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Cleveland Browns (10 Viewers)

'NJDawgPound said:
I'm gonna preface this post by kindly asking you all not to call me names. I've suffered enough.I have an authentic, pro-style Lee Suggs #44 white jersey sitting around. Anyone know where I can get just a finished nameplate so I can at least some use out of this thing? Would go Byner or Kelly but I don't even know if they had names on the back of the jersey when Leroy Kelly played. NOT going Touchdown Tommy Vardell. :)
Kelly played roughly half of his career with his name on the back of his jersey. Of course, the jersey looked a bit different. TV numbers in a different spot. But, hey, close enough.
Thanks, Freshmaker. The positive side of knowing that is that you were around to watch some great Browns football. The negative side is that you're darn old. :)
 
'NJDawgPound said:
I'm gonna preface this post by kindly asking you all not to call me names. I've suffered enough.I have an authentic, pro-style Lee Suggs #44 white jersey sitting around. Anyone know where I can get just a finished nameplate so I can at least some use out of this thing? Would go Byner or Kelly but I don't even know if they had names on the back of the jersey when Leroy Kelly played. NOT going Touchdown Tommy Vardell. :)
Kelly played roughly half of his career with his name on the back of his jersey. Of course, the jersey looked a bit different. TV numbers in a different spot. But, hey, close enough.
Thanks, Freshmaker. The positive side of knowing that is that you were around to watch some great Browns football. The negative side is that you're darn old. :)
Not really old. I am 35. Just a big NFL history buff. Went to NFL Films and the Hall of Fame this year- finally.
 
'NJDawgPound said:
I'm gonna preface this post by kindly asking you all not to call me names. I've suffered enough.I have an authentic, pro-style Lee Suggs #44 white jersey sitting around. Anyone know where I can get just a finished nameplate so I can at least some use out of this thing? Would go Byner or Kelly but I don't even know if they had names on the back of the jersey when Leroy Kelly played. NOT going Touchdown Tommy Vardell. :)
Kelly played roughly half of his career with his name on the back of his jersey. Of course, the jersey looked a bit different. TV numbers in a different spot. But, hey, close enough.
Thanks, Freshmaker. The positive side of knowing that is that you were around to watch some great Browns football. The negative side is that you're darn old. :)
Not really old. I am 35. Just a big NFL history buff. Went to NFL Films and the Hall of Fame this year- finally.
Wow. Good stuff.
 
How many 3rd and 1's did we have today...and how many were in the red zone? I think I remember running on one of them with TRich and it wasn't red zone. The throws were uber scary.

 
How many 3rd and 1's did we have today...and how many were in the red zone? I think I remember running on one of them with TRich and it wasn't red zone. The throws were uber scary.
4 - Richardson run, Weeden sneak, Weeden sack and Weeden pass to Cameron for 23 yards. So 3/4 conversions.The sack was the only one in the red zone, although the completion to Cameron was from the Bengals 26.
 
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Shurmur has had some awful decisions. And he's dug himself deeper by acting like a smug #### to the media when called out on it.

But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.

I am impressed like hell with John Hughes and Billy Winn. I thought BenJarvis was gonna go hog wild on us with Rubin out. Now 1) How far along is Phil Taylor's rehab, and 2) What do you guys think is going to play out on the defense with Haden back, when Taylor comes back, and James Michael Johnson gets some PT? The offense can score points and I have a feeling the D is going to come around shortly.

