What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Denarius Moore - CIncinnatti Bengals (2 Viewers)

bc its not all that repeatable, esp when they in the most recent sample they preferred utilizing a different entity for the same objective.
You made that statement before they used Ford in the same situation. But I agree that you shouldn't expect 100 and touch from a rookie in this offense except when he's going against the Patriots pass defense. He obviously saved his day at the end but anyone that's second guessing their decision or someone else's strong recommendation to start him this week should instead focus their energy on wondering why the hell they didn't try to put one over the top to this guy on a play action. WTF!?!?!?
 
bc its not all that repeatable, esp when they in the most recent sample they preferred utilizing a different entity for the same objective.
You made that statement before they used Ford in the same situation. But I agree that you shouldn't expect 100 and touch from a rookie in this offense except when he's going against the Patriots pass defense. He obviously saved his day at the end but anyone that's second guessing their decision or someone else's strong recommendation to start him this week should instead focus their energy on wondering why the hell they didn't try to put one over the top to this guy on a play action. WTF!?!?!?
:goodposting: I'm also very surprised. It just didn't seem like they were trying very hard to get him the ball. Guess the presence of Ford/DHB & soon Murphy are gonna make this WR corps a headache to deal with. Yes, I know, that's very conclusory of me.
 
Keep in mind the coach is new to this and may need time to figure out how and when to use these guys. There will be coaching mistakes like what was said about not trying him on a deep play action. I mean who can decipher this mess right now?

 
Keep in mind the coach is new to this and may need time to figure out how and when to use these guys. There will be coaching mistakes like what was said about not trying him on a deep play action. I mean who can decipher this mess right now?
This is the NFL if you are learning on the job... you are not going to last long.
 
'Sarnoff said:
any idea how much he played?
A lot. Don't remember seeing many plays where he wasn't on the field. He just wasn't open, or, the Raiders were calling too many WR screens to wait for a deep play to open up.
This is the positive Moore owners should be taking from this game. If he's on the field that much when the other WRs are all healthy he'll be a valuable player to own.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Positive: He was on the field 85% of the time

Negative: He only received 19 yards of Campbell's 344

Campbell is Charlie Checkdown. No Raiders WR will be an every week start.

 
Positive: He was on the field 85% of the timeNegative: He only received 19 yards of Campbell's 344Campbell is Charlie Checkdown. No Raiders WR will be an every week start.
This is what I was posting last week. Seems he is still boom/bust weekly player. I'd rather have a stat line of 5/59 then the garbage time TD. Yeah, all points count but I need to see consistent looks in order to securely put a WR in my line-up.
 
Positive: He was on the field 85% of the timeNegative: He only received 19 yards of Campbell's 344Campbell is Charlie Checkdown. No Raiders WR will be an every week start.
Campbell was throwing down the field yesterday, but only to Boss & DHB. There weren't enough isolation shots on Moore to see if he was covered or not. Campbell threw a couple into tight coverage to DHB, including a very nice catch in tight double coverage for a 25 yard pickup.My assessment from watching the broadcast was that Campbell was locking onto DHB for most of the game. Moore had an early catch, then 2 ( completely uncatchable ) targets until the last drive. I couldn't say if he was not targeted because of coverage or he wasn't a 1st or 2nd read. My sense is the latter.
 
Positive: He was on the field 85% of the timeNegative: He only received 19 yards of Campbell's 344Campbell is Charlie Checkdown. No Raiders WR will be an every week start.
Campbell was throwing down the field yesterday, but only to Boss & DHB. There weren't enough isolation shots on Moore to see if he was covered or not. Campbell threw a couple into tight coverage to DHB, including a very nice catch in tight double coverage for a 25 yard pickup.My assessment from watching the broadcast was that Campbell was locking onto DHB for most of the game. Moore had an early catch, then 2 ( completely uncatchable ) targets until the last drive. I couldn't say if he was not targeted because of coverage or he wasn't a 1st or 2nd read. My sense is the latter.
It looked to me, if you watched the play, on dhb's 25 yard catch the initial read was for a wr screen to Moore. The db had read it and was in position to take it away so Campbell threw it up for dhb and he came down with it.
 
