"Mass Casualty Event" in Las Vegas (2 Viewers)

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Whitman killed 16 people, but his main weapon was a hunting rifle. 

He was selective too.  I just was put in mind of him, not saying totally analogous.

 

[sbonomo]

http://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2017/10/02/man-covers-wife-during-shooting-in-las-vegas-orig-tc.cnn/video/playlists/atv-breaking-news/

You can say what you want but it sure sounds like a full auto weapon to me. Watch the video, about 23 seconds in you here it. For some reason that doesn't sound like a typical AR to me but I'm not anywhere near familiar with this weapons.

Pitch is too low for an Ar 15.  I bet it is an ar 10 (or some merging that shoots a 308 round) or an ak. 

 

[[icon]]

Depends on a number of factors, the weapon, the trigger configuration, and how generally handy and mechanically inclined one is.  I stand by not hard.

I'll defer to DW here. If you're able to procure a conversion kit (which most places reportedly require an ATF form 4 to purchase), or have machining/welding skills it can be easier for some weapons. I don't claim to be an expert in this particular area, just going off what more knowledgable folks than I (one being a gunsmith) have explained to me. That said, I imagine it varies greatly by rifle design. Older weapons are reportedly MUCH easier to mod than newer ones, generally speaking. 

 

[culdeus]

Interesting... could you share the link? 

Thx 

Listening to BBC at work, just repeated cops found eight (8) guns and one (1) was fully automatic soviet era type.

BBC usually gets their #### right.

 

[Daywalker]

Do you think people are are okay with committing mass murder are concerned with gun laws? 

Do you think their is a difference between 50 people getting shot and 200?

 

[[icon]]

Example of a Soviet LMG that Culdeus is saying may have been the primary weapon. 

 

 

[[icon]]

Listening to BBC at work, just repeated cops found eight (8) guns and one (1) was fully automatic soviet era type.

BBC usually gets their #### right.

They do.. thanks GB 

 

[ShamrockPride]

If the reported numbers are true, this is the largest (numbers wise) mass shooting in the history of the United States.  

I know it's unrealistic, but I don't even want information released about the shooter.  Terrorists should have their names disappear into history forever. 

Never gonna happen. Clicks are money.

 

[Phil Elliott]

I'm numb this morning.  This was 15 minutes from my home.  I think I slept 30 minutes.  I was getting updates from a lady that works for me - her kid is a cop that is stationed on the strip and he was giving her updates.  I heard 20 had died when the media was saying it was only 2.  And now 50 (probably a little higher).

My friend was at that concert, but she made it out ok.

I don't know if I am in shock or jaded to these events now.  Either way, I don't feel right...

Awful to hear this but glad you and your friend are safe.

 

[Short Corner]

Let me answer the question of balconies/open windows in Vegas. Most Vegas hotel rooms don't have balconies or windows that open.   I was always told that this was to prevent prevent people from committing suicide.  This is a city that is built on drinking, gambling, adult entertainment..etc--which can all be fun things--but they also can be things that trigger negative emotional responses from many.  Some of the higher end hotel rooms or hotels that were converted residences might have balconies or windows that open--but most do not.   A room from the 30th+ floor at the Mandalay would most likely not have a window that opens.  My guess is that he shot the window out.   

Everyone who's seen The Hangover knows this.

 

[culdeus]

I'll defer to DW here. If you're able to procure a conversion kit (which most places reportedly require an ATF form 4 to purchase), or have machining/welding skills it can be easier for some weapons. I don't claim to be an expert in this particular area, just going off what more knowledgable folks than I (one being a gunsmith) have explained to me. That said, I imagine it varies greatly by rifle design. Older weapons are reportedly MUCH easier to mod than newer ones, generally speaking. 

Modding your stuff is stupid, unless you get some trash romanian AK for 200 bucks at a gunshow to mess around with.  Everyone I know that tried this ended up with scrap

Makes the thing impossible to sell and if it ####s up and you take it to a gunsmith you could wind up in jail. 

That is if you care about such things.  

 

[jvdesigns2002]

Everyone who's seen The Hangover knows this.

I never saw the first hangover movie.   I saw the second one though.  Just seemed like a lot of members were unaware of how windows/balconies work earlier in the thread. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

Yes I could see how that would work and go unnoticed.

You can wheel anything through and go unnoticed. So many trade shows there that people are always wheeling various objects, cases, boxes, etc. 

 

[culdeus]

death toll at 70

 

[beer 30]

Example of a Soviet LMG that Culdeus is saying may have been the primary weapon. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VL7lDzV7tY

Doesn't seem like a very easy weapon to shoulder fire from standing position although spraying a crowd probably doesn't call for much accuracy. This soldier is bump firing but can't imagine a guy standing up to do that.

