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***Official Pro Wrestling Thread*** (10 Viewers)

That was a solid show, and I was not expecting much.

Tag match stole the show. Those two teams are perfect rivals and now they're in their proper roles.

Face it fellas, Roman is improving and has star written all over him. That's three straight ppvs where he had a terrific performance imo. And the Chicago crowd was hot for him which was great to see, and a shock.

Cena-Rusev again? They can't really job Rusev out 3 straight ppvs can they?

Dolph-Shameus was very good, aside from the dopey stip. Shameus is such a great heel.

Main event was boring. Maybe they left everything they had on the Mania stage. Rollins looked very boring last night. And why the hell does Kane need to be involved??

 
Craig_MiamiFL said:
RBM said:
Seriously, best tag match I've seen in years. Hope we get a long feud for these two teams.
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Was my favorite match of the night.Who woulda thunk a new refreshing feud could be enjoyable.

Nice to see Neville go over. I think they've done a solid job so far building him up. Even if I'm not super high on him as a singles guy long term, any new faces on the show are good.

Can't believe WWE still thinks fans care 'who will Kane side with?' They've done these turns so many times with him (and Big Show) that no one cares.

Really have to wonder how bad Daniel Bryan is hurt. Hard to believe this is gonna turn out good if they continue having him wrestling every week.
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I have no desire to see him wrestle anymore, but I'm enjoying the Kane storyline. The once great, proud wrestler now commanded to lay down and cheat for a snot nosed, ungrateful, undeserving, whiney punk like Rollins. 20 years of blood, sweat and tears has led to this? I think it's really good storytelling.

I really like Neville. I'm not sure where his ceiling is long term, but he's so fun to watch. We're going to the show in Green Bay tonight and if I get to see a Red Arrow live, I'll walk out a happy man.

I think we've seen the last of Daniel Bryan. If there's one injury that ends careers in a heartbeat it's neck injuries. That he rehabbed this long and has apparently had a setback can't be good. It looks like David Wilson all over again. I'm very much hope I'm wrong.

travdogg said:
RBM said:
Seriously, best tag match I've seen in years. Hope we get a long feud for these two teams.
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I thought that was the match of the night, and as much as New Day as heels looks good, I'm extremely intrigued by Cesaro/Kidd as potential faces.
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I love the New Day as heels. It's been a while since I've rooted for the bad guys, but I'm rooting for them. I love that they're apparently confused as to why they're getting boo'd. It's probably giving the writers too much credit to say they planned it this way all along, but I think them starting as faces and evolving naturally toward heels was perfect for them.

RBM said:
Lol Reigns-Big Show actually turned out great.

This crowd is fantastic by the way
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Yeah, that one way exceeded expectations. That's now 3 excellent PPV performances in a row from Reigns and nobody can say he was "carried" this time.

Agree with the crowd too. They were enthusiastic without being vulgar and having a lot of stupid chants that had nothing to do with the performers in the ring.

 
  • Smile
Reactions: RBM
RBM said:
That was a solid show, and I was not expecting much.

Tag match stole the show. Those two teams are perfect rivals and now they're in their proper roles.

Face it fellas, Roman is improving and has star written all over him. That's three straight ppvs where he had a terrific performance imo. And the Chicago crowd was hot for him which was great to see, and a shock.

Cena-Rusev again? They can't really job Rusev out 3 straight ppvs can they?

Dolph-Shameus was very good, aside from the dopey stip. Shameus is such a great heel.

Main event was boring. Maybe they left everything they had on the Mania stage. Rollins looked very boring last night. And why the hell does Kane need to be involved??
Click to expand...
Agree with pretty much all of this. Loved the tag match, and I thought Show-Reigns was hot the whole way through. Show seemed like he was having a good time the whole match...I loved it when he put the table away the first time, and he kept saying Reigns was finished. I really hope Show moves into an announcer role when he's done in the ring. Really happy to hear the crowd solidly behind Roman.

Cena vs Rusev disappointed. They hardly used the chain at all...no chain wrapped fists, chain assisted submission moves, etc. I'm happy Cena went over so he can keep the open challenge going, though.

Cage matches are generally lame, so I'm not surprised the main event fell a bit flat. I think (hope?) they are setting up Kane's swan song. He's been a loyal soldier for a long time - he deserves a little face run to finish out his career. If Bryan can't wrestle, why not re-connect those two for some backstage stuff?

