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Official 2023-2024 Subscriber Post Season/Playoffs Contest (1 Viewer)

I've never done this contest before for some reason. @TheWinz a little help here? Any major structural concerns with this?

In the Wildcard round, you have:​


Amari Cooper - WR - CLE
Jordan Love - QB - GB
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Matthew Stafford - QB - LAR
Cooper Kupp - WR - LAR
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI


In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:​


Joe Flacco - QB - CLE
Tony Pollard - RB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Jared Goff - QB - DET
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Travis Kelce - TE - KC


In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:​


Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Isaiah Likely - TE - BAL
James Cook - RB - BUF
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF


In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:​


Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
George Kittle - TE - SF
 
Hey @Contest Turk just a question if you don't mind. With so many folks thinking there is a winning strategy using this format, how many duplicate teams were there last year?

Zero duplicates. Round 1 takes care of that. But Turk did put together a tool which grouped your final six. It was at that point you had numerous teams that were covered (same players the rest of the way and behind in points) or teams that were the same in the last two rounds and the title shot for those two teams would be determine by players in round 2.
Yes, I remember the final 6 groupings last year. I just forgot if there were any exact 24's?
 
I've never done this contest before for some reason. @TheWinz a little help here? Any major structural concerns with this?

In the Wildcard round, you have:​


Amari Cooper - WR - CLE
Jordan Love - QB - GB
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Matthew Stafford - QB - LAR
Cooper Kupp - WR - LAR
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI


In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:​


Joe Flacco - QB - CLE
Tony Pollard - RB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Jared Goff - QB - DET
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Travis Kelce - TE - KC


In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:​


Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Isaiah Likely - TE - BAL
James Cook - RB - BUF
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF


In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:​


Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
George Kittle - TE - SF
Looks fine, but you forgot to use TJ Houshmazoo in the Championship!
 
My main advice (to everyone, and to @Deamon in particular) is to pick fewer games, and probably also more upsets.

e.g., Take a QB-WR stack in the divisional round instead of two different QBs. Instead of taking Flacco+Goff, go with either Flacco+Cooper or Goff+ARSB, so that you're only counting on either CLE or DET to win rather than both. That way you're picking one less game.

There are 4 main things to aim for with your entry:

1. A relatively high chance of hitting on your bracket so that you get no (or almost no) zeros.
2. Relatively few other entries also hit on their bracket, in the cases where you do hit on yours.
3. Players that are expected to score lots of points, if you hit on your bracket & they actually play that week.
4. Some distinctiveness in players on your roster, compared to the other teams whose bracket hits when yours hits, especially if there are lots of those other teams

Skipping games helps a lot with point 1, and some with 2 & 4. The main advantage is that it's one less game where you can bust (e.g. your bracket stays intact no matter who wins DET-LAR if you skip that game). This can also help you face fewer intact brackets when you do hit on yours because an upset that spoils a lot of brackets won't mess up yours, and you'll get some player distinctiveness because you have to take players on other teams while the rosters that made the correct call on the game you skipped will have players on the winning team (probably mostly their QB).

Skipping games hurts you some on point 3, because you have a smaller player pool to pick from. But with reduced QB scoring this year, the first couple games that you skip hurt your expected scoring very little, because the top non-QBs score about as much as a typical QB. e.g., By ppg, ARSB actually outscored Flacco by half a point per game this year, and Amari Cooper was only 2 ppg behind Goff. Also, players tend to score more fantasy points when their team wins, and skipping some games can let you pick more players in games that their team wins rather than in games that you're counting on them to lose.

If you pick the favorite in all 12 games you'll have about a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket (that is, 0.5% of the time all 12 favorites will win). But if that happens then you'll be facing off against a bunch of other teams who also have intact brackets, because the favorites are very popular picks. If you skip multiple games you can get your chances of an intact bracket to better than 1/100. If you skip some games and pick some underdogs, then you can still have better than a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket, while substantially reducing the number of teams that will also have an intact bracket when you do.
 
I applaud you on the scoring change to give RB 1 PPR (now please do this for the season long contest next year as well too)

I do not like that you only give 0.04 per yard passing I think that should always be 0.05

I also do not like -2 for each INT (I think that should be -1)

Just my opinion.
 
My main advice (to everyone, and to @Deamon in particular) is to pick fewer games, and probably also more upsets.

e.g., Take a QB-WR stack in the divisional round instead of two different QBs. Instead of taking Flacco+Goff, go with either Flacco+Cooper or Goff+ARSB, so that you're only counting on either CLE or DET to win rather than both. That way you're picking one less game.

There are 4 main things to aim for with your entry:

1. A relatively high chance of hitting on your bracket so that you get no (or almost no) zeros.
2. Relatively few other entries also hit on their bracket, in the cases where you do hit on yours.
3. Players that are expected to score lots of points, if you hit on your bracket & they actually play that week.
4. Some distinctiveness in players on your roster, compared to the other teams whose bracket hits when yours hits, especially if there are lots of those other teams

Skipping games helps a lot with point 1, and some with 2 & 4. The main advantage is that it's one less game where you can bust (e.g. your bracket stays intact no matter who wins DET-LAR if you skip that game). This can also help you face fewer intact brackets when you do hit on yours because an upset that spoils a lot of brackets won't mess up yours, and you'll get some player distinctiveness because you have to take players on other teams while the rosters that made the correct call on the game you skipped will have players on the winning team (probably mostly their QB).