 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic? :rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
Two drops today were drive killers. Dude can't catch a cold. He might be a blocking mother####er but I'd rip those check down throws out of the play book and scrap em.
'PlasmaDogPlasma said:
On the way to 11 and 5!
:goodposting: Great sign at today's game!
But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.
Whoa there guy, we won 1 game. . . out of the last 12 and it wasn't for Shurmur's lack of trying today. He just doesn't have it when it comes to being a HC.
 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic? :rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
Two drops today were drive killers. Dude can't catch a cold. He might be a blocking mother####er but I'd rip those check down throws out of the play book and scrap em.
'PlasmaDogPlasma said:
On the way to 11 and 5!
:goodposting: Great sign at today's game!
But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.
Whoa there guy, we won 1 game. . . out of the last 12 and it wasn't for Shurmur's lack of trying today. He just doesn't have it when it comes to being a HC.
LOL!!! You can always count on psuedo-fans to come up with something nebulous to cry about!
 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic? :rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
Two drops today were drive killers. Dude can't catch a cold. He might be a blocking mother####er but I'd rip those check down throws out of the play book and scrap em.
'PlasmaDogPlasma said:
On the way to 11 and 5!
:goodposting: Great sign at today's game!
But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.
Whoa there guy, we won 1 game. . . out of the last 12 and it wasn't for Shurmur's lack of trying today. He just doesn't have it when it comes to being a HC.
LOL!!! You can always count on psuedo-fans to come up with something nebulous to cry about!
1-5 isn't nebulous. it's a fact.
 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic? :rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
Two drops today were drive killers. Dude can't catch a cold. He might be a blocking mother####er but I'd rip those check down throws out of the play book and scrap em.
'PlasmaDogPlasma said:
On the way to 11 and 5!
:goodposting: Great sign at today's game!
But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.
Whoa there guy, we won 1 game. . . out of the last 12 and it wasn't for Shurmur's lack of trying today. He just doesn't have it when it comes to being a HC.
LOL!!! You can always count on psuedo-fans to come up with something nebulous to cry about!
1-5 isn't nebulous. it's a fact.
Look, I'm as beaten down as anyone when it comes to this team, but unlike most of our past suckiness, this team can score. Combine that with a healthy defense that was top ten last year and we may have something. Weeden looks promising, Trent looks promising, and Gordon looks promising. We have had hard luck losses but eventually those types of losses turn into wins. I'm not over the top, but kind of optimistic.
 
Brandon Weeden earns first NFL win on 29th birthday

By Marc Sessler

Around the League Writer

Brandon Weeden isn't getting any younger, and he hasn't stopped growing.

The Cleveland Browns' rookie quarterback turned 29 on Sunday, an afternoon when he won his first NFL game, 34-24 over the AFC North rival Cincinnati Bengals.

The Browns are the youngest team in football, and they started seven rookies Sunday. Against the Bengals, most of these newbies contributed.

Weeden was 17-of-29 passing for 231 yards and two touchdowns. One of those scoring strikes was a beauty -- a rope to 21-year-old Josh Gordon, who burned Cincinnati's secondary for a 71-yard score that marked the second-longest touchdown by a rookie receiver in Cleveland franchise history.

Some of Weeden's well-advertised on-field issues bubbled up in the win. He had another momentum-killing interception -- his NFL-worst 10 picks are dubious -- but he recovered to produce a solid game. The Browns are averaging 22 points per game after putting up 13.6 last season.

Weeden impressed me on a third-quarter quarterback sneak on which he had his helmet ripped off below a pile of defenders. Weeden calmly rose to his feet, plopped his helmet back on and guided the Browns on a 10-play, 66-yard scoring drive. He's not intimidated by NFL defenses.