The show needed one more impact match...wouldn't have minded another tag match (throw Lucha Dragons vs Ascension on there) to fill out the show instead of so many lengthy recap segments. Star power was a bit lacking with no Bryan or Bray on top of all of the part-timers being gone after Mania.

 
OC Zed said:
Brady Marino said:
Thunderlips said:
New Day works as a heel faction. They seem to be good workers and elicit a good response.
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I'm actually excited that Kofi will get a chance to work heel for once in his WWE career.
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Big E should have been a heel from the beginning, but I've been dead set against Kofi turning. I can sort of see how this could work though... he could be excellent in the weasel role. Xavier Woods is so $$$ as a bad guy too.
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Love the fact these guys have turned heel. Had a whole scenario where R-Truth would have helped turned them, but glad they are doing it on their own. They need these belts for a while and need to use the crap out of the Freebird Rule. Kofi = Michael Hayes, Big E = Terry Gordy, Woods = Buddy Roberts. Rock/Paper/Scissors at the beginning of the match to decide who defends the belts. Lots of outside interference from the third man on the outside. Should be a lot of fun.

 
OC Zed said:
The Divas match tonight was alright, but is it too much to ask that we get some clear face and heel roles in that division? Why does every woman wrestler have to only act like a catty ##### with her fellow female wrestlers? It's tough to get a crowd into a match when you don't have anyone to really root for/against.
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Yeah, the WWE hasn't made any secret of how they view the women's wrestlers ever since they labeled them "divas". They seem to fall into 2 categories. Catty and crazy. The WWE has always loved stereotypes.

 
RBM said:
That was a solid show, and I was not expecting much.

Tag match stole the show. Those two teams are perfect rivals and now they're in their proper roles.

Face it fellas, Roman is improving and has star written all over him. That's three straight ppvs where he had a terrific performance imo. And the Chicago crowd was hot for him which was great to see, and a shock.

Cena-Rusev again? They can't really job Rusev out 3 straight ppvs can they?

Dolph-Shameus was very good, aside from the dopey stip. Shameus is such a great heel.

Main event was boring. Maybe they left everything they had on the Mania stage. Rollins looked very boring last night. And why the hell does Kane need to be involved??
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I enjoyed the main event, but otherwise I agree.

Someone suggested on twitter last night that Rusev forces Cena to say "I quit" by threating to hurt Lana if he doesn't. I thought that was a pretty good idea. They won't have Cena say "I quit", without having him pass out like Steve Austin did against Bret Hart, or getting tricked into saying it. I agree they can't job Rusev 3 straight.

Love Shameus as a heel. And in the era of smaller wrestlers being the most popular, his mic work has been perfect. The IWC must hate this guys guts. :D

I'm really curious to see how they handle the fact that Rollins won with the move that was banned last night. I thought that was an interesting twist.

 
JB Breakfast Club said:
RBM said:
That was a solid show, and I was not expecting much.

Tag match stole the show. Those two teams are perfect rivals and now they're in their proper roles.

Face it fellas, Roman is improving and has star written all over him. That's three straight ppvs where he had a terrific performance imo. And the Chicago crowd was hot for him which was great to see, and a shock.

Cena-Rusev again? They can't really job Rusev out 3 straight ppvs can they?

Dolph-Shameus was very good, aside from the dopey stip. Shameus is such a great heel.

Main event was boring. Maybe they left everything they had on the Mania stage. Rollins looked very boring last night. And why the hell does Kane need to be involved??
Click to expand...
Cena vs Rusev disappointed. They hardly used the chain at all...no chain wrapped fists, chain assisted submission moves, etc. I'm happy Cena went over so he can keep the open challenge going, though.
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I enjoy gimmick matches so I generally enjoy this event, but if you're going to have a chain match you kind of need blood.

 
Jeremy said:
JB Breakfast Club said:
RBM said:
That was a solid show, and I was not expecting much.

Tag match stole the show. Those two teams are perfect rivals and now they're in their proper roles.

Face it fellas, Roman is improving and has star written all over him. That's three straight ppvs where he had a terrific performance imo. And the Chicago crowd was hot for him which was great to see, and a shock.

Cena-Rusev again? They can't really job Rusev out 3 straight ppvs can they?

