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Tucker Carlson: probably not in deep trouble anymore, but he should be. (1 Viewer)

I want to thank @Coach Beard for providing a lot of good information in this thread.  He has given me a lot to think about and I appreciate it.  I'm certainly not an expert on all things in here, which is one of the reasons I love this place so much.  The free flow of ideas and facts is important, especially in today's climate where news and facts are disseminated in a biased manner.  So kudos @Coach Beard, and thank you for your persepctive.  👍
Extremely gracious response here. These are sensitive topics to discuss, and it is this kind of approach that will allow us to have effective dialogue. 

 
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Extremely gracious response here. These are sensitive topics to discuss, and it is this kind of approach that will allow us to have effective dialogue. 
Everything you say here is true.  
But I’m skeptical about his sincerity, because that post was just hours apart from this one in another topic:

ekbeats said:
 And sadly I don't think there is any reasoning with the Left on this issue.  I see it in here on a daily basis.  If you don't believe as the Left does then you are either ignorant or a racist.  Exhibit A is the Tucker Carlson thread and the debate about whether Ketanji Brown Jackson or Tucker Carlson had a more difficult road to the Supreme Court.  The Left doesn't even want to consider the evidence, it's just an emotional response.  It's very frustrating to watch.  
I’m rooting for him to be the person you’re praising.  We will see which pattern emerges.  But for now, I’m tuning him out - if he wants to have it both ways, I’m not interested in either.

 
Everything you say here is true.  
But I’m skeptical about his sincerity, because that post was just hours apart from this one in another topic:

I’m rooting for him to be the person you’re praising.  We will see which pattern emerges.  But for now, I’m tuning him out - if he wants to have it both ways, I’m not interested in either.


Just had to go ruin a good thing, didn't you?  :doh:

Even when someone is being gracious you can't help yourselves.  This is why we can't have nice things.

 
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Just had to go ruin a good thing, didn't you?  :doh:

Even when someone is being gracious you can't help yourselves.  This is why we can't have nice things.
I am capable of appreciating someones graciousness while simultaneously remaining skeptical of their seriousness in offering that graciousness. If you are also capable of the same, what is the intended purpose of this quoted post?

 
Extremely gracious response here. These are sensitive topics to discuss, and it is this kind of approach that will allow us to have effective dialogue. 


Unfortunately it produced a not so gracious reply.  I appreciate your perspective and positivity. I dealt with an abusive spouse who has a borderline personality disorder for some 25 years, and I get a lot of the same vibe from modern leftist.  Neither logic, grace, or patience is effective.  If you disagree it results in a very hostile and/or personal response that has nothing to do with the issue.  

 
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I am capable of appreciating someones graciousness while simultaneously remaining skeptical of their seriousness in offering that graciousness. If you are also capable of the same, what is the intended purpose of this quoted post?


Because it was uncalled for.   Someone says something nice, why attack their character for that?

 
Unfortunately it produced a not so gracious reply.  I appreciate your perspective and positivity. I dealt with an abusive spouse who has a borderline personality disorder for some 25 years, and I get a lot of the same vibe from modern leftist.  Neither logic, grace, or patience is effective.  If you disagree it results in a very personal response that has nothing to do with the issue.  
Yes Jon, modern leftist are the most horrible people in the world.  Racist, elitist, haters of whites, etc.

I tried with you but welcome to ignore. 

 
This is a perfect example of how to have respectful dialogue over contentious topics in the PSF.  We can disagree without being disagreeable. Good on you!


Ekbeats is the only person I’ve ever removed from my ignore list.  I will sometimes show myself ignored responses to see if people have changed at all or perhaps I was too quick to ignore them.  I found that to be the case with Ekbeats and I’m glad I took him off the list.  

 
Ekbeats is the only person I’ve ever removed from my ignore list.  I will sometimes show myself ignored responses to see if people have changed at all or perhaps I was too quick to ignore them.  I found that to be the case with Ekbeats and I’m glad I took him off the list.  


The ignore function is part of the problem.  Why come to a forum and not acknowledge and consider other viewpoints?  

