Deamon
Footballguy
Easily the funniest post to ever hit this site.
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2022-23 NBA Thread: “you’ll never let me down like the Heat did”, Miami fan says to giant pile of cocaine (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Capella
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Gatorman
Supreme Elite Maximum Tier
Again, house money at this point but this will be the 4th series miami has no shot in.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I don’t think anyone gave them no shot versus the Knicks.
Boston
Footballguy
They are a strange team overall...you never know what you are going to get with them be it good or bad...very talented team that just has "something missing"...it is now up to Brad Stevens to figure out how go from being good and a contender to being very good and a legit championship team.
Capella
CAPELLODINHO
I’ll grant you Milwaukee but they were not big dogs against the Knicks and many thought they could beat Boston.
It’s not really a shot against Miami, I just think Denver is one of the best teams in recent years.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
As someone with no horse in the race (my horse has been stuck in the gate for a decade +), I'm rooting for Denver just because they have never won a championship.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I don't think enough words can be said about Caleb Martin. He shot over 60% for the series, which is insanity considering he shoots from all over the floor.
identikit
Footballguy
Bill had his dad on his podcast last night fresh from Game 7
Call me sentimental, but love it when a father and a son talks sports
Bill thinks 2nd row Joe survives, dad doesn't
Side note: a couple episodes ago, Bill said his buddy Joe House had bet that the Heat would win in 7 @ 11-1 odds
Beautiful, lucky bet
identikit
Footballguy
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Bam looked fairly exhausted to me last night. Jokic has been sitting around resting. Would love to see a competitive series but it feels like this could be a blowout - Spo needs to use all his powers to keep this close but unfortunately for him he's not facing a rookie coach this round.
How do you explain the huge differential in 3-point shooting in multiple games? Miami was around 50% in several games including last night, while the Celtics were near 20% in a few games games. Is it defense or ball distribution?
If Tyler comes back, I think he comes off the bench. We could use his 38% 3 point shooting and 93% from the FT line. But it's seems like the Heat played better in his absence.
If Tyler comes back, I think he comes off the bench. We could use his 38% 3 point shooting and 93% from the FT line. But it's seems like the Heat played better in his absence.
Gatorman
Supreme Elite Maximum Tier
I think Bams shoulder is a thing, just not a big thing. I think miamis defensive game plan is the key here. Can they slow down the nuggets? Miami likes to make things “uncomfortable” with their constant switching and their zone d. Will it slow the nugs and will Jimmy and the gang be able to get to the rim. If they can make the joker think, will that change the series.
SWC
Bromigo
i havent studied the film and wont but in general ball movement creates open threes which are hit at a better rate than contested threes so it probably has to do with how the teams moved the ball versus going one on one and the effort they put in on d and closed out on shooters at this level that is basically the answer all the time about three point shooting take that to the bank brohans
mr. furley
Footballguy
Miami has to at least try to make Jokic work before he gets in the front court. bang him around, pressure him even if he doesn't have the ball as he comes up the floor.
find some fouls to use up on him. throw Zeller out there to use up his 6 being physical. they can't let Jokic set up at his own leisure, make decisions with time and just pick them apart. disrupt what Denver wants him to do at least a little or they're going to get wiped out.
find some fouls to use up on him. throw Zeller out there to use up his 6 being physical. they can't let Jokic set up at his own leisure, make decisions with time and just pick them apart. disrupt what Denver wants him to do at least a little or they're going to get wiped out.
Kev4029
Footballguy
I absolutely love this matchup for the Nuggets. Some thoughts:
- The Nuggets are about the healthiest finals team in recent memory and they will be coming off of ten days rest.
- The Nuggets get beat on the defensive end by two things, pick and roll guards who can attack at all three levels, and teams that get out in transition. The Heat are one of the slowest pace teams and have nobody (save maybe Herro, if he plays) that can attack off the pick and roll like that.
- The Heat play the most zone of any team in the NBA - the Nuggets were #1 against the zone in the regular season and the playoffs.
- The Nuggets have a size advantage at every position - this is an underrated advantage that the Nuggets have in almost any game, but it is especially apparent here because the Heat are one of the smallest teams in the NBA. Beyond Jokic, Murray and Gordon love taking smaller defenders inside and they are both wildly effective doing it.
- Jokic beasts Bam in their matchups, so I assume the Heat are going to try what other teams have and play their power forward on Jokic while Bam roams the paint as it has both historically and recently been the best path to defensive success against the Nuggets. That will be a combination of Love and Highsmith... that won't be a great look for the Heat.
- All three teams the Nuggets have played so far have tried pressuring Murray full court to tire him out, which has worked reasonably well, and he has looked gassed in the fourth quarters at times. The Heat don't have a guard with that kind of tenacity and ability.
