Keerock
Footballguy
There's an art to it, but once you get used to the change, it's liberating! For the right kind of work anyway.
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Get Your Butt Back To The Office (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter BassNBrew
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Ron Swanson
Footballguy
So then the only way it works for you is to have a dedicated space for a workspace in your home.
My work and home life are so intertwined it makes no difference to me. But I wouldn't have it any other way.
Yeah, pickups and drop offs for my son, appointments, getting work done in the house, food shopping, etc all so much easier when I wfh.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Have been WFH the past 10+ years. Could never go back at this point. The only thing when I hear commute is how much wasted time each day/week/year in one's life dedicated towards doing nothing and not getting paid for that time. 
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AAABatteries
Footballguy
Typical day in office
- Get up to an alarm at 6:00 and get ready
- Drive an hour to office
- Arrive at 8 and Work 4 hours
- Take a lunch break
- Work four more hours (sporadic breaks to browse FBGs, water cooler, etc.)
- Drive an hour home
- Get home at 6pm and Eat dinner
Work from home
- Get up whenever I wake up
- Make coffee and relax until I feel like working - can start early to get my day going
- Work a while and take breaks to let the dog out, take the garbage out, put on a load of clothes
- Take a long lunch if I want - drink a beer with my lunch, have sex with the wife, watch 30-40 minutes of a movie, take a nap
- Work some more
- Take break and walk the dogs, get dinner prep done, talk to the kids when they get home. More time for breaks starting my day early
- Finish working
- Walk to my bar and pour a drink and watch the rest of the movie while dinner cooks
These days aren’t even comparable for me. #NeverAgain
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
We have a “work appropriately” policy. How much any given employee comes into the office is up to them and their manager. It was temporarily suspended during the Omicron surge, during which everyone stayed home every day unless they needed to come in.
The guideline from our department in non-surge times had been that everyone who is not fully remote should come into the office at least once a week, with the members of each team there on the same day, so any team-wide meetings could be done in-person.
That has now been changed from once a week to once a month. (But people can come in more frequently if they want to).
I don’t know if this is to prevent future yo-yo-ing of policies if there are future surges, because they realized people were doing just fine at home, because we had some restructuring of upper management, because changes with the physical site are planned (we own the building so there is no rent-saving potential in play) or some combination thereof.
The guideline from our department in non-surge times had been that everyone who is not fully remote should come into the office at least once a week, with the members of each team there on the same day, so any team-wide meetings could be done in-person.
That has now been changed from once a week to once a month. (But people can come in more frequently if they want to).
I don’t know if this is to prevent future yo-yo-ing of policies if there are future surges, because they realized people were doing just fine at home, because we had some restructuring of upper management, because changes with the physical site are planned (we own the building so there is no rent-saving potential in play) or some combination thereof.
culdeus
Footballguy
Feel like the next month will define everything. With Covid completely over for the workforce now it's surely a hybrid work because I want to not for safety.
My situation is sort of up in the air, but I get the sense that the give/take here will be at worst 2 days in office a week. I've found that being in office is horribly unproductive even discounting the commute time lately, and when it was productive it was because people weren't there in any quantity.
The larger and unsolved issue is how do you on-ramp college hires when the veteran staff is not around. It's hard.
My situation is sort of up in the air, but I get the sense that the give/take here will be at worst 2 days in office a week. I've found that being in office is horribly unproductive even discounting the commute time lately, and when it was productive it was because people weren't there in any quantity.
The larger and unsolved issue is how do you on-ramp college hires when the veteran staff is not around. It's hard.
belljr
Footballguy
If they don't go to a hybrid model here there might be a mutiny lol..... We have been trying for years to get some sort of wfh and management was always against it. Now we showed we can do it they are out of excuses. I don't think it will be full time remote but a couple days a week I'm ok with. The biggest issue is like a doctor's appointment I have to take like 4 hours off where now I can just wfh when needed.
