Let's Talk Peaceful USA Realignment (2 Viewers)

[Snotbubbles]

Sorry. Florida's closed. The moose out from should have told ya. 

Is there some initiation I need to go through?  I'll sleep with an alligator or whatever Floridians do for fun.

 

[the rover]

When the Big One hits California, they won’t be getting foreign aid from red states

you mean all of the broke states that California supports?  

 

[massraider]

Might be time to log off. Go outside, get some fresh air. 

 

[AAABatteries]

Is there some initiation I need to go through?  I'll sleep with an alligator or whatever Floridians do for fun.

Sleep or “sleep”.

NTTAWWT

 

[AAABatteries]

Wait, yes there is - please don’t have the sechs with an alligator.

 

[RCon]

Wait, yes there is - please don’t have the sechs with an alligator.

I spoke with the alligator.  I've been assured it consents.

 

[dkp993]

Might be time to log off. Go outside, get some fresh air. 

What, you not enjoying all of the we’re gonna starve and we need to split before civil war threads?  

 

[The Commish]

We currently send most of our income taxes to the Fed today. I would think states can still function with a modest income tax say 10 - 15%. 

With things AS IS in this country, look at all the states with the mass amounts of poverty.  Feels like you're missing the reality of a good many states in the union and how much they rely on the federal government and they STILL can't keep large segments of their populations out of poverty.

 

[The Commish]

Yeah, I just got told a couple weeks ago that I don't have to return to office for at least the next school year, if ever.  The equity partner was somewhat vague.  So, I've been looking at Florida.  

We don't have state income tax, which sounds cool until you realize most, if not all, of what you save in state income taxes is going to go directly back into property taxes and property insurance.  Of course, you could move to the area between the panhandle and Jacksonville in the swamps and likely come out ahead, but if you go to any of the large population areas or to the coast in any of the areas, you're likely not going to be saving a ton in taxes overall and in many cases you'll be paying more total.

Harsh reality I learned in our migration here in 2017

 

[massraider]

What, you not enjoying all of the we’re gonna starve and we need to split before civil war threads?  

Things getting bad. Went to the store, only 13 kinds of peanut butter to choose from. 

 

[Philo Beddoe]

With things AS IS in this country, look at all the states with the mass amounts of poverty.  Feels like you're missing the reality of a good many states in the union and how much they rely on the federal government and they STILL can't keep large segments of their populations out of poverty.

Where are these large segments in poverty you mention? Which states and cities? You won’t ever convince me that it is better to send our money to the Fed so they can launder it and send back 30 cents on the dollar.

BTW I live in Massachusetts where we have an income tax and my property tax bill is $12,500 annually on a 2300 sq ft house. You’re probably less than half of that. 

 

[The Commish]

Where are these large segments in poverty you mention? Which states and cities? You won’t ever convince me that it is better to send our money to the Fed so they can launder it and send back 30 cents on the dollar.

BTW I live in Massachusetts where we have an income tax and my property tax bill is $12,500 annually on a 2300 sq ft house. You’re probably less than half of that. 

The entire south east has huge amounts of poverty.  Start with Appalachia and work your way south all the way down to Mississippi.  And I'm not saying shipping our money off to the federal government is the way to go.  Not even close.  I am merely pointing out how reliant some states are on the federal money you want to take away.  They are reliant on it because they can't make up for it in state taxes because the people there make so little.

You can get raw data from the fed site if you choose....here's a good summary article if going direct to the source isn't your thing.

I'm in Florida and mine is $10K in a relatively "rural" area...north of Orlando and West of Daytona.  My homeowner's insurance is over $7K for a year...house is about 3500 sq.

 

[(HULK)]

Things getting bad. Went to the store, only 13 kinds of peanut butter to choose from. 

What is Joe Biden doing about this insane Peanut Butter CrisisTM? Word he Joe knew about this months ago and did nothing, and yet he sends peanut butter to illegals, which is why they keep coming here causing the Border CrisisTM.

