Hurricane Sandy (2 Viewers)

[Henry Ford]

Does New York not have anti-price-gauging laws? I know it's less often that they have these kinds of emergencies than in the South - at least historically - but people charging $5 a battery at a convenience store would go to jail in Gulf states.

If 47 people want batteries (when they are priced at $1 each), but there are only 8 batteries available, how should they be distributed?It seems to me that a pretty good way to distribute them is to raise the price until only 8 people want them at that price. We want to get the batteries to the people who need them most; and while willingness to pay isn't a perfect proxy for need, it seems at least as good as anything else I can think of.What are some better alternatives?

The store setting a per-person purchase limit is a better alternative. Also, if you could show me where there are 47 people who want batteries and only 8 batteries, I'd love to see it. Instead, what you're seeing are stores full of batteries selling them at triple or quadruple the price.

 

[Henry Ford]

....and apparently John Stossel has been arguing on Fox News that price gouging is actually a good thing after a disaster because it means that only people who really need the item will buy it. Nice.

He's right, of course. If a store isn't allowed to raise its prices to the point where supply and demand intersect, hoarders will buy up the whole supply of batteries at the store's low price and then sell them on the black market to whoever is willing to pay the most.Why is a black market preferable to a legal market?

Let's set up a false dichotomy and argue about it for awhile, as though the only possible endgame is either a black market or price gouging. That will pass the time.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Does New York not have anti-price-gauging laws? I know it's less often that they have these kinds of emergencies than in the South - at least historically - but people charging $5 a battery at a convenience store would go to jail in Gulf states.

If 47 people want batteries (when they are priced at $1 each), but there are only 8 batteries available, how should they be distributed?It seems to me that a pretty good way to distribute them is to raise the price until only 8 people want them at that price. We want to get the batteries to the people who need them most; and while willingness to pay isn't a perfect proxy for need, it seems at least as good as anything else I can think of.What are some better alternatives?

Give the batteries away for free to the 1st 8 people who ask for them.

That's an alternative, but how is it better?The batteries will still end up in the hands of the people they're worth the most to. If the first 8 people in line value them at $3, they'll re-sell them to whoever is willing to pay $5.What's the benefit of having an extra set of middlemen?

 

[BroadwayG]

Does New York not have anti-price-gauging laws? I know it's less often that they have these kinds of emergencies than in the South - at least historically - but people charging $5 a battery at a convenience store would go to jail in Gulf states.

If 47 people want batteries (when they are priced at $1 each), but there are only 8 batteries available, how should they be distributed?It seems to me that a pretty good way to distribute them is to raise the price until only 8 people want them at that price. We want to get the batteries to the people who need them most; and while willingness to pay isn't a perfect proxy for need, it seems at least as good as anything else I can think of.What are some better alternatives?

Chop the batteries into 47 equal pieces.

 

[Henry Ford]

Also, tell me - where will this black market be set up, and what happens after? Because Manhattan isn't going to be out of power for 30 days - it's going to be back on in a few days, before a major floating market headed by a guy with a waxy mustache can get the black market really rolling for massive profit.

"Shortage of batteries" isn't the new normal, it's a couple of days where people want to buy batteries.

 

[Keerock]

Ellis Boyd "Red" Redding has already opened up shop...

 

[Henry Ford]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Does New York not have anti-price-gauging laws? I know it's less often that they have these kinds of emergencies than in the South - at least historically - but people charging $5 a battery at a convenience store would go to jail in Gulf states.

If 47 people want batteries (when they are priced at $1 each), but there are only 8 batteries available, how should they be distributed?It seems to me that a pretty good way to distribute them is to raise the price until only 8 people want them at that price. We want to get the batteries to the people who need them most; and while willingness to pay isn't a perfect proxy for need, it seems at least as good as anything else I can think of.What are some better alternatives?

The store setting a per-person purchase limit is a better alternative.

How is it better? (Would you prohibit reselling the item to someone who values it more?)

 

[Gawain]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

Gas stations on LI are going to a $20 limit. I would much rather see the price get raised to $20 a gallon, with $16 of that going to the Red Cross, some other charity, the rebuilding effort. If prices are going to rise temporarily, let the extra cash go to a worthy cause.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

The best way I know of to distribute scarce goods is by using price. Distributing gas to whoever's willing to pay the most is preferable to distributing it to whoever's willing to wait in line the longest, IMO. And any other method of distribution will lead to a black market, which has its own set of problems.Don Boudreaux is really good at explaining these things, so I'll quote him again:

On Price Gouging

Is It Fair to Raise Prices after a Natural Disaster?