- Aaron Gordon was traded for to guard big combo forwards like Butler and he is one of the best in the NBA at it.
- I think the Heat are going to try to tire the Nuggets out by running KCP/Murray/MPJ through screens - it'll work a bit, but we'll see how effective it'll be.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
and get this: he was undrafted
Stoneworker
Footballguy
Denver clearly has the talent advantage. Therefore, the keys to this series will be whether the Nuggets a) have been able to remain locked in during the long layoff (rest vs. rust) and b) can handle being a series favorite for the first time (no more playing the disrespect card).
The last team to have at least a 9-day layoff was the 2019 GS Warriors. They went into the Finals vs. Toronto as high as -300 betting favorites (Nugs have opened around -360).
Toronto won in 6.
So hopefully the Nuggets continue ignoring all the pundits and just play ball.
The last team to have at least a 9-day layoff was the 2019 GS Warriors. They went into the Finals vs. Toronto as high as -300 betting favorites (Nugs have opened around -360).
Toronto won in 6.
So hopefully the Nuggets continue ignoring all the pundits and just play ball.
Juxtatarot
Footballguy
Reggie Miller was talking about Caleb Martin “getting paid” but it looks like he’s still on a team friendly contract next season.
Jayrod
Footballguy
Hadn't heard that. Huge news if true.
Jayrod
Footballguy
I think a ton of it was just mental.
Boston has the mentality of a teenager and ebbs and flows as a group like high school kids. If one guy is off, they all are. If one guy gets hot, they all do. Miami did some work to make it tough and Boston didn't make a lot of their 1 v 1 threes, but they were missing open catch and shoot looks throughout this series. Offense got a little stagnant at times, but that was Miami's doing in a lot of cases. Also, Boston can be lazy in just getting their offense initiated. Too often it took 10 seconds to even start a play. Can't leave yourself just 14 seconds to try and make 5-8 passes and get an open look.
Miami meanwhile just shot well...not other way to say it, last night they hit open looks and some that were well defended. Make or miss league and all that....
Jayrod
Footballguy
Miami's only chance is to shut EVERYONE else down and make Joker earn his points 1 on 1 vs Bam & Zeller. They have to guard Murray 1 on 1 and not let Porter get going and don't give up backcuts to Gordon, KCP, Bruce Brown & Green.
Miami's biggest struggle is going to be offensively. Denver can flat out guard and Jokic is a great positional defender which will give Bam fits and take away a lot of their drives to the goal.
Unless Spo comes up with some brilliant plan or the Heat just shoot lights out, Denver should win this in 4-6 games.
Miami's biggest struggle is going to be offensively. Denver can flat out guard and Jokic is a great positional defender which will give Bam fits and take away a lot of their drives to the goal.
Unless Spo comes up with some brilliant plan or the Heat just shoot lights out, Denver should win this in 4-6 games.
Brunell4MVP
Footballguy
I'm no Celtics fan, but from the outside looking in it doesn't seem Tatum and Brown can co-exist at a title level. They are both great talents (Brown's inability to dribble left notwithstanding) but they operate completely separate of each other. Seems at times the Celts are playing 4 vs 5. I think one of these guys needs to be traded for a better shooter willing to play second fiddle. I'd probably keep Tatum and ship out Brown. I just can't see trading a pure scorer like Tatum.
modogg
Footballguy
it will be interesting. i know the Celtics are close to salary cap, and don't have a ton of draft picks coming up. they have seemed hesitant to ship either to upset the team, but i agree coming back with the same core again is tough to accept. Great in regular season so maybe they keep both and sell high at trade deadline? Tatum definitely fetches more value, and could refill future draft picks etc along with key players.
Will be interesting to see if they finally accept they need to do something, or just go on and enjoy regular season success
Jayrod
Footballguy
Tatum has consistently showed himself to be a top 5-10 talent in the NBA. He is untouchable and will likely play his whole career in Boston.
Brown played possibly the worst playoff series of his career against Miami. I just don't know where they go that is better.
He is still young enough to learn/show improvement, but it is disappointing to see him take a step back this season with his ball handling. He fell apart there and it was really not good all season. He has his worst assist/TO ratio in 3 years at 1.18. He's had 3 season with more TO's than assists and averaged 2.9/game this year.
In this series, he had 25 turnovers (3.6/game) to 24 assists (3.4/game). That's just terrible.
He should shoulder more of the blame than even Mazzulla. Especially for being a 7-year vet and a 2nd team All-NBA guy. Just ridiculously poor execution when it mattered most.
the moops
Footballguy
This seems like a bad take. In their 6 years together, they have been to the finals once, and lost in the eastern conference finals three times.