We are scheduled for late April
We are scheduled for late April
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beer 30
Footballguy
We don't have any restrictions right now and while the building has more than in the last few months, it's still woefully empty. We typically had just shy of 500, probably 150 now. We are moving to a new, bigger building in early fall and the word is the mandate will be get back to the office except for one department who can easily work from home. Don't have a problem with it as I'm an office guy.
Insein
Footballguy
I worked from home before Covid. Like hell I'm wasting 2.5 hours of my day driving to and from the office just to sit and stare at my screen for 8hrs while paying someone else to pick up and watch my kids.
If one good thing comes from Covid, let's hope it's the end of corporate office culture.
If one good thing comes from Covid, let's hope it's the end of corporate office culture.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
I think that's the issue once they are able to hire someone - I think their bigger issue for these companies is going to be how do they convince these college hires and Millennials that they need to come to an office to begin with.
culdeus
Footballguy
Maybe I'm unique here, but most of my day is sort of barbelled. I interface with Europe teams in the US morning and Asia teams in the US evening leaving the middle of my day pretty open at times.
Working remotely has been sort of part of my gig for awhile now, but unofficially. Nobody expected me to sit in my office at 9pm talking to China. In a big ramp it's not crazy for me to do 8hrs of calls and work not inside the 9-5 timeframe.
The feeling I get is the people they do expect to do 9-5 type work are going to be pushed back, then there will be resentment to those that get a "deal". Will see how this goes, but it's going to be highly variable I feel like across even nearly the same job grades and roles.
Working remotely has been sort of part of my gig for awhile now, but unofficially. Nobody expected me to sit in my office at 9pm talking to China. In a big ramp it's not crazy for me to do 8hrs of calls and work not inside the 9-5 timeframe.
The feeling I get is the people they do expect to do 9-5 type work are going to be pushed back, then there will be resentment to those that get a "deal". Will see how this goes, but it's going to be highly variable I feel like across even nearly the same job grades and roles.
James Daulton
Footballguy
Yep. Training newbies and setting expectations is by far the biggest challenge of this whole WFH.
I think 2x a week in office is perfect.
offdee
Footballguy
Bolded is the main reason many companies are trying to get employees back to the office. Most are locked into a long term lease or had plans in place pre-pandemic to upgrade the office. So, for many it's a matter of saving face for these million dollar investments in the buildings and trying to convince all that there is actually a need for them.
Poke_4_Life
Footballguy
This is basically where my job has fallen, starting tomorrow March 1. (Not all parts of the company, but my division has been remote for almost 2 years.)
Officially, we're to be in the office roughly 50% of the time going forward in my division. I've discussed with my immediate management and direct reports that I'll be in twice a week and any other times that are necessary.
We hire a lot of college grads and train them from scratch, management worries that the 'culture' will not be imparted without that in person time. We'll see how it goes. Luckily in my current role I don't deal a lot with younger hires, so we will have a lot of flexibility.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
We're looking at a rough concept of:
- Less than 1 year work experience - in the office every day
- More than 1 year work experience - hybrid option but need to be in the office a set number of days a month (8-10, we haven't settled on a hard number). Days working at a client's office are considered an in-office workday. There may be certain times of year (namely when training new staff members) where you may be required to be in the office more than the hybrid minimum.
- If have more than 1 year work experience, you have the option to go full remote. And this means full remote, you don't keep your office/cube, you don't have any dedicated space in the office, and you're expected to be working from home full-time, no hybrid option. We expect something like ~15% of our employees to take this option.
beer 30
Footballguy
We're the Support Office for a large rental company. To that end, not a lot of folks based here didn't work at the office. AP/AR/Marketing/IT all that stuff is centralized here and while WFH was nice, there's no reason to continue it. We're not asking people to travel 3 hours into the office unless you're dumb enough to live that far away. Most everyone is pretty local. I live 4 miles away and have ridden my bike into work.