Skipping games hurts you some on point 3, because you have a smaller player pool to pick from. But with reduced QB scoring this year, the first couple games that you skip hurt your expected scoring very little, because the top non-QBs score about as much as a typical QB. e.g., By ppg, ARSB actually outscored Flacco by half a point per game this year, and Amari Cooper was only 2 ppg behind Goff. Also, players tend to score more fantasy points when their team wins, and skipping some games can let you pick more players in games that their team wins rather than in games that you're counting on them to lose.

If you pick the favorite in all 12 games you'll have about a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket (that is, 0.5% of the time all 12 favorites will win). But if that happens then you'll be facing off against a bunch of other teams who also have intact brackets, because the favorites are very popular picks. If you skip multiple games you can get your chances of an intact bracket to better than 1/100. If you skip some games and pick some underdogs, then you can still have better than a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket, while substantially reducing the number of teams that will also have an intact bracket when you do.
How I'm reacting to your comments....let's say you and I correctly pick the SB contestants and are mostly a wash in the last two rounds....there are two schools of thought: 1. I should rely on the power of correlation and pick stacks in the early rounds, or 2. I should rely on the relative stability of scoring from the QB position and maximize QB count in the early rounds. I'm not sure which is the more sound approach but it occurs to me if you are relying on picking the correct early round stacks you have just decreased your overall probability of picking correctly for the duration of the rounds. I suppose there are enough entries to where someone will pursue your approach and NAIL the early round stacks, but you just made it harder to do, dammit! :D

Oh and I suppose there is a category three, which is to generally maximize early qb count, but then to have specific exceptions. Tyreek Hill comes to mind. Unless its 40 degrees below zero.
 
My main advice (to everyone, and to @Deamon in particular) is to pick fewer games, and probably also more upsets.

e.g., Take a QB-WR stack in the divisional round instead of two different QBs. Instead of taking Flacco+Goff, go with either Flacco+Cooper or Goff+ARSB, so that you're only counting on either CLE or DET to win rather than both. That way you're picking one less game.

There are 4 main things to aim for with your entry:

1. A relatively high chance of hitting on your bracket so that you get no (or almost no) zeros.
2. Relatively few other entries also hit on their bracket, in the cases where you do hit on yours.
3. Players that are expected to score lots of points, if you hit on your bracket & they actually play that week.
4. Some distinctiveness in players on your roster, compared to the other teams whose bracket hits when yours hits, especially if there are lots of those other teams

Skipping games helps a lot with point 1, and some with 2 & 4. The main advantage is that it's one less game where you can bust (e.g. your bracket stays intact no matter who wins DET-LAR if you skip that game). This can also help you face fewer intact brackets when you do hit on yours because an upset that spoils a lot of brackets won't mess up yours, and you'll get some player distinctiveness because you have to take players on other teams while the rosters that made the correct call on the game you skipped will have players on the winning team (probably mostly their QB).

Skipping games hurts you some on point 3, because you have a smaller player pool to pick from. But with reduced QB scoring this year, the first couple games that you skip hurt your expected scoring very little, because the top non-QBs score about as much as a typical QB. e.g., By ppg, ARSB actually outscored Flacco by half a point per game this year, and Amari Cooper was only 2 ppg behind Goff. Also, players tend to score more fantasy points when their team wins, and skipping some games can let you pick more players in games that their team wins rather than in games that you're counting on them to lose.

If you pick the favorite in all 12 games you'll have about a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket (that is, 0.5% of the time all 12 favorites will win). But if that happens then you'll be facing off against a bunch of other teams who also have intact brackets, because the favorites are very popular picks. If you skip multiple games you can get your chances of an intact bracket to better than 1/100. If you skip some games and pick some underdogs, then you can still have better than a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket, while substantially reducing the number of teams that will also have an intact bracket when you do.
How I'm reacting to your comments....let's say you and I correctly pick the SB contestants and are mostly a wash in the last two rounds....there are two schools of thought: 1. I should rely on the power of correlation and pick stacks in the early rounds, or 2. I should rely on the relative stability of scoring from the QB position and maximize QB count in the early rounds. I'm not sure which is the more sound approach but it occurs to me if you are relying on picking the correct early round stacks you have just decreased your overall probability of picking correctly for the duration of the rounds. I suppose there are enough entries to where someone will pursue your approach and NAIL the early round stacks, but you just made it harder to do, dammit! :D

Oh and I suppose there is a category three, which is to generally maximize early qb count, but then to have specific exceptions. Tyreek Hill comes to mind. Unless its 40 degrees below zero.
Let's say that we have similar rosters, almost entirely picking the same teams, with some differences in players. Except, in the divisional round you have Goff & Flacco, while I have Flacco & Amari Cooper.

If DET & CLE both win in the wild card round, then you probably have a very slight edge on me in the divisional round. Maybe 2 points higher projections, let's say a 55% chance that you outscore me. Though I probably have a higher upside, because Flacco & Cooper both having a huge game in the same week. So this scenario is maybe a wash, maybe a slight edge for one of us, I don't know. It's not the main reason in favor of stacking.