 
The ignore function is part of the problem.  Why come to a forum and not acknowledge and consider other viewpoints?  
Because viewpoints built off of lies, feelings, and illogic aren't worth acknowledging.

For example, viewpoints like the 2020 election was stolen.  Or viewpoints that the vaccines are dangerous and haven't saved millions of lives.  What's the point in reading viewpoints like this?  Where there are facts, studies, failed court cases, etc that prove the truth?

 
Because viewpoints built off of lies, feelings, and illogic aren't worth acknowledging.

For example, viewpoints like the 2020 election was stolen.  Or viewpoints that the vaccines are dangerous and haven't saved millions of lives.  What's the point in reading viewpoints like this?  Where there are facts, studies, failed court cases, etc that prove the truth?
I consider real viewpoint but I give zero consideration to people who are just regurgitating the Fox News talking points.  

 
Because viewpoints built off of lies, feelings, and illogic aren't worth acknowledging.

For example, viewpoints like the 2020 election was stolen.  Or viewpoints that the vaccines are dangerous and haven't saved millions of lives.  What's the point in reading viewpoints like this?  Where there are facts, studies, failed court cases, etc that prove the truth?


Sure there are bad views not supported by facts.  But the hostility is not just limited to those cases. 

 
I think you'll see most of it is.  For example you claiming that all leftist are racist.  Or you claiming that all leftist media is based on race.  Or other folks who claim that all leftist want communism.

These absurd claims by you simply aren't worth taking seriously. 


Lol...if you don't see the media consistently inserting their narrative on race into all kinds issues, I would suggest you are not paying any attention.  

 
Ekbeats is the only person I’ve ever removed from my ignore list.  I will sometimes show myself ignored responses to see if people have changed at all or perhaps I was too quick to ignore them.  I found that to be the case with Ekbeats and I’m glad I took him off the list.  
Thanks Saber!  I appreciate that. 👍

 
The ignore function is part of the problem.  Why come to a forum and not acknowledge and consider other viewpoints?  
LOL. Considering other viewpoints is great. Reading you regurgitating the same three tired tropes of right-wing propaganda ad nauseum over the past couple of years is not an example of "other viewpoints." It's an example of spam. Your presence on MANY ignore lists is an example of meritocracy.

 
Herb said:
LOL. Considering other viewpoints is great. Reading you regurgitating the same three tired tropes of right-wing propaganda ad nauseum over the past couple of years is not an example of "other viewpoints." It's an example of spam. Your presence on MANY ignore lists is an example of meritocracy.


Full of absolute crap.   People who have a long ignore list are weak minded individuals who are afraid of having their views challenged.  I am not a partisan.  I really don't care for the Republican Party and their politics.  What I do care about is protecting free speech, fair and equal treatment of people, a d government whose power is kept in check.   Which is why I have no respect for today's left as they are against all those principles.  I am probably one of the more independent thinker on this forum who brings original arguements and analysis.  The idea that I regurgitate propaganda is 100 percent ignorant groupthink of weakminded posters who can't craft an original arguement.  

 
Ignore isn't about excluding viewpoints.

Its about not trying  to reason with people who claim others are full of absolute crap, or disgusting, or weak minded individuals.  

 
Full of absolute crap.   People who have a long ignore list are weak minded individuals who are afraid of having their views challenged.  I am not a partisan.  I really don't care for the Republican Party and their politics.  What I do care about is protecting free speech, fair and equal treatment of people, a d government whose power is kept in check.   Which is why I have no respect for today's left as they are against all those principles.  I am probably one of the more independent thinker on this forum who brings original arguements and analysis.  The idea that I regurgitate propaganda is 100 percent ignorant groupthink of weakminded posters who can't craft an original arguement.  
Your pomposity and lack of self awareness are a marvel. For you to declare that you're not partisan and then get into detailing exactly why you're partisan is a shining example. 