Weeden hasn't made much noise in our weekly rookie quarterback ratings, and that has to do with his epic turnover count. However, we saw signs of growth on his 29th birthday.
 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic? :rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
Two drops today were drive killers. Dude can't catch a cold. He might be a blocking mother####er but I'd rip those check down throws out of the play book and scrap em.
'PlasmaDogPlasma said:
On the way to 11 and 5!
:goodposting: Great sign at today's game!
But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.
Whoa there guy, we won 1 game. . . out of the last 12 and it wasn't for Shurmur's lack of trying today. He just doesn't have it when it comes to being a HC.
LOL!!! You can always count on psuedo-fans to come up with something nebulous to cry about!
C'mon, man - defend anything today, even an offense that went 7 consecutive drives without getting a 1st down, but not Maresic. The pick wasn't awful, but keeping him this year was just plain dumb - not hindsight, I was perplexed Sep 1. He's the exact same player this year he was last year. A mediocre blocker and liability in the passing game, the reason he was supposedly kept.Anyway, this defense will be scary when Taylor comes back. The kids are going to wear down so we'll need him to get them less reps. We're going to continue to scuffle defensively against teams with more than 1 quality wide out, but if we can keep pace on offense we won't have running backs gashing us for 6 and 7 yards per touch in protect the lead mode late.I'm still not on board with this offense, we can do some things against lesser defenses though, but there are some pieces there. Gordon and Richardson, I really think Cooper is going to carve a role as Weeden's safety valve (seriously why the hell was he inactive for 5 weeks?!), and opportunity is still there for Cameron to develop into one of the two tight ends pieces. If things fall right we may be only a play maker or two away at the offensive skill positions.Weeden? Keep winning games. Said it before, whether we're in a spot to take a guy like Geno rests on his shoulders. He leads us to enough wins and he is not going anywhere. He doesn't and the new guys have no ties to him. Way too many 3 and outs, deflected passes, and checking down too quickly but I thought he was on point with a lot more of his throws and handled pressure better - although there wasn't much. Next week's test isn't going to be any harder, but future ones will.We'll learn a lot about this team next week. A beatable opponent coming off a win, have to come out guns a blazing - no repeat of Buffalo going through the motions. Take them lightly and any momentum gained this week goes just like that.
 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic? :rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
Two drops today were drive killers. Dude can't catch a cold. He might be a blocking mother####er but I'd rip those check down throws out of the play book and scrap em.
'PlasmaDogPlasma said:
On the way to 11 and 5!
:goodposting: Great sign at today's game!
But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.
Whoa there guy, we won 1 game. . . out of the last 12 and it wasn't for Shurmur's lack of trying today. He just doesn't have it when it comes to being a HC.
LOL!!! You can always count on psuedo-fans to come up with something nebulous to cry about!
C'mon, man - defend anything today, even an offense that went 7 consecutive drives without getting a 1st down, but not Maresic. The pick wasn't awful, but keeping him this year was just plain dumb - not hindsight, I was perplexed Sep 1. He's the exact same player this year he was last year. A mediocre blocker and liability in the passing game, the reason he was supposedly kept.Anyway, this defense will be scary when Taylor comes back. The kids are going to wear down so we'll need him to get them less reps. We're going to continue to scuffle defensively against teams with more than 1 quality wide out, but if we can keep pace on offense we won't have running backs gashing us for 6 and 7 yards per touch in protect the lead mode late.I'm still not on board with this offense, we can do some things against lesser defenses though, but there are some pieces there. Gordon and Richardson, I really think Cooper is going to carve a role as Weeden's safety valve (seriously why the hell was he inactive for 5 weeks?!), and opportunity is still there for Cameron to develop into one of the two tight ends pieces. If things fall right we may be only a play maker or two away at the offensive skill positions.Weeden? Keep winning games. Said it before, whether we're in a spot to take a guy like Geno rests on his shoulders. He leads us to enough wins and he is not going anywhere. He doesn't and the new guys have no ties to him. Way too many 3 and outs, deflected passes, and checking down too quickly but I thought he was on point with a lot more of his throws and handled pressure better - although there wasn't much. Next week's test isn't going to be any harder, but future ones will.We'll learn a lot about this team next week. A beatable opponent coming off a win, have to come out guns a blazing - no repeat of Buffalo going through the motions. Take them lightly and any momentum gained this week goes just like that.
Good point. This next game @IND, should be winnable. Defensively, we look a notch better. If we can take Wayne out of the game, we stand a good chance.
 
'daveR said:
'nxmehta said:
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic?

:rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
I don't think you want to play this game with me. Here's a fun statistic for you: he's the only player in the NFL with 5+ targets that has a reception rate of 0% (http://www.kffl.com/fantasy-football/targets/). Probably not the greatest idea to keep throwing him the ball on 3rd down.Marecic aside, great win for the team this week. Some really fun plays to watch! Sheldon Brown pick 6 was great. Billy Winn rumbling down the field was awesome. And we are seeing a legit WR emerge in Josh Gordon. Some reasons for optimism now after watching some actual results on the field. Let's hope they've turned the corner and take out Indy on Sunday.

 
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic?

:rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
I don't think you want to play this game with me. Here's a fun statistic for you: he's the only player in the NFL with 5+ targets that has a reception rate of 0% (http://www.kffl.com/fantasy-football/targets/). Probably not the greatest idea to keep throwing him the ball on 3rd down.Marecic aside, great win for the team this week. Some really fun plays to watch! Sheldon Brown pick 6 was great. Billy Winn rumbling down the field was awesome. And we are seeing a legit WR emerge in Josh Gordon. Some reasons for optimism now after watching some actual results on the field. Let's hope they've turned the corner and take out Indy on Sunday.
My point was five targets in six games is nitpicking to complain about. Feel free, though.
 
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic?

:rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
I don't think you want to play this game with me. Here's a fun statistic for you: he's the only player in the NFL with 5+ targets that has a reception rate of 0% (http://www.kffl.com/...otball/targets/). Probably not the greatest idea to keep throwing him the ball on 3rd down.Marecic aside, great win for the team this week. Some really fun plays to watch! Sheldon Brown pick 6 was great. Billy Winn rumbling down the field was awesome. And we are seeing a legit WR emerge in Josh Gordon. Some reasons for optimism now after watching some actual results on the field. Let's hope they've turned the corner and take out Indy on Sunday.
My point was five targets in six games is nitpicking to complain about. Feel free, though.
It might be better to say "CAN THE BROWNS PLEASE quit playing Owen Marecic". It's not like he's a good blocker by NFL fullback standards.
 
Shurmur has had some awful decisions. And he's dug himself deeper by acting like a smug #### to the media when called out on it. But something tells me that we should leave this alone for a little while and see how things play out. This team has the Gary Kubiak/Texans on the verge feel that that team had a few years ago. They stayed the course when many Texans fans wanted him gone.I am impressed like hell with John Hughes and Billy Winn. I thought BenJarvis was gonna go hog wild on us with Rubin out. Now 1) How far along is Phil Taylor's rehab, and 2) What do you guys think is going to play out on the defense with Haden back, when Taylor comes back, and James Michael Johnson gets some PT? The offense can score points and I have a feeling the D is going to come around shortly.
Taylor may practice soon.
 
CAN WE PLEASE stop throwing the ball to Owen Marecic?

:rant:
Sad part is, you're serious. (Three targets going in. Five coming out.)
I don't think you want to play this game with me. Here's a fun statistic for you: he's the only player in the NFL with 5+ targets that has a reception rate of 0% (http://www.kffl.com/...otball/targets/). Probably not the greatest idea to keep throwing him the ball on 3rd down.Marecic aside, great win for the team this week. Some really fun plays to watch! Sheldon Brown pick 6 was great. Billy Winn rumbling down the field was awesome. And we are seeing a legit WR emerge in Josh Gordon. Some reasons for optimism now after watching some actual results on the field. Let's hope they've turned the corner and take out Indy on Sunday.
My point was five targets in six games is nitpicking to complain about. Feel free, though.
It might be better to say "CAN THE BROWNS PLEASE quit playing Owen Marecic". It's not like he's a good blocker by NFL fullback standards.
Agreed. To be honest, I never understood O.M. in the first place. The only thing I could come up with is they liked his versatility, but he's not much of a blocker, runner, pass catcher. Maybe he covers kicks well. I dunno.
 
Seems like a good day for Browns fans. As a Minnesota sports fan, I feel your pain and hope Haslam, Banner and Heckert can turn this franchise around. From an outside perspective, things are deinitely looking up for you. Congrats!

 
Cleveland Browns general manager Tom Heckert doesn't believe he's going to be the Cleveland Browns general manager for very long.Heckert is telling those close to him he expects to be fired after the season, multiple sources told FOXSportsOhio.com on Tuesday. The team's top personnel man reportedly has called around since August about job prospects for 2013.Josh GordonNew owner Jimmy Haslam III hand-picked Joe Banner to take over as president and CEO of the Browns. Mike Holmgren is on the way out, and it's not hard to connect the dots in Cleveland. Heckert and coach Pat Shurmur were Holmgren's guys. Both men have ties to Banner and his former team, the Philadelphia Eagles, but that might not be enough to save a duo that's posted a 5-17 record over the past two seasons.Haslam said Tuesday he "had a great visit with (Heckert) ... on Sunday. So everybody is aware of the situation. I didn't tell them any different than anything I said today. (Holmgren) is the only change we're making. We're only making it so that we have a good transition. And everybody else will be evaluated at the end of the year."It's a case of rough timing for Heckert. He's responsible for a group of productive draft picks and presides over a young roster that -- despite an ugly 1-5 record -- houses a more intriguing core of players than when he arrived.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000081262/article/browns-gm-tom-heckert-reportedly-expects-to-be-fired :popcorn:
 
I like a good J now and again.