 

[El Floppo]

Why?   What is wrong with these people?

this is my underlying question too... and I'm pretty sure the answer is going to be completely underwhelming relative to the massive casualties. he got laid off. he got dumped. he had a bad day/week/year. something every one of us has probably experienced... and dealt with in a way that didn't hurt anybody else.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

No.

Keep your bolt action hunting rifles, pump action shot guns and pistols with reasonable sized mags (less than 15 shots). Protect your home, hunt if you'd like, go to the range and shoot for sport.

There's no reason for anyone to own a weapon capable of causing this kind of damage. None. It's not what the founding fathers intended and our understanding  of the 2nd amendment can evolve just like others have.

I'm not a political person. I've never voted in my entire life. Several members of my family hunt and a few of them have open carry licenses. I'm ok with all that. Let's just stop giving lunatics the tools to commit mass murder.  I'll wait to see what guns this guy had before fully passing judgement but the videos seem to indicate that was firing way more rounds than a civilian should be allowed to fire.

Sorry if you feel that infringes on your rights to hunt or protect your land. 

 

[urbanhack]

death toll at 70

####

:(

 

[culdeus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VL7lDzV7tY

Doesn't seem like a very easy weapon to shoulder fire from standing position although spraying a crowd probably doesn't call for much accuracy. This soldier is bump firing but can't imagine a guy standing up to do that.

What makes you think he was standing?  

 

[Tony Jabroni]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VL7lDzV7tY

Doesn't seem like a very easy weapon to shoulder fire from standing position although spraying a crowd probably doesn't call for much accuracy. This soldier is bump firing but can't imagine a guy standing up to do that.

He had 2 platforms set up in the room. Perhaps he used that option? IDK.

 

[bud29]

death toll at 70

holy ####

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Simply horrific.

 

[Tiger Fan]

maybe missed it, but have they said anything about the female companion yet?  As in, have they released any info on what she said?

 

[Joe Bryant]

This is obviously a heartbreaking tragedy. Please please please be cool to each other in this and keep the back and forth jabs at each other to a minimum. There won't be a lot of warnings. If you can't be cool to each other, please don't post. 

 

[beer 30]

What makes you think he was standing?  

Nothing, my current updates about the situation are coming from this thread.

He had 2 platforms set up in the room. Perhaps he used that option? IDK.

There you go, what I figured but hadn't heard he had firing positions set up. If he was at the hotel since the 28th this was a long, well planned event.

 

[culdeus]

Gonna be a race to a triple digits for the next guy. First person to kill 100 in US. Big title there for the taking. These people are f###ing losers.

I remember when someone did some analysis on the hook/club/movie thing and said 100 wasn't really possible, that you should be tackled by someone or your gun situation breaks down before then.

Don't think they thought about something like this being possible.  

 

[fantasycurse42]

I'm numb to this stuff at this point... Honestly, it feels like it has been a while - I remember the Orlando shooting and Xmas shooting in California. Sadly, I basically expect something like this once every 6-12 months, while obviously hoping against. 

These shootings used to illicit feelings of anger from me towards gun activists, and while I still have some of those feelings, I don't have the energy to argue about it anymore, as it is unfortunately a "what's the point?" argument. Nothing will ever change with guns in this country, sadly, it is what it is.  

At the end of the day, all I can do is say a prayer for the dead/injured and hope the shooter spends eternity in a fire laden pit. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

Today show just stated that within last month the university trauma center had a person from the trauma center for the pulse nightclub shooting there to give them tips on how to handle situations like this. Things they learned, what worked, what didnt, etc. That might have saved some lives.  

 

[Tony Jabroni]

maybe missed it, but have they said anything about the female companion yet?  As in, have they released any info on what she said?

Out of the country. Contact has been made. It appears she is in the clear according to the Sheriff's presser. We shall see.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I remember when someone did some analysis on the hook/club/movie thing and said 100 wasn't really possible, that you should be tackled by someone or your gun situation breaks down before then.

Don't think they thought about something like this being possible.  

This was exactly my reaction when I first saw this story when I got up -- how did somebody get that many rounds off without being tackled?  Then I realized he was a block away in a hotel room.  

 

[honky kong]

So in your mind taking away the right to own guns would have prevented this?  Damn I really hate gun grabbers when they try to use these incidents as agenda firebrands.  Just disgusting.

It's not an "agenda firebrand" it's a person outraged about the incident trying to figure out how to stop these, just like people who want to ban refugees and Middle East immigrants (which we constantly hear after other acts of terrorism.) 