If CLE wins and DET loses, then I have a significant edge on you in the divisional round. You are taking a zero and I am not; I have Amari Cooper to your Goff zero. This is the great thing about concentrating on some teams and skipping over others - it increases my chances of making it through the whole contest unscathed by any zeros. This is why my main piece of advice is to pick fewer games.

If DET wins and CLE loses, then you have a significant edge on me but it doesn't matter much. You are taking a zero (from Flacco) and I am taking 2 zeros (from both Flacco & Cooper). But we're both are in fairly rough shape for winning the whole contest, even if we hit on the rest of our bracket, because probably there are a bunch of teams out there who didn't take any zeros.

If DET & CLE both lose then we are both in pretty bad shape, taking two zeros each, and very unlikely to win the contest.
 
My main advice (to everyone, and to @Deamon in particular) is to pick fewer games, and probably also more upsets.

e.g., Take a QB-WR stack in the divisional round instead of two different QBs. Instead of taking Flacco+Goff, go with either Flacco+Cooper or Goff+ARSB, so that you're only counting on either CLE or DET to win rather than both. That way you're picking one less game.

There are 4 main things to aim for with your entry:

1. A relatively high chance of hitting on your bracket so that you get no (or almost no) zeros.
2. Relatively few other entries also hit on their bracket, in the cases where you do hit on yours.
3. Players that are expected to score lots of points, if you hit on your bracket & they actually play that week.
4. Some distinctiveness in players on your roster, compared to the other teams whose bracket hits when yours hits, especially if there are lots of those other teams

Skipping games helps a lot with point 1, and some with 2 & 4. The main advantage is that it's one less game where you can bust (e.g. your bracket stays intact no matter who wins DET-LAR if you skip that game). This can also help you face fewer intact brackets when you do hit on yours because an upset that spoils a lot of brackets won't mess up yours, and you'll get some player distinctiveness because you have to take players on other teams while the rosters that made the correct call on the game you skipped will have players on the winning team (probably mostly their QB).

Skipping games hurts you some on point 3, because you have a smaller player pool to pick from. But with reduced QB scoring this year, the first couple games that you skip hurt your expected scoring very little, because the top non-QBs score about as much as a typical QB. e.g., By ppg, ARSB actually outscored Flacco by half a point per game this year, and Amari Cooper was only 2 ppg behind Goff. Also, players tend to score more fantasy points when their team wins, and skipping some games can let you pick more players in games that their team wins rather than in games that you're counting on them to lose.

If you pick the favorite in all 12 games you'll have about a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket (that is, 0.5% of the time all 12 favorites will win). But if that happens then you'll be facing off against a bunch of other teams who also have intact brackets, because the favorites are very popular picks. If you skip multiple games you can get your chances of an intact bracket to better than 1/100. If you skip some games and pick some underdogs, then you can still have better than a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket, while substantially reducing the number of teams that will also have an intact bracket when you do.
How I'm reacting to your comments....let's say you and I correctly pick the SB contestants and are mostly a wash in the last two rounds....there are two schools of thought: 1. I should rely on the power of correlation and pick stacks in the early rounds, or 2. I should rely on the relative stability of scoring from the QB position and maximize QB count in the early rounds. I'm not sure which is the more sound approach but it occurs to me if you are relying on picking the correct early round stacks you have just decreased your overall probability of picking correctly for the duration of the rounds. I suppose there are enough entries to where someone will pursue your approach and NAIL the early round stacks, but you just made it harder to do, dammit! :D

Oh and I suppose there is a category three, which is to generally maximize early qb count, but then to have specific exceptions. Tyreek Hill comes to mind. Unless its 40 degrees below zero.
Let's say that we have similar rosters, almost entirely picking the same teams, with some differences in players. Except, in the divisional round you have Goff & Flacco, while I have Flacco & Amari Cooper.

If DET & CLE both win in the wild card round, then you probably have a very slight edge on me in the divisional round. Maybe 2 points higher projections, let's say a 55% chance that you outscore me. Though I probably have a higher upside, because Flacco & Cooper both having a huge game in the same week. So this scenario is maybe a wash, maybe a slight edge for one of us, I don't know. It's not the main reason in favor of stacking.

If CLE wins and DET loses, then I have a significant edge on you in the divisional round. You are taking a zero and I am not; I have Amari Cooper to your Goff zero. This is the great thing about concentrating on some teams and skipping over others - it increases my chances of making it through the whole contest unscathed by any zeros. This is why my main piece of advice is to pick fewer games.

If DET wins and CLE loses, then you have a significant edge on me but it doesn't matter much. You are taking a zero (from Flacco) and I am taking 2 zeros (from both Flacco & Cooper). But we're both are in fairly rough shape for winning the whole contest, even if we hit on the rest of our bracket, because probably there are a bunch of teams out there who didn't take any zeros.

If DET & CLE both lose then we are both in pretty bad shape, taking two zeros each, and very unlikely to win the contest.
As I recall, last year the winning team had some zeros in round 2 and I know I had a winning route in my bracket of 6 with zeros in week 2. I think where your thought might come into play is if Purdy/Cmac/Deebo are within a few points of Purdy/CMac/Aiyuk in the final round.

By the way, very good read.

