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Brandon Marshall should get paid! (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter t8knovr
- Start date
ninerfanatic492000
Footballguy
i don't see alot of money and this guy mixing very well
Maven
Footballguy
Broncos want it both ways. They don't wanna pay him but then don't want to trade him?????? He's a young stud. Reward him. It makes no sense. Stop jerkin him. They want to see if he'll behave... thats the dumbest excuse. He obviously has a REASON to behave, but whats to stop him from flipping on the Broncos after he signs his new contract a year from now?
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King of the Jungle
Footballguy
Couldn't they just put a "dumb-###" clause in the contract? If he acts a fool, he takes a pay reduction. If he stays clean off the field he earns his keep. Makes too much sense.
Holy Schneikes
Footballguy
He's under contract.
He's got health issues.
He's got attitude/off the field issues.
Those are three pretty good reasons NOT to pay him the kind of money he is looking for. One or two of them you could maybe overlook, but I think Denver would be dumb to sign him right now. Call his bluff. You aren't going to the Superbowl this year anyway.
He's got health issues.
He's got attitude/off the field issues.
Those are three pretty good reasons NOT to pay him the kind of money he is looking for. One or two of them you could maybe overlook, but I think Denver would be dumb to sign him right now. Call his bluff. You aren't going to the Superbowl this year anyway.
I think the same about Marshall not being happy with the QB, but in the McDaniel's offense any QB would work. The system is one that gets the ball out of the QB's hand quick, so less time to make mistakes. He would have his catches and YAC would be of the chart because of the tackles he would have a chance to break.
Avery
Footballguy
He's a great player when his mind is right and he's on the field but the Broncos have a lot of reasons to question how often that will be.
I've questioned a lot of what this new regime in Denver has done, but rolling the dice that he will walk after his contract to see what kind of player he is going forward seems to be the smart move. Its a risk he will walk and they will get no compensation but it's less of a risk then signing him for big money and watching him implode after he cashes his signing bonus or trading him away when his trade value is relatively low.
I've questioned a lot of what this new regime in Denver has done, but rolling the dice that he will walk after his contract to see what kind of player he is going forward seems to be the smart move. Its a risk he will walk and they will get no compensation but it's less of a risk then signing him for big money and watching him implode after he cashes his signing bonus or trading him away when his trade value is relatively low.
trader jake
Footballguy
It must be getting close to the regular season when the Shark Pool starts filling up with chum like this.I might like to see this theory about the McDaniels offense tested a bit more before I buy this idea that "any QB would work" in it. I'd also like to see "work" defined with a bit more rigor. Imo Brandon Marshall is more proven than McDaniels is. If McDaniels is telling Marshall he hasn't proven himself yet, Marshall's probably thinking, pot meet kettle.
I agree with this.
Surely there is some kind of compromise available to the interested parties? Even if it's just some explanation of expectations and contract parameters should he live up to them. Maybe this has happened and it wasn't enough to make Marshall happy, I don't know.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Its probably the signing bonus that they are concerned about.
RBM
Footballguy
Delusions Of Adequacy
Footballguy
There is no passing offense where 'any qb would work'.The statement makes me wonder about your nfl knowledge.
SSOG
Moderator
I've heard rumors that Bowlen is pretty cash-strapped (he's actually one of the "poorest" owners in the NFL, or at least one of the owners with the smallest cashflow. For most owners, the NFL team is just one part of their diverse holdings, but Bowlen has no other business but the Broncos). On the other hand, he's also the sort of owner who has always done what it takes (which is why the Broncos got in trouble for cap violations in the late '90s- Bowlen didn't have the cash to honor his commitments, so he was making deferred payments).I suspect the Broncos would have a bit more money to throw Marshall's way if they hadn't spent $20 million guaranteed on RBs this offseason.
We don't even know if the McDaniels' offense works, let alone if any QB can work in it.
Mind you that I am not saying any QB from off the street. However, any NFL QB that has the ability to manage reads, coverages and blitz packages. To qualify the statement it was meant that you do not have to have the golden arm to be successful in the system.
BigJim®
Footballguy
I would think operating under the existing contract is an option here. He's not entitled to a raise, and he's not entiteld to a trade. If I'm the Denver front office, there's no way I give this guy money until I know he can stay out of trouble. He's jeopardized his own position in that regard.
Brady's 4800 yards and 50 touchdowns under McDaniel does not equal success?
Mark Wimer
Moderator
Also, as various other player incidents have shown (let's not get bogged down talking about the obvious "problem" players of recent years) an owner is investing in the player more than just $ for performance on the field, he's also investing trust that the player in question will be on the field to perform. I have no qualms about Marshall's performance on the field, but he's done a lot to erode the trust quotient up in Denver. "Slipping on a McDonald's wrapper" and seriously injuring one of his arms. Repeated clashes with the law. Serious attitude problem towards the new coaches - the guy has a problem with authority, IMO. And I have no doubt he and his agent are demanding a lot of guaranteed money, upfront.What sane owner is going to give him a lot of guaranteed money after his off-field behavior? He's the NFL equivalent of the fictional Nuke LaLouche from Bull Durham - $Millions of talent in his body but demonstrably a ".10 head". The one affects the other's earning power.