I'm just as high on Moore as anyone on here, but we need to remember last week his stats were inflated due to the end around or else he would have just had 4 catches for 34 yds. I think he's a great WR to have in dynasty formats, but so far this year I wouldn't be starting him unless I absolutely had no choice. Expecting 100 yard and 1TD performances every week is unrealistic for a rookie WR on a team that wants to run the ball a lot.
Why do you consider his stats "inflated" by the end around? It was an awesome run. Is every player's stats "inflated" by their best play of the game?
Yes. Darren McFadden's stats are inflated by the 40 yarder he breaks every week.
 
Anytime you have an explosive player, the yards per play excluding their explosions seems to be brought up as a reason by haters as to why they suck.

Denarius is a great player but a rookie who's having to compete with some other underrated veteran players at WR for the Raiders. All of them have played sufficiently so far, save for a relatively small number of drops from DHB.

And Campbell is just not good. He's an avg QB with sick talent around him. Lots of better passers around the league.

 
one of the biggest things I saw with watching him in the bills game was how he attacked the ball in the air. he is not a passive catcher. most super star WRs have that similar trait of going up and attacking the ball. tie that in with his speed, all he needs is route running, which most rookies need to learn in the NFL and a QB/system which will get him targets. I hear all the comments about how great he was doing in camp, etc.. and wasn't really a believer till I saw him play in the bills game and he seems to have 'it'.

 
'massraider said:
I'm just as high on Moore as anyone on here, but we need to remember last week his stats were inflated due to the end around or else he would have just had 4 catches for 34 yds. I think he's a great WR to have in dynasty formats, but so far this year I wouldn't be starting him unless I absolutely had no choice. Expecting 100 yard and 1TD performances every week is unrealistic for a rookie WR on a team that wants to run the ball a lot.
Why do you consider his stats "inflated" by the end around? It was an awesome run. Is every player's stats "inflated" by their best play of the game?
Yes. Darren McFadden's stats are inflated by the 40 yarder he breaks every week.
Ok ok... You guys want to nit-pick semantics. You're intelligent enough to know what I was getting at I think. Moore is not going to score a rushing TD every week, especially when Hue Jax calls the similar play for Ford the next week. If Moore's stat line against the Jets was just the 4 catches for 34 yards without the end around TD I doubt as many people would have jumped on the bandwagon. "Inflated" was a bad word choice, how about that play was an "anomaly" (something that happens out of the norm). Thats the point I was trying to make.
 
Could Belichick have been zeroing in on Moore and Ford, opting to let guys like Boss and DHB beat him?

Would go with his MO of largely taking away what you do best.

I still think Moore is in for a relatively big season. Oakland is going to score some points ... he may not be a consistently productive guy ala Calvin Johnson of course, but as a second WR I think his boom weeks will make it worth wading through the bust weeks.

 
Could Belichick have been zeroing in on Moore and Ford, opting to let guys like Boss and DHB beat him?Would go with his MO of largely taking away what you do best. I still think Moore is in for a relatively big season. Oakland is going to score some points ... he may not be a consistently productive guy ala Calvin Johnson of course, but as a second WR I think his boom weeks will make it worth wading through the bust weeks.
Second WR? On a fantasy team? Sorry, that's a bit high right now. I am drunk off the coolaid but he's not a WR 2 unless you are in a 18-team league. WR3/flex in 10-12 team leagues right now.
 
I wound up getting Moore in a trade for Hightower before last week . I watched parts of the game and he didnt seem as involved as pervious weeks but thought maybe I just did not watch enough of the game but this post I saw on USA Today basically says he was just an after thought. Thy did the same thing to Jacoby Ford last year. They just seem intent on proving DHB is a viable football WR.

Denarius Moore: Denarius Moore an afterthought?

Denarius Moore - WR - OAK - Oct. 3 - 10:34 am et

Steve Corkran of the Oakland Tribune says Denarius Moore was an "afterthought" in Sunday's game plan against the Patriots.

