ghostguy123
Footballguy
Seems like Lamars contract will end up about the same as Hurts. If he wants alot more, he isn't getting it.
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QB Lamar Jackson, BAL (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter massraider
- Start date
-OZ-
Footballguy
Hurts 2021 was about equal to Lamar’s. His 2022 was a LOT better, award winning. He had started 5 games in 2020. I like Lamar’s game, he’s among my favorite players to watch. But right now it really isn’t close.
Tau837
Footballguy
It was reported earlier in the thread that they had offered Jackson a 5 year, $267M extension (6 years, $290M total with his 5th year option) last offseason... before the Wilson, Murray, and Hurts extensions were known, and maybe before Watson's, that timing is unclear. $175M was guaranteed for injury but only $133M was fully guaranteed IIRC. At the time, that was a very good offer.
https://twitter.com/jamisonhensley
https://twitter.com/jamisonhensley
@jamisonhensley
·
Jalen Hurts' 5-year contract extension with the Eagles looks very similar to the offer that Lamar Jackson turned down in September (which was reported by
@AdamSchefter
and
@mortreport
Total value Hurts: $255M Jackson: $250M
Guaranteed for injury Hurts: $179.3M Jackson: $175M
https://twitter.com/jamisonhensley
@jamisonhensley
·
Jalen Hurts' 5-year contract extension with the Eagles looks very similar to the offer that Lamar Jackson turned down in September (which was reported by
@AdamSchefter
and
@mortreport
Total value Hurts: $255M Jackson: $250M
Guaranteed for injury Hurts: $179.3M Jackson: $175M
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I thought Jackson disputed all these Schefter reports.
Schefter reported Brady retired but then he didn't, Shefter likes to push the action
I personally do not believe the Ravens offered him $250M unless Jackson completely lied (it's possible)
I understand why people believe Schefter, I just don't always think he is correct and he's been proven wrong many times.
Thanks for the info
Chaka
Footballguy
Ultimately every dollar increase at QB salary benefits the QBs next in line for new contracts.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I have folks in my leagues texting me that Jackson is on the verge of receiving a new deal with the Ravens, $200M guaranteed.
My narrative has been that he wants out and his time in Baltimore is over, several national media types of late have been leaning that way
This would be a total 180 from that but it would make sense that Baltimore wants to keep him and $200M guaranteed should sooth his ego
Maybe that's why he hasn't been speaking with a lot of teams so far.
I still would like to see him test the market and let another team turn the heat up. He did request a trade offer in early March, is it that easy to put back in the bottle?
Stoneworker
Footballguy
Um. Yep.
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Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Steelers insider makes bold prediction for Ravens QB Lamar Jackson
...Pittsburgh Steelers reporter Mark Kaboly of The Athletic predicted that Jackson "will stay out until he has to come in to accrue another season and thus making the franchise tag unusable next year."
Added Kaboly, "I see this being a potential disaster for the Ravens if he holds out into the season and I am talking about more than just wins and losses."
...Pittsburgh Steelers reporter Mark Kaboly of The Athletic predicted that Jackson "will stay out until he has to come in to accrue another season and thus making the franchise tag unusable next year."
Added Kaboly, "I see this being a potential disaster for the Ravens if he holds out into the season and I am talking about more than just wins and losses."
Grahamburn
Footballguy
How much money does Lamar lose in this scenario? Like $20M? Lot of change to sit around being stubborn about.
And the Ravens can just tag him again in 2024. Not sure where that “unusable” bit is coming from. Am I missing something? They can tag him twice.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
It even says in the article they can tag him again in 2024.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
They can't use the same tag they used this year.
They would be forced to use the highest tag next year.
Kaboly's take is that Lamar holds out till the last minute, gets credit for this year and becomes a FA next year forcing the Ravens to pay him the highest franchise tag next year.
... in Kaboly's scenario, Baltimore could retain Jackson's rights for 2024 via the franchise tag "at 1.2 times his 2023 salary or at the as-yet-unknown value of the tag next year, whichever is greater."