I do have one question, how does a Flacco/Cooper in round one help you in round two if you can't use them? Seems like you would want someone from Houston like Stroud and save Cooper for round two. If you really want to pick fewer games then you want some of your SB team player going in round 3. This will push some of your round 3 picks into round 2. Is it possible to come up with a decent submission from just four teams across rounds 2-4 and use the best players from the remaining teams in round one? If you were come up short on good picks from 4 teams, you could sprinkle in players from a big favorite like Buffalo and Dallas in round 2 if you didn't have them in your final four teams.
 
My main advice (to everyone, and to @Deamon in particular) is to pick fewer games, and probably also more upsets.

e.g., Take a QB-WR stack in the divisional round instead of two different QBs. Instead of taking Flacco+Goff, go with either Flacco+Cooper or Goff+ARSB, so that you're only counting on either CLE or DET to win rather than both. That way you're picking one less game.

There are 4 main things to aim for with your entry:

1. A relatively high chance of hitting on your bracket so that you get no (or almost no) zeros.
2. Relatively few other entries also hit on their bracket, in the cases where you do hit on yours.
3. Players that are expected to score lots of points, if you hit on your bracket & they actually play that week.
4. Some distinctiveness in players on your roster, compared to the other teams whose bracket hits when yours hits, especially if there are lots of those other teams

Skipping games helps a lot with point 1, and some with 2 & 4. The main advantage is that it's one less game where you can bust (e.g. your bracket stays intact no matter who wins DET-LAR if you skip that game). This can also help you face fewer intact brackets when you do hit on yours because an upset that spoils a lot of brackets won't mess up yours, and you'll get some player distinctiveness because you have to take players on other teams while the rosters that made the correct call on the game you skipped will have players on the winning team (probably mostly their QB).

Skipping games hurts you some on point 3, because you have a smaller player pool to pick from. But with reduced QB scoring this year, the first couple games that you skip hurt your expected scoring very little, because the top non-QBs score about as much as a typical QB. e.g., By ppg, ARSB actually outscored Flacco by half a point per game this year, and Amari Cooper was only 2 ppg behind Goff. Also, players tend to score more fantasy points when their team wins, and skipping some games can let you pick more players in games that their team wins rather than in games that you're counting on them to lose.

If you pick the favorite in all 12 games you'll have about a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket (that is, 0.5% of the time all 12 favorites will win). But if that happens then you'll be facing off against a bunch of other teams who also have intact brackets, because the favorites are very popular picks. If you skip multiple games you can get your chances of an intact bracket to better than 1/100. If you skip some games and pick some underdogs, then you can still have better than a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket, while substantially reducing the number of teams that will also have an intact bracket when you do.
How I'm reacting to your comments....let's say you and I correctly pick the SB contestants and are mostly a wash in the last two rounds....there are two schools of thought: 1. I should rely on the power of correlation and pick stacks in the early rounds, or 2. I should rely on the relative stability of scoring from the QB position and maximize QB count in the early rounds. I'm not sure which is the more sound approach but it occurs to me if you are relying on picking the correct early round stacks you have just decreased your overall probability of picking correctly for the duration of the rounds. I suppose there are enough entries to where someone will pursue your approach and NAIL the early round stacks, but you just made it harder to do, dammit! :D

Oh and I suppose there is a category three, which is to generally maximize early qb count, but then to have specific exceptions. Tyreek Hill comes to mind. Unless its 40 degrees below zero.
Let's say that we have similar rosters, almost entirely picking the same teams, with some differences in players. Except, in the divisional round you have Goff & Flacco, while I have Flacco & Amari Cooper.

If DET & CLE both win in the wild card round, then you probably have a very slight edge on me in the divisional round. Maybe 2 points higher projections, let's say a 55% chance that you outscore me. Though I probably have a higher upside, because Flacco & Cooper both having a huge game in the same week. So this scenario is maybe a wash, maybe a slight edge for one of us, I don't know. It's not the main reason in favor of stacking.

If CLE wins and DET loses, then I have a significant edge on you in the divisional round. You are taking a zero and I am not; I have Amari Cooper to your Goff zero. This is the great thing about concentrating on some teams and skipping over others - it increases my chances of making it through the whole contest unscathed by any zeros. This is why my main piece of advice is to pick fewer games.

If DET wins and CLE loses, then you have a significant edge on me but it doesn't matter much. You are taking a zero (from Flacco) and I am taking 2 zeros (from both Flacco & Cooper). But we're both are in fairly rough shape for winning the whole contest, even if we hit on the rest of our bracket, because probably there are a bunch of teams out there who didn't take any zeros.

If DET & CLE both lose then we are both in pretty bad shape, taking two zeros each, and very unlikely to win the contest.
As I recall, last year the winning team had some zeros in round 2 and I know I had a winning route in my bracket of 6 with zeros in week 2. I think where your thought might come into play is if Purdy/Cmac/Deebo are within a few points of Purdy/CMac/Aiyuk in the final round.

By the way, very good read.

I do have one question, how does a Flacco/Cooper in round one help you in round two if you can't use them? Seems like you would want someone from Houston like Stroud and save Cooper for round two. If you really want to pick fewer games then you want some of your SB team player going in round 3. This will push some of your round 3 picks into round 2. Is it possible to come up with a decent submission from just four teams across rounds 2-4 and use the best players from the remaining teams in round one? If you were come up short on good picks from 4 teams, you could sprinkle in players from a big favorite like Buffalo and Dallas in round 2 if you didn't have them in your final four teams.
Right, the idea is to take Flacco+Cooper in round 2, not in round 1. And to not take any DET or LAR players in round 2 or later, so that the result of the DET-LAR wild card game doesn't affect you.

