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Cleveland Browns (7 Viewers)
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thecardiackid
Footballguy
The Man With No Name
Footballguy
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Jeremy Fowler @JFowlerESPN · 43m 43 minutes ago
# Browns offensive coaches meeting today. Wouldn't be surprised to see QB decision made sooner than later.
# Browns offensive coaches meeting today. Wouldn't be surprised to see QB decision made sooner than later.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
@CoachBillick 2m2 minutes ago
If the #Browns don't start Manziel now, then when? May not be any better with him but certainly can't be any worse:
If the #Browns don't start Manziel now, then when? May not be any better with him but certainly can't be any worse:
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Think it's basically a forced decision now. I'd be flabbergasted if they didnt make the switch.
Our fan base has completely turned on Hoyer (as a starter) and they just cant have that. Combine that with negative record setting stats, and, well....
It's Manziel time.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Writing is on the wall. Media isn't piling on, they had their own takes at the exact same time as have most fans, just different forms of evidence on the inevitable shoe drop to Manziel time.
I grabbed a handful of tweets last night.
People are pretty smart so they find arguments for some of the mistakes but no one is even bothering at this point.
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PatMcManamon @PatMcManamon · 9h 9 hours ago
Since 2005), 29 teams have forced at least 3 turnovers, w one fumble return and one INT return for TD. Went 28-1 in those games.#Browns
Steve Doerschuk @sdoerschukREP · 6h 6 hours ago
Getting harder to see the light. B. Hoyer's passer ratings in his last eight games: 46.3, 115.5, 85.4, 92.3, 61.2, 52.3, 51.0 … 31.7 today.
Steve Doerschuk @sdoerschukREP · Dec 5
Luck's passer ratings on road: 83.1, 140.4, 97.7, 91.0, 108.4. … Hoyer at home: 81.7, 127.7, 113.0, 111.5, 85.4, 61.2 (J.J. Watt game).
Tom Reed@treed1919 HYPERLINK "/treed1919/status/541797811231002624"1h1 hour ago So updated number by my account: 21 TOs forced by #Browns D in last 8 games. Offense has scored 3 TDs off them, the defense 2 TDs off them.
I grabbed a handful of tweets last night.
People are pretty smart so they find arguments for some of the mistakes but no one is even bothering at this point.
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PatMcManamon @PatMcManamon · 9h 9 hours ago
Since 2005), 29 teams have forced at least 3 turnovers, w one fumble return and one INT return for TD. Went 28-1 in those games.
Steve Doerschuk @sdoerschukREP · 6h 6 hours ago
Getting harder to see the light. B. Hoyer's passer ratings in his last eight games: 46.3, 115.5, 85.4, 92.3, 61.2, 52.3, 51.0 … 31.7 today.
Steve Doerschuk @sdoerschukREP · Dec 5
Luck's passer ratings on road: 83.1, 140.4, 97.7, 91.0, 108.4. … Hoyer at home: 81.7, 127.7, 113.0, 111.5, 85.4, 61.2 (J.J. Watt game).
Tom Reed
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Dizzy
Footballguy
Agreed. A decision to go with Hoyer in week 15 says a lot more about Manziel than it does about Hoyer IMO... the book is closed on the latter... but maybe the former is just flat out not ready (in the coach's eyes)?
jurb26
Footballguy
It would say a lot about JF if he didn't start. I'm of the belief you start the guy who you think gives you the best chance to win. I no longer think that can be said about Hoyer. I don't know if it can be said about JF but it's time to see IMO.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
and how sad is it that "not ready" will in all likelihood still be better than our current starter?
Dizzy
Footballguy
Yeah, that's a bummer. They would probably rather see Hoyer go down in flames though than put an unprepared Manziel on he field to get killed by defenses, media, Shark Pool, etc.
Have there been any local "oohs and ah's" from Browns practices with respect to Manziel? Anything to support that he should absolutely be given his shot this week?
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Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
The old Family Circus Cartoon of 'It wasn't me' statement from Brian Hoyer.
Two minutes ago according to Daryl Ruiter.
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Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 2m 2 minutes ago
Primary takeaway from media avail with Brian Hoyer - he said that needs someone to make a play on offense
http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/thefw.com/files/2012/01/Family-Circus-Not-Me.jpg
Two minutes ago according to Daryl Ruiter.
