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***Official*** Washington Redskins 2015 Offseason Thread (2 Viewers)

Griffindor said:
Did they switch the o-line when McCoy went in?
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well the first drive when mccoy came in they ran the ball very well which picked up most of the yardage. And for mccoy they called roll outs and an option on passing plays if i recall. i think they are calling the plays for griffen that he needs to work on, but we don't seem to be doing a good job at pass pro as usual.

 
Does anyone think griffin would look good if he was going up against the second string defense with the second string offense? I don't know but it would be curious to see.

Also amazing how the other team stops blitzing and stunts when another QB comes in. I think they know griffin will not beat the blitz and just send all the pressure they can to annihilate him. To me that is the main reason Cousins and McCoy don't get sacked as much. Whether it is on play design or rg3 pocket presence is questionable, but it's clear they have no fear of griffin having an answer for pressure.

 
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1. I wonder if Griffin has the okay to audible at the line or shift the protection around, or is Gruden a control freak like Shanahan? (putting aside whether Griffin could actually handle that)

2. We are going to finish in the bottom 5 again. I really, really, really hope that we are accompanied by teams that are already invested in QB's right now. We need JAX, OAK, TEN, and TB to be the other really bad teams. Because you know we won't naturally be in position to draft a good QB prospect high, we'll win one too many games and #### it up. So we need the teams ahead of us to not need QB's.

 
Unfortunately if Oak and probably Jax suck again they would both probably draft a QB top 5. Bortles is terrible and Jax will know by the end of the year. Oak didn't invest that much in Carr.

 
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Not to mention that QB-needy teams will trade into whatever picks are ahead of Washington in that scenario. Doesn't necessarily help.

 
That was as bad as I can remember the OL ever looking. Willie Smith may not have blocked anyone all game. Felt bad for Griffin out there. He was a sitting duck behind that disaster of an OL.

And for the 2nd straight week, why are Cosuins/McCoy running rollouts and read options, while Griffin gets none of those? Especially with as bad as the OL looked, they should have been moving the pocket for him.

Does Gruden make it through the season?

 
MattFancy said:
That was as bad as I can remember the OL ever looking. Willie Smith may not have blocked anyone all game. Felt bad for Griffin out there. He was a sitting duck behind that disaster of an OL.

And for the 2nd straight week, why are Cosuins/McCoy running rollouts and read options, while Griffin gets none of those? Especially with as bad as the OL looked, they should have been moving the pocket for him.

Does Gruden make it through the season?
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I get the impression they plan to use those in the regular season but want to force griffin to run plays he needs to work on. THe down side is defense seem to be assuming this and just all out blitzing and destroying him because we cant pass block. lol.

And regarding gruden...... if we have another horrible season i would be ok with him being gone and our GM bringing in his own guy.

 
PinkydaPimp said:
MattFancy said:
That was as bad as I can remember the OL ever looking. Willie Smith may not have blocked anyone all game. Felt bad for Griffin out there. He was a sitting duck behind that disaster of an OL.

And for the 2nd straight week, why are Cosuins/McCoy running rollouts and read options, while Griffin gets none of those? Especially with as bad as the OL looked, they should have been moving the pocket for him.

Does Gruden make it through the season?
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I get the impression they plan to use those in the regular season but want to force griffin to run plays he needs to work on. THe down side is defense seem to be assuming this and just all out blitzing and destroying him because we cant pass block. lol.

And regarding gruden...... if we have another horrible season i would be ok with him being gone and our GM bringing in his own guy.
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I think you're right. I get they want Griffin to learn to play from the pocket, but then make sure you're pass protection is doing its job. They should have taken him out sooner when it was obvious to everyone that the OL wasn't blocking worth a damn.

I really think Gruden is gone after this year. There's no way this team is any better than 6-10 this season. It doesn't seem, at least early on, that he and McCloughan are on the same page.

 
With a little Luck RGIII will sit out the next game and we'll see Cousins with the 1s. Cousins has been INT prone, but guys can grow out of that sometimes.