My guess is that every entry is best off skipping at least 2 games (so picking at most 10 games).

How far can you push it? I think it could be viable to pick only 5 games and skip 7. You have 1 Super Bowl team, with 6 players from that team. Then one conference championship team from the other conference, with 4-6 players from that team and 0-2 from your Super Bowl team. Then 2 other teams in the divisional round, probably with 3 players from each. Something like this:

Super Bowl (6 SF): Purdy, CMC, Aiyuk, Deebo, Kittle, Niners D
Conference Championship (5 KC, 1 SF): Mahomes, Kelce, Rice, Pacheco, Chiefs D, Moody
Divisional (3 LAR, 3 BAL): Stafford, Nacua, Kyren Williams, Lamar, Likely, Flowers
Wild Card: whoever

So you're predicting a LAR wild card win, KC wild card & divisional wins, and SF Divisional & conf championship wins. There's about a 1/15 chance of those 5 games all going your way, and you could get as high as a 1/5 chance if you took all the biggest favorites.

In order to win, you also need some other things to go your way. You're hoping for there to be lots of upsets (which will thin your competition a lot) and one-sided games (such as a blowout Super Bowl win for San Francisco). e.g., If it's a SF-HOU Super Bowl then this roster might be in pretty great shape against a vastly narrowed field.

One worry is that you're digging a little deep on some of these players (e.g. two defenses & a kicker over the final 2 rounds). And if KC puts up big numbers in the conference championship game then probably they're in the Super Bowl, so why not just take some of their players then? Although the conference championship and Super Bowl multipliers aren't that different, so if Mahomes has a huge conference championship game and a mediocre Super Bowl game then it could be good that you're getting 3x his conference championship points instead of 5x his Super Bowl points. And if KC loses a conference championship shootout to Houston then you're golden.

So this isn't ideal in every way, but it does seem like there are plausible scenarios where it could come together well for this kind of roster. I'm not planning to push it quite this far, but this probably has a better shot at winning than a roster that picks all 12 games and is starting with a 1/200 chance of coming through unscathed rather than a 1/15 chance.
 
My main advice (to everyone, and to @Deamon in particular) is to pick fewer games, and probably also more upsets.

e.g., Take a QB-WR stack in the divisional round instead of two different QBs. Instead of taking Flacco+Goff, go with either Flacco+Cooper or Goff+ARSB, so that you're only counting on either CLE or DET to win rather than both. That way you're picking one less game.

There are 4 main things to aim for with your entry:

1. A relatively high chance of hitting on your bracket so that you get no (or almost no) zeros.
2. Relatively few other entries also hit on their bracket, in the cases where you do hit on yours.
3. Players that are expected to score lots of points, if you hit on your bracket & they actually play that week.
4. Some distinctiveness in players on your roster, compared to the other teams whose bracket hits when yours hits, especially if there are lots of those other teams

Skipping games helps a lot with point 1, and some with 2 & 4. The main advantage is that it's one less game where you can bust (e.g. your bracket stays intact no matter who wins DET-LAR if you skip that game). This can also help you face fewer intact brackets when you do hit on yours because an upset that spoils a lot of brackets won't mess up yours, and you'll get some player distinctiveness because you have to take players on other teams while the rosters that made the correct call on the game you skipped will have players on the winning team (probably mostly their QB).

Skipping games hurts you some on point 3, because you have a smaller player pool to pick from. But with reduced QB scoring this year, the first couple games that you skip hurt your expected scoring very little, because the top non-QBs score about as much as a typical QB. e.g., By ppg, ARSB actually outscored Flacco by half a point per game this year, and Amari Cooper was only 2 ppg behind Goff. Also, players tend to score more fantasy points when their team wins, and skipping some games can let you pick more players in games that their team wins rather than in games that you're counting on them to lose.

If you pick the favorite in all 12 games you'll have about a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket (that is, 0.5% of the time all 12 favorites will win). But if that happens then you'll be facing off against a bunch of other teams who also have intact brackets, because the favorites are very popular picks. If you skip multiple games you can get your chances of an intact bracket to better than 1/100. If you skip some games and pick some underdogs, then you can still have better than a 1/200 chance of an intact bracket, while substantially reducing the number of teams that will also have an intact bracket when you do.
How I'm reacting to your comments....let's say you and I correctly pick the SB contestants and are mostly a wash in the last two rounds....there are two schools of thought: 1. I should rely on the power of correlation and pick stacks in the early rounds, or 2. I should rely on the relative stability of scoring from the QB position and maximize QB count in the early rounds. I'm not sure which is the more sound approach but it occurs to me if you are relying on picking the correct early round stacks you have just decreased your overall probability of picking correctly for the duration of the rounds. I suppose there are enough entries to where someone will pursue your approach and NAIL the early round stacks, but you just made it harder to do, dammit! :D

Oh and I suppose there is a category three, which is to generally maximize early qb count, but then to have specific exceptions. Tyreek Hill comes to mind. Unless its 40 degrees below zero.
Let's say that we have similar rosters, almost entirely picking the same teams, with some differences in players. Except, in the divisional round you have Goff & Flacco, while I have Flacco & Amari Cooper.

