RB Zach Charbonnet, SEA (2 Viewers)

[Biabreakable]

Just to add some context to the 2nd round draft capital used on both Walker and Charbonnet, the Seahawks with Pete Carrol also used a 2nd round pick on Christine Michael when they already had Marshawn Lynch.

So there is a history of the Seahawks using fairly high draft picks on RB depth even when they have an established starter.

Once they start seeing the pkayers perform on the field in practice the draft capital invested goes out the window. They are going to play the guy who is the most consistent on a per play basis. I think durability and ability to gain yardage after contact are abilities they have shown to favor over big play ability when looking at Lynch vs Michael and Carson over Penny.

I am not sure if any of the RB they have will be able to give them this type of player, that remains to be seen. If not they may keep looking for a RB that can do this for them while they try to train the RB they do have to play more like this.
I would say the boom bust performance of Walker as a rookie does not fit this profile. Can he develop into this type of player? Maybe. Seattle went back to the well in case he doesnt.

As far as Macintosh goes Seattle had JD McKissick who performed well for them in a recieving RB role before. They didnt seem to value such a player that much though and let him go where he went on to flourish for a team that seemed to value him more.

 

[Da Franchise]

What nobody here seems willing to do is compare Walkers 2022 NFL season to Charbonnetts 2022 NFL season. What else is there even to consider? Walkers was way better and that is a FACT!! Checkmate, simps.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

What nobody here seems willing to do is compare Walkers 2022 NFL season to Charbonnetts 2022 NFL season. What else is there even to consider? Walkers was way better and that is a FACT!! Checkmate, simps.

The mental gymnastics can be hysterical.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

What nobody here seems willing to do is compare Walkers 2022 NFL season to Charbonnetts 2022 NFL season. What else is there even to consider? Walkers was way better and that is a FACT!! Checkmate, simps.

legit lol

Now I have to clean up the coffee I just spit out. Thanks a bunch.

 

[pinkstapler]

Just to add some context to the 2nd round draft capital used on both Walker and Charbonnet, the Seahawks with Pete Carrol also used a 2nd round pick on Christine Michael when they already had Marshawn Lynch.

So there is a history of the Seahawks using fairly high draft picks on RB depth even when they have an established starter.

Once they start seeing the pkayers perform on the field in practice the draft capital invested goes out the window. They are going to play the guy who is the most consistent on a per play basis. I think durability and ability to gain yardage after contact are abilities they have shown to favor over big play ability when looking at Lynch vs Michael and Carson over Penny.

I am not sure if any of the RB they have will be able to give them this type of player, that remains to be seen. If not they may keep looking for a RB that can do this for them while they try to train the RB they do have to play more like this.
I would say the boom bust performance of Walker as a rookie does not fit this profile. Can he develop into this type of player? Maybe. Seattle went back to the well in case he doesnt.

As far as Macintosh goes Seattle had JD McKissick who performed well for them in a recieving RB role before. They didnt seem to value such a player that much though and let him go where he went on to flourish for a team that seemed to value him more.

This is kinda where I'm falling on it too. I think we all have a hard time turning off the fantasy part of our brain that wants to look at the numbers on the score sheet to try and make sense of what's actually going on (which as has been pointed out ad nauseum by both "sides" of this argument is just a guessing game anyhow). I think Carroll is looking beyond Walkers flat numbers last season, and seeing how he fits into his scheme and offensive game plan moving forward. Kinda like a Shanahan, I think Pete will put preference on a guy who does exactly what he wants when he wants over pure talent and performance. And if that means utilizing two backs with differing skill sets to get it done, so be it.

Side note: at much as I never liked Trey Lance much to begin with, I always thought that's another reason why he would never have a shot for SF regardless. Shanahan don't care about his talent or what he can do on the field, only how well he can operate his system. I think we might be seeing just a shade of that with Carroll. If Walker can't develop his game in some of those areas, he will either share time with someone who can (more likely); or get replaced by someone who can do it all (less likely).