Dolph-Shameus was very good, aside from the dopey stip. Shameus is such a great heel.

Main event was boring. Maybe they left everything they had on the Mania stage. Rollins looked very boring last night. And why the hell does Kane need to be involved??
Click to expand...
Cena vs Rusev disappointed. They hardly used the chain at all...no chain wrapped fists, chain assisted submission moves, etc. I'm happy Cena went over so he can keep the open challenge going, though.
Click to expand...
I enjoy gimmick matches so I generally enjoy this event, but if you're going to have a chain match you kind of need blood.
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It doesn't have to have color, but it needed intensity. It needed a hangman over the top rope spot, but it's apparent that WWE has also banned choke holds.

 
I'd like it Rollins just pointed out that cage matches have no DQ, so once Orton made it a cage match, the RKO ban was thrown out, because how could it be enforced?

Good to see most of the thread enjoyed the show last night, I was very underwhelmed myself. I thought the Tag Title match was the best match of the night, and the pre-show match was 2nd best. I actually think Neville filing in for Bryan was an upgrade at this point. Really, after Rollins and Sami Zayn, I think Neville is the 3rd most interesting wrestler in the company. That said, hopefully Bryan isn't announcing his retirement tonight, because while I know nothing about his medical state, this has a very similar feeling to Edge a few years back.

Cena-Rusev was garbage, this feud should have ended at Mania, or the Raw after.

The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.

Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.

Ambrose/Harper should have been match of the night, but the whole leaving and coming back thing was stupid and pointless. Though I did love when they came back and Xavier Woods(who has been on fire of late) started laughing that Harper was still getting beat up. Hopefully this is the start of Ambrose actually being relevant again.

Sheamus/Ziggler was ok I guess, they've had plenty of better matches before though, I mostly noticed how JBL kept saying "Zigger" over and over again.

Rollins/Orton was kind of a bust other than the pedigree and RKO spots. I don't think there is a single person, who has such a drastic shift in interestingness when heel or face than Orton. Heel Orton was interesting and great in the ring, face Orton is boring and seems bored to be there. Hopefully this won't follow the Cena/Rusev lead and have another match at Payback as well.

All in all, I'd give the show probably a C+.

 
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Jeremy said:
RBM said:
That was a solid show, and I was not expecting much.

Tag match stole the show. Those two teams are perfect rivals and now they're in their proper roles.

Face it fellas, Roman is improving and has star written all over him. That's three straight ppvs where he had a terrific performance imo. And the Chicago crowd was hot for him which was great to see, and a shock.

Cena-Rusev again? They can't really job Rusev out 3 straight ppvs can they?

Dolph-Shameus was very good, aside from the dopey stip. Shameus is such a great heel.

Main event was boring. Maybe they left everything they had on the Mania stage. Rollins looked very boring last night. And why the hell does Kane need to be involved??
Click to expand...
I'm really curious to see how they handle the fact that Rollins won with the move that was banned last night. I thought that was an interesting twist.
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Hoping Rollins calls it a diamond cutter etc and say it wasnt an rko
 
Can't believe they still use the "exit door wins cage match" rule. Time to retire that as a possible ending. Should only be by pinfall, submission (rare as it is), or climb over the top.

And doesn't Reigns standing on the table Big Show was under stop the 10 count?

 
Bobcat10 said:
Can't believe they still use the "exit door wins cage match" rule. Time to retire that as a possible ending.
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Some fatties (like King Kong Bundy in Wrestlemania 2) can't climb over the top of the cage. Then again, there aren't too many such fatties left. Probably just Big Show.No exiting through the cage door would have forced Fritz to come up with a new way to start one of the greatest wrestling feuds ever -- Freebirds-Von Erichs.

 
Gary Coal Man said:
Bobcat10 said:
Can't believe they still use the "exit door wins cage match" rule. Time to retire that as a possible ending.
Click to expand...
Some fatties (like King Kong Bundy in Wrestlemania 2) can't climb over the top of the cage. Then again, there aren't too many such fatties left. Probably just Big Show.No exiting through the cage door would have forced Fritz to come up with a new way to start one of the greatest wrestling feuds ever -- Freebirds-Von Erichs.
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Right that's why I said still use it. Just seems corny.For the fatties, break out the old school blue cage, not the chain link. I would venture to say Big Show could go over that if spec'd out correctly.

