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William Barr Thread (1 Viewer)

Ilov80s said:
I don’t think there’s any point in comparing how two different judges and level of prosecutors sentence two different crimes. We will always be able to find cases where very light sentences are given and very harsh sentences are given. Judges and prosecutors are allowed to work within the sentencing framework that the legislators provide. Everything can’t be totally fair and if the convicted criminal doesn’t like the outcome, there is an appeal process. Also like maybe they shouldn’t have committed the crimes in the first place?
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If we rolled with this line of thinking on a regular basis, you wouldnt hear a peep from me. 

 
Zow said:
Please feel free to explain to us in depth which particular factors per the federal sentencing guidelines call for 4 years instead of 7. 
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I am confident that whatever esoteric argument involving federal sentencing guidelines that could be made for 7 years vs 4 years is completely out of proportion with the reaction of the four prosecutors and the letter signers.  It’s a peculiar hill to choose to die on.

 
Sam Quentin said:
I am confident that whatever esoteric argument involving federal sentencing guidelines that could be made for 7 years vs 4 years is completely out of proportion with the reaction of the four prosecutors and the letter signers.  It’s a peculiar hill to choose to die on.
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I am honestly not sure but how often do we see the AG interfere with the sentencing of people? 

 
Skoo said:
We really debating whether or not the guy who randomly decided to hold a press conference to clear Trump of any wrongdoing in the Mueller case is helping out his buddy again?

Come on people. Let's at least try to be honest.
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I don't have any issues admitting that if this was Joe Schmoe from Louisville, KY that Barr wouldn't have been involved. 

But I also know that if Joe Shmoe from Louisville was a 67 year old man with a good record, there wouldn't have even been charges, investigations, etc. let alone a 7-9 year sentence reco. 

 
parasaurolophus said:
I don't have any issues admitting that if this was Joe Schmoe from Louisville, KY that Barr wouldn't have been involved. 

But I also know that if Joe Shmoe from Louisville was a 67 year old man with a good record, there wouldn't have even been charges, investigations, etc. let alone a 7-9 year sentence reco. 
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What? You're saying that if some Joe Schmoe obstructed the Mueller investigation and lied to federal agents, he wouldn't have been charged?

 
Contemplating the movie Gladiator.  The scene where Maximus tells the boy emperor that the time for honoring himself will soon be at an end.  So many here like to honor their perspective, their own intelligence, even when it is based on clear misinformation.  Soon too that will come to an end.  The reigns of power are always held temporarily, always.

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
Contemplating the movie Gladiator.  The scene where Maximus tells the boy emperor that the time for honoring himself will soon be at an end.  So many here like to honor their perspective, their own intelligence, even when it is based on clear misinformation.  Soon too that will come to an end.  The reigns of power are always held temporarily, always.
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Was that before of after Cuba Gooding Jr got knocked out of the ring by Brian Dennehy? 

 
jonessed said:
Its serious role reversal time in here.
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In some ways, yes. Though I think many people on both sides have argued for awhile that white collar criminals are let off too easy and that the system tends to unfairly protect the rich and well connected. So in that sense, it’s not a role reversal at all.

 
[scooter] said:
What? You're saying that if some Joe Schmoe obstructed the Mueller investigation and lied to federal agents, he wouldn't have been charged?
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Well that probably would eliminate the possibility of him being a joe schmoe from Louisville if he was involved in the mueller investigation.  

But lets say that congress would have held hearings regarding the louisville basketball scandal and some equipment manager lied to the committee, doubled down on the lie, told somebody else to lie, lied again, etc. I don't think they get the same treatment.  

My logic behind that is the long list of people that have lied to congress previously without issue.

Lets say I am wrong and they did get charged and even convicted, I then have as a fallback the number of people that have been charged and convicted for more serious issues that have been sentenced to far less. I listed two already in the thread. 

 
Ilov80s said:
Interesting, I will have to read more. I hate all these stories sparked by unnamed source. Reminds me of the NFL and all these agents putting out rumors just to manipulate the situations. It’s tough to get accurate assessments.
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Barr discusses it in his ABC interview. Says he was led to believe the reco would be different and was very shocked when it came out. Obviously he could be lying, but just relaying what he said. 

 
Has there been any official statements from the DOJ 2k or the judges emergency meeting? I certainly would give the credence over Barr or an unnamed source. 

 
Ilov80s said:
Interesting, I will have to read more. I hate all these stories sparked by unnamed source. Reminds me of the NFL and all these agents putting out rumors just to manipulate the situations. It’s tough to get accurate assessments.
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When it became clear that Ms. Liu would not stay until she was confirmed, it raised suspicions among some in the U.S. attorney’s office. Those were only compounded in late January when Mr. Barr designated Timothy Shea, a longtime trusted adviser, as her temporary successor rather than letting her top assistant serve as caretaker.