 

[barackdhouse]

Once they start seeing the pkayers perform on the field in practice the draft capital invested goes out the window. They are going to play the guy who is the most consistent on a per play basis. I think durability and ability to gain yardage after contact are abilities they have shown to favor over big play ability when looking at Lynch vs Michael and Carson over Penny.

Yes

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Trying to keep an open mind but I don't like ZC missing camp time right now, think it hurts him early in the season might be a guy I look to acquire after he doesn't come flying out of the gates.

Yes, reminds me of the aforementioned Penny/Carson debate when Penny fell way behind because IIRC, he was out of shape in camp. ZC's issue obviously isn't being out of shape, but behind is behind. If he doesn't get back soon, it will require some patience. Could pay off down the line though for sure.

If Walker gets hurt, Charb would be a league winner.

That simply is not true, he's not involved right now if he's not in camp, why is he a dead lock as a league winner?
I had Penny a couple years ago last few weeks, that was a different player, different QB IIRC, so many different elements and players on that team.
I want to see someone do well here but that kind of thinking is not showing a lot of awareness for what is unfolding right now.
If ZC were healthy and having a sensational rookie camp, I could see your point.
But as it stands he is falling behind right now.
My opinion of course

 

[jm192]

Just to add some context to the 2nd round draft capital used on both Walker and Charbonnet, the Seahawks with Pete Carrol also used a 2nd round pick on Christine Michael when they already had Marshawn Lynch.

So there is a history of the Seahawks using fairly high draft picks on RB depth even when they have an established starter.

Once they start seeing the pkayers perform on the field in practice the draft capital invested goes out the window. They are going to play the guy who is the most consistent on a per play basis. I think durability and ability to gain yardage after contact are abilities they have shown to favor over big play ability when looking at Lynch vs Michael and Carson over Penny.

I am not sure if any of the RB they have will be able to give them this type of player, that remains to be seen. If not they may keep looking for a RB that can do this for them while they try to train the RB they do have to play more like this.
I would say the boom bust performance of Walker as a rookie does not fit this profile. Can he develop into this type of player? Maybe. Seattle went back to the well in case he doesnt.

As far as Macintosh goes Seattle had JD McKissick who performed well for them in a recieving RB role before. They didnt seem to value such a player that much though and let him go where he went on to flourish for a team that seemed to value him more.

Yeah, you're repeating the same conversation in a different way.

I have said repeatedly--there's a world where Walker just blows Charbonnet out of the water and it looks like a wasted pick. It can happen. Draft capital will not matter if that happens.

As of August 1st 2023, the draft capital they used on Charbonnet matters. It's the best indicator of what they think of him. It's the best indicator of how much they would plan to use him.

The fantasy community was very high on Charbonnet going into the draft. And now he's gone to a team where he affects another back and people are acting like "Well, maybe he's not good enough to get on the field."

He can bust. But if you thought he was a good football player before Seattle took him (in the 2nd round no less), you should still think he's a good football player.

 

[rockaction]

He can bust. But if you thought he was a good football player before Seattle took him (in the 2nd round no less), you should still think he's a good football player.

What's stunning to me is that Seattle took him in the second, and I really don't think he's that great of a back. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I just didn't see it in his highlights. A guy that transferred out to a PAC-12 school that couldn't even really win the job at Michigan or against Brittain Brown at UCLA. I don't know. I want him to succeed, but there's just some gnawing feeling I get that he's not as good as second-round capital. We shall see.

 

[dkp993]

. That is your opinion. Nothing more

Same goes for literally anyone on this forum. Yours included.

Come on HSG, clearly my opinion is worth more then anyone’s here. I thought you knew!

 

[dkp993]

And nowhere is there really any clue whatsoever as to Charb's shoulder issue. I assume because we simply don't know anything more at this point.

Nothing has been reported other than he's "out indefinitely". That doesn't sound so great to me, but it doesn't mean much, necessarily either. Hopefully within a week or two it's more clear.
If there's no surgery on it, I don't think it's that big of a concern.