April 2005 • Volume: 55 • Issue: 3

The immediate aftermath of a natural disaster inevitably brings much higher prices for staple goods, such as lumber, batteries, fuel, and bottled water. Just as inevitably, these higher prices are roundly decried as unjust and inexcusable.

Such price hikes are slapped with the derisive name “price gouging.” And even people who typically endorse markets often call for it to be outlawed. A recent example comes from Times of India columnist Swaminathan Aiyar, who describes himself as a market liberal. In his January 9 column, Aiyar condemned the price hikes that followed the tsunamis, referring to them as an additional tragedy visited upon already-suffering victims.

This interpretation of the price hikes is as unfortunate as it is mistaken. Let’s review here some basic economics of “price gouging.” Prices are not set arbitrarily. They are what they are for a variety of reasons. These reasons are summarized by the two words “supply” and “demand.” Prices reflect existing conditions of supply and demand. If the price of bottled water rises, it does so either because supplies have fallen or because people’s demand has risen. In the wake of natural disasters, both of these effects kick in strongly.

A natural disaster destroys inventories, vehicles, and infrastructure (including water-treatment plants and roads). Existing stocks of bottled water and of close substitutes, such as tap water, are reduced. Also reduced is the flow of supplies of water. Many of the roads and vehicles ordinarily used to carry bottled water to market are now destroyed. Less bottled water makes it to market in the devastated region. In short, supply falls significantly.

At the same time, demand for bottled water rises, principally because tap water is now less available and more dangerous. This fall in supply combined with rise in demand means that the value of each available bottle of water rises. People are willing to pay more for each bottle.

The higher price per bottle reflects the underlying reality; it reflects the fact that bottled-water supply is lower and bottled-water demand is higher. In short, it reflects the fact that bottled water is now more valuable than it was before the disaster.

Therefore, the fact that is unfortunate is not the higher price; it’s the underlying reality reflected by the higher price. That a natural disaster destroyed supplies and supply lines is indeed unfortunate. But this is the reality. Because, as Thomas Sowell reminds us, reality is not optional, we ought to deal with it as best as we can.

Dealing Honestly with Reality

And how best to deal with this unfortunate reality? To begin, never pretend that reality is other than what it is. Face reality squarely, fully, and soberly. If this advice sounds trite, understand that government-imposed prohibitions on “price gouging” mask the underlying reality, shielding people from the truth of it.

If the market value of a bottle of water is $25, preventing merchants from charging a price higher than $5 shields consumers from the fact that potable water is now more precious than it was pre-disaster. The price cap also shields suppliers from this same truth. The inevitable consequences of this hoax only add to the problems caused by the natural disaster. With the price artificially kept low—at its pre-disaster level—consumers will try to use this now-more-precious commodity today with no more care than they used it yesterday.

But they can only try, for they’ll not succeed in using bottled water with the same nonchalance as they did pre-disaster. Misled by the counterfeit low price, consumers initially will do nothing to use water more carefully. But as fast as you can say “tsunami,” other signals will alert them to water’s now-greater preciousness. Long queues to buy water will emerge, as will empty shelves, black markets, and reports of neighbors hoarding bottled water in their basements.

Not only will most people who want bottled water be unable to buy all they want at the counterfeit price, many will spend valuable time waiting in queues (often to no avail). Some will drive over obstructed roads to buy water in distant towns, while others will use their personal or political connections to obtain water.

Time and resources that could be better spent cleaning up and launching the rebuilding effort are diverted to frequently futile efforts to obtain bottled water. These consequences are avoidable misfortunes compounding the pain of the natural disaster. Note several regrettable facts.

Fact one: capping the price does not keep the cost of bottled water low. Time spent waiting, time and fuel spent driving to distant towns where supplies are greater, and the anxiety unleashed by the inability to obtain water are all costs. The fact that these costs are not revealed in the price of bottled water does not render them less significant or real.

Fact two: while a higher market price both prompts consumers voluntarily to economize more diligently on water’s use and increases the quantity of water supplied (by giving incentives to suppliers to bring more water to this market), the queues and empty shelves generated by the price cap force consumers to economize, but do nothing to inspire suppliers to bring more water to market.

