Is it ever ok to use a belt to discipline your child? (1 Viewer)

[Bigboy10182000]

This thread is scary. WTF would really hit their kid with a belt or any other object?

I use a 2x4. You only have to hit 'em once and they learn not to get caught.

Just start breaking fingers. That'll get their attention quickly.

If you get one that's giving you static, he probably thinks he's a real cowboy, so you gotta break that son of a ##### in two. If you wanna know something and he won't tell you, cut off one of his fingers. The little one. Then tell him his thumb's next.

All kidding aside, if a parent can't control a kid by any other means besides severe corporal punishment something bigger is going on.

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand "severe corporal punishment"?

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand relevant to this thread?

Do you do this all day? Is it still fun?

 

[Sheriff66]

I put down the belt and started just caning the kids, they respond better to it

 

[jdoggydogg]

Ask the Doctor: Does Spanking Work?

QUESTION:

“Dear Dr. Pressman,

I am hoping you can give me some advice. My husband and I have drastically different parenting styles. I am soft spoken — he is loud. I use time-out’s as a form of punishment, he is more of a screamer. Although I am totally consistent with punishment, the kids tend to listen to him because – well – they are terrified of him when he raises his voice. I had a friend tell me she went through the same thing with her kids — they only listened to her husband because they were scared of him. He never hit them, just raised his voice. One day she she got so frustrated with that she spanked her 4 1/2 old daughter. She says it was the only time she ever had to do it. After that, every time she’d send her daughter to her room she listened.


I personally think spanking is wrong…but lately I’m not so sure. What do you think?”

Thanks,
Danielle W. (NY)

ANSWER:

Great question because it deals with two very important items: Punishment & Parenting Styles!

So, here is the deal with spanking…it is absolutely not recommended–for four reasons.

1. In the long run, it is ineffective. If the non-spanking parent is not present (as in “Wait ’til your father gets home!”) your child may not follow expectations. We find that children who are spanked at home are more likely to show behavior problems at school, because they will not be spanked there. Not a good situation.

2. Constant increases in the frequency and force of spanking become necessary to get the desired effect–until it is not effective at all. I had an eight year old in treatment whose mom used and threatened spanking. She reported that after using a paddle on him, he looked up at her completely dry-eyed and asked, “That all you got?“

3. It provides a dangerous model. Often a parent uses spanking when they are angry or frustrated. The model they set up is, “When you are angry–use force.” Often these parents get reports from school saying that their child is getting into fights or may be having “anger issues.”

4. It promotes poor self concept. It is rare to find a child who feels good about himself when spanking is part of his life.

So spanking is out…what’s a parent to do? I know it can be super frustrating when children seem to listen to only one parent. Remember, it’s natural for parents to have different parenting styles. BUT, there are three cautions:

1. One parent should not increase the intensity of their technique to counter what they see as the extreme use of the other parent’s technique. What happens is that the softer parent becomes excessively soft while the harder parent becomes excessively hard. It is a never ending cycle that is unpleasant and ineffective in changing your child’s behavior. It is also destructive to the parents’ relationship.

2. Never interrupt while one parent is involved in doing their “ineffective, damaging” technique. It only underscores a child’s awareness of the rift between the parents. In these cases, a child usually plays one parent against the other. Walk away . Discuss your difference of opinion at a later time, when your child is not present.

3. Make sure that you and your partner have a regular agreement that you will discuss this matter when the storms pass.

The very best method for almost any behavior change–no matter what the behavior is–is to use the system of “What’s the Rule?“ Good Nights Now gives superb instructions for making this system work. Both “hard” and “soft” parents are comfortable with it because it does not need punishment, does not require yelling or repetition, does not result in tantrums or family meltdowns and parental guilt–but actually works. It uses the careful application of “Rules” and simple, but potentially positive consequences, i.e., ”First trash goes out, then the computer may be used,” rather than commands, i.e, “How many times must I ask you to take the trash out?” However, the method, although simple, is not at all easy. So, please read the book before trying it.