If DET & CLE both win in the wild card round, then you probably have a very slight edge on me in the divisional round. Maybe 2 points higher projections, let's say a 55% chance that you outscore me. Though I probably have a higher upside, because Flacco & Cooper both having a huge game in the same week. So this scenario is maybe a wash, maybe a slight edge for one of us, I don't know. It's not the main reason in favor of stacking.

If CLE wins and DET loses, then I have a significant edge on you in the divisional round. You are taking a zero and I am not; I have Amari Cooper to your Goff zero. This is the great thing about concentrating on some teams and skipping over others - it increases my chances of making it through the whole contest unscathed by any zeros. This is why my main piece of advice is to pick fewer games.

If DET wins and CLE loses, then you have a significant edge on me but it doesn't matter much. You are taking a zero (from Flacco) and I am taking 2 zeros (from both Flacco & Cooper). But we're both are in fairly rough shape for winning the whole contest, even if we hit on the rest of our bracket, because probably there are a bunch of teams out there who didn't take any zeros.

If DET & CLE both lose then we are both in pretty bad shape, taking two zeros each, and very unlikely to win the contest.
As I recall, last year the winning team had some zeros in round 2 and I know I had a winning route in my bracket of 6 with zeros in week 2. I think where your thought might come into play is if Purdy/Cmac/Deebo are within a few points of Purdy/CMac/Aiyuk in the final round.

By the way, very good read.

I do have one question, how does a Flacco/Cooper in round one help you in round two if you can't use them? Seems like you would want someone from Houston like Stroud and save Cooper for round two. If you really want to pick fewer games then you want some of your SB team player going in round 3. This will push some of your round 3 picks into round 2. Is it possible to come up with a decent submission from just four teams across rounds 2-4 and use the best players from the remaining teams in round one? If you were come up short on good picks from 4 teams, you could sprinkle in players from a big favorite like Buffalo and Dallas in round 2 if you didn't have them in your final four teams.
Right, the idea is to take Flacco+Cooper in round 2, not in round 1. And to not take any DET or LAR players in round 2 or later, so that the result of the DET-LAR wild card game doesn't affect you.

My guess is that every entry is best off skipping at least 2 games (so picking at most 10 games).

How far can you push it? I think it could be viable to pick only 5 games and skip 7. You have 1 Super Bowl team, with 6 players from that team. Then one conference championship team from the other conference, with 4-6 players from that team and 0-2 from your Super Bowl team. Then 2 other teams in the divisional round, probably with 3 players from each. Something like this:

Super Bowl (6 SF): Purdy, CMC, Aiyuk, Deebo, Kittle, Niners D
Conference Championship (5 KC, 1 SF): Mahomes, Kelce, Rice, Pacheco, Chiefs D, Moody
Divisional (3 LAR, 3 BAL): Stafford, Nacua, Kyren Williams, Lamar, Likely, Flowers
Wild Card: whoever

So you're predicting a LAR wild card win, KC wild card & divisional wins, and SF Divisional & conf championship wins. There's about a 1/15 chance of those 5 games all going your way, and you could get as high as a 1/5 chance if you took all the biggest favorites.

In order to win, you also need some other things to go your way. You're hoping for there to be lots of upsets (which will thin your competition a lot) and one-sided games (such as a blowout Super Bowl win for San Francisco). e.g., If it's a SF-HOU Super Bowl then this roster might be in pretty great shape against a vastly narrowed field.

One worry is that you're digging a little deep on some of these players (e.g. two defenses & a kicker over the final 2 rounds). And if KC puts up big numbers in the conference championship game then probably they're in the Super Bowl, so why not just take some of their players then? Although the conference championship and Super Bowl multipliers aren't that different, so if Mahomes has a huge conference championship game and a mediocre Super Bowl game then it could be good that you're getting 3x his conference championship points instead of 5x his Super Bowl points. And if KC loses a conference championship shootout to Houston then you're golden.

So this isn't ideal in every way, but it does seem like there are plausible scenarios where it could come together well for this kind of roster. I'm not planning to push it quite this far, but this probably has a better shot at winning than a roster that picks all 12 games and is starting with a 1/200 chance of coming through unscathed rather than a 1/15 chance.
With the 5x multiplier I think you need at least one player for the opposite team.
 
Just wanted to add that I love the conversation. But, after a long day's thought, I figured out the winning formula, and will post my actual entry after the deadline.
 
Just wanted to add that I love the conversation. But, after a long day's thought, I figured out the winning formula, and will post my actual entry after the deadline.
I know your gonna have Kickers in your final iteration....after all your the Kicker whisperer!!! I think I may have one in mine as well.....
 
Right, the idea is to take Flacco+Cooper in round 2, not in round 1. And to not take any DET or LAR players in round 2 or later, so that the result of the DET-LAR wild card game doesn't affect you.

Wait...what? Who are you then taking in round 1? A stack from the losing team? Goff / St Ra? Are both strategies the same....you take the losers in the round they lose in and take the winners as late as you think they will be around? Because in that general framework there are a lot of losing QBs early on....and QBs tend to have higher raw scores.....
 
I haven't been talking about who to pick in the wild card round, but my strategy leaves you with a bigger pool of options for the wild card round so it should let you do at least as well there.