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Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 2m 2 minutes ago
Primary takeaway from media avail with Brian Hoyer - he said that needs someone to make a play on offense
http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/thefw.com/files/2012/01/Family-Circus-Not-Me.jpg
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Dizzy
Footballguy
Soulfly3
Footballguy
This is what is pissing meoff most about Hoyer... and I was a fan and supporter of his.
He has thrown everyone under the bus, except himself.
Not a leader. Get him the EFF off the field.
No way the team supports him after all the comments yesterday/today
The Man With No Name
Footballguy
Higher career completion percentage than Brian Hoyer-
Tim Couch
Ty Detmer
Kelly Holcomb
Charlie Frye
Hoyer was undrafted for reasons
Tim Couch
Ty Detmer
Kelly Holcomb
Charlie Frye
Hoyer was undrafted for reasons
MAC_32
Footballguy
I really don't think it's the last thing you mentioned. Usually with these types it is, but watching him week I don't think it is in this case. He's just not seeing the field. At all. His good, quick decision making was what made him successful early on. He read the field well pre and post snap then make the appropriate decision. Now? It's gone, as is his confidence.jurb26 said:
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Watching Hoyer dig his own grave.
Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 18m18 minutes ago
"When you're not being perfect you need 1 guy to step up and make a big play and we didn't have that yesterday" - Hoyer
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Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 19m19 minutes ago
"When 10 guys do their job right & 1 doesn't it can really affect the play...everybody's gotta be able to step up" - Hoyer
Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 28m28 minutes ago
"I don't think I'm playing any differently (than earlier this year); I don't have a different mindset" - Hoyer
Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 18m18 minutes ago"When you're not being perfect you need 1 guy to step up and make a big play and we didn't have that yesterday" - Hoyer
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Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 19m19 minutes ago"When 10 guys do their job right & 1 doesn't it can really affect the play...everybody's gotta be able to step up" - Hoyer
Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 28m28 minutes ago"I don't think I'm playing any differently (than earlier this year); I don't have a different mindset" - Hoyer
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jurb26
Footballguy
Maybe, but implosion on his part is equally bad... Maybe worse.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Oh, absolutely. He played at his best with his back against the wall early on, but after a few failures he's fallen off a cliff. Can't have that from a QB. It's almost like he's given up on those around him and rather than trusting what he sees working with a short memory he's making up his mind pre snap and just going with it hoping for the best.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Listen, we can all piss and moan about Manziel's "work ethic" or "studying habits"
But from every single account, from every single coach/teammate, no one ever gives more on the field than Manziel.
Hoyer plays like a defeated man. I doubt that no matter the state of the game, Manziel would roll like that. He just seems like he refuses to lose. that cocky swagger that makes him never want to lose
That's always been the one thing I held on to since we drafted him - the guy lives to win.
But from every single account, from every single coach/teammate, no one ever gives more on the field than Manziel.
Hoyer plays like a defeated man. I doubt that no matter the state of the game, Manziel would roll like that. He just seems like he refuses to lose. that cocky swagger that makes him never want to lose
That's always been the one thing I held on to since we drafted him - the guy lives to win.
jurb26
Footballguy
The bunker mentality he has created is rather bizarre I must say.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
After a loss like yesterday people were understandably angry and when the switch is made from Hoyer to Manziel people will want to bury Hoyer and prop up Manziel but Johnny's go a lotta work to do.
Kid has issues both on and off the field and even if he provides an instant boost we aren't making the playoffs. When we make the switch forgetabout Hoyer because at that point the story is Manziel.
The only stories we heard on Brian Hoyer were bland fluff pieces about how Brian picked up pizza on the way home to his wife and kids. Stories about Manziel will be anything other than the bland banal variety but who cares?
The real football stories will focus on his strengths and weakness on the field. If his strengths can over ride his weakness he has on and off the field then no problem but if he has one weak link then that can break the chain so he is going to have to put in the hard work to shore up his football weakness' and that might mean he will have to adjust his off-field activities.
The story that everyone is anticipating doesn't end when the switch is made, it only begins. So basically don't think the story is Brian Hoyer BAD Johnny Manziel GOOD and start chest puffing that since we got rid of Hoyer everything will be fun times and easy sailing with Johnny. Kid has a lot of work to do on his game.