Asked about his management style, Haslam said: "We’re gonna be involved, but I think involved in the proper way. I had 5 people that reported to me at Pilot Flying J. They’re all smarter than I am and they’re all better at their role than I am and we let them do their jobs. On the other hand, we question them, we push them, we challenge them, we hold them accountable. I think we’ll use that same managerial style (of) Flying J."

 
Another winnable game. Could even give it the "shoulda won" label.

With Pittsburgh looking somewhat mortal, Baltimore struggling with injuries, and the Bengals being maybe just a step ahead of us IMO, the division was still in sights even at 1-5. Heck, even the AFC wildcard is gonna be nutty this year with so much parity week to week. Now at 1-6 we can pretty much sack all that, even though once we got past game 5 we passed the toughest part of the schedule. Too bad we couldn't pull out any of the games besides NYG.

Haslem looked like he wanted to strangle somebody when Shurmur punted on 4th and 1. The Gordon touchdown drop was huge on 3rd and 1, but they also threw deep on 2nd and 1 (or vice versa). Usually when game managers call plays like that, they are looking at that as 4 down territory, especially with four minutes and change left in the game. But Shurmur blows a time out there on 4th and 1 and decides to punt. It's a very puzzling sequence. Unacceptable and cannot be defended IMO.

 
Another winnable game. Could even give it the "shoulda won" label.

With Pittsburgh looking somewhat mortal, Baltimore struggling with injuries, and the Bengals being maybe just a step ahead of us IMO, the division was still in sights even at 1-5. Heck, even the AFC wildcard is gonna be nutty this year with so much parity week to week. Now at 1-6 we can pretty much sack all that, even though once we got past game 5 we passed the toughest part of the schedule. Too bad we couldn't pull out any of the games besides NYG.

Haslem looked like he wanted to strangle somebody when Shurmur punted on 4th and 1. The Gordon touchdown drop was huge on 3rd and 1, but they also threw deep on 2nd and 1 (or vice versa). Usually when game managers call plays like that, they are looking at that as 4 down territory, especially with four minutes and change left in the game. But Shurmur blows a time out there on 4th and 1 and decides to punt. It's a very puzzling sequence. Unacceptable and cannot be defended IMO.
Taking this as a very good sign. Looks like this is a guy that really doesn't like to lose. Hoping that bodes well for us.
 
Another winnable game. Could even give it the "shoulda won" label.

With Pittsburgh looking somewhat mortal, Baltimore struggling with injuries, and the Bengals being maybe just a step ahead of us IMO, the division was still in sights even at 1-5. Heck, even the AFC wildcard is gonna be nutty this year with so much parity week to week. Now at 1-6 we can pretty much sack all that, even though once we got past game 5 we passed the toughest part of the schedule. Too bad we couldn't pull out any of the games besides NYG.

Haslem looked like he wanted to strangle somebody when Shurmur punted on 4th and 1. The Gordon touchdown drop was huge on 3rd and 1, but they also threw deep on 2nd and 1 (or vice versa). Usually when game managers call plays like that, they are looking at that as 4 down territory, especially with four minutes and change left in the game. But Shurmur blows a time out there on 4th and 1 and decides to punt. It's a very puzzling sequence. Unacceptable and cannot be defended IMO.
Taking this as a very good sign. Looks like this is a guy that really doesn't like to lose. Hoping that bodes well for us.
Randy Lerner: :sleep: Jimmy Haslam: :rant:

That in itself makes the 2012 season successful for me.

 
Another winnable game. Could even give it the "shoulda won" label.

