Christian counselor is trying to get fiancee to leave me because I'm a Non-believer (1 Viewer)

[matuski]

Evangelizing to non believers. Raising the Children to believe Christianity. Going on missions trips. Praying together. Tithing. 

I could go on. An actively religious person (Christian or Jewish or Muslim) could have vastly different money and time priorities, not to mention how they want to raise the children. I’m not sure why this is hard to believe. 

Any two people can have vastly different money and time priorities, and differences on raising children.  It isn't hard to believe at all, but largely nothing to do with religious people and non religious people being unable to share values.  Certainly nothing to do with holding "opposite" values.

Raising kids to believe.. mine are/do, don't see an issue there?

Never met a person that went on missions outside of mormons.. so meh?  My kids go to Christian camps every summer, if they want to go on missions... cool.  I was very active in Young Life growing up, was awesome.

I've "prayed" with my wife and family and friends hundreds, probably thousands of times. 

Evangelizing.. fair enough.  Really though, who does that anymore?  Seems a dying breed.

 

[mr roboto]

Any two people can have vastly different money and time priorities, and differences on raising children.  It isn't hard to believe at all, but largely nothing to do with religious people and non religious people being unable to share values.  Certainly nothing to do with holding "opposite" values.

Raising kids to believe.. mine are/do, don't see an issue there?

Never met a person that went on missions outside of mormons.. so meh?  My kids go to Christian camps every summer, if they want to go on missions... cool.  I was very active in Young Life growing up, was awesome.

I've "prayed" with my wife and family and friends hundreds, probably thousands of times. 

Evangelizing.. fair enough.  Really though, who does that anymore?  Seems a dying breed.

I believe you would probably be an exception to the rule. Maybe I’m wrong. 

Does your (assuming believer) wife mind that you aren’t on the same page?  Does she know you’re an atheist?

 

[Captain Cranks]

Religion:  Unnecessarily dividing people since the beginning of mankind.  

 

[Bonzai]

Neal Brennan has a great bit on religion.  Basically, if you're at a Jay-Z concert, most people there only know the hits.  99 Problems, Big Pimpin', the Annie song, maybe a few others.  But there's a guy here and there that knows every ###### song.  In the aisle bopping around, rapping every lyric, doing all the hand motions and ####.  Most people that "follow" a religion are like the people that just know the hits.  Maybe they can name all ten commandments. Probably not.  The super fans are the ones flying planes into buildings.  And there's folks in between of course.

For those that just know the hits, religion likely isn't going to get in the way of loving someone.  For the super fans, probably so.

 

[matuski]

I believe you would probably be an exception to the rule. Maybe I’m wrong. 

Does your (assuming believer) wife mind that you aren’t on the same page?  Does she know you’re an atheist?

Of course she does (although I have never really identified with that label).  She can get a little uncomfortable when our friends (or more specifically her family) become curious about my position.. I do answer bluntly.

I don't think I would be the exception to the rule.  Any "atheist" in this country has grown up in and around Christians their whole lives.  Family, friends, the masses.  Your connection with other human beings is based on much more important shared experiences and demonstrated qualities:

How you treat people, honesty, family, happiness, integrity, work ethic, humor.... etc, etc, etc.

I haven't found it hard to find people of any background that share most or all of the "values" I value.  I don't care at all if you credit a god for yours, I care that you live them.  In practice, I have found I get to know someone pretty well before religious beliefs even come up.  

 

[Buckychudd]

Neal Brennan has a great bit on religion.  Basically, if you're at a Jay-Z concert, most people there only know the hits.  99 Problems, Big Pimpin', the Annie song, maybe a few others.  But there's a guy here and there that knows every ###### song.  In the aisle bopping around, rapping every lyric, doing all the hand motions and ####.  Most people that "follow" a religion are like the people that just know the hits.  Maybe they can name all ten commandments. Probably not.  The super fans are the ones flying planes into buildings.  And there's folks in between of course.

