Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Why does it have to be the "dark" ages? And what does age have to do with it anyways?
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A new dark ages in art and entertainment (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter TheIronSheik
- Start date
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
bigbottom
Footballguy
Binky The Doormat
Footballguy
I have never considered the ICP crowd's depth of thought.
That's on me.
I guess I always thought that would be a deep dive in the shallow end.
whoknew
Footballguy
@rickygervais - Please stop saying "You can't joke about anything anymore". You can. You can joke about whatever the #### you like. And some people won't like it and they will tell you they don't like it. And then it's up to you whether you give a #### or not. And so on. It's a good system.
rockaction
Footballguy
Gervais's last stand-up was all about the glee he took in deadnaming Bruce Jenner. Go ahead and do that in the political forum. All I did today was suggest separate bathrooms are good and the heat thenceforth was that I was ill, needed medication, and needed professional help for using the word "tranny."
Sorry, Gervais is right about it's up to you whether you give a #### or not, but the impulse is certainly there to shout it down, as Gervais well knows.
rockaction
Footballguy
I hadn't even heard the skit nor the targets of it. I can see why they did, but they need to settle down on both sides of the aisle. I think it was the losing eye in "World War Whatever," he said with a shrug, that got people.
My favorite comment came from the YouTube comments. Said that Davidson looked like a tranny in Orange Is The New Black.
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whoknew
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
That is indeed, all I did. And people got really mad about bathrooms and my use of the word.
eta* And, indeed, somebody axed the thread so we can't even debate it. Love when they do that.
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bigbottom
Footballguy
A good friend of mine’s daughter was an incredibly talented artist and definitely marched to the beat of her own drum. She got accepted to an art school in England and was pursuing what to her was a life’s dream. At 18 years of age, just two weeks after arriving in England, she had an aneurysm and died.
Your take above reminds me of a quotation that was shared at her funeral service:
Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive.
rockaction
Footballguy
Quint
Footballguy
msommer
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
You do realize that half of the things you listed pretty much cater to one demographic on the political spectrum, right?
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Gervais can get away with it because he's a know. Sure, he can make edgy jokes and his career is still there. What happens if an up and coming comedian makes those same jokes? Twitter explodes, they call for his head and that's the end of his career. Because we all must have the same opinions and to stray from those opinions is wrong. So wrong, you don't deserve to continue your career.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
How so? And if it’s half that means the other half speaks to the other side which seems fair.
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Yup. And when you add in Daniel Tosh, Chad Daniels (who has used the "R" word several times on stage), Chappelle, etc....there's plenty of non-PC comedy out there.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Is that the sides he means? PC vs non PC? Liberal vs Conservative is what I thought but not sure.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Oy. I read the first page of it yesterday and went, "ok, i can backup my boyee RA lilbit after havin a spat in the Human Being Forum", but i couldnt wade my way thru the next 4 pgs even for world peace. hey, i want everybody to get to be who they are and still feel love & all, but i also wanna be able to think about their precious journeys the way i WANT to think.
And here's where my point about anger comes in. Gervais and the like set themselves up for this stuff because they're making fun of what's on the tables in the temple instead of turning them over. No one's going after the puritanism that has evolved from the personal liberty movement. I don't care who ####s who where, i don't care what you got on under that or how you squat, but i STILL hate extravagantly effeminate men as much as i do steroidal rassleheads and soccer moms and want the right to savage them as much as i ever did. I want everybody to be secure in who they are sos i can can tear em a new one and see if anybody wants to #### THAT! I want everyone to be able walk a road, wide and clear, on the path to finding who they are but, the second they turn it into a parade, i'm bringin out the firehoses. If you got body art, if you do buzzcut, fancywhiskered, retroglasses or any other "i'm going to look different just like everybody else" bull####, ima have at you. Cuz its funny. nufced
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Apple Jack
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
I clutch pearls for a living, you know.Heavens to Betsy, not the bathrooms!
No, I realized something over the past day and addressed it the way I best thought appropriate. It's not worth it and there was a person who expressed concern over derogatory language and his child, another who I forgot had a family member...
So I apologized. I don't see it as anything but respect, hopefully, and hopefully I can think about the larger swath of people that populate the board. Not everyone is going to be keen on usage or origins or the like. I was unaware the term had been discarded. I am no longer so misguided.
Let's let that particular thread and topic go to bed, IMHO.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I've always kind of thought that stand-up was basically a say anything for the joke, everyone knows going in that they might get made fun of so no one should take offense type medium. So yeah, I think it's kind of silly that people are getting blasted for things they say in stand-up sometimes now but then again the ones complaining/getting blasted about it seem to be making a bunch of money so I'm not really sure it's anything more than the vocal minority having a much larger platform than they used to in the past.