(Out of the pool that you haven't used for later rounds) Maybe you can just take the highest projected guys. Maybe you adjust the projections downward for players on teams that you've picked to lose that week, so that you're projecting them for how many fantasy points they'll score if they lose, and then take the guys with the highest adjusted projections. That'll leave you taking more players in the games that you've skipped (where you haven't picked a winner), because those don't get a downward adjustment. Maybe you also want to steer a little towards stacks even if they have slightly lower projections, to get some positive correlation. Last year it would've been great to have the Lawrence+Kirk duo in the wild card round and no Jaguars or Chargers in later rounds.
 
Not I, but agree it makes sense with the sentiment it makes sense to try to avoid zeros if you have other players who could score similarly available. My final 4 teams fill not only the Championship (and SB) slots, but half my divisional round slots as well. I've only got players from one other team in the divisional round. So basically I only am calling winners in 3 of the 6 first round games.
 
How about this one?

In the Wildcard round, you have:​

Jared Goff - QB - DET
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Matthew Stafford - QB - LAR
Tua Tagovailoa - QB - MIA
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI

In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:​

Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Gus Edwards - RB - BAL
Zay Flowers - WR - BAL
Isaiah Likely - TE - BAL
Justin Tucker - PK - BAL
Baltimore Ravens - TD - BAL

In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:​

Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Brock Purdy - QB - SF

In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:​

Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF
George Kittle - TE - SF
Jake Moody - PK - SF
San Francisco 49ers - TD - SF
 
Got a problem I can't pick Mark Andrews ? How can he not be available he is going to play if Baltimore makes the Super Bowl. (Maybe even AFC Champ game)

A big problem for this contest not being able to select Mark Andrews.
 
I'm guessing that 9 times out of 10 the winner of a contest like this will call at least 3 of the 4 teams playing in conference championship games; and, I'm reaching on my Super Bowl picks thinking it's better to take slimmer odds upfront that would go up significantly if I guess correctly.

So, I'm calling a Buffalo/Dallas Super Bowl (they're due) after they defeat Baltimore and San Francisco, respectively.

Sidebar: a lot of intrigue and possible intrigue happening. Stafford @Detroit; Mahomes vs Allen; Philly vs SF; Dallas vs SF in conference championship; Flacco in Baltimore.





You have successfully entered!

In the Wildcard round, you have:​

James Cook - RB - BUF
Jahmyr Gibbs - RB - DET
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Kyren Williams - RB - LAR
Tyreek Hill - WR - MIA
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI

In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:​

Jerome Ford - RB - CLE
Amon-Ra St. Brown - WR - DET
Sam LaPorta - TE - DET
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Travis Kelce - TE - KC
George Kittle - TE - SF

In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:​

Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Tony Pollard - RB - DAL
Jake Ferguson - TE - DAL
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF

In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:​

Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Khalil Shakir - WR - BUF
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
 
This week's weather

CLE at HOU - dome stadium
GB at DAL - dome stadium
LAR at DET - dome stadium
MIA at KC - Bitterly cold (temps around 0, with wind chill around -18), not expected to snow, with winds in the low teens
PIT at BUF - Very cold (temps around 18, with wind chill around 0), blizzard conditions possible, with wind gusts nearing 65
PHI at TB - Temps in the mid 60's, possible thunderstorms, with minimal wind

Anyone altering their choices based on weather?
 
This week's weather

CLE at HOU - dome stadium
GB at DAL - dome stadium
LAR at DET - dome stadium
MIA at KC - Bitterly cold (temps around 0, with wind chill around -18), not expected to snow, with winds in the low teens
PIT at BUF - Very cold (temps around 18, with wind chill around 0), blizzard conditions possible, with wind gusts nearing 65
PHI at TB - Temps in the mid 60's, possible thunderstorms, with minimal wind

Anyone altering their choices based on weather?
Hadn't thought about it, but I might...
 
Got a problem I can't pick Mark Andrews ? How can he not be available he is going to play if Baltimore makes the Super Bowl. (Maybe even AFC Champ game)

A big problem for this contest not being able to select Mark Andrews.
More like a big problem for you / your entry. Roster options are fixed at contest launch, and not every injured player is included. I wanted to add Antonio Brown, but no such luck.
 
Clicked some buttons and here we go

In the Wildcard round, you have:
Joe Flacco - QB - CLE
Jared Goff - QB - DET
Jordan Love - QB - GB
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Matthew Stafford - QB - LAR
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI

In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:
Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Jake Moody - PK - SF

In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:
Odell Beckham Jr. - WR - BAL
Justin Tucker - PK - BAL
Baltimore Ravens - TD - BAL
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF
George Kittle - TE - SF
San Francisco 49ers - TD - SF

In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:
Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Gus Edwards - RB - BAL
Zay Flowers - WR - BAL
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
 
I think I'm done. Big dice roll to be honest.

In the Wildcard round, you have:
David Njoku - TE - CLE
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Nico Collins - WR - HOU
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI
DeVonta Smith - WR - PHI
In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:
Zay Flowers - WR - BAL
James Cook - RB - BUF
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Jahmyr Gibbs - RB - DET
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:
Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Justin Tucker - PK - BAL
Khalil Shakir - WR - BUF
David Montgomery - RB - DET
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF
In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:
Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Jared Goff - QB - DET
Amon-Ra St. Brown - WR - DET
Sam LaPorta - TE - DET


-QG
 
I think I'm done. Big dice roll to be honest.