Moore caught just two passes for 13 yards before a six-yard garbage-time touchdown salvaged his fantasy day. Meanwhile, Al Davis favorite Darrius Heyward-Bey went off for a career-high 115 yards. Despite coach Hue Jackson's insistence that Moore will be getting the ball early and often, he has just seven catches for 53 yards over the last two weeks combined. Oct. 3

From this article

http://www.ibabuzz.com/oaklandraiders/2011/10/02/post-game-wrap-from-raiders-loss-to-patriots/

WHY LESS OF MOORE?

Wide receiver Denarius Moore caught a pass for 7 yards on the Raiders first play from scrimmage Sunday. He had only one other reception until he caught a 6-yard touchdown with 28 seconds left in the game.

It begs the question, why wasn’t Moore more of a factor in the offense?

Moore has developed into one of Oakland’s most consistent performers. Yet, Sunday he was an afterthought in the game plan. Overall, he caught only three passes for 19 yards.

 
Keep in mind the coach is new to this and may need time to figure out how and when to use these guys. There will be coaching mistakes like what was said about not trying him on a deep play action. I mean who can decipher this mess right now?
This is the NFL if you are learning on the job... you are not going to last long.
This is one of those sound bites that is repeated but overstated. For example, I heard a remark from Reggie Wayne this week in which he was putting into context why Kerry Collins had struggled. Wayne said that it took him two years to learn the offense (presumably "on the job") so expecting Collins to succeed after 18 days was unrealistic and unfair. Coaches and players learn on the job all the time, in my opinion.

 
Keep in mind the coach is new to this and may need time to figure out how and when to use these guys. There will be coaching mistakes like what was said about not trying him on a deep play action. I mean who can decipher this mess right now?
This is the NFL if you are learning on the job... you are not going to last long.
I feel like that's a bit ridiculous of a statement. It is only human to learn from our past mistakes. A bit of an overstatement here IMO.
 
Could Belichick have been zeroing in on Moore and Ford, opting to let guys like Boss and DHB beat him?Would go with his MO of largely taking away what you do best. I still think Moore is in for a relatively big season. Oakland is going to score some points ... he may not be a consistently productive guy ala Calvin Johnson of course, but as a second WR I think his boom weeks will make it worth wading through the bust weeks.
Second WR? On a fantasy team? Sorry, that's a bit high right now. I am drunk off the coolaid but he's not a WR 2 unless you are in a 18-team league. WR3/flex in 10-12 team leagues right now.
It's not crazy. So far this season, Moore is the 15th most productive WR in fantasy football. And that includes the goose egg he put up in Week 1. That's WR2 territory. And there's nothing so far to indicate his pace is going to decrease. I do suspect he'll fluctuate more than other folks in that range, but numbers don't lie.
 
What are we thinking about this week's matchup? Houston has been improved but not all-world against the pass, but I kind of expect this game to be over in under 3 hours; I wouldn't be surprised to see both teams run it 35+ times.

 
With Andre Johnson out and Foster back, I think Houston becomes a run first team and Oakland already is.

I've got a lot of guys on bye, so I'll probably start Moore, but I'd sit him if everyone was available this week.

 
Could Belichick have been zeroing in on Moore and Ford, opting to let guys like Boss and DHB beat him?

Would go with his MO of largely taking away what you do best.

I still think Moore is in for a relatively big season. Oakland is going to score some points ... he may not be a consistently productive guy ala Calvin Johnson of course, but as a second WR I think his boom weeks will make it worth wading through the bust weeks.
Second WR? On a fantasy team? Sorry, that's a bit high right now. I am drunk off the coolaid but he's not a WR 2 unless you are in a 18-team league. WR3/flex in 10-12 team leagues right now.
It's not crazy. So far this season, Moore is the 15th most productive WR in fantasy football. And that includes the goose egg he put up in Week 1. That's WR2 territory. And there's nothing so far to indicate his pace is going to decrease. I do suspect he'll fluctuate more than other folks in that range, but numbers don't lie.
They will not be playing Buff. again and Ford is not hurt. Is the Buff game an anomaly or can we expect another one like that this week or next? Who knows? Right now, he is a flex option and bye week filler. I'm not pinning my hopes that he rushes for a TD or gets a garbage time TD to salvage his game. In short, I'm a bit concerned of his recent pace.
 
