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2022 FBG Subscriber Contest - Contest Query Tool (1 Viewer)

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
As I said in the main thread, I want to get more people excited about the Subscriber Contest this year.

Which really means I want to make it even more fun than it already is.

One thing I want to bring back is the Contest Query tool. I'm talking with @Contest Turk on how to do that.

Let's use this thread to talk about it too.

What did you love about the Query tool?
What did you not like?
What do you wish it did more of?
How did you use it?

*****

Edit. If some sort of query tool is something you'd like to see, please "like" this post. I want to get an idea of how many people we're talking about.
 
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SeniorVBDStudent

Footballguy
I'm not one of the rabid query crowd, but I do find the tool to be a "neat feature".

If I were to say what would make me use the tool more, it would be if the tool had multi-year data and allowed for custom visualizations a la PowerBI. I'm interested in researching "structural approaches" to team design versus their "success" historically.

Now that I've gone off the deep end, I return you to your regularly scheduled query discussion.
 

Dacomish

Footballguy
@TheWinz - all your wished have come true!!!

As for me I like SVBDS above like it to look at building tendencies for future years, and in season like it later when teams get narrowed down so you can see how teams will pan out (how many had the same 5-6 players, and what are the differences between teams ect.).
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
Holy cow! Where do I begin?

What did you love about the Query tool?
- You could see the weekly survival percentages of each player, as well as combinations of players
- You could research team makeup in a variety of ways (how many chose deep rosters, how much spent at each position, how many players at each position, etc.)
- Your could see just how "unique" your team was (I'm the only submission with the combo of X, X, and X)
- I used it quite a bit for historical research (trying to find the sweet spot on numbers of players to carry at each position)
- It provided hours of fun, finding the "crazy submissions", like 14-kicker guy, or the one that made the cut with only 6 active players
- Just go back to previous years threads. Any year the querier was running from the get-go, all the cool kids were in here
- Here's an excellent post from 2019, courtesy of @ZWK :
From the ownership numbers and pricing, I calculated that the average roster has:
QB: 2.6 for $34 (last year: 2.9 for $31)
RB: 5.3 for $83 (last year: 5.4 for $86)
WR: 5.7 for $82 (last year: 6.4 for $83)
TE: 2.3 for $30 (last year: 2.5 for $30)
PK: 2.2 for $10 (last year: 2.3 for $8)
DT: 2.2 for $12 (last year: 2.3 for $11)
in total, 20.3 for $250 (last year: 21.8 for $250)
I mean, there's a ton of info there, and it was made possible by the querier.

And here is one from 2018, posted by @rustycolts
Team breakdowns
18- 4051
19- 1741
20- 1390
21- 1189
22- 1104
23- 1008
24- 895
25- 785
26- 670
27- 562
28- 470
29- 440
30- 810
Once again 18 player teams are overwhelming majority.

What did you not like? The years that the querier was not an option. Just imagine, you live in Germany and you just want to see one live NFL game before you die. As the teams take the field, you realize you have been duped - the teams left their starters in the USA. That's what the subscriber contest feels like to me without the querier. Sure, I submitted my entry, but am I going to really enjoy following along, just waiting to be eliminated?

What do you wish it did more of? Nothing that I can think of. It was wonderful when it was operational, and you can tell from the yearly threads that many people spent time playing with it.

How did you use it? How didn't I! Just make it an option for 2022 and I promise the excitement goes up by 83% (it's a Barney Stinson percentage).
 

Ignoratio Elenchi

Footballguy
Love the idea of including historical data in the querier. I used to have that on my old live scoring website but I've since misplaced all the data.
 

Genester

Footballguy
What already existed that I love: I love being able to find "all teams that have player X" that are still alive.
What I would want to have: show me the teams that have more than X of players from a list I define. For example, I pick 5 players, and have the tool show me all the teams that have at least 4 of these players.
 

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
And to be clear. I'm not promising anything on this as I truly don't know what we can do. But I want to get your thoughts on what you'd like.

Like anything we do, there has to be a work/reward ratio that makes it feasible. But the first step is hearing what you guys would want.
 

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
Also, I edited the original post. If this is something you'd like to see, please like the original post.
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
Dammit folks! Go back to post 1 of this thread and hit the like button. We won't have a contest querier if you don't. @Joe Bryant - how many likes would make your work/reward ratio feasible? Say the number and I will make it happen.
 