 
Anyone up for a prediction game?

2015 King of the Ring tournament winner (begins Tuesday): ______________ (mine: Damien Sandow)

2015 Money in the Bank winner (June PPV): ________________ (mine: Dean Ambrose)

SummerSlam main event: ________________ (mine: Rollins © vs Brock Lesnar vs Roman Reigns vs Dean Ambrose - fatal four way)

Length of Rollins' title reign: ________________ (approx six months - Survivor Series)

Wrestler to beat John Cena for the US Title: _________________ (mine: Finn Balor)

 
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Dare I say with Bryan on the shelf again, Tyson Kidd is the best technical wrestler now. He's really good.

 
JB Breakfast Club said:
Anyone up for a prediction game?

2015 King of the Ring tournament winner (begins Tuesday): ______________ (mine: Damien Sandow)

2015 Money in the Bank winner (June PPV): ________________ (mine: Dean Ambrose)

SummerSlam main event: ________________ (mine: Rollins © vs Brock Lesnar vs Roman Reigns vs Dean Ambrose - fatal four way)

Length of Rollins' title reign: ________________ (approx six months - Survivor Series)

Wrestler to beat John Cena for the US Title: _________________ (mine: Finn Balor)
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I'm not sure who's in King of the Ring. I'll say Sheamus.

Money in the Bank: Ziggler

Summerslam: Rollins vs Lesnar

Rollins Title Reign: 1 year. Loses at WM

Wrestler to beat Cena: Rusev

 
HellToupee said:
Eviloutsider said:
Don't watch much wrestling but I am going to Raw tonight. Anything I need to know?

Look for me, I will be the long-haired fat guy wearing an old NWO shirt in the 2nd row, tv side.
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bring a sign , maybe -FBG ,with an arrow pointing towards you
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On the other side of your FBG sign write the following phrase in big, bold print -- "Google Rita Chatterton". Inside joke that the WWE higher-ups will love.

 
JB Breakfast Club said:
Anyone up for a prediction game?

2015 King of the Ring tournament winner (begins Tuesday): ______________ (mine: Damien Sandow)

2015 Money in the Bank winner (June PPV): ________________ (mine: Dean Ambrose)

SummerSlam main event: ________________ (mine: Rollins © vs Brock Lesnar vs Roman Reigns vs Dean Ambrose - fatal four way)

Length of Rollins' title reign: ________________ (approx six months - Survivor Series)

Wrestler to beat John Cena for the US Title: _________________ (mine: Finn Balor)
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KotR - Dolph Ziggler

MitB - Dean Ambrose

SummerSlam ME - Rollins vs Lesnar

Length of Rollins' reign - Till SummerSlam = 5 months more or less.

Wrestler to beat Cena for U.S. Title - Sheamus

 
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
The Divas match tonight was alright, but is it too much to ask that we get some clear face and heel roles in that division? Why does every woman wrestler have to only act like a catty ##### with her fellow female wrestlers? It's tough to get a crowd into a match when you don't have anyone to really root for/against.
Click to expand...
Yeah, the WWE hasn't made any secret of how they view the women's wrestlers ever since they labeled them "divas". They seem to fall into 2 categories. Catty and crazy. The WWE WRESTLING has always loved stereotypes.
Click to expand...
Fixed

 
JB Breakfast Club said:
Eviloutsider said:
Don't watch much wrestling but I am going to Raw tonight. Anything I need to know?

Look for me, I will be the long-haired fat guy wearing an old NWO shirt in the 2nd row, tv side.
Click to expand...
Cheer for the faces and boo the heels.
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That is cheer the faces you like and boo the heels you are entertained by.

What I have done in the past is sneak in a piece of newspaper and hold it up during boring segments. That sends a message much more strongly than booing a bad segment. Expect it to get confiscated pretty quickly tho.

 
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
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:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.

 
JB Breakfast Club said:
Anyone up for a prediction game?

2015 King of the Ring tournament winner (begins Tuesday): Sheamus (mine: Damien Sandow)

2015 Money in the Bank winner (June PPV): Neville (mine: Dean Ambrose)

SummerSlam main event: Lesnar vs. Rollins (mine: Rollins © vs Brock Lesnar vs Roman Reigns vs Dean Ambrose - fatal four way)

Length of Rollins' title reign: Until SummerSlam (approx six months - Survivor Series)

Wrestler to beat John Cena for the US Title: Harper (mine: Finn Balor) (nice call on Balor though)
Click to expand...
 