In the Wildcard round, you have:
David Njoku - TE - CLE
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Nico Collins - WR - HOU
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI
DeVonta Smith - WR - PHI
In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:
Zay Flowers - WR - BAL
James Cook - RB - BUF
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Jahmyr Gibbs - RB - DET
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:
Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Justin Tucker - PK - BAL
Khalil Shakir - WR - BUF
David Montgomery - RB - DET
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF
In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:
Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Jared Goff - QB - DET
Amon-Ra St. Brown - WR - DET
Sam LaPorta - TE - DET


-QG
Nice.

You could improve your chances of keeping your bracket intact by skipping one more game and removing either BAL or SF from the conf championship round. Swap their 2 conf champ players with 2 of your divisional round players from the other team or BUF or DET.
 
Appreciate the advice actually swapped Tucker out for Flowers in round 3 and then swapped in Aubrey in round 2.

Mainly bc I had to fade Tucker who has dropped off a little.

-QG
 
Taking the advice under advisement but probably sticking with what I got. Buffalo/Detroit is improbable enough that rolling the dice with the chalk teams as the other two is probably gonna be alright.

Cuz I can always end up swapping in two zeroes.

-QG
 
Think I’ve done my final tweaks (he’s said to himself 27 times in the past 5 days… ;) )

In the Wildcard round, you have:​

Jared Goff - QB - DET
Amon-Ra St. Brown - WR - DET
Nico Collins - WR - HOU
Matthew Stafford - QB - LAR
Kyren Williams - RB - LAR
Puka Nacua - WR - LAR

In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have:​

Gus Edwards - RB - BAL
Odell Beckham Jr. - WR - BAL
James Cook - RB - BUF
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Isiah Pacheco - RB - KC
Travis Kelce - TE - KC

In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have:​

Josh Allen - QB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
Tony Pollard - RB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
George Kittle - TE - SF

In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have:​

Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Zay Flowers - WR - BAL
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF


Latest major tweaks: My heart wants Detroit, but my head says Rams, so I just jammed both of them into this first weekend since I believe they’ll score a lot but I have no faith in picking a winner.
banked on KC surviving this week so using up the KC “big 3” next weekend And using more lower level BAL players since I know they’ll be playing next week and have very low confidence in many of the Star players from this weekend making it to next weekend. Basically avoiding zeroes, I guess. Not sure if this is a good plan or not.
Then I’m totally chalk in the last 2 weekends of the contest by picking an assortment of players from the 1 and 2 seeds in each conference

What I am confident in is that I have no clue how to win this contest and I’m totally throwing darts :)
 

In the Wildcard round, you have these players:​

Jordan Love - QB - GB
C.J. Stroud - QB - HOU
Matthew Stafford - QB - LAR
Kyren Williams - RB - LAR
Tyreek Hill - WR - MIA
Baker Mayfield - QB - TB

In the Divisional round (points multiplied by 2), you have these players:​

Joe Flacco - QB - CLE
Jared Goff - QB - DET
Amon-Ra St. Brown - WR - DET
Patrick Mahomes - QB - KC
Travis Kelce - TE - KC
Jalen Hurts - QB - PHI

In the Championship round (points multiplied by 3), you have these players:​

Lamar Jackson - QB - BAL
Dalton Kincaid - TE - BUF
Dak Prescott - QB - DAL
CeeDee Lamb - WR - DAL
Brandon Aiyuk - WR - SF
George Kittle - TE - SF

In the Super Bowl (points multiplied by 5), you have these players:​

Josh Allen - QB - BUF
James Cook - RB - BUF
Stefon Diggs - WR - BUF
Brock Purdy - QB - SF
Christian McCaffrey - RB - SF
Deebo Samuel - WR - SF
 
I went with a KC/SF Super Bowl, DAL/BAL as Championship losers, and BUF as my 5th team (for Divisional round).
 
Dangit I had Houston's defense in my rooster but lost my nerve. Cleveland has given up a ton of points to fantasy defenses this season.

-QG
 
Houston putting on a clinic.... Works for me... Houson is my sleeper choice to make it to the super bowl
 
Will be interesting to see how many contest entries there were.... @Contest Turk any insight on that?

Also the team roster pages seem to come up with the yellow flag and says:

You Can't View This Content!​

If you think this is in error, rather than throw your challenge flag, we suggest making sure you are logged into the website correctly.
 
Well this sucks. I click on my status, or my entry, and I get a pic of a yellow flag saying I don't have permission to view this content.

wtf?
 
64.86 from my 3 players. Still mad I took out Houston's defense and their 32 points but a good start.

:kicksrock:

-QG
Flacco and Stroud got me 36.54 but I have no Texans or Browns next round (couldn't decide who would advance and took the skipped game route round 2)..
 
Well this sucks. I click on my status, or my entry, and I get a pic of a yellow flag saying I don't have permission to view this content.

wtf?
I got it too, maybe just early part of the contest hold while things are updated... @Contest Turk looks like its a few of us...
Glad it’s not just me. Hate to think I did all that work for nothing.

I mean, I probably did. But I’d like to see how I lose at least. :lol:
 

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