To call others weak-minded when 90%+ of your posts boil down to "red team good, blue team abominable pieces of human filth" would be laughable were it not so sad. My ignore list is very short, and you were never on it until I finally just got fed up with your one-note posts. I'm eager to hear what people with different opinions than me have to say. I've heard everything you have to say and it's not interesting,  credible, or worth my time.

Apologies to all for the sidetrack. Back to talking about Tucker, speaking of abominable...

 
It would be good shtick to do the outrage in this thread the way Carlson does. 

Why the need to ignore someone? Are you weak-minded? Does my truth frighten you? Why do you think that is? I don't care about the Republican party, I don't know why YOU need to talk about the Republican party? I'm just asking questions here, why is someone afraid of that?  

: Constipated Face:

 
Your pomposity and lack of self awareness are a marvel. For you to declare that you're not partisan and then get into detailing exactly why you're partisan is a shining example. 

To call others weak-minded when 90%+ of your posts boil down to "red team good, blue team abominable pieces of human filth" would be laughable were it not so sad. My ignore list is very short, and you were never on it until I finally just got fed up with your one-note posts. I'm eager to hear what people with different opinions than me have to say. I've heard everything you have to say and it's not interesting,  credible, or worth my time.

Apologies to all for the sidetrack. Back to talking about Tucker, speaking of abominable...


Just pathetic.  Expected, but pathetic.  What is sad is how scared leftist are a hearing conflicting ideas.  I come in and post all kinds of ideas, and 100 percent of the time posters come and make it personal.  Really without fail.  

 
Just pathetic.  Expected, but pathetic.  What is sad is how scared leftist are a hearing conflicting ideas.  I come in and post all kinds of ideas, and 100 percent of the time posters come and make it personal.  Really without fail.  
jon - if you would leave out the "pathetic" and "disgusting" and "the left is commies" then you may just have a better shot at having a debate.

You may not be a republican fan, but you come off as a terribly partisan when your shtick is to hate anything and everyone on the left. If instead of typing "the left" you actually used someone's name, you would be booted from this site immediately. Maybe think on that - if you couldn't say it about an individual, maybe you shouldn't say it about a collection of indivisuals.

 
jon - if you would leave out the "pathetic" and "disgusting" and "the left is commies" then you may just have a better shot at having a debate.

You may not be a republican fan, but you come off as a terribly partisan when your shtick is to hate anything and everyone on the left. If instead of typing "the left" you actually used someone's name, you would be booted from this site immediately. Maybe think on that - if you couldn't say it about an individual, maybe you shouldn't say it about a collection of indivisuals.


Now admonish @Herb for his post.  :popcorn:

 
The McGregor segment tonight was very good
We hear all day long that republicans aren't fans of Putin, yet we get this praise from you.

Macgregor seems to have great affection for Russia and Putin, and it isn't just his recent comments that Putin should be able to take any parts of Ukraine that he wants.

In 2014, Macgregor went on Russian state-owned RT to express his opposition to U.S. intervention in the Kosovo War.

In 2014, after Russia annex Crimea and was engaged in a conflict with Ukraine over its eastern parts, Macgregor appeared on Russian state-owned network RT where he called for the annexation of the Donbas and said residents of the region "are in fact Russians, not Ukrainians, and at the same time, you have Ukrainians in the west and in the north, who are not Russians.

 
We hear all day long that republicans aren't fans of Putin, yet we get this praise from you.

Macgregor seems to have great affection for Russia and Putin, and it isn't just his recent comments that Putin should be able to take any parts of Ukraine that he wants.

In 2014, Macgregor went on Russian state-owned RT to express his opposition to U.S. intervention in the Kosovo War.

In 2014, after Russia annex Crimea and was engaged in a conflict with Ukraine over its eastern parts, Macgregor appeared on Russian state-owned network RT where he called for the annexation of the Donbas and said residents of the region "are in fact Russians, not Ukrainians, and at the same time, you have Ukrainians in the west and in the north, who are not Russians.
He is an amazingly vile Putin stooge, I cannot believe Fox will still have him on, but I completely support Tucker continuing to show us exactly who he is. 

 
We hear all day long that republicans aren't fans of Putin, yet we get this praise from you.