I've given up on RG... he'll never succeed in a non-read option offense. He can't read a blitz, can't get through progressions (although he never even got to them in the first place last night). Without those skills, he'll never amount to anything as a QB. He's had years to learn this stuff and still hasn't. Thats on him.

What a waste.

 
O don't agree RG3 doesn't go thru progression. I think he does and had shown that. He just doesn't process it quick enough. He's late almost every time.

 
jurb26 said:
O don't agree RG3 doesn't go thru progression. I think he does and had shown that. He just doesn't process it quick enough. He's late almost every time.
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Thats exactly my point. Same problem Jason Campbell had. Too slow moving through progressions. RG needs a top 5 oline to be an effective pocket passer.

ETA: "can't get through progressions" doesn't mean he isn't going through them. It means he's doing it too slowly.

 
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dhockster said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Arodin said:
Not to mention that QB-needy teams will trade into whatever picks are ahead of Washington in that scenario. Doesn't necessarily help.
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That rarely happens, though. Hardly anybody trades into the top-5, for a QB or not.
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Wait, didn't the Redskins trade into the top 5 for......Oh.......I see what you did there.
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Yep and they should do it again if they think the QB is a franchise level talent. It's all about the QB.

 
Love listening to fans blame Gruden on RG3 getting hurt because he left him in the game. I understand that SuperBob thinks he is the best QB in the NFL but are we supposed to treat him like Peyton Manning where the main goal is to just make it the regular season. That was the strategy the last 2 years and look how prepared he was

Now since it is obvious he is going to be the starting QB no matter what he does, maybe they should have not played him. I mean why worry about his progress if it doesn't mean anything

 
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I have to say, I TRULY enjoyed listening to 980 on the way in to work today. Those guys on the postgame "Ruckus" show were a wonder to my ears.

Absolutely going bat#### crazy over last night as if it was a regular season game. Well done boys, but you may want to tone it down a touch or you will have a stroke by midseason when they are 1-7.

 
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hammerva said:
Love listening to fans blame Gruden on RG3 getting hurt because he left him in the game. I understand that SuperBob thinks he is the best QB in the NFL but are we supposed to treat him like Peyton Manning where the main goal is to just make it the regular season. That was the strategy the last 2 years and look how prepared he was

Now since it is obvious he is going to be the starting QB no matter what he does, maybe they should have not played him. I mean why worry about his progress if it doesn't mean anything
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There's making progress and there's what happened last night. When it's obvious your OL is over matched in a preseason game, it makes sense to get your QB out of there. What good was Griffin getting out of last night when the line was collapsing in on him on 75% of his drop backs?

I'm all for him getting some reps in, but last night, it should have been clear that keeping him healthy was more important. Especially when you're not playing your franchise LT.

 
So if the offensive line collapses in the 1st game against the Dolphins are you going to coddle the best QB in the NFL by taking him out again to protect him?

It is just amazing that people are more worried about the health of this quarterback then whether he can actually start.

 
hammerva said:
So if the offensive line collapses in the 1st game against the Dolphins are you going to coddle the best QB in the NFL by taking him out again to protect him?

It is just amazing that people are more worried about the health of this quarterback then whether he can actually start.
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I guess you don't understand the difference between an exhibition game and the regular season

 
So you would rather wait until week 1 and 2 when the games matter to find out that Superbob stinks then an exhibition game?

But like I said before, since he was given this huge participation trophy of the starting job in February or March it really doesn't matter how good he is. So I agree that he shouldn't play anymore this pre-season.

 
hammerva said:
So you would rather wait until week 1 and 2 when the games matter to find out that Superbob stinks then an exhibition game?

But like I said before, since he was given this huge participation trophy of the starting job in February or March it really doesn't matter how good he is. So I agree that he shouldn't play anymore this pre-season.
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So let's just get him injured in a meaningless preseason game when its shown the OL couldn't protect him. That's meaningful reps!