 

[Boomer1]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

 

[Boomer1]

This thread is scary. WTF would really hit their kid with a belt or any other object?

I use a 2x4. You only have to hit 'em once and they learn not to get caught.

Just start breaking fingers. That'll get their attention quickly.

If you get one that's giving you static, he probably thinks he's a real cowboy, so you gotta break that son of a ##### in two. If you wanna know something and he won't tell you, cut off one of his fingers. The little one. Then tell him his thumb's next.

All kidding aside, if a parent can't control a kid by any other means besides severe corporal punishment something bigger is going on.

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand "severe corporal punishment"?

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand relevant to this thread?

As relevant as cutting a kids hand off, waterboarding, busting knee caps, pile drivers or any other drivel I've heard spanking compared to.

So, I take it, you're ok with the open hand approach?

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

don't you think it's a little unfair to dump the product of years of your parenting off on someone else to figure out?

 

[The Commish]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

First, I'd get him to a therapist. Then, as I mentioned above, try and figure out what motivates him and go from there with punishment.

 

[Boomer1]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

don't you think it's a little unfair to dump the product of years of your parenting off on someone else to figure out?

See above.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

This thread is scary. WTF would really hit their kid with a belt or any other object?

I use a 2x4. You only have to hit 'em once and they learn not to get caught.

Just start breaking fingers. That'll get their attention quickly.

If you get one that's giving you static, he probably thinks he's a real cowboy, so you gotta break that son of a ##### in two. If you wanna know something and he won't tell you, cut off one of his fingers. The little one. Then tell him his thumb's next.

All kidding aside, if a parent can't control a kid by any other means besides severe corporal punishment something bigger is going on.

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand "severe corporal punishment"?

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand relevant to this thread?

As relevant as cutting a kids hand off, waterboarding, busting knee caps, pile drivers or any other drivel I've heard spanking compared to.

So, I take it, you're ok with the open hand approach?

I'm pretty sure those answers were sarcastic mockery, but I don't want to speak for anyone.

so, you're saying your comment was completely irrelevant to the topic?

 

[Henry Ford]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You got caught lighting a fire once - in a grass field, not in your living room setting curtains on fire - and weren't caught lighting matches in your room again?

 

[Idiot Boxer]

If he's one of those kids that wears his pants down below his ####, then yes, I'd use a belt on him.

You know, to hold his pants up.

Not to hit him. That's sick.

 

[Boomer1]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You got caught lighting a fire once - in a grass field, not in your living room setting curtains on fire - and weren't caught lighting matches in your room again?

I caught the curtains on fire while I played with matches in my bedroom and caught a field on fire sometime later. Sometime in between, I was caught with matches in my room, but not doing anything with them (yet). Again, nothing more than a childish facination, but could of let to very serious repercussions.

 

[Boomer1]

This thread is scary. WTF would really hit their kid with a belt or any other object?

I use a 2x4. You only have to hit 'em once and they learn not to get caught.

Just start breaking fingers. That'll get their attention quickly.

If you get one that's giving you static, he probably thinks he's a real cowboy, so you gotta break that son of a ##### in two. If you wanna know something and he won't tell you, cut off one of his fingers. The little one. Then tell him his thumb's next.

All kidding aside, if a parent can't control a kid by any other means besides severe corporal punishment something bigger is going on.

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand "severe corporal punishment"?

Do you consider a swat to the ### with your open hand relevant to this thread?

As relevant as cutting a kids hand off, waterboarding, busting knee caps, pile drivers or any other drivel I've heard spanking compared to.

So, I take it, you're ok with the open hand approach?

I'm pretty sure those answers were sarcastic mockery, but I don't want to speak for anyone.

so, you're saying your comment was completely irrelevant to the topic?

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt.