OC Zed said:
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
Click to expand...
:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.
Click to expand...
We're down to 4 moves now? I thought it was 5.

It's perfectly fine not to like the guy, but this just isn't accurate. Nor is it all that important.

 
Are we ever going to see regular tights and boots on the members of The Shield? Reigns' chest protector is getting out of control.

 
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
Click to expand...
:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.
Click to expand...
We're down to 4 moves now? I thought it was 5.

It's perfectly fine not to like the guy, but this just isn't accurate. Nor is it all that important.
Click to expand...
It's a fact that Reigns has an extremely limited move set. And it is important given that it greatly limits his matches. It's the same reason why Ric Flair's matches were 100x better than Hulk Hogan's matches, particularly after you saw more than 3 Hogan matches and figured out the script.

 
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OC Zed said:
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
Click to expand...
:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.
Click to expand...
We're down to 4 moves now? I thought it was 5.

It's perfectly fine not to like the guy, but this just isn't accurate. Nor is it all that important.
Click to expand...
It's a fact that Reigns has an extremely limited move set. And it is important given that it greatly limits his matches. It's the same reason why Ric Flair's matches were 100x better than Hulk Hogan's matches, particularly after you saw more than 3 Hogan matches and figured out the script.
Click to expand...
Flair was better in the ring, but who drew the most money? Who did most people find more entertaining?

 
  • Smile
Reactions: RBM
We had a great time at the show last night. I went with my 13 year old son and 10 year old daughter. My daughter made a sign for Neville. At the end of the match Neville pointed into the crowd in our general direction so I was able to tell her that he saw her sign. She was on cloud nine. It was cool to see the Red Arrow in person even though Harper was a bit too far away and the move missed a little bit. But we marked out big for that.

She also loved the Justin Bieber chants directed at Rollins. I wonder if that'll become a thing.

Before the show they taped a couple matches for Superstars. The Ascension's intro video is really cool live.

I was amazed at how over Randy Orton was. The crowd was white hot for him. Reigns was also very over. John Cena probably got the loudest reaction just from his music hitting. Mostly positive, with some boos. But nobody was apathetic. Kind of a "whoa" moment. You understand why he's still the man. Rollins of course got a lot of heat.

It was really fun. Created some great memories. :)

 
Billy Corgan joins TNA Wrestling as senior producer

With the future of Smashing Pumpkins looking “kind of murky”, Billy Corgan appears to be carving out a new profession for himself. Putting his “deep-rooted passion for pro wrestling” and three decades in the entertainment industry to good use, the frontman has been appointed senior producer of creative and talent development for TNA Wrestling.

“Saying I’m humbled and honoured by this opportunity to be part of TNA, a world-class wrestling organisation, is an understatement and a dream come true,”Corgan said. “The entire TNA organisation stands in full support of my music life with the Smashing Pumpkins.”

Corgan’s new role includes developing characters and creating storylines, as well as “finding and developing new talent, and working eye-to-eye with the best of the best.” He added: “As cultures currently evolve at great speed, so must pro wrestling meet and supersede such expectations to thrive.”

Corgan will immediately take up his new role for the company’s flagship programme Impact Wrestling, which airs in the US on Friday nights on Destination America, as well as other TNA programming.

In an interview with Variety, the musician said he hoped to help the format progress. “There is a tremendous opportunity to go into really fresh, new directions. There are ways to explore those themes in ways that are productive, create new stars and show that value-based ‘babyfaces’, no matter what their background, no matter where they come from, can draw new audiences and inspire people in new ways.”

Corgan has long admired wrestling. He founded a wrestling league in Chicago in 2011 and in 2008 wrote the song G.L.O.W. – an acronym for Gorgeous Ladies of Wrestling and the name of a 1980s television show.

How Corgan’s new career will affect his role in Smashing Pumpkins is yet to be seen: the band are scheduled to go on a joint US tour this summer with Marilyn Manson.
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Cjw_55106 said:
RIP to one of the founding fathers. Vern Gagne dead at 89.
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As a kid in North Texas, I didn't get exposed to too much AWA. It was World Class first, NWA second and WWF third. The only thing I knew of the AWA was from PWI and other wrestling magazine.