I get what you are saying. In our business park there was a national mortgage company that was based in Charlotte and made it a big deal about moving across the border to South Carolina (we're 20 minutes from Charlotte) because of taxes. Built a $32m building and opened in January 2020. I see some cars in the parking lot now but no where near what it should be. Guessing they are struggling.
offdee
Footballguy
If the company is more than 50 employees, seems like a nightmare to try and keep track of and enforce.
Tax breaks and government pressure is another big reason. Mayors want people working in the big office buildings because those people help support the local economy.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
belljr
Footballguy
Thats a point that is over looked. I know our lunch spot is struggling right now with our office close
offdee
Footballguy
Ah, didn't think about that...good point. Overall though, the main reasoning really doesn't have much to do with actual work efficiency.
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Poke_4_Life
Footballguy
I feel obligated to eat out at lunch every time I go into the office. My favorite places seems to be barely hanging on. :(
STEADYMOBBIN 22
Footballguy
Ive been working this entire time but now our office is opening up to everyone else and they are requiring booster shots. I am livid. I got my vaccine shots, I DO NOT want a booster or anything else forced into my bloodstream.
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PhillipPhoto
Footballguy
nirad3
Footballguy
Our big boss man stresses that while Covid has changed things in the short-term, we are NOT going to be a "full remote" type of company. I think he's saying that for the 70%+ of the company that really does need to be in the office every day. I work for a company that represents investors in affordable housing.
In my division there are folks that are 100% remote since they live in Denver, Austin, Tennessee, New York, etc. They are assigned a territory and visit the properties within that territory on a regular basis so they are always going to be remote. Then there's my little group that handles the assets during construction phase ONLY. So we travel all over the country.
But when we're not traveling, we are based in Irvine, CA. My boss actually relocated to Boise and that's been working out fine. My guess is that they continue to have us coming into the office 2x a week (I'm Monday/Wednesday) until that somehow proves inefficient. Which it won't.
The folks in accounting and such will likely, at some point, go back to a normal M-F 8-5 type of situation.
Right now I love 2x a week in the office. I get a lot done on Mondays. Tuesdays my wife works at Starbucks so I have to pick up the kids and make sure they're doing homework and chores. I do a lot of laundry on Tuesdays. I take a nap sometimes. I usually start happy hour around 4pm on Tuesdays too.
Wednesdays are good to get caught up.... and if I'm traveling it's usually on a Wednesday so there's another day that I don't go to the office. Thursdays are usually booked up with Teams video meetings. Fridays are relaxed and during the summer months they actually let us free at 1pm... which is awesome.
So yeah if there's been anything good that's come of Covid, it's this work environment. I love my job and this schedule is great.
In my division there are folks that are 100% remote since they live in Denver, Austin, Tennessee, New York, etc. They are assigned a territory and visit the properties within that territory on a regular basis so they are always going to be remote. Then there's my little group that handles the assets during construction phase ONLY. So we travel all over the country.
But when we're not traveling, we are based in Irvine, CA. My boss actually relocated to Boise and that's been working out fine. My guess is that they continue to have us coming into the office 2x a week (I'm Monday/Wednesday) until that somehow proves inefficient. Which it won't.
The folks in accounting and such will likely, at some point, go back to a normal M-F 8-5 type of situation.
Right now I love 2x a week in the office. I get a lot done on Mondays. Tuesdays my wife works at Starbucks so I have to pick up the kids and make sure they're doing homework and chores. I do a lot of laundry on Tuesdays. I take a nap sometimes. I usually start happy hour around 4pm on Tuesdays too.
Wednesdays are good to get caught up.... and if I'm traveling it's usually on a Wednesday so there's another day that I don't go to the office. Thursdays are usually booked up with Teams video meetings. Fridays are relaxed and during the summer months they actually let us free at 1pm... which is awesome. So yeah if there's been anything good that's come of Covid, it's this work environment. I love my job and this schedule is great.