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Right. So, Lamar's strategy would basically be to sit out two years in a row leaving tens of millions of dollars on the table and then hope he gets the contract he wants from another team, which doesn't appear to be happening NOW, after wasting two MORE years of his prime? Brilliant stuff.
massraider
Footballguy
They should maybe ask themselves why
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
If Kaboly is correct, when Lamar reports, he'll be unhappy, with a new OC, new starting WR, no offseason, missing first six games.
They have had a poor record without Lamar.
If Kaboly is correct, and many seem to agree with him then it could be exactly what he describes as a disaster for the Ravens.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Sounds like disaster for Lamar as well. He's costing himself possibly dozens of millions of he shows up late, crabby, and sucks
massraider
Footballguy
I don't understand how we don't know exactly what Lamar wants, when we have insight into what his state of mind will be----three months from now. 
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Entire francise disaster, personal disaster.
If many are correct, he will show up late, unhappy, unprepared, and will suck.
As Kaboly predicts, a disaster for the Ravens.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Do you want it to be a disaster for the Ravens? How is either of these scenarios beneficial for Lamar? He shows up and plays well, great for the Ravens and they tag him again in 2024. He shows up and plays poorly he doesn't get the contract he wants, annnnd the Ravens tag him again in 2024.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Yeah, not great for the Ravens, but really not great for Lamar to show up late and "suck," right?
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Sounds like a scare tactic
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Sounds like a realistic scenario.
Tau837
Footballguy
First, Kaboly is identified as a "Steelers insider." I recommend taking what he says about a disaster for the Ravens with a grain of salt. He might have some bias...
Second, this may be bad for the Ravens, but it would be much worse for Jackson. If he waits until the last minute to sign his franchise tag, that means waiting until after the 10th week of the regular season. That means:
- Jackson willingly gives up 10/18 of his 2023 salary, just over $18M. He will never make that money back.
- Jackson takes a risk that the Ravens play just fine without him. Probably not likely, but stranger things have happened... see Brock Purdy last year. That could hurt Jackson's perceived market value.
- Jackson takes a risk of playing poorly when he comes back into a new offense with some new coaches and teammates, after not having practiced for roughly a year and having missed the entire offseason program. That could hurt his perceived market value.
- Jackson takes a risk that the Ravens just tag him again next offseason, leaving him in the exact same situation as he is now, but another year older and another year removed from his MVP season. That could hurt his perceived market value.
Nope. The Browns fan is still furiously scouring twitter and posting worthless hot takes because he so desperately wants the Ravens to look as bad as the brownies do.
-OZ-
Footballguy
It could be fun if Huntley has them at 4-2 or better.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
If this was July maybe
Chaka
Footballguy
"He"? Who, Lamar?
No, the Browns fan.
Same thing again- few teams can afford him. He is sadly going to be the model for the next generation of free agency. Yes QBs should make a lot and he should be paid handsomely but there also has to be cap space to do it and that much cap space has to be planned.
Imagine you're a GM that thinks he'll land a top QB, doesn't, and then has 60 mil in cap space AFTER all the big free agents signed elsewhere. Then what?
Also a lot of teams have made changes to QB coach and given them an assistant which seems to lend towards developing youth and how cheap a young QB is versus a star QB. Aaron Rodgers maybe the last old starting QB we see.
Jalen Hurts credited Alex Tanney (the long time third stringer turned QB assistant) with helping him and said how he made the game simple for him and knew what it's like to be told to do this n that and think that's uncomfortable to throw like that and Alex got him through all that. Tanney was suddenly getting offers from most NFL teams and decided to stay out with a promotion in Philly but Tanney's story of how sooo many teams made offers instantly without even interviewing him shows how premium a young QB developer is in the league now.
I love Lamar. He is so fun. Its just so hard to find suitors and it's brutal for him. It does lend to someone late at night having a few drinks and claiming collusion until you look at the caps of 32 teams. Like three teams can afford him.
Monte had a story of teams inquiring about Kyler that's similar but ya can't trade injured players so that also lends to "let me know now so I can plan for next year's cap."