For those that just know the hits, religion likely isn't going to get in the way of loving someone.  For the super fans, probably so.

I love this analogy.

 

[matuski]

Neal Brennan has a great bit on religion.  Basically, if you're at a Jay-Z concert, most people there only know the hits.  99 Problems, Big Pimpin', the Annie song, maybe a few others.  But there's a guy here and there that knows every ###### song.  In the aisle bopping around, rapping every lyric, doing all the hand motions and ####.  Most people that "follow" a religion are like the people that just know the hits.  Maybe they can name all ten commandments. Probably not.  The super fans are the ones flying planes into buildings.  And there's folks in between of course.

For those that just know the hits, religion likely isn't going to get in the way of loving someone.  For the super fans, probably so.

Awesome.

I would still say it is a underlying character flaw that leads to overdoing/abusing religion.  Bad people abusing religion, not religion making them bad.  The super fandom is a symptom of the flaw, not the flaw.

 

[culdeus]

So you just lied?

Well I didn't kill the goat till after. 

 

[Jayrod]

"Religion that God our Father considers pure and faultless is this, look after orphans and widows in their distress and keep oneself from being polluted by the world."

 

[Bonzai]

Awesome.

I would still say it is a underlying character flaw that leads to overdoing/abusing religion.  Bad people abusing religion, not religion making them bad.  The super fandom is a symptom of the flaw, not the flaw.

Right.  Jay-Z doesn't make that superfan a doosh.  He was who he was before he got there.

 

[matuski]

Right.  Jay-Z doesn't make that superfan a doosh.  He was who he was before he got there.

Either love me, or leave me alone.

 

[matuski]

"Religion that God our Father considers pure and faultless is this, look after orphans and widows in their distress and keep oneself from being polluted by the world."

What an awful quote.

 

[Bonzai]

Either love me, or leave me alone.

Oh, the irony.

 

[Shula-holic]

My wife is Catholic, and I am Presbyterian.  We had to go to those classes that couples have to take in order to get married in the Catholic church.  It was fairly brutal and we (meaning me) were pointed out a number of times as being "challenged" being of mixed religion.  In our private session with the priest/counselor he looked her straight in the eyes and told her that she shouldn't marry me, that I was not of her faith, and I was too selfish (being almost 30 and never married - and whatever those personality tests show).  What a ####.  

I was like "hey, I'm sittin' right here father!"  Luckily my wife just laughed and said she thought we were right for each other.  Of course, I had to sign papers that we would raise our kids Catholic in order to get married in the Catholic church.

We have raised our kids Catholic, and educated them in Catholic schools.  Thirty-one years later - here we are.  Sit on it father!!

Man this sounds exactly like what happened with my wife and me.  She is Catholic and I was raised some mix of Methodist and Baptist.  I'm not sure why we had the meeting, maybe it's to have our marriage recognized or something, but we didn't get married in the church.  We got married by a Methodist pastor at our house.  We did have the meetings with another parent before our first child.  It was a little comical of a lady telling my wife who is an elementary school teacher about kids.  But I also grew up in a pretty devout Baptist church so I really just was like whatever and didn't let it bother me.  Both of my daughters had baptisms in the Catholic church and go there.

But to the original poster's situation, I think like others stated it depends how devout she is.  While my wife and I are both believers, we aren't either one in lock step agreement with certain church positions.  So for us, we can understand or adapt to the other's views some.  For other people, they may be extremely devout and have very little room there for a significant other who feels any different from them.

 

[Jayrod]

What an awful quote.

It is James 1:27

 

[matuski]

It is James 1:27

Exactly.

 

[Jayrod]

Exactly.

So what is awful about it?

 

[matuski]

So what is awful about it?

That is the trap.  Don't want to go down that rabbit hole.. irrelevant.

Citing bible passages is always productive in these threads (or ever for that matter)....