Jerry Rice had 4 total TDs his rookie year. Moore is nearly at that number at 1/4 through the season.

I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin

 
Jerry Rice had 4 total TDs his rookie year. Moore is nearly at that number at 1/4 through the season.I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin
In dyynasty, your post has relevance. In re-draft it would be nice to see a concerted effort on behalf of the Raiders to have DM become a focal point of the offense. He's not there yet, but it could change. I simply can't count on garbage time TDs or rushing TDs from my starting WR. He's still a bye week filler or flex at best. Only time will tell if that changes. I have noticed that the DM hype train has slowed down considerably this week. Maybe people are starting to feel as I do.
 
Could Belichick have been zeroing in on Moore and Ford, opting to let guys like Boss and DHB beat him?

Would go with his MO of largely taking away what you do best.

I still think Moore is in for a relatively big season. Oakland is going to score some points ... he may not be a consistently productive guy ala Calvin Johnson of course, but as a second WR I think his boom weeks will make it worth wading through the bust weeks.
This is what I was thinking.Give it another game or two, especially any one where MdFadden is abusing opposing defenses.

 
Jerry Rice had 4 total TDs his rookie year. Moore is nearly at that number at 1/4 through the season.I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin
In dyynasty, your post has relevance. In re-draft it would be nice to see a concerted effort on behalf of the Raiders to have DM become a focal point of the offense. He's not there yet, but it could change. I simply can't count on garbage time TDs or rushing TDs from my starting WR. He's still a bye week filler or flex at best. Only time will tell if that changes. I have noticed that the DM hype train has slowed down considerably this week. Maybe people are starting to feel as I do.
It really doesn't have any relevance. I don't think Rice played much his rookie season, and a million other rookies put up better stats than he did. But Moore is already an important part of an up and coming offense with a new HC. We are only 1/4 of the way into the season. You can't guarantee it, but would it be surprising if he were the #1 passing option by week 10, or even earlier?
 
Jerry Rice had 4 total TDs his rookie year. Moore is nearly at that number at 1/4 through the season.I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin
In dyynasty, your post has relevance. In re-draft it would be nice to see a concerted effort on behalf of the Raiders to have DM become a focal point of the offense. He's not there yet, but it could change. I simply can't count on garbage time TDs or rushing TDs from my starting WR. He's still a bye week filler or flex at best. Only time will tell if that changes. I have noticed that the DM hype train has slowed down considerably this week. Maybe people are starting to feel as I do.
It really doesn't have any relevance. I don't think Rice played much his rookie season, and a million other rookies put up better stats than he did. But Moore is already an important part of an up and coming offense with a new HC. We are only 1/4 of the way into the season. You can't guarantee it, but would it be surprising if he were the #1 passing option by week 10, or even earlier?
And they called him Amos Moses.... the alligator gonna get ya sucka. i am starting him this week. I had some nads and picked Andre Johnson at #2 in a non ppr 10 team league. With byes Denarius is my man this week after no choice. The little I have seen of him and the lots I have read of him, he seems to have a ton of savvy, game and work ethic. I am on the D train... :popcorn:
 
Jerry Rice had 4 total TDs his rookie year. Moore is nearly at that number at 1/4 through the season.I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin
In dyynasty, your post has relevance. In re-draft it would be nice to see a concerted effort on behalf of the Raiders to have DM become a focal point of the offense. He's not there yet, but it could change. I simply can't count on garbage time TDs or rushing TDs from my starting WR. He's still a bye week filler or flex at best. Only time will tell if that changes. I have noticed that the DM hype train has slowed down considerably this week. Maybe people are starting to feel as I do.
It really doesn't have any relevance. I don't think Rice played much his rookie season, and a million other rookies put up better stats than he did. But Moore is already an important part of an up and coming offense with a new HC. We are only 1/4 of the way into the season. You can't guarantee it, but would it be surprising if he were the #1 passing option by week 10, or even earlier?
And they called him Amos Moses.... the alligator gonna get ya sucka. i am starting him this week. I had some nads and picked Andre Johnson at #2 in a non ppr 10 team league. With byes Denarius is my man this week after no choice. The little I have seen of him and the lots I have read of him, he seems to have a ton of savvy, game and work ethic. I am on the D train... :popcorn:
:hifive: I start him every week. So far so good.
 