With Pittsburgh looking somewhat mortal, Baltimore struggling with injuries, and the Bengals being maybe just a step ahead of us IMO, the division was still in sights even at 1-5. Heck, even the AFC wildcard is gonna be nutty this year with so much parity week to week. Now at 1-6 we can pretty much sack all that, even though once we got past game 5 we passed the toughest part of the schedule. Too bad we couldn't pull out any of the games besides NYG.

Haslem looked like he wanted to strangle somebody when Shurmur punted on 4th and 1. The Gordon touchdown drop was huge on 3rd and 1, but they also threw deep on 2nd and 1 (or vice versa). Usually when game managers call plays like that, they are looking at that as 4 down territory, especially with four minutes and change left in the game. But Shurmur blows a time out there on 4th and 1 and decides to punt. It's a very puzzling sequence. Unacceptable and cannot be defended IMO.
Taking this as a very good sign. Looks like this is a guy that really doesn't like to lose. Hoping that bodes well for us.
Hope so, too! :thumbup:
 
'NJDawgPound said:
'dancingbones said:
Another winnable game. Could even give it the "shoulda won" label.

With Pittsburgh looking somewhat mortal, Baltimore struggling with injuries, and the Bengals being maybe just a step ahead of us IMO, the division was still in sights even at 1-5. Heck, even the AFC wildcard is gonna be nutty this year with so much parity week to week. Now at 1-6 we can pretty much sack all that, even though once we got past game 5 we passed the toughest part of the schedule. Too bad we couldn't pull out any of the games besides NYG.

Haslem looked like he wanted to strangle somebody when Shurmur punted on 4th and 1. The Gordon touchdown drop was huge on 3rd and 1, but they also threw deep on 2nd and 1 (or vice versa). Usually when game managers call plays like that, they are looking at that as 4 down territory, especially with four minutes and change left in the game. But Shurmur blows a time out there on 4th and 1 and decides to punt. It's a very puzzling sequence. Unacceptable and cannot be defended IMO.
Taking this as a very good sign. Looks like this is a guy that really doesn't like to lose. Hoping that bodes well for us.
Randy Lerner: :sleep: Jimmy Haslam: :rant:

That in itself makes the 2012 season successful for me.
:goodposting: I have no problems with the 3rd and 1 call and I'm not going to kill Gordon for the drop either - they're infrequent so far, he's made so many big plays to offset it, he's still just a kid, and most importantly he doesn't have a history of acting like an ### #usainboltpose. However, when you go deep on 3rd and 1 it's assumed you're going for it on 4th down. Not indecisively going for it forcing your QB to burn a timeout because you took 30 seconds to get him the play call then pissing on your leg as you decide to punt it away. I don't see the point in letting him keep coaching except Haslam already said he gets the season, Shurmur is a total lost cause.

 
WOW, this story from Grossi is crazy. Apparently Holmgren sat on his ####### ### as president of the Browns.I have to say, the post-ESPN Tony Grossi is such an amazing step up from his PD days.http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=17&post_id=6771