KingPrawn

Footballguy

Modog814

Footballguy
I'd say even better than offering the query tool (and probably easier) would be to just provide a downloadable file that has all the teams in it. :-)

IIRC you've got some pretty creative people in these contest threads that could mine that data for some interesting tidbits.
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
there's no "giving in". I'm just trying to get a sense for how many people actually care about this so we can weigh out how many $ we invest in it.
Of course I was kidding. As far as $ is concerned, you said live scoring was expensive, so I stopped asking about that. But you said nothing about the contest querier. Is it expensive too?
 

msudaisy26

Footballguy

I didn't get an @ so I am not liking ANYTHING!!!

Please don't take me seriously.
 

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
But you said nothing about the contest querier. Is it expensive too?

Nothing like the live scoring.

But virtually everything we do in programming has a cost associated with it. Weighing out the costs vs the benefit on pretty much everything is a big part of what I do.
 

Grid71

Footballguy
During the season the contest query tool is fun to mess with. Everything theWinz said and checking out some unique combos that’ll separate our roster from the rest. Mostly additional obsession continues tracking how various rosters compositions fare
 

BassNBrew

IBL Representative
But you said nothing about the contest querier. Is it expensive too?

Nothing like the live scoring.

But virtually everything we do in programming has a cost associated with it. Weighing out the costs vs the benefit on pretty much everything is a big part of what I do.

The querier was a huge part of the fun of tracking small vs. large rosters throughout the season. Helped build better teams in the future analyzing the data.

In year one Doug spit out the querier over a cup of coffee (probably exaggerating here) without any request iirc.

I'd appreciate it if you could find the time to include it. That said, I understand the other side. In fact, I made the decision to prioritize reading your content this year over working on a contest lineups until the last week.
 

Stray Doug

Footballguy
I really liked the querier for finding what my "fairly unique" combination of top players were that set my roster apart from the other thousands.

That said, what I really wanted instead of the querier was just a csv matrix of entries and players... put all the data into a file I can download into Excel or MySQL and I'll do all the querying my heart desires without the constraints of the online tool. Also I can duct tape together a personal solution for semi-live scoring with the latter... not sure if I couid make it shareable but maybe.
 

Ignoratio Elenchi

Footballguy
I agree with the other suggestions to just put all the entries in a downloadable CSV. Every year I and however many others are independently scraping your website to collect all the entries anyway. Just make them all available in a file. Then you don't have to build a querier, someone here will build something even better anyway.
 

Modog814

Footballguy
I agree with the other suggestions to just put all the entries in a downloadable CSV. Every year I and however many others are independently scraping your website to collect all the entries anyway. Just make them all available in a file. Then you don't have to build a querier, someone here will build something even better anyway.
And build it for free!
 

Puppies

Footballguy
As I said in the main thread, I want to get more people excited about the Subscriber Contest this year.

Which really means I want to make it even more fun than it already is.

One thing I want to bring back is the Contest Query tool. I'm talking with @Contest Turk on how to do that.

Let's use this thread to talk about it too.

What did you love about the Query tool?
What did you not like?
What do you wish it did more of?
How did you use it?

*****

Edit. If some sort of query tool is something you'd like to see, please "like" this post. I want to get an idea of how many people we're talking about.
I loved the querier and used it quite a bit. I made a spreasheet, and each week I recorded stats for each team size from 18 to team size 30. I tracked the number of teams eliminated in each team size, the number still alive and the percentages of each. It was interesting to see the survival rate at each team size from week to week. I did this every week and it helped me identify a trend pointing to the statistically optimum team size. It was fun to do, and it always influenced my team structure the following season. In years when my team was still alive going into the finals, it allowed me to compare my team to other teams and see who had the same players, as well as give me a feel for what my chances were to stay alive and possibly win something.
 
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dbc925

Footballguy

SeniorVBDStudent

Footballguy
I agree with the other suggestions to just put all the entries in a downloadable CSV. Every year I and however many others are independently scraping your website to collect all the entries anyway. Just make them all available in a file. Then you don't have to build a querier, someone here will build something even better anyway.
Spot on.