 

[Sinn Fein]

Right.. I didn't encounter this 15 years ago.

eta - little jealous.. would have been a huge help to us imo.

That seems odd.  Unless I am misunderstanding something.

Its a pretty big deal in the Catholic church.  We got married 23 years ago - we were living in Atlanta at the time, but both our families were in Virginia - so we opted to get married in Virginia.  We went to my parent's parish, and the priest there was really not a big fan of Catholics marrying non-Catholics - and my wife did not really like him, so we ended up using the priest of my best-man's parish.  He was fine with the wedding - but we had to meet with him a few times - and promise to raise the kids catholic, and all that.

 

[Gally]

Religion:  Unnecessarily dividing people since the beginning of mankind.  

If your fiancée holds her religious beliefs strongly in any way then this type of dismissiveness will eventually lead to problems.  Maybe that is the point the counselor was trying to get to by pressing her to see how important her beliefs were to her. 

 

[Captain Cranks]

If your fiancée holds her religious beliefs strongly in any way then this type of dismissiveness will eventually lead to problems.  Maybe that is the point the counselor was trying to get to by pressing her to see how important her beliefs were to her. 

Whether the Christians of today want to admit it or not, they've all performed some form of mental gymnastics to rationalize not living by many of the rules in the Bible.  Beyond marriage, the Bible teaches that Christians shouldn't have close friendships with non-Christians, or even fraternize with non-believers like some of you on this board are doing right now.  In the same way that Christians in today's society find some of the rules irrelevant in today's world, my fiancee finds friending and marrying non-Christians to be a rule she can disregard while still maintaining her faith.  It's not your or the counselor's right to judge whether that signifies how important her beliefs are.  At the end of the day, most Christians, beyond fundamentalists, are "Cafeteria Christians."     

 

[Gally]

Whether the Christians of today want to admit it or not, they've all performed some form of mental gymnastics to rationalize not living by the many of the rules in the Bible.  Beyond marriage, the Bible teaches that Christians shouldn't have close friendships with non-Christians, or even fraternize with non-believers like some of you on this board are doing right now.  In the same way that Christians in today's society find some of the rules irrelevant in today's world, my fiancee finds friending and marrying non-Christians to be a rule she can disregard while still maintaining her faith.  It's not your or the counselor's right to judge whether that signifies how important her beliefs are.  At the end of the day, most Christians, beyond fundamentalists, are "Cafeteria Christians."     

None of what I said has anything to do with how Christians live there life.  I am not judging her beliefs in any way.  I am not saying Christians do or do not follow some, all, or any of the rules in the bible.  I am simply stating that the point of pre-marriage counseling is to be truthful to yourself and to figure out if certain things about your possible marriage partner are important or not.   You seem to be very dismissive of religion in general from the comments you have made in this thread.  Maybe you don't say these to your fiancée or maybe you do.  My only point is that if religion is important to your fiancée (I have no idea and don't really care one way or another) and you are dismissive of it that it likely will be a significant issue between you to in the future.  If she doesn't care then it probably won't be an issue.  My only comment is that she (and you) probably need to figure out if it is a big deal or not before you move forward.  I believe that is what the counselor was trying to get your fiancée to do (find out how important religion is to her) and since she got so upset about the questions then maybe it is something she needs to look inward to see why it was so upsetting. 

Bottom line for me is that I don't know anything about either of you other than what is in this thread.  I am just being a devils advocate to why the counselor may have done what she did.  I have no idea if I am right or not.  I am just trying to give you some food for thought that you can do what you want with.  Just trying to give a different perspective.  I wish you luck and hope it all works out for the best with whichever outcome happens. 

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

That is the trap.  Don't want to go down that rabbit hole.. irrelevant.

Citing bible passages is always productive in these threads (or ever for that matter)....

Then why are you even in a thread clearly about religion and commenting on the quote in the first place?