I heard on NFL networks camp report yesterday that they got the sense no one in the Seattle brass was concerned the issue would bleed into the season. I picked up from the reporting that they were being cautious like with KW3.

 

[jm192]

He can bust. But if you thought he was a good football player before Seattle took him (in the 2nd round no less), you should still think he's a good football player.

What's stunning to me is that Seattle took him in the second, and I really don't think he's that great of a back. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I just didn't see it in his highlights. A guy that transferred out to a PAC-12 school that couldn't even really win the job at Michigan or against Brittain Brown at UCLA. I don't know. I want him to succeed, but there's just some gnawing feeling I get that he's not as good as second-round capital. We shall see.

That's fair.

In general, I think the NFL gets it right more than we do--but there are people I can't believe an NFL team took them as highly as they did. And I don't just automatically change my mind because of what the NFL did.

I wasn't super impressed by Rashee Rice's tape and then KC takes him 2nd round. I'm still not a big Rice guy.

 

[Payne]

Right it is a fact he was atrocious in all the categories that Charb excelled in during his college career.

Edit: talking about short yardage, getting stuffed for 0 gain not his overall play.

Correct!

It’s almost as if we have stats to back that up.

Almost as if…

Will one of you please post Charbs NFL stats to date? I'll wait.......

Here are Walkers:

2022 Rushing​

See All

STATS
Regular Season
Postseason
Career

CAR	YDS	AVG	TD	LNG	REC	YDS	AVG	TD	LNG	FUM	LST
228	1,050	4.6	9	74	27	165	6.1	0	33	0	0

Or compare the college stats of Walker and Charbs.

You don't seem to understand predicting of current statistics. That's okay no one is perfect. Enjoy your season.

This is so weak. And the sly "no one is perfect" comment is completely unnecessary. Agree? Not something the moderators appreciate it.

I am trying to bring facts to support my stance and you bring opinions and apparently predictions now.
The truth is Charbs has ZERO NFL stats. And Walker's college resume is superior.

Sorry. You enjoy your season as well. Honestly.

 

[The Finist]

Charbs is more likely to be a decent change of pace back or bust than a NFL starter.


Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

 

[Streetduck]

Charbs is more likely to be a decent change of pace back or bust than a NFL starter.


Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Just as RB value has changed, I'm sure this fun little fact will also change the longer RB's are pushed down in the draft.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

But each second round RB is an independent event so you can’t apply those odds to any one RB in particular.

Charbonet surely could bust but it wouldn’t be because he was drafted in the second round.

With that said the NFL draft is an efficient market so draft position in theory should be a good indicator. Using it against him seems counterintuitive.

This seems to be a very personal debate to some people for some reason.

I think very few people have said Walker sucks or that he’ll be a bust for fantasy. He helped my redraft team lead the league in scoring last season and I’d surely consider drafting him again depending on what happens. I’d also trade for him in dynasty if an owner was panicking.

I think Seattle clearly has a plan - but of course “think” is the key word there.

 

[Boston]

As far as the RB position goes what exactly does "NFL starter" mean in 2023?

 

[Biabreakable]

Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Wouldnt this reasoning also be applicable to Walker as well?

 

[Bronco Billy]

Charbs is more likely to be a decent change of pace back or bust than a NFL starter.


Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Just jumped in to say that over the past 5-6 drafts that this is a patently false statement. 12 of the past 17 2nd round RBs have been starters prior to this year. Normally I’d continue lurking but given the disposition of this poster throughout this thread I thought it would be worth pointing out. See you all again in a few years.

 

[The Finist]

Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Wouldnt this reasoning also be applicable to Walker as well?

It did. And now he is a nfl starter. And a good one.

 

[The Finist]

As far as the RB position goes what exactly does "NFL starter" mean in 2023?

You should know it when you see it if you have played this game long enough.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Wouldnt this reasoning also be applicable to Walker as well?

It did. And now he is a nfl starter. And a good one.