Then one day I get this VHS tape because it had the Freebirds on the cover. Loved the Road Warriors/Sgt Slaughter & Jerry Blackwell match. Enjoyed seeing the Freebirds against Curt Henning and Greg Gagne, but as a kid could not stand watching Verne Gagne old man wrestle.

That said, that tape got me into the AWA just in time to see the Road Warriors dominate, Sgt. Slaughter be a huge face and spend hours thinking that AWA champ Rick Martel would most likely beat Hogan and push Flair to the limit in a mythical Round Robin tourney of the NWA, AWA and WWF champs.

RIP Verne. You had some special up north for quite a while.

 
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
Click to expand...
:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.
Click to expand...
We're down to 4 moves now? I thought it was 5.

It's perfectly fine not to like the guy, but this just isn't accurate. Nor is it all that important.
Click to expand...
It's a fact that Reigns has an extremely limited move set. And it is important given that it greatly limits his matches. It's the same reason why Ric Flair's matches were 100x better than Hulk Hogan's matches, particularly after you saw more than 3 Hogan matches and figured out the script.
Click to expand...
Flair was better in the ring, but who drew the most money? Who did most people find more entertaining?
Click to expand...
Hogan obviously drew more. That's not even in question. But you also know that shtick wouldn't last today (as has been woefully evident the last 4 months). The uber-man hero petered out 20+ years ago.

And the WWF's massive advantage in distribution over the NWA and WCW in the 80s/early 90s had a lot to do with Hogan's success... Hogan obviously aided that, of course, but I'd still say Hogan was more of a beneficiary of that than the cause.

 
OC Zed said:
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
Click to expand...
:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.
Click to expand...
We're down to 4 moves now? I thought it was 5.

It's perfectly fine not to like the guy, but this just isn't accurate. Nor is it all that important.
Click to expand...
It's a fact that Reigns has an extremely limited move set. And it is important given that it greatly limits his matches. It's the same reason why Ric Flair's matches were 100x better than Hulk Hogan's matches, particularly after you saw more than 3 Hogan matches and figured out the script.
Click to expand...
Flair was better in the ring, but who drew the most money? Who did most people find more entertaining?
Click to expand...
Hogan obviously drew more. That's not even in question. But you also know that shtick wouldn't last today (as has been woefully evident the last 4 months). The uber-man hero petered out 20+ years ago.

And the WWF's massive advantage in distribution over the NWA and WCW in the 80s/early 90s had a lot to do with Hogan's success... Hogan obviously aided that, of course, but I'd still say Hogan was more of a beneficiary of that than the cause.
Click to expand...
I would make the case that a lot of guys could have been Hogan, if they were booked the same way he was. I'm not sure their were many who could have been Flair.

Getting back to Reigns, my problem with him, is that he is boring as a character and in-ring. He's plenty capable, but he's just not interesting, he'd be way better as a monster heel. I thought Sheamus had the exact same problem when they were pushing him as a top face.

 
travdogg said:
OC Zed said:
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
Jeremy said:
OC Zed said:
travdogg said:
The women's match was ok, but they would benefit so much from splitting up Nikki and Brie, the best either of them has ever been was when they did that last fall. Also, I'd love a crowd that just screamed "Come on Nikki" in a sarcastic manner after every time Brie does it.
Click to expand...
:lmao:

travdogg said:
Reigns-Show was an ok match, with a garbage ending. I wish they'd retire last man standing matches. I'm still not seeing this Roman Reigns has proved himself with these last 3 PPVs talking point. 2 matches where he was carried by elite performers, and a lumbering match that was just ok with a dumb ending. Also, someone pointed it out earlier, but say what you will about Show's in-ring ability, the guy is outstanding as a talker.
Click to expand...
I agree in re Reigns... we've still only seen 4 moves out of the guy. Although I will acknowledge that last night's match was entertaining and that most wrestlers have a limited move set against Big Show. With that being said, he can't be carried by his opponent in every match or rely on weird match gimmicks.
Click to expand...
We're down to 4 moves now? I thought it was 5.