Fact three: the economization forced on consumers by price caps is ugly and arbitrary. Those obliged to do without are the unlucky ones who couldn’t get into the queue early enough and who have no political or business connections. These unlucky consumers are also typically too poor to pay the high prices demanded on the black market. A fact always missed by proponents of price caps is that black-market prices are higher than the unregulated market prices would be. The reason is that unregulated market prices—being visible and legal—will stimulate a larger inflow of supplies than will black-market prices.

There’s no denying that people dislike the higher prices. What is deniable is that the higher prices are the problem. They are not the problem; they reflect the problem. Because the problem itself is unfortunate, its undistorted reflection will reveal this misfortune. But only by revealing this misfortune as accurately as possible to everyone who can help to minimize its effects will reality be returned as quickly as possible to normal.

Shouldn’t Merchants Be More Charitable?

Still, why must merchants profit from other people’s misfortune? Surely sellers can and should choose to sell their inventories at pre-disaster prices? Such questions reveal a deep and persistent objection to post-disaster price hikes—namely, it’s simply unfair for merchants to profit from disasters.

Of course, merchants can voluntarily keep their prices below market levels. But to do so would be not only harmful but also unfair! If a grocer refuses to raise the price he charges for bottled water up to the market level, he will find his store besieged by consumers. Only consumers near the front of the line will be lucky enough to get the water; those closer to the rear will go home empty-handed. Is queuing a fair means of deciding who gets the water?

Also, by not raising the price, the grocer will mute the price signal sent to the global market that bottled water is especially needed in this locale. Muting this signal will reduce how much or the speed with which additional, much-needed supplies of bottled water are shipped from where they are valued less to the disaster area where they are desired more.

A better way for the merchant to extend a helping hand would be to charge market prices and, out of the profits he earns, to make cash contributions to cash-strapped victims of the disaster. Those contributions will enable victims to better express on the market their need for bottled water and other supplies—thus communicating to suppliers worldwide just how desperately they need things to help rebuild their lives—without diluting the incentives of all consumers to economize on the now-much-scarcer goods or the incentives of suppliers to turn their supplies to where they are now needed most urgently.

Thwarting market forces only worsens calamities and is therefore most unfair.

 

[Henry Ford]

Does New York not have anti-price-gauging laws? I know it's less often that they have these kinds of emergencies than in the South - at least historically - but people charging $5 a battery at a convenience store would go to jail in Gulf states.

If 47 people want batteries (when they are priced at $1 each), but there are only 8 batteries available, how should they be distributed?It seems to me that a pretty good way to distribute them is to raise the price until only 8 people want them at that price. We want to get the batteries to the people who need them most; and while willingness to pay isn't a perfect proxy for need, it seems at least as good as anything else I can think of.What are some better alternatives?

The store setting a per-person purchase limit is a better alternative.

How is it better? (Would you prohibit reselling the item to someone who values it more?)

1. Because it is not engaging in price gouging, which keeps necessities and near-necessities out of the hands of those with the least stockpiled reserves in times of crisis.2. No, but I would prohibit returns on any item purchased at my store before the lights come back on.You (and Stossel) seem to be assuming that people will just come up with money for necessities if they really need them. If you have twelve dollars in your possession, no way to work to earn money, no electricity, and the corner store is selling ramen noodles for fifteen dollars a cup, you're going to die. Price gouging is bad.

 

[Henry Ford]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

The best way I know of to distribute scarce goods is by using price. Distributing gas to whoever's willing to pay the most is preferable to distributing it to whoever's willing to wait in line the longest, IMO. And any other method of distribution will lead to a black market, which has its own set of problems.

I've been through several major hurricanes in states with anti-price gouging laws, and have never had to purchase a single thing off of a black market. The situation is temporary. Everyone knows this. Setting up a black market isn't going to last long enough to be substantially worth it - at least not enough for people to heavily affect the availability of necessary items.

 

[Henry Ford]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

Gas stations on LI are going to a $20 limit. I would much rather see the price get raised to $20 a gallon, with $16 of that going to the Red Cross, some other charity, the rebuilding effort. If prices are going to rise temporarily, let the extra cash go to a worthy cause.

And how about a family of four in New Jersey who has $20 left and needs a generator to keep a 4-month old from freezing to death while it's 35 degrees out, until the power gets back on? How should we handle that?

 

[Apple Jack]

Price gouging in disasters is pretty much the scummiest of the scum of mankind. Just short of child molesters and people who like Creed.

 

[Don Quixote]

There's got to be a race track somewhere near New York that the joggers could just run around until they've ran a marathon.