He’s very good and potentially great. And he and Hall both look like very good to great backs that went in Round 2 last season.

 

[Boston]

As far as the RB position goes what exactly does "NFL starter" mean in 2023?

You should know it when you see it if you have played this game long enough.

Been doing this for over 30 years and I think who is a starting RB (outside of a few like Henry and CMac) is an antiquated way of judging one's fantasy value.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I think who is a starting RB (outside of a few like Henry and CMac) is an antiquated way of judging one's fantasy value.

Agreed. I tend to look at which parts of a backfield are likely to have more or less FF value based on role, and then look to ADP to see if they can be exploited.

“Starting RB” is kind of meaningless outside of a few situations.

 

[TripItUp]

If Charbonnet has half the career of Walker I'll be shocked.

There is a huge disparity in talent IMHO.

 

[The Finist]

I think who is a starting RB (outside of a few like Henry and CMac) is an antiquated way of judging one's fantasy value.

“Starting RB” is kind of meaningless outside of a few situations.

Kind of meaningless? when you check the rb rankings on fbg pretty much the top 25+ are starting rbs.

Seems meaningful not meaningless

 

[Biabreakable]

Charbs is more likely to be a decent change of pace back or bust than a NFL starter.


Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Just jumped in to say that over the past 5-6 drafts that this is a patently false statement. Normally I’d continue lurking but given the disposition of this poster throughout this thread I thought it would be worth pointing out. See you all again in a few years.

Hi BB. We have had our dissagreements in the past but nice to hear from you.

I had not taken the time to fact check this statement about the percentage of 2nd round NFL RB becoming starters or not. The definition of starter is one subject to debate as well, (starter for how long for example? or by what percentage of the teams opportunities?) but perhaps it is a larger percentage than what was stated, especially when considering more recent history of that sample in a NFL that for a long time has been showing decline of investment into the position compared to a decade ago.

Last time I really looked into that closely was 2014 when we had 2 drafts in a row without a RB selected in the 1st round.

There have been 11 RB selected in the 1st round in the 9 seasons since then and 32 teams, so about 1 per season on average over the last 11 seasons. Very roughly that means 31 teams per season, if they have a RB you could consider a starter, is a 2nd round or later pick.

That does seem like more than 25% of them, although starters are coming from later than the 2nd round as well.

That all being said there are plenty of 2nd round RB over that time frame who have not become starting RB or were not starting RB for very long.

Guys I would be comfortable saying were are:

LeVeon Bell
Derrick Henry
Dalvin Cook
Joe Mixon
Nick Chubb
Johnathan Taylor

Thats 6 out of the 27 players in the sample. 22%

Then there are a bunch of guys who maybe were?

Breece Hall
Kenneth Walker
Javonte Williams
Cam Akers
Miles Sanders
Ronald Jones
Jeremy Hill
Carlos Hyde
Eddie Lacy

But all of those are questionable of the definition as they still split carries quite a bit or did not sustain high level opportunities for very long, like even a whole season. But alright lets say they did enough. Thats 9 more. So thats 55% of the RB selected in the 2nd round.

Whos left?

James Cook
DeAndre Swift
JK Dobbins
AJ Dillon
Kerryon Johnson
Derrius Guice
TJ Yeldon
Ameer Abdullah
Bishop Sankey
Giovanni Bernard
Montee Ball
Christine Michael

A lot of these guys got injured or have been in RBBC. Some of them just plain sucked, but actually not that many of them.

The maybe and not lists are questionable.

Breece Hall only had 99 touches in the 7 games he played before being injured. He played fantastic though and would have likely had an awesome season if he had stayed healthy.

Kenneth Walker started 11 games and led the team in opportunities but Penny started the first 5 games before being injured and the Seahawks didnt have much else.

Javonte Williams technically only had one start and had identical rushing attempts as Gordon as a rookie, then got injured after 4 games as a starter in his 2nd season.

Cam Akers has never put it together for a full season. He had starter opportunity for a sample of games then didnt then did again.