Regardless, "I can't enjoy a movie because I have to conform to a pre-determined view of it" is one of the silliest schticks I've seen.
Regardless, "I can't enjoy a movie because I have to conform to a pre-determined view of it" is one of the silliest schticks I've seen.
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FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
Small-time deep cut bands have just as many fans as they ever did before. Mainstream music has just as many haters as they ever did before. Probably more, really. Plenty of haters for Taylor Swift or Kanye or any of those other garbage mainstream music, and it's not like ripping on the Beatles or the Rolling Stones 40 years ago made you cool.
I know somewhere between jack and crap about comics but the Deadpool movies were funny. So sue me. I liked them for that reason not because they were popular. There are plenty of people that didn't like it just like any other popular movie throughout history.
It's the same as it ever was. It's just easier to find someone to argue with now with the internet.
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TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Hollywood is fairly liberal. I'd be surprised if you could name me a couple TV shows or movies right now where you see politics talked about where Democrats are being made fun of. Now, keep in mind, I'm an Independent who has voted Democrat more times than anything else in Presidential election years. So I'm not a Republican.
When I was growing up, there were probably only about 4 real political comedians. If that. Now, everyone pretty much has a take on why Republicans are evil and why Democrats are great. In fact, a lot of it isn't even comedy anymore. Look at SNL. They just have Baldwin saying things he makes up that sound racist and everyone howls with laughter going, "Oh yeah. That's funny because that's Trump." But it's not funny. That's not comedy. That's the equivalent to making a fart sound with your armpit and getting laughs.
After the 2016 election, I decided I would stop watching anything that tried to talk about politics that had no reason to. Since then, I've pretty much stopped watching everything. I'm guessing most of the people who are saying, "I don't think comedy has changed" or "I don't think Hollywood is one sided" probably are democrats. So from their view, everything seems great. But that's because your views are the views that are allowed. But if anyone differs from those, they are shunned and ridiculed.
So you can say it's silly shtick, but it's true.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I do think it's funny that in the thread where I'm saying people have different opinions, I'm being told that's ridiculous. 
Kind of proves my point.
Kind of proves my point.
SWC
Bromigo
if you stopped watching everything how do you know if anything has changed of if there is anything out there you like take that to the bank bromigo
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
SWC
Bromigo
ill do me and you keep on doing get off my lawn threads i guess take that to the bank brochacho
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
mr. furley
Footballguy
all i can think of is this scene from Back to School
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiALXNKTNds
partly because of the "anger" angle that Wikkid brought up, partly because it involves Rodney Dangerfield who is old-line comedian and partly because it speaks to the "get off my lawn" nature of the line of thinking that comedy isn't funny anymore.
if comedy isn't funny anymore it's because what "it" is has changed from what "it" was when we were younger (assuming the demographic is largely the same here). my kids laugh riotously at things that i don't think are remotely funny. and they look at me cross-eyed when i tell obviously hilarious dad jokes that my dad was killing rooms with in the 70s and 80s. yes, kids are dumb, but they also change every 10 years or so.
previous generations have funneled things in the direction of "alright, enough with bullying, sexism, racism, etc. let's work on being good to each other". so now kids are more accepting, whether they actually understand the foundation of how it got here or not. that may be part of the lack of "anger" Wikkid is positing about.
i'd say comedy is born from pain, by and large. born from rejection or need for attention, from trying to defuse volatile situations, etc. Richard Pryor's entire comedy act was about pain. there wan't therapy for boys, there wasn't acceptance at school, parents didn't nurture and encourage as much even 40 years ago. if you were a weird kid that got picked on because he wore raggedy clothes and liked being in the school play, or whose dad beat the #### out of him because he was a drunk.. or whatever .. your audience for expressing hurt wasn't a counselor, a group of friends that would listen and accept you for who you were, teachers who had specialized training to deal, etc. you took your beatings like a man and shut everything down because that's what boys did.
so maybe you learned to be funny to keep the wolves at bay. or you learned to be cruel-funny to shut down the verbal attacks. or you were funny because nobody paid attention to anything you did or said unless you were cracking jokes. comedy for a long while, up until the 80s probably was vicious and angry. seething under the surface. acerbic and cutting if you paid attention.
