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Probably? Yeah, if I wasn't clear - I was not just "blaimg" Musk here - anyone that does it...... I get some of it is because publicly one thing is said that counters what was said privately so there is this "rush/need" to publicly set the record straight but in general yes I don't understand when anyone does itWasn't that an internal email that was publicly released by an employee? I get Musk is open in a lot of his conversations, but I wasn't under the impression this was one of them.I mean every company i worked for when we got bought out had to sign some pledge or some other document (not HR stuff thats different) and if you didn't you were basically let go. But it was never labeled hardcore or done publicly but i get the ideaSeems fine to me. That's not the way I would phrase it, but if my goal was to get rid of the "bring your whole self to work" crowd, this is part of how I would implement that purge. You have to get these people to self-select their way to some other firm.Agree to be "extremely hardcore" or get 3 months of severance.
I'm very fascinated with the whole "behind closed door is now handled publicly" phenomenon..... I'm not talking about just this situation but like players calling out coaches via tweets, people calling out bosses via tweets, calling out customers via tweets etc
Like just handle your **** privately..... I'll never understand this current "public spats/arguments" etc
Me as well, if people want to work 60-80 hour weeks for him, be my guest.Seems fine to me. That's not the way I would phrase it, but if my goal was to get rid of the "bring your whole self to work" crowd, this is part of how I would implement that purge. You have to get these people to self-select their way to some other firm.Agree to be "extremely hardcore" or get 3 months of severance.
Seems fine to me. That's not the way I would phrase it, but if my goal was to get rid of the "bring your whole self to work" crowd, this is part of how I would implement that purge. You have to get these people to self-select their way to some other firm.Agree to be "extremely hardcore" or get 3 months of severance.
I used to think this until I got to a company that had a dedicated UX group. I'll take a dedicated UX person working in conjunction with an engineer all day every day over an engineer trying to do both.
I think there’s two things here:
Yep. I am curious how many people are going to sign up for that. Only the types that are most fanatical or lowest skilled probably would.Me as well, if people want to work 60-80 hour weeks for him, be my guest.Seems fine to me. That's not the way I would phrase it, but if my goal was to get rid of the "bring your whole self to work" crowd, this is part of how I would implement that purge. You have to get these people to self-select their way to some other firm.Agree to be "extremely hardcore" or get 3 months of severance.
I've been trying to figure out why this hasn't happened for the last 5-6 years.
Yeah this...UX experience especially a UX App experience isn't something most engineers are especially good at and they really aren't good at it when it needs to be for the mass market. They are good when say you want to go from a scrolling experience to say TikTok's swiping experience, but the UX experience is vitally important. What's interesting to me at this stage is Elon gets that for a car (lets make it as cool as possible), but doesn't seem to get that (yet) here. I'll also say that bells and whistles works in a physical setting, but when you have limited real estate (the size of an iPhone screen) all the engineering bells and whistles can make the UX experience fraught (of course maybe Twitter was for the power user, but as someone just going for news, it didn't seem that way to me).
Because Twitter is a really poor advertising medium while Facebook wasn't. You wouldn't drive your customers from a money printing machine to something that isn't.
Ugh..No it doesn't. At all. And trying to say this is just wrong. If an employee posts pubicly on social media that he thinks Musk as an utter POS he should have every right to fire him. Free speech or no. remember, free speech says you can say what you want it doesn't mean it doesn't come with repercussions. TerribleYou’re not necessarily wrong, but this flies pretty heavily in the face of Musk’s claim of Twitter as being some kind of bastion of free speech.I agree that Musk is behaving like an ***, but "punching up" and "punching down" aren't really things in a hierarchical organization. If you're a colonel and you decide to publicly clap back at your general, that isn't going to fly.Exactly. The employees were punching up after Musk publicly denigrated their work after firing their co-workers. In some of the cases, they explained why he was wrong. In one case, Musk seemed to take the guy's idea (get rid of the microservices that clutter the load) and claimed it as his own.I mean, I seems incredibly juvenile while also, in a way, mocking the folks he’s fired. It’s like he’s speed running all the ways not to be a good manager.
Media falling for the prank was a wild one. https://nypost.com/2022/10/28/pranksters-posing-as-laid-off-twitter-employees-trick-media-outlets/
Every person under 30 instantly realized it was
He's punching down at people he fired.
A strong leader will accept strong push-back in private and will probably be cool with people questioning him in public, but nobody is going to be good with open insubordination. Nor should they be.
Sorry...I thought when you said "blending", you meant an engineer would be doing both. I want my engineers focused on code and my UX people focused on the customer. It's two completely separate work streams. The best engineers are the names you never hear and don't go anywhere near the UX outside of executing their code through the frameworks created by UX and architects.
I guess I don't view it as "either/or" rather "both/and"
I don’t think that’s any different than before. The only change seems to be in who is defining the repercussions.Ugh..No it doesn't. At all. And trying to say this is just wrong. If an employee posts pubicly on social media that he thinks Musk as an utter POS he should have every right to fire him. Free speech or no. remember, free speech says you can say what you want it doesn't mean it doesn't come with repercussions. TerribleYou’re not necessarily wrong, but this flies pretty heavily in the face of Musk’s claim of Twitter as being some kind of bastion of free speech.I agree that Musk is behaving like an ***, but "punching up" and "punching down" aren't really things in a hierarchical organization. If you're a colonel and you decide to publicly clap back at your general, that isn't going to fly.Exactly. The employees were punching up after Musk publicly denigrated their work after firing their co-workers. In some of the cases, they explained why he was wrong. In one case, Musk seemed to take the guy's idea (get rid of the microservices that clutter the load) and claimed it as his own.I mean, I seems incredibly juvenile while also, in a way, mocking the folks he’s fired. It’s like he’s speed running all the ways not to be a good manager.
Media falling for the prank was a wild one. https://nypost.com/2022/10/28/pranksters-posing-as-laid-off-twitter-employees-trick-media-outlets/
Every person under 30 instantly realized it was
He's punching down at people he fired.
A strong leader will accept strong push-back in private and will probably be cool with people questioning him in public, but nobody is going to be good with open insubordination. Nor should they be.
I was commenting specifically on the language in his letter. I know nothing about Twitter's structure, but my guess is they had teams of product and UX and engineering. Product likely drove innovation and priorities. It was product-driven development.
You're probably right. I'm probably overreacting to his letter... But he's an engineer. Engineers think differently than product and UX folks about product. So "engineering-driven" company gave me pause.
Seems fine to me. That's not the way I would phrase it, but if my goal was to get rid of the "bring your whole self to work" crowd, this is part of how I would implement that purge. You have to get these people to self-select their way to some other firm.Agree to be "extremely hardcore" or get 3 months of severance.
Lots of things are different for me. I can see tweets and then when I click on them I get an error.
If anyone wants to see what happens when engineers take control over UX sorts of things, look no further than Disney and their app fiasco they have. They cut the entire department of UX people and got rid of all the focus group stuff and now its in the hands of developers.
Gee what a shock. Figured forcing a bunch of highly skilled and valued employees to bend the knee to your archaic demands would actually work.
Beat me to it. Scarce, highly-skilled workers with a ton of options in an industry where most people know how to job hop -- what could go wrong with threatening them?
There's a lot of interesting stuff in that thread. This jumped out at me.
It’s not so much he is asking people to come back occasionally. It’s the demand that they have to, every single day, the next day after the email was sent, or they’re fired.