Kid has issues both on and off the field and even if he provides an instant boost we aren't making the playoffs. When we make the switch forgetabout Hoyer because at that point the story is Manziel.
The only stories we heard on Brian Hoyer were bland fluff pieces about how Brian picked up pizza on the way home to his wife and kids. Stories about Manziel will be anything other than the bland banal variety but who cares?
The real football stories will focus on his strengths and weakness on the field. If his strengths can over ride his weakness he has on and off the field then no problem but if he has one weak link then that can break the chain so he is going to have to put in the hard work to shore up his football weakness' and that might mean he will have to adjust his off-field activities.
The story that everyone is anticipating doesn't end when the switch is made, it only begins. So basically don't think the story is Brian Hoyer BAD Johnny Manziel GOOD and start chest puffing that since we got rid of Hoyer everything will be fun times and easy sailing with Johnny. Kid has a lot of work to do on his game.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
He did and I think Pettine was hoping he'd show that again yesterday but he didn't.
We saw Brian mount incredible comebacks this year, first game Pittsburgh nearly pulled off a miracle, against the Saints he did, then made history with the incredible comeback in Tennessee, did it again against the Falcons. But the numbers have been dropping steadily and I don't want to speculate on why but their have been injuries that effected the running game that we all saw and we've all seen TE Jordan Cameron go down and Josh struggle where it was soo obvious that Gordon even admitted he has screwed up so I don't have any problems with Pettine sticking with Hoyer hoping for more comeback miracle magic and hoping the chemistry develops with Josh while Cameron comes back. But hey... at some point you can justify any mistake and he does need people to step-up yadda yadda yadda. Call it bad luck karma, or whatever.
Its time to make the switch and when we do then we need to give Johnny enough room to find himself and give him enough time to screw up and not kill him when he does screw up because he will. The anti-Johnny guys are going to have to back off at that point just like the anti-Hoyer guys should do that now.
MAC_32
Footballguy
I hoped for, expected it, too. It's why I was behind sticking with him for another week. He's shown it before, now go do it again.
I was very tempted to pile on like so many others about not putting in Johnny during the game, but with a clearer head this morning I reminded myself that in an earlier game this year protecting a lead (Oakland?) Pettine stayed away from Crow and leaned on Tate because he felt relying on the vet for ball control was the correct route. Crow's more talented and needed reps, but the game situation called for the more reliable vet. He approached yesterday's second half the same way. 14 point lead and my QB is playing like ####, but do I dare play with fire and go to the likely error prone kid? or hope the clock hits 0 before the Colts can come back?
That decision may have cost us the game, but in the big picture it provided closure on the Brian Hoyer chapter of this franchise. An in-game switch probably wouldn't have. It sucks, but I get it.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Don't take what someone in the media tweets as gospel. The media only tweets what they want to and the leave out a whole hell of a lot.
Kicker WILL BE discussed in tonight's meeting.
Also Pettine is only the head coach, he's not the GM so he doesn't make personnel decisions, that's Farmer's job. Pettine can only comment on what he knows and he told the truth. At the time he was asked about the kicker, the kicker position hadn't been discussed but it is on the table for discussion in tonight's meeting with Farmer.
Farmer brought in two kickers to work out last week so it obviously was talked about last week so he was probably only replying to whether or not the kicker had been brought up this week but he meets with Farmer on Monday night so no, it hadn't. No big deal.
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Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN · 40m 40 minutes ago
Pettine politely says there will be a discussion about the kicker position in meeting later tonight with GM Ray Farmer among other topics
nxmehta
Footballguy
Ok. So I guess I'll wait to freak out until Cundiff is out there shanking kicks on Sunday.
Which is what I told myself last week... I guess let's hope they realize that this is the week to make a change?
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jurb26
Footballguy
Bobcat10
Footballguy
He talked about familiarity with the opponent, players and coaches. Could mean nothing.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
IF this is true, was I wrong about firing pettine?
It cant be. I cannot fathom it whatsoever. He cant
The Man With No Name
Footballguy
Watching Julio Jones have yet another great game tonight got me looking back at the 2011 trade that really was terrible. Those bosses aren't around anymore, thank God.
Gave pick #6 to Atlanta who drafted Julio Jones.