SSOG
Moderator
No, a QB doesn't need a golden arm, but he does need a golden head.
We know that if you pair arguably the best QB in the league with the most talented WR in the league, an unbelievable pass-blocking offensive line, the best slot WR in the league, and a coach willing to run up the score then the offense can be successful. Of course, under those circumstances I'd argue that the overwhelming majority of offenses would be successful. Let's see how McDaniels' offense does without Brady, Moss, Welker, and Belichick before we start talking about it as a proven system.Most importantly, let's wait until the sample size is greater than two before talking about how "any QB can succeed in McDaniels' offense". Especially since one of those two is a hall of famer who could succeed in any system, and the other of the two is a guy who had many years on the bench to learn the system, and who has a 16-game sample right now (remember, even Tommy Maddox looked pretty good in a 16-game sample).
Not a great example. Nuke's head didn't affect his earning power in the slightest- he was still a high draft pick making big bucks while he played in the minors "working on that $.10 head of his" (in actuality, he was working on his control more than anything).
Rovers
Footballguy
Holy Schneikes said:
White has none of these issues. Marshall (and I was one of the Marshall nut huggers when he came out in the draft) is simply too risky a proposition at this time, especially with the cash strapped Broncs. They also have Royal, who might even be better than Marshall.Given the state of affairs, I do however think trading him would be the best move. Then they can trade the next guy that they antagonize, and the next guy.... this franchise is a PR nightmare. Now they are apologozing for public statements made by a "junior" PR employee regarding comments about Marshall's recent aquital in court. I think they have screwed this up to fubar status, just like the Cutler situation.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
You mean he cheats.psIf Marshall wasn't getting paid they wouldn't allow him on the field.He's actually already under a contract he signed, and when this one expires I'm sure his agent will negotiate him another one.You believe in honoring your agreements like an adult, right?SSOG said:
Rovers
Footballguy
Holy schnikes! Where to start.... NFL teams do not have to honor contracts, they are not guaranteed..... thus, the large signing bonuses. Marshall, like White, has outperformed his rookie contract. The NFL is, and will remain a biz for profit, and given that fact, players also look out for their own financial security the same way NFL teams do. It's all very cut throat, and since the teams live by the sword means so will the players.By the way.... adults are not, or at least should not be so nieve. The NFL and it's teams are all about making money.... and by default, so now too are the players. It's a business.
Couch Potato
Footballguy
Marshall should take a pay cut.
doubletrouble
Footballguy
Get in camp, shut your mouth and out play your contract..
ish you make more than 60% of the population in the US now and only work 5 months out of the year...
and STOP SLAPPING WOMEN!
ish you make more than 60% of the population in the US now and only work 5 months out of the year...
and STOP SLAPPING WOMEN!
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
You really never heard of guaranteed money in the NFL?Anyway, it actually does exist, and if they write that into your contract they can't just decide to stop payment, like so many players like to stop production on their end of the deal.
As for the portion that's not guaranteed, the players have agreed with the league under the terms of their CBA that the teams can tear that #### up any time they want.
I hear a lot about these guys 'outperforming their contracts' and the easiest way to solve this is if everybody simply got paid for play on one year deals that got reviewed on an annual basis.
Maybe you should suggest that to NFLPA --- I understand they're in the process of hammering out a new agreement.
Bottom line is that maybe if Marshall could conduct himself like a responsible 20+ yr old adult, instead of a problem child 12 yr old who still needed a babysitter, he might be getting a new deal right now.
As you mentioned, it's a business, and I hope you aren't naive enough to think somebody should trust this guy with the kind of signing bonus, and/or guaranteed money some other star players have gotten --- it's always easy to spend somebody else's money.
edit:
It wasn't until after I had posted that I realized where you had confused yourself drawing that equivalence between players and owners.
The way it works in the NFL, all guaranteed monies and bonuses aside, is that a player signs his rights over to a given team for a set period, or until such time as the club opts out of the deal, per the CBA, just as ownership has collectively opted out of the CBA itself.
The team agrees that while the player plays for them, they will pay him some agreed upon salary.
For the team to renege on this deal, they would actually have to fail to pay the guy after he played, which doesn't happen as often as you seem to think.
Rather, it's the players who continually take up front signing bonuses, which are based on the entire deal, then fail to honor part of that agreement.
When the team tears up those deals, it's simply surrendering the rights to said player, freeing him up to take part in the free agent market --- again, as set forth in the CBA, which is the agreement the players entered into with ownership.
Hope that clears things up for you.
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SproutDaddy
Footballguy
I would really like to hear the reasoning behind this comment......due to the fact of the lack of logic it embodies.
Couch Potato
Footballguy
Mostly he annoys me.He's a whiner. He's a tool. He can't be counted on by his team because he's in off field trouble every year and his next screw up will get him a bigger suspension. He's a headache and a head case, and his team won't extend his contract because they know they can't trust him.On the field, they won't go to him nearly as often in this offense as they did in Shanny's offense with Cutler. Not nearly. Plus he's injured with a hammy, and with a hip before that. Maybe he can't perform this year the way he should. He has been pouting on the sidelines of practice rather than getting his work in, the immature baby that he is. Maybe he's been so preoccupied with being dissed that he's not been in great shape to play this year.But mostly, he annoys me. And I wasn't all that serious about a pay cut. But I own him in ZERO leagues and have no desire to.