i'm not old enough to address the Vaudeville stuff.. maybe it was mean, too
there's definitely more acceptance of what was considered "weird" or "outsider" not so long ago.. so maybe kids aren't channeling their angst and anger in to comedy as a form of expression in the same ways. it's now done in outlandish youtube videos that make no sense to 40 year olds. my kids will laugh riotously when they see a video of a kid pulling his sweatshirt up over his head, running in circles making random noises
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiALXNKTNds
partly because of the "anger" angle that Wikkid brought up, partly because it involves Rodney Dangerfield who is old-line comedian and partly because it speaks to the "get off my lawn" nature of the line of thinking that comedy isn't funny anymore.
if comedy isn't funny anymore it's because what "it" is has changed from what "it" was when we were younger (assuming the demographic is largely the same here). my kids laugh riotously at things that i don't think are remotely funny. and they look at me cross-eyed when i tell obviously hilarious dad jokes that my dad was killing rooms with in the 70s and 80s. yes, kids are dumb, but they also change every 10 years or so.
previous generations have funneled things in the direction of "alright, enough with bullying, sexism, racism, etc. let's work on being good to each other". so now kids are more accepting, whether they actually understand the foundation of how it got here or not. that may be part of the lack of "anger" Wikkid is positing about.
i'd say comedy is born from pain, by and large. born from rejection or need for attention, from trying to defuse volatile situations, etc. Richard Pryor's entire comedy act was about pain. there wan't therapy for boys, there wasn't acceptance at school, parents didn't nurture and encourage as much even 40 years ago. if you were a weird kid that got picked on because he wore raggedy clothes and liked being in the school play, or whose dad beat the #### out of him because he was a drunk.. or whatever .. your audience for expressing hurt wasn't a counselor, a group of friends that would listen and accept you for who you were, teachers who had specialized training to deal, etc. you took your beatings like a man and shut everything down because that's what boys did.
so maybe you learned to be funny to keep the wolves at bay. or you learned to be cruel-funny to shut down the verbal attacks. or you were funny because nobody paid attention to anything you did or said unless you were cracking jokes. comedy for a long while, up until the 80s probably was vicious and angry. seething under the surface. acerbic and cutting if you paid attention.
i'm not old enough to address the Vaudeville stuff.. maybe it was mean, too
there's definitely more acceptance of what was considered "weird" or "outsider" not so long ago.. so maybe kids aren't channeling their angst and anger in to comedy as a form of expression in the same ways. it's now done in outlandish youtube videos that make no sense to 40 year olds. my kids will laugh riotously when they see a video of a kid pulling his sweatshirt up over his head, running in circles making random noises
SWC
Bromigo
your just kind of a grumpy guy huh well whatever i hope you have a good afternoon and that things pick up on your end brohan and i mean that take that to the bank
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I would say the key thing here, GB, is that I'm not saying things aren't funny now. Or that people don't find things funny. What I'm saying is we've narrowed down what can be funny. We're only allowed to say certain things. Now, to a lot of comedians credit, they are able to be very funny in that narrowed scope. This isn't about me being old and others being young. Young comedians who are coming up can't say the things that their idols before them did. And if they do, their careers are over. Thus, weeding them out and only allowing a certain type through to advance.all i can think of is this scene from Back to School
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiALXNKTNds
partly because of the "anger" angle that Wikkid brought up, partly because it involves Rodney Dangerfield who is old-line comedian and partly because it speaks to the "get off my lawn" nature of the line of thinking that comedy isn't funny anymore.
if comedy isn't funny anymore it's because what "it" is has changed from what "it" was when we were younger (assuming the demographic is largely the same here). my kids laugh riotously at things that i don't think are remotely funny. and they look at me cross-eyed when i tell obviously hilarious dad jokes that my dad was killing rooms with in the 70s and 80s. yes, kids are dumb, but they also change every 10 years or so.
previous generations have funneled things in the direction of "alright, enough with bullying, sexism, racism, etc. let's work on being good to each other". so now kids are more accepting, whether they actually understand the foundation of how it got here or not. that may be part of the lack of "anger" Wikkid is positing about.
i'd say comedy is born from pain, by and large. born from rejection or need for attention, from trying to defuse volatile situations, etc. Richard Pryor's entire comedy act was about pain. there wan't therapy for boys, there wasn't acceptance at school, parents didn't nurture and encourage as much even 40 years ago. if you were a weird kid that got picked on because he wore raggedy clothes and liked being in the school play, or whose dad beat the #### out of him because he was a drunk.. or whatever .. your audience for expressing hurt wasn't a counselor, a group of friends that would listen and accept you for who you were, teachers who had specialized training to deal, etc. you took your beatings like a man and shut everything down because that's what boys did.
so maybe you learned to be funny to keep the wolves at bay. or you learned to be cruel-funny to shut down the verbal attacks. or you were funny because nobody paid attention to anything you did or said unless you were cracking jokes. comedy for a long while, up until the 80s probably was vicious and angry. seething under the surface. acerbic and cutting if you paid attention.
