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US Men's National Team (17 Viewers)

NewlyRetired said:
Since Steffen can't go to Panama, I wonder if GGG will rotate keepers or just stick with Turner for the first two and then see from that point?
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Very interested in this too.  If Turner hasn't done enough to be the starter until he has a run of bad games, it's close.  Feel like he just doesn't make the same kinds of mistakes Steffen does.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
It doesn't apply to Scally, but the one thing I do think everyone has to acknowledge is that Gregg has more information on most of these players than we do.  He's had them for training.  He's evaluated them in his system (and I get that many are not fans of his system, but he's the coach).   It really doesn't matter if you rate a guy like Arriola or Roldan or Lletget.  Gregg trusts them.   And it's easy to see why (and I hate myself for becoming Bill Simmons here) because while they might not put as much on the table as some other options, they generally don't take anything off the table.  They always play hard.  They don't make big mistakes.  They don't dog it on defense.  Arriola, in particular, seems to always at least get chances (and this is a team that struggles to create chances, not just to convert them).  

I hope Scally and KDF have long, great careers with the USMNT.  But I think it's just silly to act like that excluding them is some huge oversight considering both have pretty thin resumes. 
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GGG seems to rate guys that on the please-the-eye level, aren't quite as popping. Guys that I assume he knows and knows that they can play how he wants them to play- formation or otherwise. Nips, Roldan, Ream, Lletget. There's something to be said for that- and obviously we also don't see what's going on in training.

but if it's about trusting guys to play your system- I'd be happier about it if the system was actually... working.

and when two gimpy guys in Nips and Weah get hurt in training prior to the 1st game- who plays their spot? 

 
NewlyRetired said:
That is my whole point.  Scally would not be an emergency, number 27 player, if included. 

His ability to play left back would make him an instant start for me in Panama when Robbo can't play.

Moore just having been in camp before should not trump the quality and flexibility that comes with Scally and I don't buy for a second a player who has played every second of every game is suddenly going to lose his spot because he goes on international duty.
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Agreed...

The Ream pick is also strange to me for similar Panama reasons as that seems like the match you would play him.  I'm not particularly wedded to Miazga or anyone else, but Ream just seems out of place if he can't play in Panama since he shouldn't be starting against Jamaica.  

I also think these picks scream 3-5-2 (or something like that), but we'll see.  There frankly aren't enough wingers to really pull off a 4-3-3 for all 3 games.  

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
It doesn't apply to Scally, but the one thing I do think everyone has to acknowledge is that Gregg has more information on most of these players than we do.  He's had them for training.  He's evaluated them in his system (and I get that many are not fans of his system, but he's the coach).   It really doesn't matter if you rate a guy like Arriola or Roldan or Lletget.  Gregg trusts them.   And it's easy to see why (and I hate myself for becoming Bill Simmons here) because while they might not put as much on the table as some other options, they generally don't take anything off the table.  They always play hard.  They don't make big mistakes.  They don't dog it on defense.  Arriola, in particular, seems to always at least get chances (and this is a team that struggles to create chances, not just to convert them).  

I hope Scally and KDF have long, great careers with the USMNT.  But I think it's just silly to act like that excluding them is some huge oversight considering both have pretty thin resumes. 
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pin it

 
And calling in only 27 when you know 3 of them (is that the official count?) can't go to Panama just seems weird to me knowing our injury history especially with 28-30 (ex-Sands) all being in Europe.  

 
I am not sure I get the "needs to be integrated" stance. 

I guess if it was consistent across the board, I could kind of understand it but GGG had absolutely no issues bringing in a brand new player like Pepi last window, and it may have even saved his job....

 
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GGG being interviewed right now in the CL post game.  He gave a candid answer about Pefok after being asked by Henry pointed blank why he was left off the roster.  Basically said they are looking for verticality and feel that Zardes and Pepi can provide what Pefok can while also making the runs that Pefok isn't as adept at right now.  Whether you agree or disagree I was surprised he was that open with his answer.

 
GGG - less candid answer about #1 GK spot - says it's open competition and that's a good thing.  Talked about Turner's good work for the team though.

 
NewlyRetired said:
here is some hard trivia if you don't look it up.

Yedlin has 67 caps and 0 goals. 

Only two field players in US history have more caps and 0 goals.  Name them.
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While researching this, I noticed GGG had a donut in 44 caps. 

It has to kill him to think his possible one national team goal could have been an epic one against Germany to possibly launch them into the semi finals of a World Cup if not for Torstin Frings hand.

https://images.mlssoccer.com/image/private/t_editorial_landscape_12_desktop_3x/f_auto/prd-league/xnkv72zckczob5kn9ihh.jpg

 
NewlyRetired said:
here is some hard trivia if you don't look it up.

Yedlin has 67 caps and 0 goals. 

Only two field players in US history have more caps and 0 goals.  Name them.
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Agoos scored a few worldies for DCU but I don't remember any for the US.  