Seeing 50,000 people crammed onto a race track and running around it for several hours would be cool to see. Maybe a taxi driver with instincts for avoiding traffic would win the race.

The track could even take bets, with proceeds going to charity.

Watching the race would be a lot more interesting if the Belmont PA guy was at the mic the whole time too.

 

[Gawain]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

Gas stations on LI are going to a $20 limit. I would much rather see the price get raised to $20 a gallon, with $16 of that going to the Red Cross, some other charity, the rebuilding effort. If prices are going to rise temporarily, let the extra cash go to a worthy cause.

And how about a family of four in New Jersey who has $20 left and needs a generator to keep a 4-month old from freezing to death while it's 35 degrees out, until the power gets back on? How should we handle that?

There are a lot of problems with this hypothetical question, but if this was a life and death situation, that family should go to one of the emergency shelters. That is why they are there.

 

[Henry Ford]

Convenience for rich people is more important that basic necessities for poor people - ladies and gentlemen, your Health Care argument laid out against the backdrop of price gouging.

 

[Henry Ford]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

Gas stations on LI are going to a $20 limit. I would much rather see the price get raised to $20 a gallon, with $16 of that going to the Red Cross, some other charity, the rebuilding effort. If prices are going to rise temporarily, let the extra cash go to a worthy cause.

And how about a family of four in New Jersey who has $20 left and needs a generator to keep a 4-month old from freezing to death while it's 35 degrees out, until the power gets back on? How should we handle that?

There are a lot of problems with this hypothetical question, but if this was a life and death situation, that family should go to one of the emergency shelters. That is why they are there.

So you'd prefer to spend tax dollars, rather than simply keeping people from price gouging. That seems odd.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

You (and Stossel) seem to be assuming that people will just come up with money for necessities if they really need them. If you have twelve dollars in your possession, no way to work to earn money, no electricity, and the corner store is selling ramen noodles for fifteen dollars a cup, you're going to die. Price gouging is bad.

I'm not assuming that. People are going to die no matter what system we use. The trick is to minimize the deaths and other harms. I think artificial caps on prices will increase deaths. It will reduce the amount of Ramen noodles available, for example, and have other negative effects as well.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

Gas stations on LI are going to a $20 limit. I would much rather see the price get raised to $20 a gallon, with $16 of that going to the Red Cross, some other charity, the rebuilding effort. If prices are going to rise temporarily, let the extra cash go to a worthy cause.

And how about a family of four in New Jersey who has $20 left and needs a generator to keep a 4-month old from freezing to death while it's 35 degrees out, until the power gets back on? How should we handle that?

I think we should try to find a way to keep them warm.I don't see how restricting sales on generators will help accomplish that. I think it will have the opposite effect.People who can't buy their own generators will need to rely on charity or government assistance. A good first step, IMO, is making generators as widely available as possible. You don't do that by capping their price.

 

[culdeus]

How about these joggers that are coming in with hotel reservations and booting out families without homes to return to?

I'm sure it's all good in the name of healing right?

 

[TLEF316]

Power just came back on here at the office.

If I get home and it's still dark, I may just break

 

[Politician Spock]

Tell me, Maurile, how about a gas station charging $25 a gallon for gas? Does that seem perfectly acceptable to you as well? People will pay it right now.

The best way I know of to distribute scarce goods is by using price. Distributing gas to whoever's willing to pay the most is preferable to distributing it to whoever's willing to wait in line the longest, IMO. And any other method of distribution will lead to a black market, which has its own set of problems.

I've been through several major hurricanes in states with anti-price gouging laws, and have never had to purchase a single thing off of a black market. The situation is temporary. Everyone knows this. Setting up a black market isn't going to last long enough to be substantially worth it - at least not enough for people to heavily affect the availability of necessary items.

at the thought of people applying for black market permits and negotiating a lease for the back of a van parked on the street.

 

[JerseyToughGuys]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/inspiring-images-from-hurricane-sandy

:(

Literally had tears running down my face. Every time I count humanity out, I see stuff like this. Just wish everyday could be this way.

NeighborsKids were in the backseat. My daughter goes to school with the 11 year old, swim team, ect.

Crappy, crappy crappy.

ETA: not sure why the #### they were out on the road at that point.

 

[shadyridr]

How about these joggers that are coming in with hotel reservations and booting out families without homes to return to? I'm sure it's all good in the name of healing right?

if the evacuaees need the rooms more they should be willing to pay higher prices

 

[Keerock]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/inspiring-images-from-hurricane-sandy

:(

Literally had tears running down my face. Every time I count humanity out, I see stuff like this. Just wish everyday could be this way.