Miles Sanders split with other RB his first 3 seasons before doing a lot more last season with 279 touches.

Ronald Jones had two 200 touch seasons but Im not sure that meets the threshold of "starter" or not. Its borderline. He was replaced by Fournette.

Jeremy Hill split with Bernard and only had 30 more touches than Bernard when both played 16 games in 2015 and Bernard had 300 more yards than Hill despite this. Bernard had similar touches as Ronald Jones and others and maybe should be considered on that list too.

Carlos Hyde had 3 seasons near 250 touches but an up and down career.

Eddie Lacy had 2 high touch seasons before fading then falling off.

There are still some players on the whos left list that might get a chance to shine in upcoming seasons like Cook, Swift, Dobbins and Dillon.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Eddie Lacy

Awe man, why you had to go there.

Now I’ve gotta remember Eddie Lacy

 

[Biabreakable]

Eddie Lacy

Awe man, why you had to go there.

Now I’ve gotta remember Eddie Lacy

Sorry.

I didnt mean to make such a long rambly post when I started, but figured I should get caught up to the last time I had looked at this.

The threshold for starter touches seems to be around 250. Or you could look at it by touches per game to eliminate games missed to injury. These younger players do have potentially one more game to work with than their predecesdors did.

 

[goose_egged]

12 mins agoSeattle Seahawks rookie running back Zach Charbonnet (shoulder) returned to Thursday's practice at training camp. The rookie from UCLA was banged up last weekend and was expected to miss significant time, but he missed just three practices. Fellow running back Kenneth Walker III is dealing with a groin injury, so the Charbonnet, Kenny McIntosh, and DeeJay Dallas should see additional work until he returns. Charbonnet is an intriguing running back handcuff in PPR formats thanks to his receiving skill set.--Jackson Sparks - RotoBaller

Pete said he'd be out "indefinitely" just days ago...

 

[Weebs210]

Thankfully a few days fits in the definition of indefinite

 

[dipandglide]

The backup RB needs preseason reps. Good timing.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Pete said he'd be out "indefinitely" just days ago...

First time Pete Carroll listener?

Stay tuned, it gets worse.

 

[FarFromHome]

Pete said he'd be out "indefinitely" just days ago...

First time Pete Carroll listener?

Stay tuned, it gets worse.

Bingo.

Reporter: "After missing a couple of practices, how is Player X feeling?"

Pete: "Player X has looked as good as any player or athlete I have ever seen. I think we should rename the holiday Christmas and call it Player X."

 

[Shanahanigans]

Charbs is more likely to be a decent change of pace back or bust than a NFL starter.


Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Just jumped in to say that over the past 5-6 drafts that this is a patently false statement. Normally I’d continue lurking but given the disposition of this poster throughout this thread I thought it would be worth pointing out. See you all again in a few years.

Hi BB. We have had our dissagreements in the past but nice to hear from you.

I had not taken the time to fact check this statement about the percentage of 2nd round NFL RB becoming starters or not. The definition of starter is one subject to debate as well, (starter for how long for example? or by what percentage of the teams opportunities?) but perhaps it is a larger percentage than what was stated, especially when considering more recent history of that sample in a NFL that for a long time has been showing decline of investment into the position compared to a decade ago.

Last time I really looked into that closely was 2014 when we had 2 drafts in a row without a RB selected in the 1st round.

There have been 11 RB selected in the 1st round in the 9 seasons since then and 32 teams, so about 1 per season on average over the last 11 seasons. Very roughly that means 31 teams per season, if they have a RB you could consider a starter, is a 2nd round or later pick.

That does seem like more than 25% of them, although starters are coming from later than the 2nd round as well.

That all being said there are plenty of 2nd round RB over that time frame who have not become starting RB or were not starting RB for very long.

Guys I would be comfortable saying were are:

LeVeon Bell
Derrick Henry
Dalvin Cook
Joe Mixon
Nick Chubb
Johnathan Taylor

Thats 6 out of the 27 players in the sample. 22%

Then there are a bunch of guys who maybe were?