 

[(HULK)]

Where are these large segments in poverty you mention? Which states and cities? You won’t ever convince me that it is better to send our money to the Fed so they can launder it and send back 30 cents on the dollar.

BTW I live in Massachusetts where we have an income tax and my property tax bill is $12,500 annually on a 2300 sq ft house. You’re probably less than half of that. 

If you look at total federal taxes collected and then how they're dispersed amongst the states, you'll quickly see that the blue states typically subsidize the red states. That's what several posters are referring to.

 

[Mister CIA]

Feels like this should be a board game.

 

[glvsav37]

I don’t see a problem with the libs on the costs.

Yes!!!....all liberals move to the coasts. Then hopefully in a few years, with the help of global warming, the Red center of the country will become beach front property. 

 

[roadkill1292]

At another board somebody proposed this idea for a thought exercise: your state has been granted the right to leave the union and can take any additional three states with you, as long as the end product has contiguous borders.

That was a fun couple of pages.

 

[-fish-]

Yes!!!....all liberals move to the coasts. Then hopefully in a few years, with the help of global warming, the Red center of the country will become beach front property. 

The property values of walmart, churches and chick fil a will skyrocket!

 

[Sand]

The entire south east has huge amounts of poverty.  Start with Appalachia and work your way south all the way down to Mississippi.  And I'm not saying shipping our money off to the federal government is the way to go.  Not even close.  I am merely pointing out how reliant some states are on the federal money you want to take away.  They are reliant on it because they can't make up for it in state taxes because the people there make so little.

California leads the nation in poverty.

 

[Sand]

You can get raw data from the fed site if you choose....here's a good summary article if going direct to the source isn't your thing.

This is largely a non-sequitur.  These states have a lot of federal dollars due to installations that employ a ton of people.  Alabama has MSFC, New Mexico has Los Alamos, etc.

 

[Shula-holic]

The property values of walmart, churches and chick fil a will skyrocket!

I was looking at a Chick Fil A property with some partners and looking at acquiring a land lease for one.  It's amazing the demand for those things.  Partly because most CFA's are on premium parcels, but what we found is that in most cases your return on these leases was less than fixed income.  The implied ability of CFA to pay their lease was essentially a surety.

 

[FairWarning]

Yes!!!....all liberals move to the coasts. Then hopefully in a few years, with the help of global warming, the Red center of the country will become beach front property. 

I basically have it now, I’m on Lake Michigan.

 

[The Commish]

This is largely a non-sequitur.  These states have a lot of federal dollars due to installations that employ a ton of people.  Alabama has MSFC, New Mexico has Los Alamos, etc.

You can look at the federal site if that's more to your liking.  These are dealing with state budgets, what the citizens pay to the federal government vs what the states receive.  Your factors are addressed in the ratios both on the federal site and the link I provided you.

 

[The Commish]

California leads the nation in poverty.

Right...and this likely gets greatly reduced if they can now charge a higher state tax because residents aren't having to pay federal taxes.  This is NOT an option in most areas in the SE.  I think Florida would be the exception.  We'd likely be able to balance what we get from federal government with a consumption based tax.  This, of course, assumes that travel/vacation was still a major money source for the state.

 

[RCon]

Feels like this should be a board game.

@fatguyinalittlecoat and I already have dibs on the TV series.

 

[ekbeats]

You guys know my thoughts on this.  We’ve passed the Event Horizon.  When Justice becomes politicized, the end isn’t far behind.  I hope the split will be amicable, but I highly doubt it.  “If things didn’t end badly, they wouldn’t end at all.”

 

[E Street Brat]

I was trying to give both Liberaland and Conservistan a fighting chance with access to a coast. Plus those two states both have strong leans already. I almost went with Texas for Conservistan but I was happy to take the opportunity to move the Florida Man meme out of my country.

Hey now. I was close to trending.