Mr. Shea arrived on Feb. 3 with David Metcalf, another perceived Barr loyalist, to serve essentially as his chief of staff. Mr. Metcalf immediately caused discord when he moved a prosecutor from her office so that he could work adjacent to Mr. Shea, according to two people familiar with the move. A Justice Department official said Wednesday that the office next to Mr. Shea’s had already been vacated.

One week later, they faced a dilemma when the four career prosecutors working on the Stone case proposed recommending a sentence of seven to nine years, in line with nonbinding federal sentencing guidelines.

...

On Monday, several people familiar with the matter said, Mr. Shea told the prosecutors that he wanted a lower sentence, reminding them that they had discretion to deviate from the guidelines. But three of the four prosecutors threatened to quit the case, so Mr. Shea acquiesced until Mr. Barr and the deputy attorney general, Jeffrey A. Rosen, overruled him on Tuesday.

It was unclear how much Mr. Shea told his superiors about the final recommendation before it was filed, but department officials maintained they were not given adequate information.

At the same time, Mr. Trump withdrew Ms. Liu’s nomination for the Treasury post. Mr. Mnuchin told a Senate committee on Wednesday that he learned about the decision on Monday but declined to elaborate.

Morale sank inside the Washington office after the intervention on the Stone sentencing, and some prosecutors expressed skepticism that senior Justice Department officials were not adequately warned about the recommendation.

On Wednesday night, Mr. Shea told staff members that he respected their work and vowed to “do my best” to support it, according to an email he wrote to the office that was reviewed by The New York Times.
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NYT

- It should also be noted that roughly 10-12 days earlier Jessie Liu was replaced - by Shea - as US Attorney for DC when her office submitted a tough but fair sentencing memorandum in the Flynn case.

 
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Sam Quentin said:
I am confident that whatever esoteric argument involving federal sentencing guidelines that could be made for 7 years vs 4 years is completely out of proportion with the reaction of the four prosecutors and the letter signers.  It’s a peculiar hill to choose to die on.
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The actual law is a “peculiar hill”? 

 
Zow said:
The actual law is a “peculiar hill”? 
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Wat?  What are you on about?  The law says that Barr is the AG and has the final say in what the department will recommend.  He felt the recommendation forwarded by the line prosecutors was too severe.  This is a valid well-founded opinion within the bounds of reason and prosecutorial discretion and not that far apart from the opinion of the line prosecutors.

The question that you keep trying to deflect from is that with all of the abuses of power by the department as a whole in recent history, why focus on a reasonable and small difference of opinion on a single case to go all in?  That is what is peculiar.

 
Matt Zapotosky‏ @mattzap 13h13 hours ago (WaPo Reporter)

AG Bill Barr, on Fox News, refers to current restrictions as "draconian measures" and says at end of April, he thinks we should "allow people to adapt more than we have, & not just tell people to go home and hide under their bed."

Barr, a major proponent of executive power, adds "I am concerned that we not get into the business of declaring everything an emergency & then using these kinds of sweeping, extraordinary steps. But given where we were back in March, I think the president made the right decision"

Barr also criticizes “snarky, gotcha questions from the White House media pool” and says of Trump & hydroxychloroquine, "As soon as he said something positive about it, the media’s been on a jihad to discredit the drug."

Barr notes that the economic impact of the crisis also means lives are lost; for example, cancer researchers are at home now. “We will have a weaker healthcare system, if we go into a deep depression. So just measured in lives, the cure cannot be worse than the disease," he says.

Barr says he and his security detail wear masks going to and from the office (when they come in -- they are teleworking more, he says). He did not wear a mask during the interview, and joked he didn't think it would be allowed.

Previewing segment Fox plans to air tomorrow, Barr says what happened to Trump in Russia investigation was “one of the greatest travesties in American history." Probe, he says, was started "without any basis" & steps taken post-election were meant "to sabotage the presidency"

The full story on Barr’s interview tonight

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/attorney-general-william-barr-fox-news-coronavirus/2020/04/09/dfda1f94-7a12-11ea-a130-df573469f094_story.html

 
squistion said:
Matt Zapotosky‏ @mattzap 13h13 hours ago (WaPo Reporter)

AG Bill Barr, on Fox News, refers to current restrictions as "draconian measures" and says at end of April, he thinks we should "allow people to adapt more than we have, & not just tell people to go home and hide under their bed."

Barr, a major proponent of executive power, adds "I am concerned that we not get into the business of declaring everything an emergency & then using these kinds of sweeping, extraordinary steps. But given where we were back in March, I think the president made the right decision"

Barr also criticizes “snarky, gotcha questions from the White House media pool” and says of Trump & hydroxychloroquine, "As soon as he said something positive about it, the media’s been on a jihad to discredit the drug."

Barr notes that the economic impact of the crisis also means lives are lost; for example, cancer researchers are at home now. “We will have a weaker healthcare system, if we go into a deep depression. So just measured in lives, the cure cannot be worse than the disease," he says.