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Dan Lambskin
Footballguy
We have been on a hybrid program for a while now, WFH Friday and one other day, in the office the other 3
From Xmas until today it was basically come in if you need to but you don’t have to, we are back to the hybrid now
I definitely like sleeping in and being able to do things around the house during downtime, but I also see benefits being in the office as well, so I’m fine with the hybrid schedule and we are lenient enough that I can take an extra day to WFH home when needed
From Xmas until today it was basically come in if you need to but you don’t have to, we are back to the hybrid now
I definitely like sleeping in and being able to do things around the house during downtime, but I also see benefits being in the office as well, so I’m fine with the hybrid schedule and we are lenient enough that I can take an extra day to WFH home when needed
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
belljr
Footballguy
This is the big thing for me.
It was beyond stupid to not even have this ability. I have house issue - plumber is on the way - ill be taking the whole day OFF sorry OR I'll be logged on at home and may be sporadic for an hour
AAABatteries
Footballguy
James Daulton
Footballguy
Seriously.I went into the office two weeks ago and found a Christmas card on my desk.
You got a Christmas card?
coopersdad
Footballguy
Large global multi brand company. Last summer they had all departments come up with their own plan for coming back to work. Our department came up with 2 days in office during month end close (2 weeks), and then 1 day the other 2 weeks of the month.................however, we were in the process of refurbishing our building last summer when an fire inspector found issues w/ our 100 year old building. So they are trying to figure out if we can occupy more than the 1st floor until those issues are fixed (and that may take 1-2 years). Our lease is up the end of 2023, so they are looking at building a new building somewhere, but that would take 2/3 years. So everything is in limbo. Our CEO does not want to rent office space as he doesn't want "suits" from other tenants wondering why the CEO of a billion dollar company is showing up to work in fllp flops, a hoodie, and shorts. So we are work from home. 30 miles / 1 hour if I don't take toll roads. I get that time back X 2, plus laundry, and grocery shopping (during lunch) are all done. Evenings are free to do whatever, and they start around 415 (I hop on computer at around 715). But ESPN is on in other room, the dogs are getting attention, and I can take my Sr. son lunch once / twice a week.
JaxBill
Footballguy
After further thought and introspection...still a big fat nope.
Permanently remote and loving it. My actual company is 750 miles away.
As a government IT contractor, I get approached by recruiters with plenty of permanently remote opportunities.
I had a loose string hanging from my pair of gym shorts and my wife told me that I need to buy new "work pants".
Permanently remote and loving it. My actual company is 750 miles away.
As a government IT contractor, I get approached by recruiters with plenty of permanently remote opportunities.
I had a loose string hanging from my pair of gym shorts and my wife told me that I need to buy new "work pants".
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Multiple aspects to this:
1) As an employee, I would only go back to working in an office if I was either the CEO or President of a company. In those roles you have to be there. But that's it.
2) AAA batteries outlined it perfectly. The hours and flexibility you get from working from home adds immense quality of life. More time with your family, more time to workout, less expense, etc. His lunches are better than mine though
3) I do think in most cases company culture suffers with a remote workforce. At the very least I think teams have to get together on a fairly regular basis. And not on Zoom. A week each quarter at a minimum if people have to fly in, etc. More if local. Not just for work. But to break bread, have fun, etc.
4) There are some roles/teams where you lose so much being remote. Engineers are used to huddling and whiteboarding, doing brainstorming, etc. Not easily replicated remotely. And in Sales I believe SDR/BDR teams (typically younger sales reps who are prospecting) are far more productive with higher career development when they are in person. They can hear each other's calls, walk through objection handling, etc, support each other with friendly competition and more.
So in summary I think a hybrid model is best. People won't feel attachment to a company with permanent WFH. But quality of life is sure sweet otherwise.
1) As an employee, I would only go back to working in an office if I was either the CEO or President of a company. In those roles you have to be there. But that's it.