So again, you're ok with a swat to the a$$ with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

 

[Henry Ford]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You got caught lighting a fire once - in a grass field, not in your living room setting curtains on fire - and weren't caught lighting matches in your room again?

I caught the curtains on fire while I played with matches in my bedroom and caught a field on fire sometime later. Sometime in between, I was caught with matches in my room, but not doing anything with them (yet). Again, nothing more than a childish facination, but could of let to very serious repercussions.

I don't feel a deep-seated need to argue with you about this, and I'm glad you didn't turn out to be a complete pyromaniac. That said, there are other ways to get a child to stop setting fires than spanking, and a 10-year-old is actually a big difference from an 8-year-old when it comes to both firestarting and reaction to spanking.

 

[Henry Ford]

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt.

So again, you're ok with a swat to the ### with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

I missed that. Who said that a hand is worse than a belt?

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt.

So again, you're ok with a swat to the ### with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

I missed that. Who said that a hand is worse than a belt?

mike tyson's kid

 

[gianmarco]

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt.

So again, you're ok with a swat to the ### with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

I missed that. Who said that a hand is worse than a belt?

mike tyson's kid

And Otis's.

 

[Christo]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

 

[Gr00vus]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

Yeah, that second one is pretty goofy on its face. I wonder how it relates to the actual study. I don't really have the time to read the study though.

 

[12punch]

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt. So again, you're ok with a swat to the ### with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

I missed that. Who said that a hand is worse than a belt?

This is the part where he gets you to agree to the open hand then reveals the gotcha is it's bruce lee hitting you 1000x

 

[Boomer1]

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt.

So again, you're ok with a swat to the ### with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

I missed that. Who said that a hand is worse than a belt?

I'm not going back through this whole mess to look for it but it was mentioned a couple times. I believe it was the personal nature of using a hand vs an inanimate object. It was not based on level of pain administered.

 

[Boomer1]

The use of a hand vs belt? Yes - especially since some have come out with the opinion the hand is WORSE than a belt. So again, you're ok with a swat to the ### with the hand, but not a belt? Just trying to figure out where you you stand with the severe corporal punishment thing.

I missed that. Who said that a hand is worse than a belt?

This is the part where he gets you to agree to the open hand then reveals the gotcha is it's bruce lee hitting you 1000x

 

[Apple Jack]

Love Hannity's "I was hit and I turned out fine" line. Actually, you turned out as one of the biggest ###holes on the planet, but easy mistake when you're that clueless about the nature of human existence.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You know what else works great?

Actually parenting your child before he lights a fire three times. Perhaps introducing the dangers of fire at an earlier age. Following up on it at a later stage and even having ongoing discussions with him about said dangers every time you guys have a fire in the fireplace, or outside in the firepit. Show him where you have smoke detectors and why. Have him help test them. Then make sure he isn't stockpiling matches to play with, then taking action the first time if he somehow got a hold of them without your knowledge and lit something on fire.

Or you could wait til the third time, smack the kid around and call it a day.

 

[Boomer1]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You know what else works great?

Actually parenting your child before he lights a fire three times. Perhaps introducing the dangers of fire at an earlier age. Following up on it at a later stage and even having ongoing discussions with him about said dangers every time you guys have a fire in the fireplace, or outside in the firepit. Show him where you have smoke detectors and why. Have him help test them. Then make sure he isn't stockpiling matches to play with, then taking action the first time if he somehow got a hold of them without your knowledge and lit something on fire.

Or you could wait til the third time, smack the kid around and call it a day.

Parenting or lack of was not an issue. I had an obvious facination with fire for a very brief period, My guess is that "teaching me" with a fire pitwould have fuel my inquisitive nature. I'm fairly certain, I understood the danger, but just didn't care.

And there we go go with the sensationalism, smack the kid around and call it a day. This really makes you look stupid. If you have the inability to hold an adult conversation, please say so.

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done and how it would not be tolerated.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Love Hannity's "I was hit and I turned out fine" line. Actually, you turned out as one of the biggest ###holes on the planet, but easy mistake when you're that clueless about the nature of human existence.