I'm wondering when it is ok to talk about this stuff. After everyone has moved on and forgot about it?

 

[KarmaPolice]

For most people with mental illness in our country, their very fist interaction with the state is through the police due to a criminal event.  I saw the chief of police for my city speaking recently, and he said the majority of the work his guys do, more than anything else, is dealing with mental illness in our community. 

I think focusing  this and gun control would be an excellent start, but sadly this country doesn't seem overly interested in either. 

T&P to victims and family. 

 

[whoknew]

maybe missed it, but have they said anything about the female companion yet?  As in, have they released any info on what she said?

According to the news conference this morning, they found her but at this time do not believe she was involved. It looks like he was using some of her info (like debit cards).

 

[ShamrockPride]

My question is how did nobody phone this guy in? None of the rooms next to him, none of the rooms down this hall in the hotel did anything? This must have been loud as hell in a hotel. Surely they weren't all empty.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Out of the country. Contact has been made. It appears she is in the clear according to the Sheriff's presser. We shall see.

They should stop putting her photo and name on the TV. If she is clear, that is not fair to her. Irresponsible. 

 

[whiskey7]

Beyond horrible  :(

 

[parasaurolophus]

My question is how did nobody phone this guy in? None of the rooms next to him, none of the rooms down this hall in the hotel did anything? This must have been loud as hell in a hotel. Surely they weren't all empty.

Probably for the same reason the music kept playing for a while. Nobody really knew at first. I am sure calls eventually came in. 

 

[Tony Jabroni]

My question is how did nobody phone this guy in? None of the rooms next to him, none of the rooms down this hall in the hotel did anything? This must have been loud as hell in a hotel. Surely they weren't all empty.

The police got to him within 20 minutes due to the smoke alarm going off in his room.

 

[Uwe Blab]

So i wonder what was with all the reports of some lady at the concert beforehand saying "you are all gonna die here...."  Figured the companion was in it as well, but now not even in town?  These side reports as things unfold are bizarre. So I wonder if that lady was just some random Las Vegas crazy?

 

[parasaurolophus]

seeing citizens using metal grate stanchions as stretchers carrying wounded away is a burning and somewhat beautiful image. what an awful situation. 

 

[eoMMan]

So in your mind taking away the right to own guns would have prevented this?  Damn I really hate gun grabbers when they try to use these incidents as agenda firebrands.  Just disgusting.

I definitely don't think all guns should be illegal but we definitely need to review all of our current gun rules/regulations.  For example, maybe more regulations in place in regards to who exactly should own these high powered weapons that can shoot many rounds in seconds (if anyone), background checks, mental illness history, etc etc.

To simply disregard our current gun laws/regulations and dismiss this as "Oh well, the guns themselves didn't do this" is ridiculous. 

Something needs to change.

 

[parasaurolophus]

So i wonder what was with all the reports of some lady at the concert beforehand saying "you are all gonna die here...."  Figured the companion was in it as well, but now not even in town?  These side reports as things unfold are bizarre. So I wonder if that lady was just some random Las Vegas crazy?

They had a woman on earlier, a local reporter i believe who was at concert, and she said the number of crazy things they heard was off the charts. Bombers at bellagio, strip wide violence, etc etc. Games of telephone during crisis most likely explanation. 

 

[Tony Jabroni]

ISIS claiming responsibilty. Fox News speculating Paddock converted to Islam months ago. Passing it along.

 

[PIK95]

Read elsewhere that it's multiple shooters multiple locations and Muslim. I hope that's not true at all. I hope it's just one dip#### that's now dead. I guess I'll know more in the morning. Holy hell

I just read this.  Where did you see that that report you read out of curiosity?

 

[El Floppo]

death toll at 70

####

:(

:(

 

[culdeus]

My question is how did nobody phone this guy in? None of the rooms next to him, none of the rooms down this hall in the hotel did anything? This must have been loud as hell in a hotel. Surely they weren't all empty.

The guy in the very next room called the front desk right away.  

 

[Courtjester]

ISIS claiming responsibilty. Fox News speculating Haddock converted to Islam months ago. Passing it along.

I just saw that reported as well. It just seems so far fetched---especially after seeing the interview with his brother

 

[Mile High]

ISIS claiming responsibilty. Fox News speculating Paddock converted to Islam months ago. Passing it along.

Just heard this to.

 

[ShamrockPride]

ISIS claiming responsibilty. Fox News speculating Paddock converted to Islam months ago. Passing it along.

Lol okay. Blood sucking leeches those guys. Trolls.

 

[GoBirds]

ISIS claiming responsibilty. Fox News speculating Paddock converted to Islam months ago. Passing it along.

Wow.