 

[El Floppo]

If that's necessary, then immaturity might be the issue, rather than living/not living together.  Living together isn't the necessary thing.  Sufficient knowlege about, and respect for, the other person is more important.  I knew Mr R for about ten years before we started dating.  We were already best friends.  Living together really didn't change anything.

Actually, the thing that told me we were okay together is when we both had the Martian Death Flu, back in around 1996.  If your partner isn't annoying under those circumstances, he likely won't ever be.

it's an example, not the bottom line. and of course maturity is relevant for a healthy relationship. 

and like I said- lots do it without living together and are just fine... or at least haven't gotten divorced yet. 

but honestly- the benefits far outweigh any negatives (aside from a biblical/religious "reason", I don't see any negatives tbh). and while I'm glad it worked out for you, I've seen enough examples and lived it first hand where living together highlighted/tested issues in the relationship that having the freedom to go to separate homes didn't. 

and yeah- getting sick at the same time might be the best possible test of the strength of a relationship- both people at their most miserable, selfish worst... at the same time. should be a requirement for pre-marriage prep. and lol- my wife probably would've left me on the spot if that had happened for us- I'm the wimpiest most useless sick person around. were you guys married already, or were going to different homes every night during that?

 

[culdeus]

Am I the only one that thinks marriage is not where you need counseling.  People should seek it after a few years and before kids.  

If you divorce without kids who cares anymore?  Most try to overlook obvious issues and have kids thinking they will vanish.  

 

[Captain Cranks]

None of what I said has anything to do with how Christians live there life.  I am not judging her beliefs in any way.  I am not saying Christians do or do not follow some, all, or any of the rules in the bible.  I am simply stating that the point of pre-marriage counseling is to be truthful to yourself and to figure out if certain things about your possible marriage partner are important or not.   You seem to be very dismissive of religion in general from the comments you have made in this thread.  Maybe you don't say these to your fiancée or maybe you do.  My only point is that if religion is important to your fiancée (I have no idea and don't really care one way or another) and you are dismissive of it that it likely will be a significant issue between you to in the future.  If she doesn't care then it probably won't be an issue.  My only comment is that she (and you) probably need to figure out if it is a big deal or not before you move forward.  I believe that is what the counselor was trying to get your fiancée to do (find out how important religion is to her) and since she got so upset about the questions then maybe it is something she needs to look inward to see why it was so upsetting. 

Bottom line for me is that I don't know anything about either of you other than what is in this thread.  I am just being a devils advocate to why the counselor may have done what she did.  I have no idea if I am right or not.  I am just trying to give you some food for thought that you can do what you want with.  Just trying to give a different perspective.  I wish you luck and hope it all works out for the best with whichever outcome happens. 

I appreciate the devil's advocate role you're playing.  It has given me food for thought in understanding the counselor's perspective.  

That said, your previous post was a departure from that role and more of statement of what "will eventually" happen.  You say you don't know if religion is important to my fiancee, yet I've tried to explain what being a Christian means to her in this thread at least a couple of times.  Our difference of religion is NOT an issue for us.  Is there a chance she becomes devout and suddenly things change?  Sure, but knowing what we know about each other I'd put that probability at pretty close to zero.  So, no, even if I internally have a problem with Christianity, it's not going to "eventually lead to problems."  As I've said many times in this thread, I respect my SO's faith and encourage her to have a relationship with God including being a part of her religious path if she'd like me to be.   

While I understand you're trying to justify the counselor's actions, and I don't disagree that this is something that she'd logically bring up as a concern, I firmly believe she overstepped in the following ways:  1.  She isolated my fiancee rather than bring it to us as couple.  2.  She didn't just provide food for thought; per my SO, she pressed her to think differently than she would.  3.  She used a derogatory term to label someone who would stay with a non-believer.  

So my response to you as an extension of the counselor in this thread is, 1.  We're fine...our difference of religion isn't an issue so quit trying to make it one and 2.  If you're going to judge someone for disregarding rules in the Bible as a Cafeteria Christian, take a look in the mirror and keep it out of your practice.  