 

[Gr00vus]

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done..

So it's possible that spanking didn't have anything to do with you figuring out you shouldn't be messing with fire. Interesting.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

well, to be fair to the study, you and the original linker, like a lot of people, have causality and correlation confused.

 

[Boomer1]

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done..

So it's possible that spanking didn't have anything to do with you figuring out you shouldn't be messing with fire. Interesting.

Entirely possible, but doubtful. As I explained above, I'm fairly certain I knew the dangers (as much as a 8-10 y/o could). Its also possible that without a spanking, my next experiment would have resulted in far worse than curtains or and empty field.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done..

So it's possible that spanking didn't have anything to do with you figuring out you shouldn't be messing with fire. Interesting.

Entirely possible, but doubtful. As I explained above, I'm fairly certain I knew the dangers (as much as a 8-10 y/o could). Its also possible that without a spanking, my next experiment would have resulted in far worse than curtains or and empty field.

a lot of kids that age play with fire, and most just lose interest.

it's certainly possible you would've burned your town down, but unlikely.

like I posted pages ago, millions of parents manage to parent their kids without beating them.

the people who were at the business end of the belt as kids may have simply lacked respect for their parents, and there may be a reason for that.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You know what else works great?

Actually parenting your child before he lights a fire three times. Perhaps introducing the dangers of fire at an earlier age. Following up on it at a later stage and even having ongoing discussions with him about said dangers every time you guys have a fire in the fireplace, or outside in the firepit. Show him where you have smoke detectors and why. Have him help test them. Then make sure he isn't stockpiling matches to play with, then taking action the first time if he somehow got a hold of them without your knowledge and lit something on fire.

Or you could wait til the third time, smack the kid around and call it a day.

Parenting or lack of was not an issue. I had an obvious facination with fire for a very brief period, My guess is that "teaching me" with a fire pitwould have fuel my inquisitive nature. I'm fairly certain, I understood the danger, but just didn't care.

And there we go go with the sensationalism, smack the kid around and call it a day. This really makes you look stupid. If you have the inability to hold an adult conversation, please say so.

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done and how it would not be tolerated.

In your opinion, spanking is a valid form of parenting. You also think it is effective.

Why did you have three incidents if lack of parenting wasn't the issue? Why didn't you get spanked day 1 and have it be over with? Youa re basically saying that your parents didn't parent you until it happened a few times.

It is kind of hard to have an adult conversation with somebody that wants to just keep making stuff up regarding a situation you cant even remember how old you were.

ETA: as far as the sensationalism is concerned you still simply don't get it. I refuse to believe that an 8 year old kid that knows what he is doing is wrong suddenly wises up because the spanking he received was such a "shock" to him. If it was going to have an effect on you, it would have to hurt like hell. If it hurt like hell, well you just got smacked around. There is no other way to put it. Your silly little "it is so shocking" BS isn't believable. It is complete crap.

 

[Gr00vus]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

well, to be fair to the study, you and the original linker, like a lot of people, have causality and correlation confused.

Actually I'm pretty sure both Christo and I understand the difference between causation and correlation. I was just copying/paraphrasing the language in the articles - at no point did I say I agreed with any of it.

 

[Boomer1]

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done..

So it's possible that spanking didn't have anything to do with you figuring out you shouldn't be messing with fire. Interesting.

Entirely possible, but doubtful. As I explained above, I'm fairly certain I knew the dangers (as much as a 8-10 y/o could). Its also possible that without a spanking, my next experiment would have resulted in far worse than curtains or and empty field.

a lot of kids that age play with fire, and most just lose interest.

it's certainly possible you would've burned your town down, but unlikely.

like I posted pages ago, millions of parents manage to parent their kids without beating them.

the people who were at the business end of the belt as kids may have simply lacked respect for fear of consequenses from their parents, and there may be a reason for that.