And I'll go with Cobi Jones as the other.

(joking, not joking)

 
Beasley?

This was apparently a horrible guess.

I cheated and looked it up - I'm not sure I've heard of either guy.

 
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Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
 I think KDF would be the fifth wing.  Aaronson, Weah, Hoppe, Arriola, KDF.  I get that Hoppe is a striker, but he's a LW with this group.  And Gregg's had to chance to compare Hoppe in the Gold Cup to KDF in the September window.  Hoppe apparently came out on top.   
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I get that and he can play Roldan there as well as he's done in the past. But there's no limit here and there's no reason not to bring another guy that is a natural wing.

If someone gets dinged and we have to bring someone else in, it likely is going to be from MLS. Looking forward to Jonathan Lewis dazzling us this window

 
Yeah, I just dont see how.....after the situation we just dealt with in the last window.....with COVID being out there.....with several "injury prone" guys on the roster.....and 2 of our best players out......and a game in the window where we likely can't bring everyone......Greg can be like "Yeah, 27 is fine" and "yeah.....I think we'll just bring 3 "natural wingers" (Plus Hoppe).

Its just mind boggling. Konrad will literally just be sitting around Marseile playing video games for the next week and a half.   So will several other talented players who, while not world beaters ...could be useful in a pinch. And the alternative is Weah pulls a hammy, Aaronson gets kicked to pieces in Panama and we're calling in an emergency MLS player to cover.

Its absolute lunacy to call in so few when the "backups" are an ocean away.

 
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TLEF316 said:
Yeah, I just dont see how.....after the situation we just dealt with in the last window.....with COVID being out there.....with several "injury prone" guys on the roster.....and 2 of our best players out......and a game in the window where we likely can't bring everyone......Greg can be like "Yeah, 27 is fine" and "yeah.....I think we'll just bring 3 "natural wingers" (Plus Hoppe).

Its just mind boggling. Konrad will literally just be sitting around Marseile playing video games for the next week and a half.   So will several other talented players who, while not world beaters ...could be useful in a pinch. And the alternative is Weah pulls a hammy, Aaronson gets kicked to pieces in Panama and we're calling in an emergency MLS player to cover.

Its absolute lunacy to call in so few when the "backups" are an ocean away.
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It’s the combo of all that that gets me, but I guess I shouldn’t be surprised.  I can understand not calling in Sands for cover additional Adams cover given he’s in NY, but we were comically thin at wing by the end of last window and are even moreso with this roster.  Yet again, the roster is divorced from a real consistent tactical setup.  

 
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Sammy3469 said:
And calling in only 27 when you know 3 of them (is that the official count?) can't go to Panama just seems weird to me knowing our injury history especially with 28-30 (ex-Sands) all being in Europe.  
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What is Mexico doing here? Are they calling in 30 players? I get that they have less talent playing overseas than the US, but are worried about injuries and rotation?

 
TLEF316 said:
Yeah, I just dont see how.....after the situation we just dealt with in the last window.....with COVID being out there.....with several "injury prone" guys on the roster.....and 2 of our best players out......and a game in the window where we likely can't bring everyone......Greg can be like "Yeah, 27 is fine" and "yeah.....I think we'll just bring 3 "natural wingers" (Plus Hoppe).

Its just mind boggling. Konrad will literally just be sitting around Marseile playing video games for the next week and a half.   So will several other talented players who, while not world beaters ...could be useful in a pinch. And the alternative is Weah pulls a hammy, Aaronson gets kicked to pieces in Panama and we're calling in an emergency MLS player to cover.

Its absolute lunacy to call in so few when the "backups" are an ocean away.
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On the flip side, I doubt players 28-30 want to fly across the pond to train and then not play.  If I was Konrad I'd be the rest days and video games rather than the hassle of jumping thru hoops for nothing.  Call me up when I might sniff some PT.

 
BassNBrew said:
On the flip side, I doubt players 28-30 want to fly across the pond to train and then not play.  If I was Konrad I'd be the rest days and video games rather than the hassle of jumping thru hoops for nothing.  Call me up when I might sniff some PT.
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I mean...They're certainly entitled to make that decision.  For a 20 year old who I presume has ambition to play in a world cup (which, even if he didn't really care about playing for the national team, could lead to significant exposure and additional club opportunities) that would be an incredibly short sighted and dumb decision. 

I also seriously doubt Greg would call him in with the premise of "hey, you're my 28th man"

If konrad actually turns down a call up because he doesn't think he can out-train Paul arriola and earn some PT, he certainly doesn't have much self belief 

 
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NewlyRetired said:
17 year old keeper Gabriel Slonina has now started 3 games for the Fire and the reviews have been very good.
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Back to back shut outs and his first win as a pro tonight. 
 

It is wonderful experience he is getting at such a young age.  If he can keep getting minutes, having an actively playing pro keeper is going to be nice for U20 qualifying. 