i'm not old enough to address the Vaudeville stuff.. maybe it was mean, too
there's definitely more acceptance of what was considered "weird" or "outsider" not so long ago.. so maybe kids aren't channeling their angst and anger in to comedy as a form of expression in the same ways. it's now done in outlandish youtube videos that make no sense to 40 year olds. my kids will laugh riotously when they see a video of a kid pulling his sweatshirt up over his head, running in circles making random noises
We all know what funny is. We all know what makes us laugh. The fact that we have to censor ourselves from making jokes because it might offend a small group of people is not good for the art. Comedy isn't painting. It's not sculpting. The whole basis of comedy is pushing the lines, stepping over the lines and sometimes crossing multiple lines. That's the humor. We need to laugh at ourselves. We need to not be so uptight that we are offended by jokes. But this isn't allowed anymore.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
mr. furley
Footballguy
yeah, and i think at least part of the reason for that is America decided we'd gone too far with the racism, sexism, violence against others, etc. so now everyone is less quick to attack "others". at least for now.
nothing was off limits in the 80s. you could almost say anything. culture has changed. like a pendulum, what's acceptable shifts back and forth.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Exactly. And that's my point. I said right now the pendulum has swung all the way to the other far side. I think we'll eventually get back to understanding that comedy is meant to poke fun and can seem a little mean, when really it's just a mirror on ourselves. My whole argument was just that we've entered a dark ages, of sorts, for comedy. And I would say you agree since you're saying the same thing about the pendulum swinging.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
I don't really think you're wrong; "outrage culture" has been amplified by social media and the like. There is a very vocal minority of people who dominate the "outrage Twitterverse", for example. Chappelle's Show was revolutionary less than 20 years ago, and I struggle to see how it would fly on TV today.
For me personally, I've got no problem with dark or offensive humor; I actually quite like it. To me, there is a clear delineation between humor, or at least attempted humor, and <insert word>-ism. Some people don't see it that way, though.
I certainly know far less about comedy/film/TV than you do...just my two cents.
For me personally, I've got no problem with dark or offensive humor; I actually quite like it. To me, there is a clear delineation between humor, or at least attempted humor, and <insert word>-ism. Some people don't see it that way, though.
I certainly know far less about comedy/film/TV than you do...just my two cents.
Don Quixote
Footballguy
I don't think it is a career-killer (but definitely career-limiting). There are more avenues to put comedy out there than ever before now. Shane Gillis, for example, still has his podcast. While he won't get the exposure that he would have gotten on SNL, if his podcast is funny, word about it will spread and people will listen to it, and maybe he can get a breakthrough on his own terms.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
My wife and I talk about this all the time. It is literally eating itself alive. People want to be so offended that they are turning on their own. We watch Vanderpump Rules and everyone on that show is incredibly LGBT friendly. They celebrate the Gay Pride parade every season. This past season they had a transgender girl on and as soon as she got mad at the other staff members, she accused them all of being intolerant of the trans culture. My wife and I laughed so hard because they must have finally known what it was like for everyone else who has been falsely accused of being racist or intolerant of a culture. It's like the go to thing.
I do believe that will be what pushes us back towards the middle again. When the people who have spent years accusing others of being intolerant finally get accused themselves. That's when people will finally start to push back.
The General
Footballguy
I’d suggest not watching Vanderpump.
Netflix has hundreds of comedy specials, we have smart political satire everywhere, a bunch of good comedies on HBO, Comedy Channel, etc. 100’s of podcasts.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
In fact, now that I think about it, I might start finding the most PC people and just start accusing them of being intolerant to Muslims and Arabs. As soon as they say something I don't agree with, I'll just pull out the Race/Religion card. I'm going to try to personally single handily speed this whole pendulum swing up.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Sure. This is exactly what I'd expect to hear from someone who hates Muslims. Take your hate elsewhere, racist.
The General
Footballguy
You see now I just ignore this like people should do when something absurd is said.
What shortage of comedy and arts are you missing out on right now? Chapelle is cranking out hour comedy specials about this every couple months it seems, getting less and less funny in the process.
His last one was pretty damn good. Much better than the previous couple before that.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
From what I can tell the monoculture represents about 20% of the population and from that 80% of the tweets come from 10% of the users. I don’t think the “monoculture” is really representative, just loud.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
The General
Footballguy
Pretty meh I thought. Michael Jackson and Bill Cosby hole? Had some funny stuff I guess, even his C game is pretty good.
There is good comedy everywhere, more accessible than ever. There’s also PC bull#### everywhere but you get to pick what you want to listen to.