Breece Hall
Kenneth Walker
Javonte Williams
Cam Akers
Miles Sanders
Ronald Jones
Jeremy Hill
Carlos Hyde
Eddie Lacy

But all of those are questionable of the definition as they still split carries quite a bit or did not sustain high level opportunities for very long, like even a whole season. But alright lets say they did enough. Thats 9 more. So thats 55% of the RB selected in the 2nd round.

Whos left?

James Cook
DeAndre Swift
JK Dobbins
AJ Dillon
Kerryon Johnson
Derrius Guice
TJ Yeldon
Ameer Abdullah
Bishop Sankey
Giovanni Bernard
Montee Ball
Christine Michael

A lot of these guys got injured or have been in RBBC. Some of them just plain sucked, but actually not that many of them.

The maybe and not lists are questionable.

Breece Hall only had 99 touches in the 7 games he played before being injured. He played fantastic though and would have likely had an awesome season if he had stayed healthy.

Kenneth Walker started 11 games and led the team in opportunities but Penny started the first 5 games before being injured and the Seahawks didnt have much else.

Javonte Williams technically only had one start and had identical rushing attempts as Gordon as a rookie, then got injured after 4 games as a starter in his 2nd season.

Cam Akers has never put it together for a full season. He had starter opportunity for a sample of games then didnt then did again.

Miles Sanders split with other RB his first 3 seasons before doing a lot more last season with 279 touches.

Ronald Jones had two 200 touch seasons but Im not sure that meets the threshold of "starter" or not. Its borderline. He was replaced by Fournette.

Jeremy Hill split with Bernard and only had 30 more touches than Bernard when both played 16 games in 2015 and Bernard had 300 more yards than Hill despite this. Bernard had similar touches as Ronald Jones and others and maybe should be considered on that list too.

Carlos Hyde had 3 seasons near 250 touches but an up and down career.

Eddie Lacy had 2 high touch seasons before fading then falling off.

There are still some players on the whos left list that might get a chance to shine in upcoming seasons like Cook, Swift, Dobbins and Dillon.

Really appreciate the in depth breakdown! Just about all these guys held significant fantasy value at some point. That's a good data point to have when drafting.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Bingo.

Reporter: "After missing a couple of practices, how is Player X feeling?"

Pete: "Player X has looked as good as any player or athlete I have ever seen. I think we should rename the holiday Christmas and call it Player X."

He looks (chew chew) pretty good in what he’s been (chew chew) able to (chew) do so far, and (chew chew) I know this kid, and he’s (chew chew) really champing at the bit to get back (chew chew) out there, which we’ll do just (chew chew) as soon as he’s ready. (Chew chew) which should be any day now. (chew chew chew chew chew chew chew)

 

[Biabreakable]

Charbs is more likely to be a decent change of pace back or bust than a NFL starter.


Only around 25% of RBs selected in rd2 are nfl starters. It's pretty simple.

Just jumped in to say that over the past 5-6 drafts that this is a patently false statement. Normally I’d continue lurking but given the disposition of this poster throughout this thread I thought it would be worth pointing out. See you all again in a few years.

Hi BB. We have had our dissagreements in the past but nice to hear from you.

I had not taken the time to fact check this statement about the percentage of 2nd round NFL RB becoming starters or not. The definition of starter is one subject to debate as well, (starter for how long for example? or by what percentage of the teams opportunities?) but perhaps it is a larger percentage than what was stated, especially when considering more recent history of that sample in a NFL that for a long time has been showing decline of investment into the position compared to a decade ago.

Last time I really looked into that closely was 2014 when we had 2 drafts in a row without a RB selected in the 1st round.

There have been 11 RB selected in the 1st round in the 9 seasons since then and 32 teams, so about 1 per season on average over the last 11 seasons. Very roughly that means 31 teams per season, if they have a RB you could consider a starter, is a 2nd round or later pick.