 
The Z Machine said:
What is Mexico doing here? Are they calling in 30 players? I get that they have less talent playing overseas than the US, but are worried about injuries and rotation?
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They really only have Jimenez who is affected and all three of their matches are in red countries (Mexico looks like it’s red anyway).

 
TripItUp said:
I thought GGG gives a good explanation for no Pefok.  I was pleased with the response.  

I also liked what he said about Mckennie.

Would have preferred the panel ask him about more players including Scally and Konrad.
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I swear if I hear him say vertical one more time I’m going to shoot myself especially when some of these teams may bunker.  I’m fine with Zardes over Pefok in those scenarios anyway since he can find space in congestion, but that’s just insipid coachspeak.  

 
TLEF316 said:
I mean...They're certainly entitled to make that decision.  For a 20 year old who I presume has ambition to play in a world cup (which, even if he didn't really care about playing for the national team, could lead to significant exposure and additional club opportunities) that would be an incredibly short sighted and dumb decision. 

I also seriously doubt Greg would call him in with the premise of "hey, you're my 28th man"

If konrad actually turns down a call up because he doesn't think he can out-train Paul arriola and earn some PT, he certainly doesn't have much self belief 
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Five weeks from today they are back at it with a new rooster.  Plenty of opportunities.  If we think this is tough, next year chasing 23 will be even worse.  Maybe Greg doesn't want to turn camp into a UNC practice.  I'm fine arguing that Konrad should be one of the 27, but I also good with a coach deciding he only wants 27 players in camp.

 
BassNBrew said:
Five weeks from today they are back at it with a new rooster.  Plenty of opportunities.  If we think this is tough, next year chasing 23 will be even worse.  Maybe Greg doesn't want to turn camp into a UNC practice.  I'm fine arguing that Konrad should be one of the 27, but I also good with a coach deciding he only wants 27 players in camp.
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Yeah, obviously there will be plenty of opportunities. Although it wouldn't surprise me if Greg (or any coach) "punished" a guy who turned down a call up by not even asking the next time. Obviously that didn't happen here but may have already happened with De La Torre in September. (after he declined the Gold Cup Call up).

As someone who never played soccer, I have ZERO idea how the logistics of a high level training session work. Maybe having 30 guys there makes it tough to get work done. I honestly dont know.  Maybe there's something to that.

The part that bothers me is that we JUST had a camp where injuries, illness and suspension caused us to lose FIVE guys off the initial roster and miss entire games.

Weah never made it there with the injury

Dest got hurt

Reyna got hurt

Snacks got suspended

Steffen got back spasms and then COVID.

Obviously the Weston situation was a fluky thing (you hope) but any of those things COULD happen again. Add in the Panama red country situation and I just think they're unnecessarily putting themselves in a situation where they MIGHT have to call in emergency domestic players (who aren't very good) to fill out the roster for the last game. Considering they're already down arguably their 2 most talented attackers, that just seems really unwise.

 
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Sammy3469 said:
I swear if I hear him say vertical one more time I’m going to shoot myself especially when some of these teams may bunker.  I’m fine with Zardes over Pefok in those scenarios anyway since he can find space in congestion, but that’s just insipid coachspeak.  
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I'm starting to think Berhalter had his way with someone close to you.

 
NewlyRetired said:
Back to back shut outs and his first win as a pro tonight. 
 

It is wonderful experience he is getting at such a young age.  If he can keep getting minutes, having an actively playing pro keeper is going to be nice for U20 qualifying. 
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Oh oh.....

The Chicago coach just got sacked.....I hope this won't effect the kids playing time...

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
I'm starting to think Berhalter had his way with someone close to you.
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Not to get too technical, but having the CF or wings "get vertical" is a horrendous data point to be using when choosing guys.  Effectively what he's really saying is he wants these guys to make runs into the half spaces between defenders to facilitate a progressive pass (which is how most good teams score run of play goals these days and why CPs 1v1 stuff is less than fantastic).  On that I agree. However, progressive passes don't come out of thin air.  You need both the guy with the ball in a position to make that pass, the space for that pass to land without it being gobbled up by a defender, and the guy up the field having the awareness of where that space is and that the pass is probably coming.  We frankly have 1.5 guys in MF that can make that progressive pass that play regularly (Weston and Adams sometimes).  Musah substitutes the pass with his dribbling and Llegett can, but his #1 desire is to play it safe.  Sands and Acosta are bad at this as well (and this is why the Doyle's of the world want Pomykal).  

Between our shape and our MFs abilities, we simply don't put them in consistent positions to actually make these passes and blaming CFs for "verticality" is a cop out for not putting MFs and defenders in positions to make those passes.   

This is also why having CP/Reyna/Aaronson as "wingers" trying to get vertical isn't ideal as they are 3 of our stronger guys at making progressive passes.  

 
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