P.S.  One important element that perhaps will change your perspective is at the beginning of the program, the counselor asked us which therapy path we wanted to go down:  1.  The 'Should we be together' path where couples decide if there's anything to the relationship or it should just end,  2. Pre-marital counseling, or 3. EFT which seeks to bring a deeper emotional connection between couples who know they want to be together.  We chose 3.  The individual sessions were part of 3.  However the counselor used a good bit of that time to work on 1.  

 

[jonessed]

Am I the only one that thinks marriage is not where you need counseling.  People should seek it after a few years and before kids.  

If you divorce without kids who cares anymore?  Most try to overlook obvious issues and have kids thinking they will vanish.  

Probably.

 

[Gally]

I appreciate the devil's advocate role you're playing.  It has given me food for thought in understanding the counselor's perspective.  

That said, your previous post was a departure from that role and more of statement of what "will eventually" happen.  You say you don't know if religion is important to my fiancee, yet I've tried to explain what being a Christian means to her in this thread at least a couple of times.  Our difference of religion is NOT an issue for us.  Is there a chance she becomes devout and suddenly things change?  Sure, but knowing what we know about each other I'd put that probability at pretty close to zero.  So, no, even if I internally have a problem with Christianity, it's not going to "eventually lead to problems."  As I've said many times in this thread, I respect my SO's faith and encourage her to have a relationship with God including being a part of her religious path if she'd like me to be.   

While I understand you're trying to justify the counselor's actions, and I don't disagree that this is something that she'd logically bring up as a concern, I firmly believe she overstepped in the following ways:  1.  She isolated my fiancee rather than bring it to us as couple.  2.  She didn't just provide food for thought; per my SO, she pressed her to think differently than she would.  3.  She used a derogatory term to label someone who would stay with a non-believer.  

So my response to you as an extension of the counselor in this thread is, 1.  We're fine...our difference of religion isn't an issue so quit trying to make it one and 2.  If you're going to judge someone for disregarding rules in the Bible as a Cafeteria Christian, take a look in the mirror and keep it out of your practice.  

P.S.  One important element that perhaps will change your perspective is at the beginning of the program, the counselor asked us which therapy path we wanted to go down:  1.  The 'Should we be together' path where couples decide if there's anything to the relationship or it should just end,  2. Pre-marital counseling, or 3. EFT which seeks to bring a deeper emotional connection between couples who know they want to be together.  We chose 3.  The individual sessions were part of 3.  However the counselor used a good bit of that time to work on 1.  

Sounds like you have thought about things which is a good thing. Like I said I don't know either of you so I was just giving a different perspective. 

However, I really don't think having individual sessions is sinister.  It is a very good way to see if each individual will open up more without the significant other there to judge/use later/etc.  Since you aren't religious I could see where it would make sense to bring religion up to the more religious person alone to possibly get a more honest answer as to how she really felt.  I really don't think the "isolation" is negative or over the line and it makes me curious why you are so against having individual sessions as part of the total counseling experience. 

As for the #2 reason, the counselor is supposed to press you to think differently at times.  Maybe there is something she didn't realize or a different perspective she didn't even think about.  A good counselor will push you to think differently and reassess your beliefs so that you can be satisfied that you have thought about all aspects of a situation.  This will lead you to being more confident in your belief because you have exhausted all sides of the situation.  This again is not necessarily a bad thing.  However, using derogatory terms should never happen and that would be over the line in any instance and does erode any trust that may have been built up. 

 

[Captain Cranks]

However, I really don't think having individual sessions is sinister.  It is a very good way to see if each individual will open up more without the significant other there to judge/use later/etc.  Since you aren't religious I could see where it would make sense to bring religion up to the more religious person alone to possibly get a more honest answer as to how she really felt.  I really don't think the "isolation" is negative or over the line and it makes me curious why you are so against having individual sessions as part of the total counseling experience. 