Fixed.

In my case, I believe this may be the underlying issue. There was ALWAY a repercussion for my action but I did not fear it, This maybe due to not having a father figure in the house.

This same attitude carried on throughout my teen years, I understood the consequeneses, but felt they came with the territory.

 

[top dog]

Is it ok to smash a kid over the head with a plastic laundry basket and then get in their face and tell them any time they REALLY DO think they are bad enough to take out their old man go ahead and take that swing?

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

well, to be fair to the study, you and the original linker, like a lot of people, have causality and correlation confused.

Actually I'm pretty sure both Christo and I understand the difference between causation and correlation. I was just copying/paraphrasing the language in the articles - at no point did I say I agreed with any of it.

yeah, that was my point.

 

[Boomer1]

Question for those opposed to spanking. How would you deal with a child (say 10 y/o) who repeatedly plays with fire? He has already caught the curtains on fire once, you've caught him in his room with matches again after this? He does not have fear of retribution, does not play video games.

Please keep the "just beat him or cut his hands off comments to yourself", they do nothing to help your position, just show you can only deal in extremes.

10 is a big deal. If that's the actual age of the kid, I say get him into counseling immediately. A 10-year old has the capacity to understand consequences and be able to make basic judgments about things. A child playing with fire at 10 can be very dangerous now and in the future.

If it's not the case that he simply overestimates his ability to control the fire, or if it goes deeper than that (and it sounds like it may, given that you've caught him with matches since), there are probably much bigger things that need to be addressed.

As far as spanking goes, I seriously doubt it would keep him from being fascinated with fire, unless it's a bad enough spanking to strike legitimate fear of you into his heart. In which case, it's probably not terribly healthy long term and may actually make the fire-setting worse given the possible motivations for it.

Where is he getting matches?

I'm the kid in the above scenerio and could be off a little on the age, maybe 8 y/o. It had nothing to do with facination of fire or any other phyco babble, Dr. Phil stuff, I was a child who need to be spanked plane and simple. Without the spanking, who knows what I would have burnt down. I quickly learned that fire = pain to the backside and it ended my pyro career (after catching the grass field on fire behind my house).

Thankfully this level of punishment has never been needed on my kids, but if ever in their lives, I thought it was warrented to prevent harm to them or anyone else, it would have been an option on the table.

You know what else works great?

Actually parenting your child before he lights a fire three times. Perhaps introducing the dangers of fire at an earlier age. Following up on it at a later stage and even having ongoing discussions with him about said dangers every time you guys have a fire in the fireplace, or outside in the firepit. Show him where you have smoke detectors and why. Have him help test them. Then make sure he isn't stockpiling matches to play with, then taking action the first time if he somehow got a hold of them without your knowledge and lit something on fire.

Or you could wait til the third time, smack the kid around and call it a day.

Parenting or lack of was not an issue. I had an obvious facination with fire for a very brief period, My guess is that "teaching me" with a fire pitwould have fuel my inquisitive nature. I'm fairly certain, I understood the danger, but just didn't care.

And there we go go with the sensationalism, smack the kid around and call it a day. This really makes you look stupid. If you have the inability to hold an adult conversation, please say so.

Not that I remember the exact occurance but suspect it went much like the other times, there was a long conversation prior to the spanking, ensuring I understood the seriousness of what I'd done. Later in the evening once things calmed down, more conversation speaking to the severity of what I'd done and how it would not be tolerated.

In your opinion, spanking is a valid form of parenting. You also think it is effective.

Why did you have three incidents if lack of parenting wasn't the issue? Why didn't you get spanked day 1 and have it be over with? Youa re basically saying that your parents didn't parent you until it happened a few times.

It is kind of hard to have an adult conversation with somebody that wants to just keep making stuff up regarding a situation you cant even remember how old you were.