Imagine you're a GM that thinks he'll land a top QB, doesn't, and then has 60 mil in cap space AFTER all the big free agents signed elsewhere. Then what?
Also a lot of teams have made changes to QB coach and given them an assistant which seems to lend towards developing youth and how cheap a young QB is versus a star QB. Aaron Rodgers maybe the last old starting QB we see.
Jalen Hurts credited Alex Tanney (the long time third stringer turned QB assistant) with helping him and said how he made the game simple for him and knew what it's like to be told to do this n that and think that's uncomfortable to throw like that and Alex got him through all that. Tanney was suddenly getting offers from most NFL teams and decided to stay out with a promotion in Philly but Tanney's story of how sooo many teams made offers instantly without even interviewing him shows how premium a young QB developer is in the league now.
I love Lamar. He is so fun. Its just so hard to find suitors and it's brutal for him. It does lend to someone late at night having a few drinks and claiming collusion until you look at the caps of 32 teams. Like three teams can afford him.
Monte had a story of teams inquiring about Kyler that's similar but ya can't trade injured players so that also lends to "let me know now so I can plan for next year's cap."
Anarchy99
Footballguy
Not sure that I agree with this. The Browns gave Watson two boatloads of money last year and only took a $9 million salary cap hit for him in 2022. They pushed the cap hit into future years (and tinkered with his contract again since then to push more off into future years). What's holding Lamar back is the franchise tag. Teams don't want to go through all the machinations and gyrations to try to sign him and either give up the two first round picks (which they may not even have) or have the Ravens match their offer.
We may see more movement on Lamar at or just after the draft, when more teams either have the ability to sign him to an offer sheet (ie, they have picks again) or a sign and trade becomes more of an option. If things start looking like Jackson has played his last down in BAL, the Ravens may be more motivated to trade him. Lamar would need to sign the franchise tender, but he could get a whole new deal from his new team. (The acquiring team would need to be able to fit him under the cap on the franchise tag at $32 million and change to do that). No team will have that much space lying around at this point, but most teams could make a few extensions or convert salary to bonuses to free up the space.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
But has his dog weighed in yet?
Tau837
Footballguy
The 49ers would have to clear a lot of cap space. They only have $2.9M right now, per OTC.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
This makes no sense and sounds like a writer that's just throwing around terms to sound knowledgable. An accrued season doesn't mean anything to Jackson, he's already a Vested Veteran. He has no contract to toll should he remain out. There may be a date by which he must sign the tender or not play in 2023, I don't recall this off the top of my head, so maybe he gets partial credit for accidentally being right that Jackson "must" eventually report. The thing that's going to make him report is not sacrificing nearly $2M per NFL game he misses.
And nothing makes the FT unusable next year. It's more expensive, but it's still usable. FT values go up each consecutive year a player is tendered.
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Chaka
Footballguy
Yup. It's the third tag where costs become prohibitive to the team.
Tau837
Footballguy
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Maybe? In Lamar's case, the 2nd tag would be 120% of his 2023 salary, which is $32M. So 2024 would be $38.4M. Then the third is 144% of 2024, which comes out to $55.9M. Will $56M even be a big cap hit by the 2025 season for a QB? Watson is scheduled to be $63M, Josh Allen $55M, and Russell Wilson $55M. Hell our buddy Derek Carr is scheduled at $45M in 2025.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
No one should take much Mark Kaboly sez as if he has any kind of insight to anything, unless he's discussing the quality of the of curly fries at the Dirty O on a particular day, I suppose.
efactor
Footballguy
Yeah, giving up a young QB and 2 firsts for the pleasure of paying Lamar a massive contract isn’t happening in SF. Good click bait though.
Chaka
Footballguy
Watson & Allen will likely be restructured to push the cap hit back. That can't be done with the franchise tag.
That's why the Jets made a bad deal for Rodgers, they had a ton of leverage with Green Bay poised to take a $60 mil hit if he showed up.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Yeah I didn't want to take the time during my reply to do the research, I wasn't sure if that was only for players under contract but it's definitely also tendered players.
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