Don't know how that isn't existing at a title level
Anarchy99
Footballguy
After listening to the post-mortem discussion in Boston, the consensus seemed to be that Joe would be coming back, but there would be changes to his staff. Some guys would be leaving to go to other franchises anyway, but others might be replaced. The panel mentioned that Joe inherited the coaching staff when he took over the team right before the season started and picked none of them. Moving forward, they said he would get the chance to pick his own staff for next season.
They also mentioned that they have no real choice but to extend Brown with a supermax. They said he would have limited trade value and would get limited return in a trade (he's have one year left on his contract and the team that acquired him could easily lose him to free agency). By extending him, they'd have Brown for two more seasons before they could trade him. No way would he turn down an extra $100+ million to sign with Boston. Also clear that Brown isn't a #1 player on a team and Tatum is the must keep guy to build around.
Given the updated rules of the salary cap and tax structure, the thought was they would supermax Tatum and Brown. But they wouldn't have a ton of dollars to play with beyond that. So someone like Smart might have to go. And maybe Horford. Likely Brogden. Probably a core of JT, JB, White, and RW with Mazzulla back with a different supporting coaching staff. That sounds like an ok place to start from, but not sure who rounds out the roster.
They also mentioned that they have no real choice but to extend Brown with a supermax. They said he would have limited trade value and would get limited return in a trade (he's have one year left on his contract and the team that acquired him could easily lose him to free agency). By extending him, they'd have Brown for two more seasons before they could trade him. No way would he turn down an extra $100+ million to sign with Boston. Also clear that Brown isn't a #1 player on a team and Tatum is the must keep guy to build around.
Given the updated rules of the salary cap and tax structure, the thought was they would supermax Tatum and Brown. But they wouldn't have a ton of dollars to play with beyond that. So someone like Smart might have to go. And maybe Horford. Likely Brogden. Probably a core of JT, JB, White, and RW with Mazzulla back with a different supporting coaching staff. That sounds like an ok place to start from, but not sure who rounds out the roster.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Denver won't settle for a ton of 3's like the Celtics did. It's going to be really hard for Miami to score enough to keep up. Jokes aside about Herro and the Ewing Theory, they may need his scoring to keep up. Or hope Martin continues his torrid pace for at least 4 more games.
STEADYMOBBIN 22
Footballguy
I dont see what everyone loves about Tatum. Very good player with poor body language. Lays down after pretending to be fouled and he looks very slow to me. Almost as slow as Paul Pierce was.
I would in no way, shape or form build a team around him.
I would in no way, shape or form build a team around him.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Also, Heat are veteran team (read: old) - they have just faced a 7 game series that was tough - while the Nuggets sat. Maybe they catch the Nuggets rusty in Game 1 and steal it to get home court but outside that scenario I just don't see this going 6 much less 7.
I’m generally opposed to blowing up successful teams but they have to consider moving Brown. Simmons talked about this on one of his recent podcasts, but it’s going to be extremely difficult to build a team around Tatum and Brown on their contracts under the new CBA rules.
Brunell4MVP
Footballguy
Because they haven't won a title? Seems like that is the English definition of title level ?
Hell, my team can't even make the playoffs. I assume BOS fans want more than playoffs and bust
I don't expect much from a guy who hardly played in the playoffs, but Yurtseven filled in well for Bam when he was hurt in the 2021-2022 season. For about 20 games, he was a double-double machine, and they were winning games. But he didn't face the Joker. He's about the same size. Maybe slower.
Capella
CAPELLODINHO
Yes they’ll be filling the roster out with minimum guys.
I think Brown is probably a top-30 player in the league but the super max is killing them. 300M for him os legitimately insane. But how do they let him go?
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Trade for Lillard somehow?
I guess the options would be to go out and get someone like Dame or some draft picks that Stevens thinks he can turn into high level contributors (Portland might give them the ability to do both, actually).
Zow
Footballguy
Yeah I'm not sure how other teams don't recognize Boston's plight here and try to pay 60 cents on the dollar.
Capella
CAPELLODINHO
He’s better than Brown but does he deliver a title? And he’s older, probably less durable and also very expensive.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
This is the big issue. They really can't let him walk and get nothing for him. Also, if he leaves as a free agent, that wouldn't help their cap situation any (they wouldn't gain any cap space and would still be over the cap). And they can't do a Supermax sign and trade (they couldn't trade him for two years). They could only trade him now with one year on his remaining contract and hope to get 50 cents on the dollar back in return. I am sure Brown would be exceedingly furious over that, as it would cost him $105M by not getting a Supermax.
Zow
Footballguy
Yeah there's some rumor (mainly from Simmons) about Portland possibly trading the third pick for Brown to try to reward Dame and give him one last run.