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I am pretty sure if someone offered the same deal Dallas did for Roy Williams Denver would probably move him, but no one is offering the Broncos the value that he commands in the trade market.
Everyone says Denver should just trade him, but they are not going to give him away.
Everyone says Denver should just trade him, but they are not going to give him away.
Fear & Loathing
Footballguy
His rap sheet is ridiculously long, and he can't be counted on for tomorrow much less into the future.
He has an attitude problem.
He has an injured hip a year after an injured arm -- which he lied about.
He drops too many passes and doesn't get into the end zone enough.
He's under contract.
Nobody wants to trade for him because they know all of the above + he wants to break the bank.
Any GM who gives this guy long-term security deserves to be canned.
He has an attitude problem.
He has an injured hip a year after an injured arm -- which he lied about.
He drops too many passes and doesn't get into the end zone enough.
He's under contract.
Nobody wants to trade for him because they know all of the above + he wants to break the bank.
Any GM who gives this guy long-term security deserves to be canned.
Fear & Loathing
Footballguy
It's that easy, is it? Nobody wants to give anything of real value for him because of his baggage and contract demands. He simply doesn't have much trade value. The Broncos are better off letting him play out the season.
moleculo
Footballguy
So Per the Denver Post, Marshall has 1 year left for $2.2 mil. Seeing has how he was originally a 4th round pick, I really doubt that he is on his rookie contract.. Does anybody know when his last deal was done?
At the end of this contract, he will be an unrestricted free agent, right? So if he walks after this season, and goes on to great things at his next stop, the Broncos should get a compensatory 3rd rounder. That would set the absolute floor for his trade value. Given his behavioral issues, injuries and the fact that he is demanding a fat contract, I really don't see anyone ponying up more than a third.
At the end of this contract, he will be an unrestricted free agent, right? So if he walks after this season, and goes on to great things at his next stop, the Broncos should get a compensatory 3rd rounder. That would set the absolute floor for his trade value. Given his behavioral issues, injuries and the fact that he is demanding a fat contract, I really don't see anyone ponying up more than a third.
The problem with that is that they tie up cap money. So he does something dumb (which is very likely given his history) and they don't have to pay himthe extra money. That puts them behind the eight ball because they have not been able to go out and get a player that might help them because beforeMarshall messed up, they had no cap room.The Boncos are not going to commit a large amount of money to Marshall because of his history of legal problems. If they don't want to pay him, hebecomes a free agent. Then we'll see if any other teams wants to commit a large sum of cap money to someone who, with one more brush with thelaw, is probably suspended for a good portion, if not the whole season.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
I'm no authority on the subject, but I thought he was still on his rookie deal, and I doubt that's 2.2m salary this year.link, plz.Maybe the whole deal was 2m.If the league is uncapped next year he becomes an rfa.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
psWhy do people always use that 'makes too much sense' expression?If it made sense, they would do it.
money.never.sleeps
Footballguy
Holy Schneikes said:
As much as I like this guys ability and production, I have to agree with the bolded part. Denver will pay him more than enough if he can produce like he has the last 2 years.. healthy & out of trouble would be key also.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
and if he tears his ACL, you will be first person to call him an idiot for not getting a new contract.
moleculo
Footballguy
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Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
oh ho.......
The root of “The Beast’s” beef with the Broncos is his $2.2 million salary, however. The four-year rookie deal that paid him $1.5 million over his first three pro years automatically increased to $2.2 million for this season after Brandon’s Pro Bowl appearance after last season
http://www.examiner.com/x-7651-Denver-Page...learing-the-Air
The root of “The Beast’s” beef with the Broncos is his $2.2 million salary, however. The four-year rookie deal that paid him $1.5 million over his first three pro years automatically increased to $2.2 million for this season after Brandon’s Pro Bowl appearance after last season
http://www.examiner.com/x-7651-Denver-Page...learing-the-Air
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
...and if Bowlen dumps a fat signing bonus on him and the hip gives out, he gets suspended for a year, jailed, runs a dog fighting ring, or whatever, you'd be the first to call Bowlen an idiot.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
Seriously, most players have short careers I don't blame Marshall for trying to get paid knowing that next year he could be a restricted free agent if the year is uncapped. By most accounts, the uncapped year benefits the owners so it is likely a reality. Most players in his situation already have new contracts - Greg Jennings, Roddy White. Marshall should hold out indefinitely IMO. Bowlen is already an idiot in my book since he hired the two jokers, McDaniel and Xander.
kremenull
Footballguy
On-field production isn't the only reason guys get big contracts. From an owner's perspective, he would be a very risky investment. I feel the same way about him in my dynasty leagues, wouldn't touch him.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
The package for Roy Williams is an outlier that will not be duplicated any time soon. No top WRs looking for a change of scenery will be traded until teams realize that and set their demands lower.