NeighborsKids were in the backseat. My daughter goes to school with the 11 year old, swim team, ect.

Crappy, crappy crappy.

ETA: not sure why the #### they were out on the road at that point.

####!

 

[Mello]

On the price gouging thing, I think those arguing against price fixing are restricting the market too much. The market here is the entire country, not just the area devastated. We have plenty of bottled water, fuel, and other items to share with the disaster area. These items are not scarce. If they become scarce locally, then that's a failure on the rest of the country in getting the necessary supplies to the area. When those problems occur I would much rather have the risk of not getting something they need shared among everyone affected rather than it be based on how much money someone has access to. That does generates lines but I think they correlate better with need than how much money someone has.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Price gouging in disasters is pretty much the scummiest of the scum of mankind. Just short of child molesters and people who like Creed.

It may indeed be despicable to profiteer in the face of other people's misfortunes when one could simply lend a helping hand instead.But the most socially useful way for a shop-owner to avoid profiteering is not to sell scarce items below their market value, which tends to result in a misallocation of resources at precisely the time when resources most need to be allocated efficiently. The better way is to sell scarce items at their market value, and then donate the excess profits to a worthy cause.

(I have nothing against shop-owners selling scarce items below their market value, or even giving scarce items away for free, to people who really need those items but can't afford them. But that's not going to be the likely result of government-mandated caps on price. The likely result of government-mandated caps in price is, first, a reduction in the overall distribution of those goods, and second, a distribution based more on political/business connections and less on need, as compared to a price-driven system.)

If left to themselves, I don't expect many shop-owners to actually donate their excess profits to a worthy cause (but I could be wrong about that). If the government is going to step in, that's where it should do it. Put a temporary surtax on scarce items, so that if a gallon of gas is sold for $20, at least $10 of it goes to disaster-relief. The result won't be wholly positive (it will decrease the incentive for shop-owners to stockpile necessities to be distributed during emergencies, and could also result in black-market sales), but it may be positive on net, and would almost certainly be better than capping prices.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

On the price gouging thing, I think those arguing against price fixing are restricting the market too much. The market here is the entire country, not just the area devastated. We have plenty of bottled water, fuel, and other items to share with the disaster area. These items are not scarce. If they become scarce locally, then that's a failure on the rest of the country in getting the necessary supplies to the area.

The way to get more bottled water from the rest of the country to the disaster area is to allow the price of bottled water to increase in the disaster area.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I considered responding to some of the comments against price gouging (like the guy who was selling gasoline for $10 a gallon) earlier, but I figured this wasn't a good time for people to think about this issue rationally. Patting myself on the back now for being right.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

I considered responding to some of the comments against price gouging (like the guy who was selling gasoline for $10 a gallon) earlier, but I figured this wasn't a good time for people to think about this issue rationally. Patting myself on the back now for being right.

You are wiser than I am.

 

[B-Deep]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/inspiring-images-from-hurricane-sandy

:(

Literally had tears running down my face. Every time I count humanity out, I see stuff like this. Just wish everyday could be this way.

NeighborsKids were in the backseat. My daughter goes to school with the 11 year old, swim team, ect.

Crappy, crappy crappy.

ETA: not sure why the #### they were out on the road at that point.

 

[Henry Ford]

On the price gouging thing, I think those arguing against price fixing are restricting the market too much. The market here is the entire country, not just the area devastated. We have plenty of bottled water, fuel, and other items to share with the disaster area. These items are not scarce. If they become scarce locally, then that's a failure on the rest of the country in getting the necessary supplies to the area.

The way to get more bottled water from the rest of the country to the disaster area is to allow the price of bottled water to increase in the disaster area.

Wholesale price. If wholesale price goes up and the cost is passed on in the retail price, it's not price gouging. When you sell goods at an inflated profit - that is, goods that you purchased from the wholesaler for normal price, now being sold at a much higher rate, it's price gouging. Which doesn't impact the wholesaler, and therefore doesn't do any of the wonderful things you're talking about from the supply side.The shortage crisis will be over before it affects the country-wide marketplace by wholesale prices.

 

[Henry Ford]

I considered responding to some of the comments against price gouging (like the guy who was selling gasoline for $10 a gallon) earlier, but I figured this wasn't a good time for people to think about this issue rationally. Patting myself on the back now for being right.

Individuals re-selling for convenience at a higher rate isn't price gouging.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

The results of laws against price-gouging, with pics.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

"]More: with video.