For bonus points, also make a CSV of auction prices available. And add a formatted for CSV tab to the vbd app so its easy to merge costs and projections. Then, make me a sandwich. :D
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
@Joe Bryant
Have you decided whether or not you will have a contest querier this year? We got lots of likes in the main post, but I honestly don't know how much money it costs you to have it. Money HAS to be the deciding factor, right?
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
@Joe Bryant
Have you decided whether or not you will have a contest querier this year? We got lots of likes in the main post, but I honestly don't know how much money it costs you to have it. Money HAS to be the deciding factor, right?
@Joe Bryant I'm confident that @TheWinz would donate half his yearly salary to this lol
I really wished that I knew the actual cost associated with live scoring and contest querier. I have a sneaking suspicion the querier is very cheap, and could probably be funded by just a few dedicated thread posters (maybe even just 1 dedicated poster).
 

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
Have you decided whether or not you will have a contest querier this year? We got lots of likes in the main post, but I honestly don't know how much money it costs you to have it. Money HAS to be the deciding factor, right?

Still working on what we can do. Thanks.
 

chocula

Footballguy
The queries was great but live scoring was the best. If I had the technical skills, I would love to build something
 

Contest Turk

Footballguy
A couple updates....

1. There will be a querier. Can't swear it'll be live before Thursday night kickoff, but soon.

2. This year we'll be releasing ALL the entry data as a set of downloadable .csv files, so anyone who wants to dig and and create their own tools can do so without having to scrape. Again, it won't be available right at lock time, but hopefully by the end of the weekend.
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
A couple updates....

1. There will be a querier. Can't swear it'll be live before Thursday night kickoff, but soon.

2. This year we'll be releasing ALL the entry data as a set of downloadable .csv files, so anyone who wants to dig and and create their own tools can do so without having to scrape. Again, it won't be available right at lock time, but hopefully by the end of the weekend.
Question from an old fart who is computer illiterate - Is there still going to be a querier like from year's past, or is it going to be this downloadable .csv file you speak of?
 

BassNBrew

IBL Representative
A couple updates....

1. There will be a querier. Can't swear it'll be live before Thursday night kickoff, but soon.

2. This year we'll be releasing ALL the entry data as a set of downloadable .csv files, so anyone who wants to dig and and create their own tools can do so without having to scrape. Again, it won't be available right at lock time, but hopefully by the end of the weekend.

A couple updates....

1. There will be a querier. Can't swear it'll be live before Thursday night kickoff, but soon.

2. This year we'll be releasing ALL the entry data as a set of downloadable .csv files, so anyone who wants to dig and and create their own tools can do so without having to scrape. Again, it won't be available right at lock time, but hopefully by the end of the weekend.
Question from an old fart who is computer illiterate - Is there still going to be a querier like from year's past, or is it going to be this downloadable .csv file you speak of?

Not trying to be a jerk, but I thought he answered your question pretty clearly. There will be a querier and there will be a csv file.
 

TheWinz

Footballguy
Not trying to be a jerk, but I thought he answered your question pretty clearly. There will be a querier and there will be a csv file.
That's why I prefaced my question by saying I am computer illiterate. I really didn't know if the querier was going to be the downloadable file, if that even makes sense. See how stupid I am?
 

BassNBrew

IBL Representative
Not trying to be a jerk, but I thought he answered your question pretty clearly. There will be a querier and there will be a csv file.
That's why I prefaced my question by saying I am computer illiterate. I really didn't know if the querier was going to be the downloadable file, if that even makes sense. See how stupid I am?

You're a Wiz and a huge asset to these boards. Appreciate all your contributions.
 

Joe Bryant

Guide
Staff member
A couple updates....

1. There will be a querier. Can't swear it'll be live before Thursday night kickoff, but soon.

2. This year we'll be releasing ALL the entry data as a set of downloadable .csv files, so anyone who wants to dig and and create their own tools can do so without having to scrape. Again, it won't be available right at lock time, but hopefully by the end of the weekend.

Thanks Buddy.

Folks asked for this and Doug was able to bring it back and get it going. Hope to have it up by the end of the weekend.

We'll likely change the name to Contest Analyzer.

Good luck everyone!
 

Stray Doug

Footballguy
Can the CSV have links to rosters and/or include the ID number so that we can construct a link at least? If it only has the entry name, we have no way to link (I believe). Want to link so that I could potentially keep CSV updated with which teams are alive/eliminated each week. I guess technically I could do that by pulling the results in from the site and then matching on name... actually, that might be less work than trying to write code to do it based on links... just a copy/paste/excel formula. Just spitballin'... but I guess having both the name and ID available in some form in the CSV is preferred so that we can do things either way.
 

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