ETA: as far as the sensationalism is concerned you still simply don't get it. I refuse to believe that an 8 year old kid that knows what he is doing is wrong suddenly wises up because the spanking he received was such a "shock" to him. If it was going to have an effect on you, it would have to hurt like hell. If it hurt like hell, well you just got smacked around. There is no other way to put it. Your silly little "it is so shocking" BS isn't believable. It is complete crap.

You are confusing my childhood where spanking occured which involved pain, and IMO were warrented as a means to end a destructive situation, with my kids spanking, which amounted to a swat or two on the ###, very little pain, more shock, but due to their personality, just as effective.

Also - Not sure why you find it hard to believe that an 8 year old associates the spanking they received with the action that caused it, especially when it was explained before and after.

 

[Gr00vus]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

well, to be fair to the study, you and the original linker, like a lot of people, have causality and correlation confused.

Actually I'm pretty sure both Christo and I understand the difference between causation and correlation. I was just copying/paraphrasing the language in the articles - at no point did I say I agreed with any of it.

yeah, that was my point.

You're not making it very well.

From the 2nd linked article:

STUDY: Being spanked as a child could lead to higher cancer risk

From the 4th linked article:

Studies Show Spanking Children Ineffective, Making Them Aggressive and Depressed

Causation is suggested in both headlines.

 

[Christo]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

well, to be fair to the study, you and the original linker, like a lot of people, have causality and correlation confused.

I don't think the study deserves to be treated fairly.

A study done by Plymouth University's School of Psychology says hitting or yelling can increase a child's stress. Researchers found increased stress can trigger biological changes that could lead to health issues later in life.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I think an interesting follow on poll would explore the correlation between those who think belting/spanking/etc. are o.k. and those who were belted/spanked/etc. as kids. I have a hunch there'd be a pretty strong correlation. I did a quick google search to see if any studies have been done on that and came up empty. But the results did turn up some other interesting reading:

Kids who were spanked have lower IQs.

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

Spanking ineffective in correcting behavior and and can lead to depression and anxiety in kids.

Spanking causes all kinds of behavioral problems.

Some handwaving combined with some more serious study in the above links.

Hell, that second one says yelling can cause cancer.

well, to be fair to the study, you and the original linker, like a lot of people, have causality and correlation confused.

Actually I'm pretty sure both Christo and I understand the difference between causation and correlation. I was just copying/paraphrasing the language in the articles - at no point did I say I agreed with any of it.

yeah, that was my point.

You're not making it very well.

From the 2nd linked article:

STUDY: Being spanked as a child could lead to higher cancer risk

From the 4th linked article:

Studies Show Spanking Children Ineffective, Making Them Aggressive and Depressed

Causation is suggested in both headlines.

I was commenting specifically on the cancer one.

I didn't read the study, but the little sensationalized blurb that you linked was titled

Being spanked as a child could lead to higher cancer riskomgfont

I don't know if this was the actual conclusion of the study, but from teh study to the blurb it became a possibility of causation, as is always the case with correlation, to your further paraphrasing of

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

again, I didn't read the study, but I doubt that was their conclusion, and is evidently more your confusion.

 

[Abraham]

I had spankings as a kid, but no belt. My friend Corey got the belt every night as did his brother and little sister. The day had a tally, and they each got their licks at night.

Now that I'm a parent, I can't imagine a scenario where a spanking or lashing isn't more damaging to the parent then the kid.

 

[Gr00vus]

I was commenting specifically on the cancer one.

I didn't read the study, but the little sensationalized blurb that you linked was titled

Being spanked as a child could lead to higher cancer risk
omgfont

I don't know if this was the actual conclusion of the study, but from teh study to the blurb it became a possibility of causation, as is always the case with correlation, to your further paraphrasing of

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

again, I didn't read the study, but I doubt that was their conclusion, and is evidently more your confusion.

The text of the articles do state correlation. The sensationalist headlines imply causation - that was the whole ####### point of my paraphrasing, highlighting the silliness of how the studies are presented. I was kinda hoping it would lead people to read the actual text and get the real info (or at least what passed for info in the articles).