Drawing the curtain on the Big ShowOct 23, 2012 -- 6:00amBy Tony GrossiHigh hopes dashed: My first reaction when Mike Holmgren agreed to serve as Randy Lerner’s “credible, serious leader” at Christmastime 2009 was “Wow … finally.”There was a pause and then this thought: “What if this doesn’t work? Lerner will have to sell.”So here we are.Lerner has handed off the Browns to Jimmy Haslam for $1.05 billion. And today marks Holmgren’s last appearance in front of Cleveland media as Browns president.Last week in Chicago, Haslam outlined a graceful exit for Holmgren when Joe Banner arrives as Browns CEO on October 25. Haslam said Holmgren would work with Banner over the next 3 ½ months “to transition … in a seamless fashion” and then retire at the end of the year.In truth, Holmgren has said his goodbyes to everyone in the Browns’ support staff. He has had no influence on any Browns business since Lerner crushed him with the news of his intent to sell in June. Make no mistake, Lerner’s decision blindsided him.After today’s press appearance, Holmgren will strap on his helmet for the final time and ride his Harley out of the pages of Browns history, his saddlebags loaded with Lerner’s Monopoly money.The deal Holmgren signed with Lerner was reported to be $40 million over five years. This was merely the third year.Whatever the severance package, Holmgren’s likely final contract as an NFL coach or executive – he’ll be 65 next June -- secured him the distinction of hauling in more money in his career than any non-player, non-owner and non-commissioner in NFL history. Bill Parcells had one more Super Bowl championship than Holmgren, but he couldn’t match Holmgren’s career earnings. After leaving the community-owned Green Bay Packers, Holmgren hit the lottery by signing up with billionaires Paul Allen, Microsoft co-founder, and the Lerner Family Trust.Holmgren’s legacy: A number of names can be associated with Holmgren’s short tenure with the Browns as – Haslam’s words – “the de facto owner.” There were quarterbacks Seneca Wallace, Jake Delhomme, Colt McCoy and Brandon Weeden. There were executives Tom Heckert and Bryan Wiedmeier. There were old buddies Gil Haskell, Ray Rhodes, Nolan Cromwell and **** Jauron.And there was Pat Shurmur, the nephew of the late Fritz Shurmur, one of Holmgren’s favorite assistant coaches from his glory days in Green Bay.Holmgren’s one and only coaching search was symbolic of the minimal effort he put into the awesome position that he held. He interviewed three coaches – Perry Fewell, the minority candidate to comply with the Rooney Rule; Mike Mularkey, whom he didn’t know; and Shurmur. He said he also talked with Bill Cowher and Jon Gruden.In truth, the job was always earmarked for a young offensive coach in the stable of agent Bob LaMonte, Holmgren’s long-time friend and business associate. The only serious candidates were Shurmur and Eagles offensive coordinator Marty Mornhinweg. Mornhinweg’s pathetic record as Detroit Lions head coach eliminated him.To me, Holmgren’s epitaph is this: He fired Jim Brown and Lew Merletti – two icons in their profession. And then he wouldn’t take accountability for either act. He denied both moves after I reported them with The Plain Dealer. Brown would later blow the lid off Holmgren’s denial, through team spokesman Neal Gulkis, that Brown’s role as executive advisor “hasn’t changed.” Brown released a scathing letter in the summer of 2010 lambasting Holmgren for disrespecting him by offering him a token position as a greeter. (The two have since patched up their differences, thanks partially to an intervention by Haslam.)As for Merletti, the former U. S. Secret Service director and Browns senior vice president of security, a paradigm of class and honor who was personally recruited by Al Lerner, Holmgren banished him from the team’s headquarters in Berea for reasons he never explained. Merletti has spent the past two years at the Lerners’ Brooklyn N.Y. Holdings, LLC, office space on the grounds of the Cuyahoga County Airport.Holmgren effectively received a retraction, or clarification, from The Plain Dealer on my story of Merletti’s ouster in May of 2011. But the power play by Holmgren destroyed relations, for good, with Norma Lerner, Al’s widow.The only thing that could save Holmgren from that point was a complete resurgence of the Browns’ football program. And on that front, Holmgren was an abject failure.No energy: My initial excitement about Holmgren taking over the Browns’ fortunes was based on the assumption he would coach.Coaching is what made Holmgren a multi-millionaire. He took the Packers to two Super Bowls – winning one, thanks to Clevelander Desmond Howard’s 244 return yards, including a 99-yard kickoff touchdown return – and the Seahawks to one. But by the time Lerner lured him out of semi-retirement with his millions, Holmgren didn’t have the energy to continue coaching. And Lerner gave Holmgren the option of coaching or not.Holmgren was never one of those coaches who slept in the office, anyway. When he was given total authority by Lerner to shape the franchise whichever way he wished, he did the absolute minimum.On sales occasions with VIP corporate customers, it was not uncommon for Holmgren to say a few words and slip out before dinner. Certainly, he was not a salesman. But Holmgren’s minimal effort infected the entire organization. If he could coast, anybody could.There is a story making the rounds that on at least one occasion since Haslam came onto the scene, Haslam beat Holmgren to the office – and Haslam started the day from Knoxville, Tenn.,; Holmgren from his condo in Bratenahl.I asked Jim Brown what he felt Holmgren’s legacy was with the Browns.Brown, who has reconciled with Holmgren, said, “I don’t see a lot of positives. It’s obvious that something didn’t work. It’s so obvious it’s just not right to talk about it.”
 