I'm not against the individual sessions.  They're a necessary part of the program as the counselor needs to understand our individual pasts and how that might be impacting our relationship.  I guess I object to the targeting of this one issue in that setting; not once, but twice.  And when the counselor didn't get the answer she was hoping for, began using guilt mechanisms (How do you think God would feel about that.  Those who disregard God's desires could be considered Cafeteria Christians).  I think your point about the counselor's role on pressing what one believes has some validity.  I just feel the tact was poor.  Had she mentioned the Bible verses, given my fiancee a week to think about them, followed up the next week and said, "ok, I just wanted to provide you with that perspective as it could create difficulties for you in the future," we'd be fine with that.  But that's not how it went down.  She didn't get the answer she liked, used seemingly guilt-ridden tactics to get my SO to rethink her stance, and not once did she mention this concern to me.  Rather than a counselor who's being paid to bring us closer together, she acted as a judgmental friend who wants her buddy to leave a non-Christian.  

 

[matuski]

Then why are you even in a thread clearly about religion and commenting on the quote in the first place?

My discussion was about values, and whether religion has exclusive claims to any of them.

 Bringing the bible into it really has no bearing.

You are right, I should have ignored it.

 

[ChainsawU]

You are right, I should have ignored it.

I still haven't made a decision on God/religion/all that stuff. Buddhism or whatever. Still undecided. I'm unsure of the quote's context and why it was used, but I didn't think it was that bad. I kinda liked it, actually. It kinda sounded like "a helping hand to the innocent+unfortunate can be rewarding" and "stay strong out there - the world is full of complicated, dangerous ideas." I thought the quote itself was cool but didn't understand why it was used. I agree with you that random bible quotes are annoying af though.

 

[Mrs. Rannous]

Not following I was forced to do it for my fake presby wife family church. 

I meant the goat sacrifice and blood drinking.  We did not do that.  That just never came up.

 

[Mrs. Rannous]

Never met a person that went on missions outside of mormons..

I guess you don't know many Southern Baptists or evangelicals.  My Baptist next-door neighbor went on a mission to Paris, France.  We tried to imagine how he was going to convince French people not to dance or drink.  We just couldn't wrap our heads around it.

 

[Mrs. Rannous]

and yeah- getting sick at the same time might be the best possible test of the strength of a relationship- both people at their most miserable, selfish worst... at the same time. should be a requirement for pre-marriage prep. and lol- my wife probably would've left me on the spot if that had happened for us- I'm the wimpiest most useless sick person around. were you guys married already, or were going to different homes every night during that?

We weren't even engaged at that point.  We were just very, very sick and miserable.  Amazingly, it was comforting to have him around, even if he was a feverish wreck.  Usualy, people are just annoying when one is sick.  But I couldn't go home during that.  I would have spread a very nasty germ to other household members.  We just stuck it out at his apartment for two weeks.  

It really isn't the living/not living together that matters, so much as what you do with the time together.  (Keep it clean, folks!)

 

[Captain Cranks]

Neal Brennan has a great bit on religion.  Basically, if you're at a Jay-Z concert, most people there only know the hits.  99 Problems, Big Pimpin', the Annie song, maybe a few others.  But there's a guy here and there that knows every ###### song.  In the aisle bopping around, rapping every lyric, doing all the hand motions and ####.  Most people that "follow" a religion are like the people that just know the hits.  Maybe they can name all ten commandments. Probably not.  The super fans are the ones flying planes into buildings.  And there's folks in between of course.

For those that just know the hits, religion likely isn't going to get in the way of loving someone.  For the super fans, probably so.

To piggy-back on this analogy, my fiancee knows one or two Jay-Z songs.  Some in here are like, "OMG, that's going to cause issues for you in the future since you don't like Jay-Z."  Meanwhile, my counselor is like, "OMG, you're not a real fan of Jay-Z like I am.  Leave your fiancee so you can become one of his biggest fans."  