 

[kwille]

People who wish cast for this break up garbage are at the root of the problem. We're loud, noisy, and complicated and all the better for it.

 

[(HULK)]

@fatguyinalittlecoat and I already have dibs on the TV series.

If it splits into 13 districts I think you run into IP issues with Suzanne Collins.

 

[Manster]

Who's gonna do all the actual work in the lib states?......not everyone can be cool, starving artists, or techies who work from home.  Oh yea, I forgot, the guaranteed wage will take care of all of it after you take all the rich people's money......oh wait, they will migrate to a conservative state........hmm, sounds like Skyler is gonna have to get his hands dirty.

 

[kwille]

Who's gonna do all the actual work in the lib states?......not everyone can be cool, starving artists, or techies who work from home.  Oh yea, I forgot, the guaranteed wage will take care of all of it after you take all the rich people's money......oh wait, they will move too a conservative state........hmm, sounds like Skyler is gonna have to get his hands dirty.

Do you want this dissolution to happen? Sounds like you and a few others (from all sides) are having some nice fantasy time imagining the suffering of other Americans cut off from the better part of a broken America. I'd like to ask that you all knock it off. 

 

[dozer]

Who's gonna do all the actual work in the lib states?......not everyone can be cool, starving artists, or techies who work from home.  Oh yea, I forgot, the guaranteed wage will take care of all of it after you take all the rich people's money......oh wait, they will migrate to a conservative state........hmm, sounds like Skyler is gonna have to get his hands dirty.

I guarantee I will work you or any man under the table. 
 

Your lack of awareness is an affront to any man who has ever swung a hammer.

If you have trouble driving a nail maybe you should try hitting it with your purse!

 

[massraider]

Do you want this dissolution to happen? Sounds like you and a few others (from all sides) are having some nice fantasy time imagining the suffering of other Americans cut off from the better part of a broken America. I'd like to ask that you all knock it off. 

The coast will be underwater, and we'll have beachfront, haw haw haw. 

4chan fantasy thread here. 

 

[Joe Mammy]

Is there some initiation I need to go through?  I'll sleep with an alligator or whatever Floridians do for fun.

Here you'll only have rocks to throw at Santa.

 

[Mister CIA]

Who's gonna do all the actual work in the lib states?......not everyone can be cool, starving artists, or techies who work from home.  Oh yea, I forgot, the guaranteed wage will take care of all of it after you take all the rich people's money......oh wait, they will migrate to a conservative state........hmm, sounds like Skyler is gonna have to get his hands dirty.

Have you tried marijuana?

 

[ShamrockPride]

Fine with me...as long as Independents get dual citizenship.

 

[dickey moe]

Let the Tenth Amendment sort it out. 

 

[Manster]

I guarantee I will work you or any man under the table. 
 

Your lack of awareness is an affront to any man who has ever swung a hammer.

If you have trouble driving a nail maybe you should try hitting it with your purse!

Lighten up Francis......this is what we do.  We stereotype the other side.

I have no doubt you are a hard worker......but let's be honest, it ain't my boys who are carrying a purse.

 

[Manster]

Have you tried marijuana?

I had my phase in college...ate a lot of Doritos.....played a lot of vids....kind of turned into a fatass

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

I guarantee I will work you or any man under the table. 
 

Your lack of awareness is an affront to any man who has ever swung a hammer.

If you have trouble driving a nail maybe you should try hitting it with your purse!

Lol at the guy obsessing over 1/6 all day every day claims he outwork someone. 
 

Are you making fun of guys that have purses?  How liberal of you.

 

[Manster]

Do you want this dissolution to happen? Sounds like you and a few others (from all sides) are having some nice fantasy time imagining the suffering of other Americans cut off from the better part of a broken America. I'd like to ask that you all knock it off. 

Sometimes I think we'd be better off.  The average Portland lib really has almost nothing in common with the rest of the state.....but they think they know better.....that's the problem 

 

[massraider]

.....but they think they know better....