2) AAA batteries outlined it perfectly. The hours and flexibility you get from working from home adds immense quality of life. More time with your family, more time to workout, less expense, etc. His lunches are better than mine though
3) I do think in most cases company culture suffers with a remote workforce. At the very least I think teams have to get together on a fairly regular basis. And not on Zoom. A week each quarter at a minimum if people have to fly in, etc. More if local. Not just for work. But to break bread, have fun, etc.
4) There are some roles/teams where you lose so much being remote. Engineers are used to huddling and whiteboarding, doing brainstorming, etc. Not easily replicated remotely. And in Sales I believe SDR/BDR teams (typically younger sales reps who are prospecting) are far more productive with higher career development when they are in person. They can hear each other's calls, walk through objection handling, etc, support each other with friendly competition and more.
So in summary I think a hybrid model is best. People won't feel attachment to a company with permanent WFH. But quality of life is sure sweet otherwise.
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JaxBill
Footballguy
Multiple aspects to this:
1) As an employee, I would only go back to working in an office if I was either the CEO or President of a company. In those roles you have to be there. But that's it.
2) AAA batteries outlined it perfectly. The hours and flexibility you get from working from home adds immense quality of life. More time with your family, more time to workout, less expense, etc. His lunches are better than mine though
3) I do think in most cases company culture suffers with a remote workforce. At the very least I think teams have to get together on a fairly regular basis. And not on Zoom. A week each quarter at a minimum if people have to fly in, etc. More if local. Not just for work. But to break bread, have fun, etc.
4) There are some roles/teams where you lose so much being remote. Engineers are used to huddling and whiteboarding, doing brainstorming, etc. Not easily replicated remotely. And in Sales I believe SDR/BDR teams (typically younger sales reps who are prospecting) are far more productive with higher career development when they are in person. They can hear each other's calls, walk through objection handling, etc, support each other with friendly competition and more.
So in summary I think a hybrid model is best. People won't feel attachment to a company with permanent WFH. But quality of life is sure sweet otherwise.
I partially agree. I think the huddling/whiteboard thing for Engineers is overblown. I have had some good design sessions online.
While I am permanently remote, I can understand the desire to bring everyone onsight periodically. But really, managememt and the client gets the most out of that. Last contract they flew me up to Beltway for quarterly design and planning next set of releases. Yes, there were technical questions worked out but the biggest accomplishments were informing management of intended deliverables and the client to put faces to names.
As far as breaking bread together, that can be good but it can also get old. On that last trip, we were putting 10+ hour days, having lunch brought in, and going out to dinner. I tried to hide my enthusiasm for the final night's dinner plans falling through. I kind of felt like I was a hostage for a few days. Let me go back to the hotel, have a couple beers and GrubHub and let me crash.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Selling anything? My firm owns/manages apartments across the country, including around 9,000 affordable housing units.Our big boss man stresses that while Covid has changed things in the short-term, we are NOT going to be a "full remote" type of company. I think he's saying that for the 70%+ of the company that really does need to be in the office every day. I work for a company that represents investors in affordable housing.
In my division there are folks that are 100% remote since they live in Denver, Austin, Tennessee, New York, etc. They are assigned a territory and visit the properties within that territory on a regular basis so they are always going to be remote. Then there's my little group that handles the assets during construction phase ONLY. So we travel all over the country.
But when we're not traveling, we are based in Irvine, CA. My boss actually relocated to Boise and that's been working out fine. My guess is that they continue to have us coming into the office 2x a week (I'm Monday/Wednesday) until that somehow proves inefficient. Which it won't.
The folks in accounting and such will likely, at some point, go back to a normal M-F 8-5 type of situation.
Right now I love 2x a week in the office. I get a lot done on Mondays. Tuesdays my wife works at Starbucks so I have to pick up the kids and make sure they're doing homework and chores. I do a lot of laundry on Tuesdays. I take a nap sometimes. I usually start happy hour around 4pm on Tuesdays too.