 

[El Floppo]

To piggy-back on this analogy, my fiancee knows one or two Jay-Z songs.  Some in here are like, "OMG, that's going to cause issues for you in the future since you don't like Jay-Z."  Meanwhile, my counselor is like, "OMG, you're not a real fan of Jay-Z like I am.  Leave your fiancee so you can become one of his biggest fans."  

But what if you really like Beyonce?

 

[That one guy]

But what if you really like Beyonce?

We may think we are, but none of us are ready for that jelly...the constant look of confusion on Jay’s face says he wasn’t either

 

[BobbyLayne]

So what is awful about it?

That is the trap.  Don't want to go down that rabbit hole.. irrelevant.

Citing bible passages is always productive in these threads (or ever for that matter)....

I have to agree with matuski here. I mean, I’m a Jesus follower & view the Bible as the word of God. But when your go to response to a non-believer is “the Bible says”, man that just shuts the conversation down.

We shouldn’t be afraid of having conversations with people. Even when someone is 180 out from us, they’ve likely had a different life experience than your own which informs their thinking. Which means we all have something to learn from one another.

 

[matuski]

I have to agree with matuski here. I mean, I’m a Jesus follower & view the Bible as the word of God. But when your go to response to a non-believer is “the Bible says”, man that just shuts the conversation down.

We shouldn’t be afraid of having conversations with people. Even when someone is 180 out from us, they’ve likely had a different life experience than your own which informs their thinking. Which means we all have something to learn from one another.

Thank you @BobbyLayne

A lesson I struggle to remember myself.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

Regardless of what you think of religion in general, the counselor has no business marketing herself as an EFT therapist if she's pulling that stuff in the first individual sessions. Unless the couple is explicitly on-board with discernment therapy, the counselor needs to be on the relationship's side.  

 

[Captain Cranks]

Regardless of what you think of religion in general, the counselor has no business marketing herself as an EFT therapist if she's pulling that stuff in the first individual sessions. Unless the couple is explicitly on-board with discernment therapy, the counselor needs to be on the relationship's side.  

You seem to know a thing or two about this.  Are you in the profession?  Also, you say "first" individual sessions.  Does that mean there are more to come?  

 

[dgreen]

Update? Have you been back? Did you ask the counselor about it?

 

[Captain Cranks]

Update? Have you been back? Did you ask the counselor about it?

Thanks for asking.  I sent her this email: 

Counselor,

After last week’s sessions, XXXXXX and I got together to discuss our respective meetings.  To my surprise, XXXXX wasn’t happy and told me she didn’t want to return.  After hearing some of the things that were said during her sessions, it was clear why she felt this way. 

During our second couple’s session, we agreed to move forward with the EFT program.  It was our understanding that this program would help bring us closer together by improving our communication and understanding of ourselves and each other.  However, it sounds like you’ve used at least a large portion of the individual sessions for discernment therapy.  Rather than counsel the couple in order to foster closeness, it appears as though you’re steering XXXXXX to leave me because of our religious differences.  I understand that this is a valid point to bring up in discernment therapy, but it seems outside the scope of services that you’re being paid to provide under EFT. 

Also, I was shocked to hear the use of the derogatory term “Cafeteria Christian.”  We feel it’s demeaning and judgmental; neither quality we expect from someone in your position.  I would encourage you to reconsider the use of that term in your practice going forward.

That said, we would still like to continue moving forward with the EFT program.  I feel as though we can accomplish our goal through your guidance as you’ve shown the potential to help us during our group sessions.  However, we would need to be assured that we stick to the EFT program and that bringing our relationship closer together is the goal.  If this is not something you can commit to because of your religious views, we understand.  We do hope that we can put this past us and get back to bringing XXXXXXX and I closer together.