Macgregor seems to have great affection for Russia and Putin, and it isn't just his recent comments that Putin should be able to take any parts of Ukraine that he wants.

In 2014, Macgregor went on Russian state-owned RT to express his opposition to U.S. intervention in the Kosovo War.

In 2014, after Russia annex Crimea and was engaged in a conflict with Ukraine over its eastern parts, Macgregor appeared on Russian state-owned network RT where he called for the annexation of the Donbas and said residents of the region "are in fact Russians, not Ukrainians, and at the same time, you have Ukrainians in the west and in the north, who are not Russians.
Some background on McGregor….

The revenge of Col. Douglas Macgregor 

Amid an unprecedented Pentagon shakeup, an outspoken defense reformer who wants out of endless war, finally gets his shot.

NOVEMBER 12, 2020 

Written by 
Mark Perry

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As it turns out, not only does Donald Trump hate to lose, he can be vindictive when he does. The defeated president — clearly pouting over his election loss to Joe Biden and unforgiving to those who he thinks have crossed him — has roiled the national security establishment with a shake up that rippled through the Pentagon this week. 

The first to go was Defense Secretary Mark Esper, summarily dismissed by presidential tweet. But Esper was soon followed by the swift resignations of several others, a gallery of figures that Trump (apparently) felt had not shown sufficient fidelity to his governing style: Jen Stewart, Esper’s chief of staff (whose exit, once Esper was gone, was predictable); James Anderson, acting undersecretary of defense for policy (reports say he was forced out); Vice Adm. Joseph Kernan, undersecretary of defense for intelligence; and Lisa Gordon-Hagerty, head of the National Nuclear Security Administration. 

Then there are the rumors: a deeper flush at the Pentagon, that CIA director Gina Haspel would soon be dragged to the block, and that Trump will consign to oblivion any and all who have disagreed with him. Excepting, presumably, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. 

Washington was immediately filled with dark forebodings: that the president was lining up acolytes who would take us to war, that he was taking vengeance on those who opposed his suggestion that the U.S. military be used to put down domestic disturbances, that he was planning to announce a full withdrawal of U.S. troops in Afghanistan — that he was master-minding some kind of “soft coup.” The names of some of the reported replacements helped to fan the flames: retired Army General Anthony Tata (an on-the-record Islamophobe), Ezra Cohen-Watnick (a former aide to retired Gen. Michael Flynn and regime-change proponent), and retired Army Col. Doug Macgregor — who will serve as special assistant to Christopher Miller, the new acting secretary.  

Most of these guys, with the exception of Miller himself, are well-known to the public, having built reputations as last-ditch Trump supporters or seeding controversy with hair-raising suggestions on how to handle people (like Muslims and Mexicans) whom they don’t particularly like. But there are also outliers — like Macgregor — whose statements on America’s overseas adventures have been so controversial, and so outside the military’s own well-trodden path, that they actually make sense. 

Macgregor, a West Point graduate, is an acquired taste: outspoken and controversial. He has flagged reporters with his statements about immigrants (we need martial law at the U.S.-Mexico border), Iranians (we need to look for areas where we can cooperate), Afghanistan (we have no business being there) Iraq (we should have left, long ago), and Syria (we should get out immediately). Those views aren’t to everyone’s liking, but they’re especially controversial in the military, whose staid stance on foreign interventions does not countenance the kind of dissent in the upper ranks that Macgregor represents. Macgregor, it is said, has refused to “stay in his lane,” has been too outspoken, too vocal, and not really a team player. 

Yet, senior military officers quietly admit that in terms of sheer intellect, no one quite matches Macgregor. Several years ago, I asked a senior U.S. Marine Corps officer to name each of the services’s most creative thinkers. His answers were entirely predictable to anyone with even a passing knowledge of those in uniform, except when it came to the Army. He didn’t hesitate: “It’s Doug Macgregor,” he said. “He’s the best thinker they have, living or dead.” Retired Gen. Tommy Franks would probably disagree. 