No, I want to see him get reps, but there's a point where protecting your player becomes more important than reps. Especially in a meaningless preseason game.

 
PinkydaPimp said:
Griffindor said:
Did they switch the o-line when McCoy went in?
Click to expand...
well the first drive when mccoy came in they ran the ball very well which picked up most of the yardage. And for mccoy they called roll outs and an option on passing plays if i recall. i think they are calling the plays for griffen that he needs to work on, but we don't seem to be doing a good job at pass pro as usual.
Click to expand...
They did change the OL when McCoy went in. McCoy was working will all 2nd stringers and beyond.

 
My quick thoughts are below. Once again, I focus primarily on the starters.

1. The OL looked really bad in pass protection. Griffin was hit or under pressure on every play

2. The play calling is not helping him one bit. I really hope Griffin is only doing drop back passes because it is the preseason. If Griffin is refusing to run read option, he is playing himself out of the league. Cousins and McCoy both ran read option plays the past two weeks.

3. I am starting to think the read option is easier for the OL to run. The backup OL looked ok in pass protection. Of course, that is against Detroits backups.

4. For run blocking, it is hard to tell how the staring OL did. The backup OL looked really good.

5. The defense looks really bad. It looks like there is a wide open wide receiver on every play. That does not bode will for them. I think the reserves did a little better, but not well at all.

6. It sure would be nice if Forbath could kick off into the endzone. Maybe Hayward would not have been injured if he could.

 
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Um. The OL may be overmatched all season. Griffin better find a way to deal with it if he's going to play. Perhaps finding the receivers that are wide ####### open would be a start. Or at least figuring out how to take 2 steps right or left. Or not dropping the damn ball. Or maybe using your legs when the line caves in on only one side. RG3 may be a good guy and have lots of tools, but as an nfl QB he is a clown.

Put in cousins or McCoy next week as the 1. See what happens. If the offense is still moving the problem is griffin. If not you need other solutions (that may not even exist). Then put in griffin as backup. See what happens when he goes against the 2nd string. Pretty sure he will still suxor.

Of course this will not happen because Danny won't let his latest best friend not start.

 
Read in the Washington Post that Willie Smith was terrible at LT. I saw the first sack where a player blew right by Scherff. On the 2nd sack, Lavauo was chasing after the guy tackling Griffin.

I will say that when Griffin is playing, there are no play calls to help alleviate the pass rush. No read option, no roll outs, no QB draws. It was all straight drops and get hit. If this is the game plan for the regular season, I say the OL and Griffin have no chance. Maybe they should start game planning for the final preseason games.

 
(HULK) said:
So, someone tell me about 1st round QB prospects for next April.
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Looks like a good group. My early rankings;Cook

Goff

Hackenberg

Kessler

C. Jones

Towels

Kiel

I think just those top 3 are pretty safe 1st rounders. I'd say Cook and Goff have the most franchise QB potential. C. Jones is a wild card still IMO.

 
We dont have the OL to play grudens scheme, thats obvious, but the first team offense needs the reps even if they are getting manhandled.

why not let bob run play action roll outs? well, last time they let him do that he left his ankle 5 yards behind him.

 
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Rimez said:
We dont have the OL to play grudens scheme, thats obvious, but the first team offense needs the reps even if they are getting manhandled.

why not let bob run play action roll outs? well, last time they let him do that he left his ankle 5 yards behind him.
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I have to say, he looked REALLY good on that naked bootleg last week, even though he took a pretty good shot after getting the ball out.

 
Look at the bright side guys. We have no expections and the GM we have is solid. We need to give him a couple more drafts.

 
Milkman said:
Look at the bright side guys. We have no expections and the GM we have is solid. We need to give him a couple more drafts.
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Agree.

I think its clear that the next time we make the playoffs it will be with a qb not currently on the roster and with another HC in charge.

Scotch mccloughan will get it done, in time.

I'm not gonna overanalyze this roster too much, outside of the guys scotch brought in this yr and the guys he brings in going forward.