Everyone thinks they know better. 

Do rural people think Portland libs know better?

If the answer is no, guess what that means?

 

[Manster]

Everyone thinks they know better. 

Do rural people think Portland libs know better?

If the answer is no, guess what that means?

The difference is the rural folks just wanna be left alone.  The Portland lib wants dictate to everyone else...

 

[Nugget]

The difference is the rural folks just wanna be left alone.  The Portland lib wants dictate to everyone else...

What do they want to dictate to you? My rural friends in Kansas and Missouri are able to turn  off the noise. They just fish, drink, and shoot #### in the woods.  And lots of 4 wheelers. 

 

[dozer]

Lol at the guy obsessing over 1/6 all day every day claims he outwork someone. 
 

Are you making fun of guys that have purses?  How liberal of you.

I’m making fun of you.

 

[tymarsas]

Are you making fun of guys that have purses?  How liberal of you.

Its a European carry-all!!!

 

[AAABatteries]

At another board somebody proposed this idea for a thought exercise: your state has been granted the right to leave the union and can take any additional three states with you, as long as the end product has contiguous borders.

That was a fun couple of pages.

Florida, North Carolina, Tennessee (Georgia)

suck it Alabama and South Carolina!

 

[Tecumseh]

I'm curious about how those living in the Traditional Remaining USA want their government to be? Same as before only more conservative?

Have you seen Handmaid’s Tale?

 

[GordonGekko]

So how do we do this? How do we divide our country along political and geographic lines in a fashion that won't lead to kinetic conflict between us? I

How does that work? Be reasonable.

This is a good topic.

Each state should have two governors. One Republican and one Democrat. It's far easier for people to move within their own state versus into another state. Some people do the latter but it's much more complicated.

Then within each state have cities that align to certain politics. If you want to be under the laws that lean Conservative, move to a Conservative city in that state. Same for Liberals. If you choose to be a Republican but live in a Liberal city, well tough luck, you live under the state laws that lean Democrat. Same for Liberals who live in Republican cities.

Some states will likely end up entire Red Zones or Blue Zones naturally.

The tax base of the cities that lean Republican goes strictly to help those cities. Same for Democrats.

Once the argument over "whose values are more correct", then you can get to practical functional public policy and functional governance.

The problem of course is that the traditional liberals will essentially be held hostage. They can live in a city with masses of the woke radical left ( Good luck with that. No police and bailed out rapists everywhere) or they can live in a Conservative city where the laws and policy likely don't suit their personal ideology, but it's better to walk the streets in safety there instead.

Imagine how hard it would be to be a gay Republican woman. Especially college aged and working somewhere in like Big Tech. 

In the same way, I can see how it would be terrifying for a traditional liberal to live somewhere surrounded by the radical left and woke unhinged shock troopers newly minted from the corrupt Big Education system.

Pretty sure each city would just build walls around it. And I'm OK with that.

This is a good topic, thanks for starting it.

 

[Philo Beddoe]

The entire south east has huge amounts of poverty.  Start with Appalachia and work your way south all the way down to Mississippi.  And I'm not saying shipping our money off to the federal government is the way to go.  Not even close.  I am merely pointing out how reliant some states are on the federal money you want to take away.  They are reliant on it because they can't make up for it in state taxes because the people there make so little.

You can get raw data from the fed site if you choose....here's a good summary article if going direct to the source isn't your thing.

I'm in Florida and mine is $10K in a relatively "rural" area...north of Orlando and West of Daytona.  My homeowner's insurance is over $7K for a year...house is about 3500 sq.

Maybe some states merge to eliminate redundancy. Kentucky/Alabama  Mississippi/Louisiana. Article IV covers this. Also, these states contain VA’s and other Fed infrastructure which is included in those numbers. They are also attractive to retirees which skew the numbers and carry their SS and Medicare payments with them.

That homeowners # is insane. Our home heating oil total this season was nauseating.