbon
Ride the High Country
Winchester '73
The Fasest Gun Alive

These are all B tier Westerns for me. Not B as in B movie but just a simple grading scale. Not the top shelf but movies all Wesrern fans should try at some point. I see only Winchester made @Bracie Smathers list

I haven't seen EVERY Western.
The one you saw that I haven't watched is 'The Fastest Gun Alive'. Love Glen Ford and Brodrick Crawford is always amazing as a baddie. Great pipes. Best known for 'All the Kings Men' as Hughie Long.
Noted that I liked 'Ride the High Country' but just never clicked with 'She Wore a Yellow Ribbon'.

 

[Ilov80s]

On a little Western kick this weekend, all rewatches

She Wore a Yellow Ribbon
Ride the High Country
Winchester '73
The Fasest Gun Alive

These are all B tier Westerns for me. Not B as in B movie but just a simple grading scale. Not the top shelf but movies all Wesrern fans should try at some point. I see only Winchester made @Bracie Smathers list

I haven't seen EVERY Western.
The one you saw that I haven't watched is 'The Fastest Gun Alive'. Love Glen Ford and Brodrick Crawford is always amazing as a baddie. Great pipes. Best known for 'All the Kings Men' as Hughie Long.
Noted that I liked 'Ride the High Country' but just never clicked with 'She Wore a Yellow Ribbon'.

I’m wrapping up the weekend westerns with one of your favorites, Tombstone. RIP Val Kilmer. Every few years I keep going back to it hoping to like it more. Val is great in it but I think for some reason I struggle with Kurt Russell as Wyatt Earp.

 

[Cowboysfan8]

The one you saw that I haven't watched is 'The Fastest Gun Alive'.

A good one imo

I believe I read once that Ford was actually timed the fastest of all the actors

 

[Ilov80s]

The one you saw that I haven't watched is 'The Fastest Gun Alive'.

A good one imo

I believe I read once that Ford was actually timed the fastest of all the actors

They do this incredible trick photography in a certain shot that makes him look insanely fast. It’s obvious that it’s a trick I think but it’s pretty darn smooth for the time. I also like how the movie is a sort of response to High Noon (and a better movie imo).

 

[Bracie Smathers]

I believe I read once that Ford was actually timed the fastest of all the actors

You would be correct.
I accidentally stumbled upon this a few days ago.
Which Actor was the Fastest 6 Gun Draw?
Some of the actors became obsessed with the fast-gun culture and a few went onto professional fast-gun competitions. Ford's draw-time wasn't the 'fastest' but of the top Hollywood Western stars he was definitely the fastest draw.
A few names that shocked me were Sammy Davis Junior and Jerry Lewis. Sammy and Jerry actually faced off and Sammy beat him. These guys took fast-gun competitions seriously.

They do this incredible trick photography in a certain shot that makes him look insanely fast. It’s obvious that it’s a trick I think but it’s pretty darn smooth for the time.

You are not going to believe this but...
Ford's draw time was soo quick in that movie that the camera couldn't catch it so they had to SLOW DOWN the film so audiences could see.
I caught a Western a few days ago called 'Slow West'. I had seen it but didn't remember it and I understand the reason.
The title 'SLOW' is aptly named because of the glacial pacing. Loved the cinemaphotography and it stars Michael Fassbender who is one of the best actors of our time, but the story jumps into odd corners that go nowhere. It is only ok. I can't recommend that one.

 

[Cowboysfan8]

I believe I read once that Ford was actually timed the fastest of all the actors

You would be correct.
I accidentally stumbled upon this a few days ago.
Which Actor was the Fastest 6 Gun Draw?
Some of the actors became obsessed with the fast-gun culture and a few went onto professional fast-gun competitions. Ford's draw-time wasn't the 'fastest' but of the top Hollywood Western stars he was definitely the fastest draw.
A few names that shocked me were Sammy Davis Junior and Jerry Lewis. Sammy and Jerry actually faced off and Sammy beat him. These guys took fast-gun competitions seriously.

They do this incredible trick photography in a certain shot that makes him look insanely fast. It’s obvious that it’s a trick I think but it’s pretty darn smooth for the time.

You are not going to believe this but...
Ford's draw time was soo quick in that movie that the camera couldn't catch it so they had to SLOW DOWN the film so audiences could see.
I caught a Western a few days ago called 'Slow West'. I had seen it but didn't remember it and I understand the reason.
The title 'SLOW' is aptly named because of the glacial pacing. Loved the cinemaphotography and it stars Michael Fassbender who is one of the best actors of our time, but the story jumps into odd corners that go nowhere. It is only ok. I can't recommend that one.

I remember Sammy Davis Jr as a gunman in an episode of the Rifleman

 

[Ilov80s]

I believe I read once that Ford was actually timed the fastest of all the actors

You would be correct.
I accidentally stumbled upon this a few days ago.
Which Actor was the Fastest 6 Gun Draw?
Some of the actors became obsessed with the fast-gun culture and a few went onto professional fast-gun competitions. Ford's draw-time wasn't the 'fastest' but of the top Hollywood Western stars he was definitely the fastest draw.
A few names that shocked me were Sammy Davis Junior and Jerry Lewis. Sammy and Jerry actually faced off and Sammy beat him. These guys took fast-gun competitions seriously.

They do this incredible trick photography in a certain shot that makes him look insanely fast. It’s obvious that it’s a trick I think but it’s pretty darn smooth for the time.

You are not going to believe this but...
Ford's draw time was soo quick in that movie that the camera couldn't catch it so they had to SLOW DOWN the film so audiences could see.
I caught a Western a few days ago called 'Slow West'. I had seen it but didn't remember it and I understand the reason.
The title 'SLOW' is aptly named because of the glacial pacing. Loved the cinemaphotography and it stars Michael Fassbender who is one of the best actors of our time, but the story jumps into odd corners that go nowhere. It is only ok. I can't recommend that one.

I like Slow West. Didn’t love but it was solid. Do you have a link where they talk about slowing the camera down for Ford? The scene where he shoots a beer bottle before it hits the ground in The Fastest Gun Alive almost surely uses a mini jumpcut to make him appear faster than he is. You can kind of see it’s a little jerky as he draws and shoots so I’m curious to read about the process or if it’s actually not what it appears.