 
Milkman said:
Look at the bright side guys. We have no expections and the GM we have is solid. We need to give him a couple more drafts.
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Yep this is where i am. I assume a coaching change next year and then a few more years until we have something. Until then, i will watch this trainwreck to see how it all unfolds.

 
Definitely seems like an overpay, but sounds like the Saints and Bears were also bidding for him. Interesting. If its a conditional trade, I hope the 5th is the highest it can go and not the lowest. I'm betting lowest and it has unrealistic escalators like pro bowler or something.

Interesting stuff about Carrier:

Derek Carrier: The Athlete

Carrier scores an 88 athleticism score in the projection model, better than any of the tight end prospects of the 2014 and 2013 draft classes. Running a 4.50 40 time at nearly 240 pounds for his pro day was excellent as well as a 6.65 three-cone time that puts him in the top 1% of tight ends since the turn of the century. Derek Carrier’s vertical and broad jumps were also in the top 20% of tight end prospects. Carrier is on the short side for tight ends, putting him in the ‘move’ category. Considering his athleticism, that is basically a given anyway.

Derek Carrier: Production

Carrier was pretty ridiculous in college. His age-weighted market share figures were all above average starting at 18 years old. In short, Carrier was a phenom as he dominated his much-older peers in college. After two above-market market share performances, Carrier absolutely killed his final two college seasons with weighted market shares of more than 40 each season. As a point of reference, Ladarius Green or Rob Gronkowski did not even reach that lofty ceiling in college. Derek Carrier has an age-weighted production score of 99. Here are the other tight end prospects with score of at least 95 in the model:

  • Rob Gronkowski
  • Ladarius Green
  • Travis Beckum
  • Vernon Davis
  • Michael Allan
Link: http://uthdynasty.co...ect-since-1999/

 
I'm intrigued by the Carrier signing. Not only is he a physical specimen, but IIRC, the 49'ers were prepared to move on from Delanie Walker in the pipeline behind Vernon Davis because of this guy. Now they have a boatload of TE, and can afford to move one to reduce the glut. Carrier is in the mode of Cooley/Reed. More receiver than blocker. If he develops to his full potential, he's closer to Reed than Paul, and could be a real offensive weapon. 5th rounders are often speculative picks, and I don't mind giving one up for a player with considerable upside at a position manned by a fragile starter and questionable depth at best.

 
Rimez said:
We dont have the OL to play grudens scheme, thats obvious, but the first team offense needs the reps even if they are getting manhandled.

why not let bob run play action roll outs? well, last time they let him do that he left his ankle 5 yards behind him.
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So Tom Brady should never drop back again because he tore his ACL while in the pocket?

 
Marvelous said:
My quick thoughts are below. Once again, I focus primarily on the starters.

2. The play calling is not helping him one bit. I really hope Griffin is only doing drop back passes because it is the preseason. If Griffin is refusing to run read option, he is playing himself out of the league. Cousins and McCoy both ran read option plays the past two weeks.
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From the Footballguys View of the latest email:

If you look at the play selection during the last preseason game, which seemed much more protective of Colt McCoy and Kirk Cousins than it was of Griffin...
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It looks like others think Gruden's playcalling isn't helping Griffin out. Jason Reid's twitter feed suggests this is intentional.

 
I remembered today about a play that bothered me. I believe it was with Griffin at QB.

The Redskins were all lined up and then you see a Lions player running onto the field. He ends up running to the LDT spot, getting in his stance, and has a second to get himself ready before the snap. Griffin then calls for the snap, hands off, and Morris runs right towards the same Lions player.

If you know the play you have called is designed to go directly where your opponent isn't ready, why not quick snap it? Among many other problems, we just haven't been a smart team for a looooooong time.

Notice how other teams quick snap it to throw immediately to an uncovered WR? Or if a DB is playing 10 yards off on 1st and 10, they just throw a quick hitter to the WR and pick up 6 yards even if that wasn't the designed play? Simple things like that can help move chains and lead to points. How often do we take advantage of opponents' mistakes?

 
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