Barr says he and his security detail wear masks going to and from the office (when they come in -- they are teleworking more, he says). He did not wear a mask during the interview, and joked he didn't think it would be allowed.

Previewing segment Fox plans to air tomorrow, Barr says what happened to Trump in Russia investigation was “one of the greatest travesties in American history." Probe, he says, was started "without any basis" & steps taken post-election were meant "to sabotage the presidency"

The full story on Barr’s interview tonight

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/attorney-general-william-barr-fox-news-coronavirus/2020/04/09/dfda1f94-7a12-11ea-a130-df573469f094_story.html
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It's so discouraging when awful, immoral people succeed at anything...hopefully karma is a thing

 
squistion said:
AG Bill Barr, on Fox News, refers to current restrictions as "draconian measures" and says at end of April, he thinks we should "allow people to adapt more than we have, & not just tell people to go home and hide under their bed."
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I saw this or some of it, and I was struck by the continuing question of whether these people are genuinely paranoid/delusional or whether they know that Trump is easily influencible. Tell him pleasing things, get carte Blanche for whatever policies they want.

 
++++++++++++++++++++

As Barr appears before the House Judiciary Committee, these are important areas of inquiry:

On the Mueller report, the committee should compare Barr’s now notorious summary to what is actually in that document. A judge found that Barr engaged in “a calculated attempt to influence public discourse about the Mueller Report in favor of President Trump.” Barr should be pressed to explain why he failed to disclose that Mueller lacked “confidence … that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice.”

On Ukraine, the committee should pin Barr down on what he knew about the decision to keep the whistleblower complaint from Congress. What was Barr’s involvement? Did he discuss the effort to suppress the complaint with the president or other White House officials?

The committee should also question Barr on his changing accounts of his role in the assault on peaceful protesters at Lafayette Square, examining his contacts with Justice and White House officials who said Barr ordered the actions. It is also imperative to address Barr’s role in the recent “surge” of federal law enforcement into Portland, Ore., and other cities.

On Flynn and Stone, the committee should probe Barr’s involvement and what conversations he had with the president, the White House or the handpicked prosecutors who moved to dismiss the Flynn charges and reduce the Stone sentence. Barr must also be asked how he can defend the later Stone clemency when he himself called the case “a righteous prosecution.”

Sadly, that’s not all. Barr should also be confronted about his statement that former Manhattan U.S. attorney Geoffrey Berman — who was overseeing several investigations potentially implicating Trump — quit. Berman’s sworn account establishes that was not true. And a whistleblower has testified that investigations at the Antitrust Division have been infected with Trump’s partisan agenda.

Barr should answer for all of that — and more. And he should keep in mind how history remembers John Mitchell, dragged down alongside the president he sought to protect.

++++++++++++++++++++

Norm Ornstein

 
From West Point grad, Maj. Adam DeMarco,  who "served in the 1st Cavalry and 1st Armored Divisions during Operation Iraqi Freedom, joined the D.C. National Guard in 2014, after completing his active duty obligation:"

D.C. National Guard officer challenges account of violent clearing of protesters in Lafayette Square

>>  From what I could observe, the demonstrators were behaving peacefully,” when Park Police, the Secret Service, and other, unidentified forces turned on the crowd, DeMarco writes. The rout started shortly after Barr and Gen. Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff appeared in the square, where Barr appeared to confer with Park Police leaders, he says.

The legally required warnings to demonstrators before clearing the square shortly after were “barely audible” from 20 yards away and apparently not heard by protesters, he said.

Park Police and other officers began suddenly routing the crowd without warning to National Guard forces present, DeMarco said. And a Park Police liaison officer told DeMarco that his forces were only using “stage smoke” against the crowd, not tear gas. DeMarco said the stinging to his nose and eyes appeared to be tear gas, however, and says he found spent tear gas canisters in the street later that evening. <<

 
Jordan "Can you ask those who don't come in to work to silence their cell phones? It's distracting to what we're trying to do."
 

 
zoonation said:
What an absolute partisan gong show this hearing is.  Waste of time and money.
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Seems like most hearings are like this.

I'd rather give both sides a set amount of time, and the limit questions to 1-2 people per side.  I hate this 5 minutes for everyone - it just begs for political grandstanding.

 
Barr also knows that there is nothing congress can do to him, so he has no sense of being accountable to congress.

 
Barr is just owning these democrats.  Come more prepared.  terrible.  The GOP speeches are just nauseating.  "Antifa"!  "There is an Antifa under my bed"!

 
zoonation said:
Barr is just owning these democrats.  Come more prepared.  terrible.  The GOP speeches are just nauseating.  "Antifa"!  "There is an Antifa under my bed"!
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He’s schooling them. Pretty crazy how bad they all are at this. 

 
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