It's perfectly fine not to like the guy, but this just isn't accurate. Nor is it all that important.
Click to expand...
It's a fact that Reigns has an extremely limited move set. And it is important given that it greatly limits his matches. It's the same reason why Ric Flair's matches were 100x better than Hulk Hogan's matches, particularly after you saw more than 3 Hogan matches and figured out the script.
Click to expand...
Flair was better in the ring, but who drew the most money? Who did most people find more entertaining?
Click to expand...
Hogan obviously drew more. That's not even in question. But you also know that shtick wouldn't last today (as has been woefully evident the last 4 months). The uber-man hero petered out 20+ years ago.

And the WWF's massive advantage in distribution over the NWA and WCW in the 80s/early 90s had a lot to do with Hogan's success... Hogan obviously aided that, of course, but I'd still say Hogan was more of a beneficiary of that than the cause.
Click to expand...
I would make the case that a lot of guys could have been Hogan, if they were booked the same way he was. I'm not sure their were many who could have been Flair.

Getting back to Reigns, my problem with him, is that he is boring as a character and in-ring. He's plenty capable, but he's just not interesting, he'd be way better as a monster heel. I thought Sheamus had the exact same problem when they were pushing him as a top face.
Click to expand...
I used to believe the bolded because: (1) I'm not a Hogan fan; and (2) I've seen Vince flourish without Hogan.

With that said, I've listened to Dave Meltzer of the Wrestling Observer on enough different wrestling podcasts discussing the 80s WWF that I now believe the bolded is false and Hogan was more instrumental in the WWF flourishing in the 80s than I originally gave him credit for.

Meltzer has reported that when Vince went national in the 80s he wanted to build the WWF around one of three guys: Hogan, Flair, or Kerry Von Erich.

Meltzer said that Vince was perhaps most intrigued with Von Erich because he was younger, more built, and perhaps more popular than Hogan at that time. Vince knew that he'd likely be unsuccessful in wooing Von Erich away from his family business, though.

Meltzer then said that while Vince considered Flair, Vince was never fully enamored with Flair as the centerpiece because Flair didn't have the body and he was older than both Hogan and Von Erich.

Finally, Meltzer said that if Vince wasn't able to woo any of the above guys (including Hogan), then Vince was prepared to build around Orndorff. Vince's love of the physique again.

Now here's where I became convinced that Hogan was more instrumental for the WWF explosion than I gave him credit for. Meltzer noted that early on Vince was looking to build successors to Hogan so that Vince had another stud champion ready to go if Hogan jumped ship or business began to dip under Hogan. Vince put the title on the Macho Man in WrestleMania IV, in part, because Hogan was leaving to film No Holds Barred and, in part, because Vince wanted to build that replacement champ. Just one year later Vince put the belt back on Hogan at WrestleMania V because ticket sales and ratings dipped under Savage.

Same thing with Warrior. Vince put the belt on Warrior at WrestleMania VI. One year later Vince took the title off Warrior (via Sgt. Slaughter as intermediary champion to Hogan) because ticket sales and ratings dipped under Warrior as champion.

Same thing with Bret Hart's first title run. Just several months after Hart won the title Vince took it off him (via Yokozuna as several minute intermediary champion) before putting the title back on Hogan.

From '84 all the way into '93, whenever Vince worried about business declining he'd put the title on Hogan, and business would pick up as a result.

Listen, I don't get it either because Hogan does nothing for me, but Meltzer makes convincing arguments about Vince needing Hogan as much as Hogan needing Vince during that 80s-early 90s run.

 
King Of The Ring was a fun little show last night. BNB probably needed the "King Run" more than any of the four guys there, but in my opinion the best two things about the show were Neville's performance especially in the finals and R-Truth taking about killing all the spiders if he was made King. Can we get him on New Day please?

 
Bogart said:
King Of The Ring was a fun little show last night. BNB probably needed the "King Run" more than any of the four guys there, but in my opinion the best two things about the show were Neville's performance especially in the finals and R-Truth taking about killing all the spiders if he was made King. Can we get him on New Day please?
Click to expand...
I don't see the connection between New Day and R-Truth.

 
JB Breakfast Club said:
Bogart said:
King Of The Ring was a fun little show last night. BNB probably needed the "King Run" more than any of the four guys there, but in my opinion the best two things about the show were Neville's performance especially in the finals and R-Truth taking about killing all the spiders if he was made King. Can we get him on New Day please?
Click to expand...
I don't see the connection between New Day and R-Truth.
Click to expand...
He's black :shrug:

 
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