Franks, the former commander of Operation Iraqi Freedom, brought Macgregor (then still in uniform), to U.S. Central Command headquarters in Tampa in the run-up to the Iraq War in early 2002 to brief his war planners. Macgregor took a roundabout, but effective route, in getting there: he had briefed Newt Gingrich on his own war plan for Iraq, and Gingrich was so taken by what he had to say that he recommended him to then-Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, who insisted that Franks hear him out. 

Macgregor’s appearance in Tampa is now a part of Army legend. The U.S. military can take Baghdad with 15,000 troops, Macgregor announced to the room of uniformed experts. The statement stunned Franks, as did Macgregor’s advice on “Phase IV” (postwar) operations — which had not been mentioned in his briefing. Why wasn’t it there? Macgregor was asked. “The reason it’s not there,” Macgregor said, “is because we’re not going to need it. We’re going to turn the governing of Iraq over to the Iraqis, then we’re going to get out.” 

Whereupon Mike Fitzgerald, one of Franks’ most senior planners, got up from his seat and left the room. “I think it was at that point that Doug’s career ended,” a fellow West Point graduate says. That’s probably true, but only in part.  

While Macgregor retired soon after his Tampa appearance, he did so only after talking with then-Army Chief of Staff Eric Shinseki. Macgregor told Shinseki that the Army needed to get lighter and faster, cutting away its logistic tail and its top-heavy officer corps. Shinseki not only agreed, he was planning his own Macgregor-like series of reforms. But the talk with Shinseki wasn’t the first time Macgregor had made his mark. Shinseki’s immediate predecessor, Army Chief of Staff Dennis Reimer, required his senior staff to read “Breaking the Phalanx,” Macgregor’s 1997 book on how the Army should fight. Reimer helped to put Macgregor’s innovations on the map. This is where we need to go, Reimer told his staff. 

And then there’s 73 Easting.

Arguably, none of Doug Macgregor’s later influence would have been possible without the Battle of 73 Easting (named for its map coordinates — its “phase lines”), which is still studied by armored officers as one of the most significant, and most lopsided, tank victories in the history of American warfare. The battle took place on February 26, 1991 — when elements of the U.S. 2nd Armored Cavalry Regiment, under Macgregor, took on the tanks of the Tawakalna Division of Saddam Hussein’s vaunted Republican Guard. Macgregor expertly maneuvered his tanks through the enemy lines — directing his tank leaders, one of whom was H.R. McMaster, through the enemy lines. Macgregor lost one man killed, but his tank squadrons destroyed dozens of armored vehicles. The battle had a deep effect on Macgregor, who remembers talking with one of the Iraqi prisoners after the battle: “Why do you not go to Baghdad now?” the prisoner asked him. “You have the power. Your army rules the heavens and the earth. Do you think we love Saddam?” In the years that followed, the Iraqi prisoners’ words haunted Macgregor. The road to Baghdad was open — but America didn’t take it. 

Ironically, in one of those odd twists of history, Macgregor’s role as the commander of his tank squadrons is often ignored, while McMaster is remembered and celebrated. Then too, as any senior Army officer will testify, Macgregor’s outspoken and often too-public critique of his own service hurt his chances for promotion. Macgregor questioned everything: why are we staying in Afghanistan? Or Iraq? Or Syria? Why are we prosecuting these endless wars? Doug Macgregor had lots of time to ponder these questions, particularly during Operation Iraqi Freedom, as his kinsman and fellow officer, McMaster, was adding to his laurels during the Anbar Awakening, where he performed brilliantly. Macgregor, meanwhile, was sidelined and marginalized, with a position at the National Defense University.

And so, it seems the McMaster-Macgregor narrative was set. McMaster got his stars, while Doug Macgregor went on to a career as a military historian. McMaster became the acolyte to greatness (the up-and-coming friend of David Petraeus), a controversial president’s national security advisor (one of the “adults in the room”), a gruff-voiced patriot (warning us incessantly of looming threats in Russia, China, Iran, etc.), and all-around “team player.” 