Got picks 27, 59, 124 and Atlanta's 1st and 4th round picks in 2012. Those picks turned out to be:
#27 (Jimmy Smith) - traded to move up to #21 where Phil Taylor was taken.
#59 Greg Little
#124 Owen Morecic
2012 1st Brandon Weeden
2012 4th James Michael Johnson
And some other players that were taken after Julio Jones that we could have traded back not as far for: pick 7 Aldon Smith, pick 9 Tyron Smith, pick 11 J.J. Watt, pick 16 Robert Quinn. Any of those guys would have been way better than the accumulation of junk we got instead.
Gave pick #6 to Atlanta who drafted Julio Jones.
Got picks 27, 59, 124 and Atlanta's 1st and 4th round picks in 2012. Those picks turned out to be:
#27 (Jimmy Smith) - traded to move up to #21 where Phil Taylor was taken.
#59 Greg Little
#124 Owen Morecic
2012 1st Brandon Weeden
2012 4th James Michael Johnson
And some other players that were taken after Julio Jones that we could have traded back not as far for: pick 7 Aldon Smith, pick 9 Tyron Smith, pick 11 J.J. Watt, pick 16 Robert Quinn. Any of those guys would have been way better than the accumulation of junk we got instead.
Mr. Retukes
Footballguy
The trade wouldn't have been so bad if they hadn't wasted a 1st-round pick on a 28-year-old quarterback...
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Browns Offensive Coordinator Kyle Shanahan has had to get two rookie QBs ready for their very first NFL game, RG III and Kirk Cousins.
This is what they did in their first game under OC Kyle Shanahan:
- RG III - 19 of 26 for 320 yards with 2 TD and 9 rush attempts for 42 yards
- Kirk Cousins - 26 of 37 for 329 yards with 2 TDs, 1 INT, and 3 rush attempts for 22 yards
Both of em won and the best Washington WR was Garcon. The combo of Josh Gordon and Jordan Cameron with our O-Line and running backs would suggest that the numbers posted by RG III and Kirk Cousins are attainable if Johnny is as good as Kirk Cousins since his supporting cast is better than what Cousins had and the Bengals are struggling defensively. Sack numbers way down and they just got lit up by Big Ben and we play at home so...........
This is what they did in their first game under OC Kyle Shanahan:
- RG III - 19 of 26 for 320 yards with 2 TD and 9 rush attempts for 42 yards
- Kirk Cousins - 26 of 37 for 329 yards with 2 TDs, 1 INT, and 3 rush attempts for 22 yards
Both of em won and the best Washington WR was Garcon. The combo of Josh Gordon and Jordan Cameron with our O-Line and running backs would suggest that the numbers posted by RG III and Kirk Cousins are attainable if Johnny is as good as Kirk Cousins since his supporting cast is better than what Cousins had and the Bengals are struggling defensively. Sack numbers way down and they just got lit up by Big Ben and we play at home so...........
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Aditi Kinkhabwala @AKinkhabwala 3m3 minutes ago
We know #Browns will have a new QB Sunday. But may have a new PK too. Two are trying out right now.
We know #Browns will have a new QB Sunday. But may have a new PK too. Two are trying out right now.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Its time to break this one out again:
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http://static01.nyt.com/images/2014/08/31/sports/Browns/Browns-master495.jpg
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And a fitting new vid from Mike Polk.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxpAi813HJg
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http://static01.nyt.com/images/2014/08/31/sports/Browns/Browns-master495.jpg
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And a fitting new vid from Mike Polk.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxpAi813HJg
nxmehta
Footballguy
wadegarrett
FFA Legend™
See enough of Billy Shank.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Yesterday Bloom had Lance Zierlien 'On the Couch' and the first 14 minutes they devoted just to Johnny Manziel and how he will impact the Browns offense, especially the running game and how defenses will be forced to defend us differently.
Pretty good and extensive break down and worth the listen especially for us Manziel owners or anyone who owns a part of the Browns RBBC.
LINK to the podcast:
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Dec 9 2014
2014 Volume#245a - On The Couch 12.09.2014 (#2314)
Pretty good and extensive break down and worth the listen especially for us Manziel owners or anyone who owns a part of the Browns RBBC.
LINK to the podcast:
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Dec 9 2014
2014 Volume#245a - On The Couch 12.09.2014 (#2314)