 

[Henry Ford]

The results of laws against price-gouging, with pics.

You're right. We should have priced any of the poor people in line out, thereby assuring convenience for those with bigger bank accounts.

 

[Sheriff Bart]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/inspiring-images-from-hurricane-sandy

:(

Literally had tears running down my face. Every time I count humanity out, I see stuff like this. Just wish everyday could be this way.

NeighborsKids were in the backseat. My daughter goes to school with the 11 year old, swim team, ect.

Crappy, crappy crappy.

ETA: not sure why the #### they were out on the road at that point.

Godamnit

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

The results of laws against price-gouging, with pics.

You're right. We should have priced any of the poor people in line out, thereby assuring convenience for those with bigger bank accounts.

Why are you using "poor people" as a synonym for "people unwilling to pay $20/gallon"? They're not the same thing.

 

[Henry Ford]

The results of laws against price-gouging, with pics.

You're right. We should have priced any of the poor people in line out, thereby assuring convenience for those with bigger bank accounts.

Why are you using "poor people" as a synonym for "people unwilling to pay $20/gallon"? They're not the same thing at all.

I didn't. But "people unwilling to pay $20/gallon" aren't "priced out" - they're making a financial decision. There will be three sets of people in the $20/gallon gas world:1. Can and will pay $20 per gallon

2. Can but will not pay $20 per gallon

3. Cannot pay $20 per gallon

1. is doing fine. 2. is doing fine, and has made a rational decision to do something else with that money. 3. is screwed. There's no reason 3. has to be screwed in order to let 1. have more convenience during the disaster.

 

[Henry Ford]

It doesn't matter. We clearly will not agree on this. I have lived through disasters with anti-price-gouging laws and without. I greatly prefer the former. I'll leave this discussion along until another time, when it's not interspersed with news of someone's neighbors dying. Apologies to the thread.

 

[TLEF316]

Still no power, so now I'm basically a powerless bizarro oasis in a desert of electricity filled goodness.

And yes, I realize others are much worse off but this still blows

 

[JerseyToughGuys]

Still no power, so now I'm basically a powerless bizarro oasis in a desert of electricity filled goodness. And yes, I realize others are much worse off but this still blows

I will run a really, really long extension cord. But, please take pics and post them.:feelgoodstory:

 

[glock]

http://www.buzzfeed....hurricane-sandy

:(

Literally had tears running down my face. Every time I count humanity out, I see stuff like this. Just wish everyday could be this way.

NeighborsKids were in the backseat. My daughter goes to school with the 11 year old, swim team, ect.

Crappy, crappy crappy.

ETA: not sure why the #### they were out on the road at that point.

:( Where could they have been going? At that time Sandy was kicking my neighborhoods ###!

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

what people are waiting in line for in nyc

 

[Nick Vermeil]

Still no power, so now I'm basically a powerless bizarro oasis in a desert of electricity filled goodness. And yes, I realize others are much worse off but this still blows

You'll get there tlef. Have your upstairs neighbors bugged out?

 

[BroadwayG]

The results of laws against price-gouging, with pics.

Does NJ still have that law where you can't pump your own gas?

 

[TLEF316]

Still no power, so now I'm basically a powerless bizarro oasis in a desert of electricity filled goodness. And yes, I realize others are much worse off but this still blows

You'll get there tlef. Have your upstairs neighbors bugged out?

I thought they did yesterday morning but now I think I hear them walking around upstairs.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Still no power, so now I'm basically a powerless bizarro oasis in a desert of electricity filled goodness. And yes, I realize others are much worse off but this still blows

How was Stern this morning?

 

[Billy Bats]

Marathon postponed.

New York City Marathon Postponed The New York City Marathon is no longer on for this Sunday, WNBC reported. The decision to postpone the race comes after Mayor Michael Bloomberg faced an onslaught of criticism for vowing to push ahead with the annual event, just days after a massive storm caused millions of dollars in damage to the city's five boroughs. "If they take one first responder from Staten Island to cover this marathon, I will scream," New York City Councilman James Oddo said on his Twitter account. "We have people with no homes and no hope right now." Manhattan Borough President Scott Stringer echoed Oddo's concerns, saying that people in the area should be helped first. Emergency workers continue to wade through flooded homes to look for survivors in the area. Millions of people remain without power in the Northeast, as the death toll from Superstorm Sandy swelled to 95. At least 37 of those deaths were in New York City. Get More at NBC News