But I am sorry, to be completely accurate in my mockery, I should have stated "Spanking could cause cancer and asthma." Rock on captain pedantic - keep playing with your new found "causation != correlation" toy. That never gets old and always informs the discussion at hand invaluably.

 

[Henry Ford]

I had spankings as a kid, but no belt. My friend Corey got the belt every night as did his brother and little sister. The day had a tally, and they each got their licks at night. Now that I'm a parent, I can't imagine a scenario where a spanking or lashing isn't more damaging to the parent then the kid.

Sounds like a failure of imagination

 

[Abraham]

Really? My kid is 2 and I constantly remind myself that when she misbehaves she isn't doing it on purpose bit rather because she doesn't know. In sure that will change.

 

[parasaurolophus]

You are confusing my childhood where spanking occured which involved pain, and IMO were warrented as a means to end a destructive situation, with my kids spanking, which amounted to a swat or two on the ###, very little pain, more shock, but due to their personality, just as effective.

Also - Not sure why you find it hard to believe that an 8 year old associates the spanking they received with the action that caused it, especially when it was explained before and after.

You are again dodging my point. If the 8 year old is to take it seriously and have it affect his behavior it has got to hurt. Period. If you are hurting your child, you are a bad parent.

 

[Christo]

You are confusing my childhood where spanking occured which involved pain, and IMO were warrented as a means to end a destructive situation, with my kids spanking, which amounted to a swat or two on the ###, very little pain, more shock, but due to their personality, just as effective.

Also - Not sure why you find it hard to believe that an 8 year old associates the spanking they received with the action that caused it, especially when it was explained before and after.

You are again dodging my point. If the 8 year old is to take it seriously and have it affect his behavior it has got to hurt. Period. If you are hurting your child, you are a bad parent.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I was commenting specifically on the cancer one.

I didn't read the study, but the little sensationalized blurb that you linked was titled

Being spanked as a child could lead to higher cancer riskomgfont

I don't know if this was the actual conclusion of the study, but from teh study to the blurb it became a possibility of causation, as is always the case with correlation, to your further paraphrasing of

Spanking causes cancer and asthma.

again, I didn't read the study, but I doubt that was their conclusion, and is evidently more your confusion.

The text of the articles do state correlation. The sensationalist headlines imply causation - that was the whole ####### point of my paraphrasing, highlighting the silliness of how the studies are presented. I was kinda hoping it would lead people to read the actual text and get the real info (or at least what passed for info in the articles).

But I am sorry, to be completely accurate in my mockery, I should have stated "Spanking could cause cancer and asthma." Rock on captain pedantic - keep playing with your new found "causation != correlation" toy. That never gets old and always informs the discussion at hand invaluably.

dude, you don't have to get defensive about it.

were you one of these people who got belted as a kid?

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

I had spankings as a kid, but no belt. My friend Corey got the belt every night as did his brother and little sister. The day had a tally, and they each got their licks at night.

Now that I'm a parent, I can't imagine a scenario where a spanking or lashing isn't more damaging to the parent then the kid.

what about if the belt had little spikes on it?

 

[Gr00vus]

dude, you don't have to get defensive about it.

were you one of these people who got belted as a kid?

Opposite. I guess I needed more spankings.

 

[Henry Ford]

Really? My kid is 2 and I constantly remind myself that when she misbehaves she isn't doing it on purpose bit rather because she doesn't know. In sure that will change.

You sound like a good parent. Not everyone is. Many bad parents hurt their kids more than themselves.

 

[Abraham]

Really? My kid is 2 and I constantly remind myself that when she misbehaves she isn't doing it on purpose bit rather because she doesn't know. In sure that will change.

You sound like a good parent. Not everyone is. Many bad parents hurt their kids more than themselves.

Thanks. I can't imagine a scenario where I would hurt her to make a point.