Macgregor has always shrugged this off: his old friend deserves his stars, deserves his praise, and has proved his courage. Team player? It’s true: McMaster has been so fitted to his uniform that he looks like a throwback, a latter-day Patton. He’s the quintessential team player in a service that prizes staying in your lane, that rewards teamwork. And Macgregor? Oddly, and ironically — and for all of his outspoken views on ending America’s endless wars, Doug Macgregor has also been a team player. 

He’s just been on the wrong team. 
https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2020/11/12/the-revenge-of-col-douglas-macgregor/

 
It's getting rough out here, people are coming for Tucker, same way they came for the 'hilarious' Alex Jones.
He's a young man, that Tucker.  Suspect it'll be hard for him to dodge the consequences of his recent decision-making forever.

 
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Full of absolute crap.   People who have a long ignore list are weak minded individuals who are afraid of having their views challenged.  I am not a partisan.  I really don't care for the Republican Party and their politics.  What I do care about is protecting free speech, fair and equal treatment of people, a d government whose power is kept in check.   Which is why I have no respect for today's left as they are against all those principles.  I am probably one of the more independent thinker on this forum who brings original arguements and analysis.  The idea that I regurgitate propaganda is 100 percent ignorant groupthink of weakminded posters who can't craft an original arguement.  


Either way, it's good to come here to see how leftists think and operate under anonymity. Unfortunately/fortunately, in real life my leftist friends hide these thought patterns much more, but experiencing many of their underlying conceptions here in an unfettered way allows me to better deal with them in the real world when they do creep to the surface at times - I'm less emotional about stuff that would potentially otherwise shock, frustrate and/or anger me into a less than desirable response.

 
Either way, it's good to come here to see how leftists think and operate under anonymity. Unfortunately/fortunately, in real life my leftist friends hide these thought patterns much more, but experiencing many of their underlying conceptions here in an unfettered way allows me to better deal with them in the real world when they do creep to the surface at times - I'm less emotional about stuff that would potentially otherwise shock, frustrate and/or anger me into a less than desirable response.
Wow.  Its like you guys are at war with the lefties.  Guess we better be more careful with our unfetteredness here lest we give away our secrets  :cool:

 
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In past wars people like Tucker Carlson have been convicted of treason.

Tokyo Rose is the most famous, but Mildred Gillars was jailed for 15 years for her broadcasts during WWII as well.  And if you read what these people were actually saying it's not all that different from what he's doing now. If anything, the WWII enemy propagandists were less overt in their undermining of democracy and America.

I mean... how much do you have to hate America to puppet Putin almost word-for-word?

Tucker: At exactly the moment when the emergency powers they awarded to themselves to fight COVID started to wane, our leaders began pushing for conflict against Russia… Without even pausing, the Biden Administration declared total economic war on a sovereign country...
If we do end up in a war, he's well across the line.  Stupid games, stupid prizes.  FAFO, etc.

 
In past wars people like Tucker Carlson have been convicted of treason.

Tokyo Rose is the most famous, but Mildred Gillars was jailed for 15 years for her broadcasts during WWII as well.  And if you read what these people were actually saying it's not all that different from what he's doing now. If anything, the WWII enemy propagandists were less overt in their undermining of democracy and America.

I mean... how much do you have to hate America to puppet Putin almost word-for-word?

If we do end up in a war, he's well across the line.  Stupid games, stupid prizes.  FAFO, etc.
Another example.

 
As someone who enjoyed Tucker for his more investigative segments, his reactions to this fast moving storyline with Ukraine have been very poor. He's jumping to conclusions much too quickly and isn't verifying the info his is putting out. Very disappointing.

 
Wait till Russia uses chemical weapons, and Carlson says Putin was backed into a corner by Ukraine's biological weapons, crippling sanctions, and the West trying to starve the Russian people. 

And that still won't be enough for my mom to stop watching him,

 
Tucker's plot arc from Father Coughlin to Tokyo Rose to Benedict Arnold seems rushed.  Don't get me wrong, it's interesting, but the writers could have spread that out over a season or two.  

I mean, even Joffrey made it halfway thru the series.

 
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