Gatorman
Supreme Elite Maximum Tier
Boston: Basically they need a better point guard. Someone to disribute the ball and set the tone. They also need an offensive game plan outside of "let our stars cook". They almost look like the Jordan Bulls before Phil got there. It's too easy to get them out of their flow when they aren't hitting.
MIami Vs Denver: Again, Miami getting no chance here. They are tired, they will be playing at altitude, etc etc etc. Vincent, Butler, Martin, and even Robinson have been playing great. Bam hasn't nor has Struss, and Tyler may or may not be a lift when he is ready to play, BUT, all the heat have to do is win one game in Denver and the narrative shifts. I agree witht he concept of make the Joker a scorer and not a facilitator. Give him his 40 and lets see how his legs feel in the 4th. Throw Love, Zeller, Yurt, and Bam at him (maybe even Highsmith) and Tire him out. Miami is not afraid to shoot and shoot and shoot.
Edit to add: also, the Joker does not like it when teams get physical with him. He tends to respond with cheap shots (as he did to M Morris in the heats matchup with them in 2021). If he loses his cool and does something dumb, that benefits the heat. Just sayin.
Again, someone can roll an ankle 2 plays in and change the entire series.
MIami Vs Denver: Again, Miami getting no chance here. They are tired, they will be playing at altitude, etc etc etc. Vincent, Butler, Martin, and even Robinson have been playing great. Bam hasn't nor has Struss, and Tyler may or may not be a lift when he is ready to play, BUT, all the heat have to do is win one game in Denver and the narrative shifts. I agree witht he concept of make the Joker a scorer and not a facilitator. Give him his 40 and lets see how his legs feel in the 4th. Throw Love, Zeller, Yurt, and Bam at him (maybe even Highsmith) and Tire him out. Miami is not afraid to shoot and shoot and shoot.
Edit to add: also, the Joker does not like it when teams get physical with him. He tends to respond with cheap shots (as he did to M Morris in the heats matchup with them in 2021). If he loses his cool and does something dumb, that benefits the heat. Just sayin.
Again, someone can roll an ankle 2 plays in and change the entire series.
The Heat are also coming off of a tough 7-game series, and have to travel to Denver to play in the thin air. I'd be pretty surprised if they won game 1.
Major
Footballguy
Ha, think I heard Van Gundy mention that at some point…I do find it funny it took a rapper playing with Martin at the gym to bring him to Miami’s attention.
Jayrod
Footballguy
He averaged 30.1p/8.8r/4.6a per game and was 1st team all-NBA for the second year in a row. He has played in the Eastern Conference Finals in all but like 2 seasons of his career and is only 25 years old. He was still the best player on the floor for either team in the Heat series. He is closer to a James Harden/Russell Westbrook level than your MJ/Lebron/Kobe level but he gives you a better chance to win a title than all but a handful of players.
The only guys I would definitely take over him right now are Jokic, Giannis & Doncic. Embiid & SGA are close, but Embiid gets hurt too much and has never even led his team to the ECF, much less the Finals and SGA has only had 1 great season. Guys like LeBron, Durant and even Curry on the decline. Guys like Young, Booker & Mitchell just aren't as complete or good as Tatum.
He really is a top 5 guy. Who else has better "body language" at that level? Curry, Durant & LeBron are all-time greats and Tatum will not be there, but Harden/Westbrook are pretty apt comparisons...guys that can get you on the doorstep, but can't finish the job.
Capella
CAPELLODINHO
Yea sounds like they are all stuck.
I understand why Brown would be upset but he simply is not worth that kind of money.
Jayrod
Footballguy
He was until this past week.
Showed all of his weaknesses and very little of his strengths when it mattered most. If he doesn't get the supermax, this series is the reason. He was the primary reason they lost to the Heat. Everybody had a hand, but he came up very small over and over again.
Boston needs a leader. Doesn't need to be a superstar, just a guy who is THE voice. Udoka was that guy, but Smart is not and Mazzulla is not. Horford was trying, but his skill level is too low and he has never won a championship in the NBA, plus he is a big and just can't exert any control over the pace of a game. A great PG or coach is the missing piece to a championship. I love Smart's game, but him at the 2 or as a 6th man is ideal. Him as the initiator and floor general is above his skill level when it comes to trying to win a championship.
the moops
Footballguy
Typically title contending teams are teams that make it conference finals and finals over a multi-year span. If you are narrowly describing title level as just teams that win, are you advocating for every team in the league but the champion to retool or blow it up every year?
the moops
Footballguy
They would still get a haul for him. Players are traded in the last year of their deal all the time. The Bucks gave up a ton for Holiday who was a soon to be free agent. Same goes for Anthony Davis. There would be robust interest in 26 year old Jaylen Brown
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