Starting him over Ingram in the flex spot in one league and over Manningham as my WR3 in another. I missed his blow-up week vs BUF (he was on my bench) but I've found a way to get him into my lineup since. Can't complain about his production. I do worry about how he's been used the past couple of games and what that means going forward.

The bright spot in all of this is that he seemed to be on the field almost the entire NE game (don't know his ecact snap count)which means he was either purposely taken out of the game by Belichik (who did the same thing to Gates the week before)or the Raiders decided to get cute with DHB. If it was the latter hopefully they come to their senses and realize that they're a much more dynamic unit when Smooth gets more touches. Not holding my breath - this is, after all, the Raiders.

 
Starting him over Ingram in the flex spot in one league and over Manningham as my WR3 in another. I missed his blow-up week vs BUF (he was on my bench) but I've found a way to get him into my lineup since. Can't complain about his production. I do worry about how he's been used the past couple of games and what that means going forward. The bright spot in all of this is that he seemed to be on the field almost the entire NE game (don't know his ecact snap count)which means he was either purposely taken out of the game by Belichik (who did the same thing to Gates the week before)or the Raiders decided to get cute with DHB. If it was the latter hopefully they come to their senses and realize that they're a much more dynamic unit when Smooth gets more touches. Not holding my breath - this is, after all, the Raiders.
My view is that NE took Moore out with double coverage most of the time. In terms of snap count, it appears Moore had 51 snaps. By way of comparison, DHB had 53, and Ford had 22. http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/10/04/fantasy-the-snap-report-%e2%80%93-week-4-offense/I found it particularly interesting that Moore's snap count went up from the Jets game (43) to the Patriots game (51). It certainly doesn't look like Moore is losing time at all. So far, Ford's time is coming at the expense of the other receivers.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
This from a reporter covering the Raiders:

@VittorioTafur Vittorio Tafur

Hue Jackson didn't seem confident Shaughnessy back Sunday, said Moore won't lose time now that Ford, Murphy back

Sounds good.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Starting him over Ingram in the flex spot in one league and over Manningham as my WR3 in another. I missed his blow-up week vs BUF (he was on my bench) but I've found a way to get him into my lineup since. Can't complain about his production. I do worry about how he's been used the past couple of games and what that means going forward. The bright spot in all of this is that he seemed to be on the field almost the entire NE game (don't know his ecact snap count)which means he was either purposely taken out of the game by Belichik (who did the same thing to Gates the week before)or the Raiders decided to get cute with DHB. If it was the latter hopefully they come to their senses and realize that they're a much more dynamic unit when Smooth gets more touches. Not holding my breath - this is, after all, the Raiders.
My view is that NE took Moore out with double coverage most of the time. In terms of snap count, it appears Moore had 51 snaps. By way of comparison, DHB had 53, and Ford had 22. http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/10/04/fantasy-the-snap-report-%e2%80%93-week-4-offense/
Sounds like good news/bad news to me. If NE did indeed take him out of the game that doesn't seem to bode well for Smooth going forward unless the Raiders can figure out how to make the D pay. In the copycat NFL I'd assume upcoming opponents would just try do the same. After all, the Raiders offense was nowhere as explosive as they had been - and this was against a very suspect NE defense. Until the Raiders can find ways to exploit the double team on Smooth, perhpas we should temper our expectations.
 