So yeah if there's been anything good that's come of Covid, it's this work environment. I love my job and this schedule is great.
MAC_32
Footballguy
From an organizational perspective we cannot do something like this, but the parameters you mentioned in bullets 1 and 2 are aligned with what I'm looking at for our team of 11. Not something I'm going to apply much thought to until at least year end though. Our vets prefer to work in the office so since we're already offering WFH flexibility when the situation dictates time is not of the essence, but I would like a plan in place as our new staff nears a year of service time. I don't think fully remote will ever be an option, but it's something I'd listen to after an infrastructure/systems overhaul.Steve Tasker said:
nirad3
Footballguy
I'm strictly on the construction side. I know we do sell off assets after the tax credit deliveries stop. If you want to PM me your info I can probably get you in touch with our dispositions team.
Green and Gold
Footballguy
For me, going in to work will do nothing but add distractions to my day. I'm in IT and I manage a team of 20 worldwide, none of which work anywhere near my office. My company is still making me go back in.
Now I get to look forward to constant drivebys by people who think anyone in IT should be their own personal support person, even if that IT person has nothing to do with user support. I'll have to keep my office door closed all day, which kind of defeats the purpose of going back to the office.
Such a waste.
Now I get to look forward to constant drivebys by people who think anyone in IT should be their own personal support person, even if that IT person has nothing to do with user support. I'll have to keep my office door closed all day, which kind of defeats the purpose of going back to the office.
Such a waste.
Poke_4_Life
Footballguy
That sucks. Sorry. Here's my response.
1 . Make a cardboard version of you sitting at your desk
2. Keep the office door closed.
3. ???
4. Profit.
Corporation
Angry Bovine
Like many others we have settled into the hybrid model. We were going to be 3 days a week, but when Omicron spiked up we moved to 2 days a week so the other side of our floor could also do 2 days a week. In theory, that gave us room to spread out if anyone was uncomfortable with how close in proximity we are. In practice, almost no one moved to the other side because everyone wants to sit at their desk.
I expect we will stay with 2 days a week for the foreseeable future but wouldn't be shocked at all if we go back to the original plan of 3 days. The CFO said the 5 day in office week for us is done, too big a benefit and we performed very well remotely. I think hybrid is the way to go especially for younger people. We need to be in person to help reinforce the culture. Many of the projects I received accolades on were "water cooler" talks; I'd hear about a need and find a solution. Hybrid allows that to happen while getting young/new to the company associates comfortable with who we are.
I had a meeting and had to go in to the office on a WFH day. I actually told my wife I was exhausted from having to drive downtown 3 days in a row, then laughed because I wouldn't have batted an eye 2 years prior.
I expect we will stay with 2 days a week for the foreseeable future but wouldn't be shocked at all if we go back to the original plan of 3 days. The CFO said the 5 day in office week for us is done, too big a benefit and we performed very well remotely. I think hybrid is the way to go especially for younger people. We need to be in person to help reinforce the culture. Many of the projects I received accolades on were "water cooler" talks; I'd hear about a need and find a solution. Hybrid allows that to happen while getting young/new to the company associates comfortable with who we are.
I had a meeting and had to go in to the office on a WFH day. I actually told my wife I was exhausted from having to drive downtown 3 days in a row, then laughed because I wouldn't have batted an eye 2 years prior.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Good points. I definitely like alone time when traveling to corporate. Usually I'll have a nice dinner and some wine by myself on the day of arrival. But I do think there are some benefits to getting together. While there are ways to work remotely, you never really get to know someone over Zoom. I feel a deeper connection with colleagues when we get to really talk outside of work stuff. Learn their story, family, etc. I just think WFH will further fuel a lack of company culture. You become a bunch of individual contractors with very little loyalty, other than the loyalty gained from being able to WFH.JaxBill said:
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