Thanks,

After a day, she responded with:

XXXXXX,

Thank you for your email letting me know your concerns about the individual sessions. I appreciate your honesty. Hearing that it is your desire to move forward and continue therapy with me, I am glad to see the alliance has not been breached as the therapeutic alliance is 40% of the effectiveness in therapy. So, to answer your question, we can move forward and continue with EFT.

Would it be possible, however, to move your upcoming conjoint session to Thursday the 14th at 1:30pm as I need to reschedule my appointments on the 12th? If not, I have Tuesday, February 19, at 1:30pm or Wednesday, the 20th, at 11am still available at this time.

Again, thank you for your email and I look forward to hearing back from you.

Her response seemed to gloss right over the offenses.  Our next session back is next Tuesday.  It will be interesting to see how the first 5 minutes goes.  I'll report back.  

 

[El Floppo]

a- yeah, doesn't even comment on or address what your issue was even in passing.

b- your lady has an equal parts goofy/sexy name. how do you pronounce XXXXXX? I'm thinking with an emphasis on the first part.

 

[Captain Cranks]

a- yeah, doesn't even comment on or address what your issue was even in passing.

b- your lady has an equal parts goofy/sexy name. how do you pronounce XXXXXX? I'm thinking with an emphasis on the first part.

Don't know how her parents called it in advance, but she's a freak.  

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

Love the Neal Brennan Jay Z analogy.  That's great.

I "became" an atheist after I married my superfan wife.  It's..sticky.

 

[Captain Cranks]

Love the Neal Brennan Jay Z analogy.  That's great.

I "became" an atheist after I married my superfan wife.  It's..sticky.

Got any anecdotes you'd like to share?

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

Got any anecdotes you'd like to share?

I think your wife is likely different from mine.  But sure..

I live in south Texas.  My whole family is Christian.  I was raised Lutheran and still "believed" when we got married.  My wife's whole family is Christian (Catholic).  Her dad is a deacon.  Of that group only my wife knows I'm an atheist.  We have 2 daughters that are being raised Catholic.  I go to church with them to keep up appearances.  It just feels so weird standing there not saying all the stuff and in my mind thinking all these people are mostly ignorant sheep (admittedly not fair on my part).  My wife laments that she can't pray with her life partner and make religion part of our marriage.  Had I come to this atheist conclusion prior to marriage, I don't think we'd have gotten married.  I don't know that it leads to divorce..not in the cards for now for sure but who knows.  Back to the Jay Z concert analogy, when it comes to religion neither one of us is on the fence so it makes it sticky.

I wish you all the best..don't want my post to come across as a don't do it type of thing.  Every person and every relationship is different.

 

[Captain Cranks]

I think your wife is likely different from mine.  But sure..

I live in south Texas.  My whole family is Christian.  I was raised Lutheran and still "believed" when we got married.  My wife's whole family is Christian (Catholic).  Her dad is a deacon.  Of that group only my wife knows I'm an atheist.  We have 2 daughters that are being raised Catholic.  I go to church with them to keep up appearances.  It just feels so weird standing there not saying all the stuff and in my mind thinking all these people are mostly ignorant sheep (admittedly not fair on my part).  My wife laments that she can't pray with her life partner and make religion part of our marriage.  Had I come to this atheist conclusion prior to marriage, I don't think we'd have gotten married.  I don't know that it leads to divorce..not in the cards for now for sure but who knows.  Back to the Jay Z concert analogy, when it comes to religion neither one of us is on the fence so it makes it sticky.

I wish you all the best..don't want my post to come across as a don't do it type of thing.  Every person and every relationship is different.

Thanks for sharing.  I highly doubt my SO would reach a point where it bothered her that I'm not Christian.  It doesn't bother her now and she's making a conscious decision to move forward despite our differences.  If her faith did become a bigger part of her life I'd try to support it in any way I could.  It sounds like you're doing the same.  

 

[OrtonToOlsen]

Makes sense