Not surprised by any of that, the lack of urgency from this regime was there from the beginning and became painfully undeniable midseason 2011 and continued on until the sale was announced. Good riddance.

 
Not surprised by any of that, the lack of urgency from this regime was there from the beginning and became painfully undeniable midseason 2011 and continued on until the sale was announced. Good riddance.
Emotion is a poor ingredient to good decision-making.
 
Not surprised by any of that, the lack of urgency from this regime was there from the beginning and became painfully undeniable midseason 2011 and continued on until the sale was announced. Good riddance.
Emotion is a poor ingredient to good decision-making.
That has nothing to do with anything I have said dating back to last year when you (I think it was you anyway) got on my case about my take on the lack of urgency of this regime. They're late - to everything - and it shows in the product on the field and in the record. Starts at the top.
 
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I'll agree on the lack of urgency thing.

I'll also agree that decisions based on emotions do not work out well.

We must consider that Heckert and Holmgren were probably acting on orders from Lerner not to blow it up in free agency to keep the costs at a minimum to make the team more attractive to potential buyers. Lerner's plan after Al's passing was to keep the team in the family for 10 years. He did just that and got out cleanly.

 
Not surprised by any of that, the lack of urgency from this regime was there from the beginning and became painfully undeniable midseason 2011 and continued on until the sale was announced. Good riddance.
Emotion is a poor ingredient to good decision-making.
That has nothing to do with anything I have said dating back to last year when you (I think it was you anyway) got on my case about my take on the lack of urgency of this regime. They're late - to everything - and it shows in the product on the field and in the record. Starts at the top.
Apparently I misunderstand. What was it that they should have done during "mid-season 2011"?
 
Not surprised by any of that, the lack of urgency from this regime was there from the beginning and became painfully undeniable midseason 2011 and continued on until the sale was announced. Good riddance.
Emotion is a poor ingredient to good decision-making.
That has nothing to do with anything I have said dating back to last year when you (I think it was you anyway) got on my case about my take on the lack of urgency of this regime. They're late - to everything - and it shows in the product on the field and in the record. Starts at the top.
Apparently I misunderstand. What was it that they should have done during "mid-season 2011"?
The problem wasn't midseason 2011, it was everything starting from the beginning. Not being between the 4 walls in Berea this takes longer to get to us on the outside, it just became apparent then and if you want to know search for my posts. I've gone into great detail before.
 
Not surprised by any of that, the lack of urgency from this regime was there from the beginning and became painfully undeniable midseason 2011 and continued on until the sale was announced. Good riddance.
Emotion is a poor ingredient to good decision-making.
That has nothing to do with anything I have said dating back to last year when you (I think it was you anyway) got on my case about my take on the lack of urgency of this regime. They're late - to everything - and it shows in the product on the field and in the record. Starts at the top.
Apparently I misunderstand. What was it that they should have done during "mid-season 2011"?
The problem wasn't midseason 2011, it was everything starting from the beginning. Not being between the 4 walls in Berea this takes longer to get to us on the outside, it just became apparent then and if you want to know search for my posts. I've gone into great detail before.
They have added a new QB, a new RB, a new RT, two new WRs, new DL, new LBs. All good stuff, no? If they displayed more urgency, what would they have done differently / better? Now that Haslam & Banner are in charge, what urgent things are they doing?
 
I've beaten this to death and want to move on with what I hope/think will be a brighter future, if you're that curious on my takes then go back and read my posts from before. I'll trust if Haslam + Banner retain Heckert then his role/strategy will be tweaked, good news is they are going to look great with their coaching hire regardless because they cannot possibly get a worse gameday coach than Pat.

 
I've beaten this to death and want to move on with what I hope/think will be a brighter future, if you're that curious on my takes then go back and read my posts from before. I'll trust if Haslam + Banner retain Heckert then his role/strategy will be tweaked, good news is they are going to look great with their coaching hire regardless because they cannot possibly get a worse gameday coach than Pat.
You're a Browns fan & so am I. Bottom line: Go Browns!
 

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