That does seem like more than 25% of them, although starters are coming from later than the 2nd round as well.

That all being said there are plenty of 2nd round RB over that time frame who have not become starting RB or were not starting RB for very long.

Guys I would be comfortable saying were are:

LeVeon Bell
Derrick Henry
Dalvin Cook
Joe Mixon
Nick Chubb
Johnathan Taylor

Thats 6 out of the 27 players in the sample. 22%

Then there are a bunch of guys who maybe were?

Breece Hall
Kenneth Walker
Javonte Williams
Cam Akers
Miles Sanders
Ronald Jones
Jeremy Hill
Carlos Hyde
Eddie Lacy

But all of those are questionable of the definition as they still split carries quite a bit or did not sustain high level opportunities for very long, like even a whole season. But alright lets say they did enough. Thats 9 more. So thats 55% of the RB selected in the 2nd round.

Whos left?

James Cook
DeAndre Swift
JK Dobbins
AJ Dillon
Kerryon Johnson
Derrius Guice
TJ Yeldon
Ameer Abdullah
Bishop Sankey
Giovanni Bernard
Montee Ball
Christine Michael

A lot of these guys got injured or have been in RBBC. Some of them just plain sucked, but actually not that many of them.

The maybe and not lists are questionable.

Breece Hall only had 99 touches in the 7 games he played before being injured. He played fantastic though and would have likely had an awesome season if he had stayed healthy.

Kenneth Walker started 11 games and led the team in opportunities but Penny started the first 5 games before being injured and the Seahawks didnt have much else.

Javonte Williams technically only had one start and had identical rushing attempts as Gordon as a rookie, then got injured after 4 games as a starter in his 2nd season.

Cam Akers has never put it together for a full season. He had starter opportunity for a sample of games then didnt then did again.

Miles Sanders split with other RB his first 3 seasons before doing a lot more last season with 279 touches.

Ronald Jones had two 200 touch seasons but Im not sure that meets the threshold of "starter" or not. Its borderline. He was replaced by Fournette.

Jeremy Hill split with Bernard and only had 30 more touches than Bernard when both played 16 games in 2015 and Bernard had 300 more yards than Hill despite this. Bernard had similar touches as Ronald Jones and others and maybe should be considered on that list too.

Carlos Hyde had 3 seasons near 250 touches but an up and down career.

Eddie Lacy had 2 high touch seasons before fading then falling off.

There are still some players on the whos left list that might get a chance to shine in upcoming seasons like Cook, Swift, Dobbins and Dillon.

Really appreciate the in depth breakdown! Just about all these guys held significant fantasy value at some point. That's a good data point to have when drafting.

Glad you found this useful.

I thought I was mostly rambling. But since I was looking it up anyways I figured might as well share what I found.

I do think there are more accurate ways to evaluate things like this than what I did. I have done so before. It just takes more time to do that.

The bit about the 11 first round picks since 2013 is definitely off for example as far as how many of them were starters over the time frame. Because of overlap seasons of those players and seasons of starter qualifying seasons by 1st round RB drafted prior to 2013.

But that wasn't really the information I was looking for at the time.

The more complete way to do this is by looking at RB drafted in every round, including undrafted RB as well who had starter quality games, even if not for a whole season. Which I determined through a combination of VBD and PPG thresholds from the entire sample size.

I dont really see myself putting the time in to bring this back up to my previous standard though. Just so many other things to do instead.

 

[Da Franchise]

Had a feeling this was a nothingburger. Which is great, because I may already regret drafting him over Kendre Miller in my startup. The plan is to sell though if/when he gets a value pop during the season.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

First time Pete Carroll listener?

He didn’t exactly lie.

 

[Faust]

Seahawks RB Zach Charbonnet had four carries for 14 yards and caught both of his targets for 14 yards in Thursday’s preseason win over the Vikings.