Starting him over Ingram in the flex spot in one league and over Manningham as my WR3 in another. I missed his blow-up week vs BUF (he was on my bench) but I've found a way to get him into my lineup since. Can't complain about his production. I do worry about how he's been used the past couple of games and what that means going forward. The bright spot in all of this is that he seemed to be on the field almost the entire NE game (don't know his ecact snap count)which means he was either purposely taken out of the game by Belichik (who did the same thing to Gates the week before)or the Raiders decided to get cute with DHB. If it was the latter hopefully they come to their senses and realize that they're a much more dynamic unit when Smooth gets more touches. Not holding my breath - this is, after all, the Raiders.
My view is that NE took Moore out with double coverage most of the time. In terms of snap count, it appears Moore had 51 snaps. By way of comparison, DHB had 53, and Ford had 22. http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/10/04/fantasy-the-snap-report-%e2%80%93-week-4-offense/
Sounds like good news/bad news to me. If NE did indeed take him out of the game that doesn't seem to bode well for Smooth going forward unless the Raiders can figure out how to make the D pay. In the copycat NFL I'd assume upcoming opponents would just try do the same. After all, the Raiders offense was nowhere as explosive as they had been - and this was against a very suspect NE defense. Until the Raiders can find ways to exploit the double team on Smooth, perhpas we should temper our expectations.
No way other teams will do that, with McFadden running like he is. Moore will get plenty of one on one's.
 
@VittorioTafur

Hue on Moore not losing snaps: "You earn what you get and get what you earn. ... (Ford and Murphy) have nothing to do with Denarius Moore."

 
Starting him over Ingram in the flex spot in one league and over Manningham as my WR3 in another. I missed his blow-up week vs BUF (he was on my bench) but I've found a way to get him into my lineup since. Can't complain about his production. I do worry about how he's been used the past couple of games and what that means going forward. The bright spot in all of this is that he seemed to be on the field almost the entire NE game (don't know his ecact snap count)which means he was either purposely taken out of the game by Belichik (who did the same thing to Gates the week before)or the Raiders decided to get cute with DHB. If it was the latter hopefully they come to their senses and realize that they're a much more dynamic unit when Smooth gets more touches. Not holding my breath - this is, after all, the Raiders.
My view is that NE took Moore out with double coverage most of the time. In terms of snap count, it appears Moore had 51 snaps. By way of comparison, DHB had 53, and Ford had 22. http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/10/04/fantasy-the-snap-report-%e2%80%93-week-4-offense/I found it particularly interesting that Moore's snap count went up from the Jets game (43) to the Patriots game (51). It certainly doesn't look like Moore is losing time at all. So far, Ford's time is coming at the expense of the other receivers.
Watching the game, I didn't see NE rolling coverage specifically to Moore. I don't have play direction data, but it felt like Campbell was looking middle-left in his reads most of the day ( and I recall seeing Moore lining up right most of the day ) Now, granted, I was at a sports bar having :banned: :banned: :banned: but I did have Moore in my lineup and was looking for him pre-snap. This may be more related to every receiver looking open vs. NE - hence 1st read gets the ball, as opposed to Moore being covered and Campbell having to move on.Just my :2cents:
 
Watching the game, I didn't see NE rolling coverage specifically to Moore. I don't have play direction data, but it felt like Campbell was looking middle-left in his reads most of the day ( and I recall seeing Moore lining up right most of the day ) This may be more related to every receiver looking open vs. NE - hence 1st read gets the ball, as opposed to Moore being covered and Campbell having to move on.
I saw the game too (totally sober) and agree with your assessment. By design or by adjustment it just seemed like Campbell wasn't looking Moore's way much.
 
Denarius Moore - WR - Raiders Coach Hue Jackson said Wednesday that Denarius Moore is "not in danger" of losing his role.

With Jacoby Ford back and Louis Murphy nearing a return, the Raiders' receiving corps is suddenly very crowded. But Jackson was clear that Moore will continue to get his chances. "You earn what you get and get what you earn. All those other guys are back, and they'll earn their time -- they're good players. We'll give them opportunities as we continue to move forward. But they have nothing to do with Denarius Moore." Consider Moore a high-risk, high-reward WR3 for Sunday's game against the Texans.

Source: Oakland Tribune Oct 6 - 9:09 AM

 
I drafted him and started him the last two weeks and I'm keeping him in there over Branch and Ford as my WR3/Flex in a 12-teamer. I just figure he's only going to get better, more confident, more learned and more in sync with Campbell as the season progresses. I feel I'll miss out on a 150/2 game if I get jumpy and pull him. Everything written has been stellar and for some reason I believe he could be the key to a FF Championship.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top