Seattle started DJ Dallas, with Charbonnet the No. 2 back through the rotation. Playing behind Dallas wasn’t a great look for the rookie, who has missed time with a shoulder injury. Charbonnet made it though the game without a setback and should be in line for a larger workload next week. With Ken Walker (core) sidelined and at risk of sitting out the preseason, Seattle could start Charbonnet in their second preseason game.

 

[Faust]

NFL Rookie Watch
Zach Charbonnet absolutely laying the BOOM

Not once, but TWICE on Lewis Cine (Vikings Safety).
Charbonnet’s contact balance was reportedly viewed as “elite” by many NFL scouts leading up to the NFL Draft.Charbonnet has reportedly looked “fantastic” at training camp after coming back from a shoulder injury.The Seahawks rookie RB is not afraid to TRUCK.

https://twitter.com/nflrookiewatxh/status/1689848119419191296?s=21

 

[jobarules]

I think who is a starting RB (outside of a few like Henry and CMac) is an antiquated way of judging one's fantasy value.

Agreed. I tend to look at which parts of a backfield are likely to have more or less FF value based on role, and then look to ADP to see if they can be exploited.

“Starting RB” is kind of meaningless outside of a few situations.

How many backup RBs score more fantasy points than starting RBs when both are healthy? Maybe McKinnon? Anyone else? This is foolish to say its meaningless.

 

[Chaka]

Christine Michael

2023 is his year, I can feel it.

 

[Chaka]

NFL Rookie Watch
Zach Charbonnet absolutely laying the BOOM

Not once, but TWICE on Lewis Cine (Vikings Safety).
Charbonnet’s contact balance was reportedly viewed as “elite” by many NFL scouts leading up to the NFL Draft.Charbonnet has reportedly looked “fantastic” at training camp after coming back from a shoulder injury.The Seahawks rookie RB is not afraid to TRUCK.

https://twitter.com/nflrookiewatxh/status/1689848119419191296?s=21

I don't understand how a RB is allowed to lower the crown of his helmet into the head of a defender, but if the defender does it it's 15 yards and a 1st down.

 

[Weebs210]

Christine Michael

2023 is his year, I can feel it.

I've never been so wrong on a player before haha. Just wish his brain was bigger :/

 

[Chaka]

Christine Michael

2023 is his year, I can feel it.

I've never been so wrong on a player before haha. Just wish his brain was bigger :/

Who cares about his brain? Have you seen his SPARQ score!!!?!?!??

 

[Alex P Keaton]

Christine Michael

2023 is his year, I can feel it.

I've never been so wrong on a player before haha. Just wish his brain was bigger :/

Shot out of a cannon!!!!

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Playing behind Dallas wasn’t a great look for the rookie, who has missed time with a shoulder injury.

This Rotoworld "analysis" just keeps getting worse and worse. Veteran deference has always been a thing in preseason - plus Charbonet did miss time in camp.

 

[Payne]

NFL Rookie Watch
Zach Charbonnet absolutely laying the BOOM

Not once, but TWICE on Lewis Cine (Vikings Safety).
Charbonnet’s contact balance was reportedly viewed as “elite” by many NFL scouts leading up to the NFL Draft.Charbonnet has reportedly looked “fantastic” at training camp after coming back from a shoulder injury.The Seahawks rookie RB is not afraid to TRUCK.

https://twitter.com/nflrookiewatxh/status/1689848119419191296?s=21

Like Walker even more after viewing this.

 

[zed2283]

NFL Rookie Watch
Zach Charbonnet absolutely laying the BOOM

Not once, but TWICE on Lewis Cine (Vikings Safety).
Charbonnet’s contact balance was reportedly viewed as “elite” by many NFL scouts leading up to the NFL Draft.Charbonnet has reportedly looked “fantastic” at training camp after coming back from a shoulder injury.The Seahawks rookie RB is not afraid to TRUCK.

https://twitter.com/nflrookiewatxh/status/1689848119419191296?s=21

I don't understand how a RB is allowed to lower the crown of his helmet into the head of a defender, but if the defender does it it's 15 yards and a 1st down.

It's supposed to be a penalty.