Agree or Disagree? Donald Trump Controls The Republican Party And Republicans Must Yield To Him (3 Viewers)

[SeniorVBDStudent]

Very true.  I, personally, cannot vote for a democrat with what i perceive as a shift to moving so far left in the last decade.

That doesnt mean i support trump.  It means the left scares me more than trump.

In the spirit of an open dialog, your perspective fascinates me.

Is the basis of your fear economic, moral or other?

Assuming its economic, as in my experience this is at the root of most things political, on the left or the right, let's say that Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren were elected president.  Do you think this would result in the economic collapse of the country?

Speaking personally, the worst case scenario of Trump being allowed to resume political office is straight-up insurgency and replacement of the democratic republic with a police state.  And/or variations involving nuclear war, civil war, etc etc.  As such, Its hard for me to absorb a perspective where "the left scares me more than trump".  Help me understand that if you can.

 

[GordonGekko]

How many GOPers won't challenge Trump in a 2024 primary?  ...

Feels like Trump controls the party...

Direct Headline: POLITICO Playbook: GOP donors privately pan Trump’s ‘horrible’ RNC speech

“It was horrible, it was long and negative,” one attendee with a donor in the room tells Playbook. “It was dour. He didn’t talk about the positive things that his administration has done.”...Instead, Trump used the final night of the retreat to talk about himself, his grievances and how he plans to enact retribution against those who voted to impeach him — which runs counter to the donors’ main objective of making sure their dollars go toward winning overall.

By TARA PALMERI and RACHAEL BADE  04/11/2021 11:47 AM EDT

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/playbook/2021/04/11/gop-donors-privately-pan-trumps-horrible-rnc-speech-492435

Direct Headline: ‘They have better things to do’ – Major Republican donors are staying away from Trump

“Big money, sophisticated people are just losing interest in this s--- show,” said an advisor to longtime Trump allies in Silicon Valley...“Donors don’t contribute out of the goodness of their heart. And right now they’re being asked to donate to an organization that has no other purpose than pumping cash into someone who doesn’t need it and isn’t using it,” said a Republican strategist who represents financiers on Wall Street. “They have better things to do.” 

Brian Schwartz Tue, Aug 31 202111:55 AM EDT

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/31/trump-gets-little-support-from-major-republican-donors.html

Direct Headline: Nikki Haley's new PAC steers clear of Trump brand

Stand for America PAC, a political iteration of Haley’s nonprofit of the same name, says it’s currently focused on the 2022 midterms, and will “recruit, advise, train and financially support strong conservatives to run in key House and Senate races to take back control of both chambers.”..Trump’s image has taken a major hit following the insurrection at the Capitol last week. He retains strong support among his core voters, according to a new Axios/Ipsos poll, but Republicans generally are starting to waver...According to that poll, independents largely reject Trump's efforts to overturn the results of the 2020 election...Neither the website nor the donation page mention Trump, Haley’s former boss, or feature a photo with him.

Lachlan Markay Jan 14, 2021

https://www.axios.com/nikki-haley-pac-avoids-trump-brand-ff6ed150-17bf-4eab-8e54-968f9c1650f1.html

Direct Headline: These 16 Billionaires Have Already Donated To Nikki Haley’s PAC Ahead Of A Possible 2024 Run

In the meantime, here are the 23 billionaire donors who have already opened their wallets for Haley’s PAC.... Within six months, 16 billionaires and 7 spouses of billionaires donated to her group, called Stand For America....Eleven of the billionaire donors who donated to Haley’s PAC had previously supported Donald Trump’s 2020 campaign.

Michela Tindera Oct 20, 2021,09:06am EDT

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michelatindera/2021/10/20/these-16-billionaires-have-already-donated-to-nikki-haleys-pac-ahead-of-a-possible-2024-run/?sh=7b6682df7fb0

*****

You can't win without money. How does Trump "control" the Republican Party without enough money to win back POTUS in 2024?

Do you think the massive defection in big donor dollars means nothing here? Do you think all these billionaires and major players are supporting Nikki Haley's Super PAC for no reason at all? So she can choose to not run for POTUS?

Some of you radical leftist zealots who just want to find another topic to beat down on Conservatives and Republicans and drive more Orange/Man/Bad and Smear The Cheeto narratives and can only do so if you can try sell the ridiculous story that Trump, who ran out of campaign money at the end of 2020, is going to magically look like a major contender while being silenced on major platforms and having a great deal of his former big time financial contributors walk on him.

Some of you like to smear Conservatives as some kind of hillbilly zombie like cult for Trump but you fail to acknowledge that someone has to pay the light bill eventually. Even cults need running water and lights and garbage service and groceries and gasoline for their cars and insurance and on and on and on.

How unhinged does tribalism have to be to believe that you can win a major election without money?

 

[FreeBaGeL]

And that right there is the core of the problem with the left:  either agree with them or you're a racist, sexist, etc.. Or now, apparently, a fascist.

Never any room for disagreement.  Youre either in agreement or the devil.  

You really think thats the way to get someone to vote democrat?  Get outta here.

I'm not trying to get you to vote democrat.  You literally said a few posts ago that you would sooner vote for someone that you thought was trying to subvert our election process than you would vote for a democrat.  I have no delusions that I nor anyone else would ever convince you to vote for a democrat.  You've colored democrats as worse than people that try to illegally seize power, you're obviously not going to vote for one, lol.

I don't do ultimatums very often.  "Yeah, I think that guy is trying to undermine our free election process in order to illegally gain the office of president but I am going to vote for him anyway" I don't think is a reasonable stance for people to take, and I don't think it's going out on some limb to believe that.

5 years ago before the person trying to do that happened to be a Republican, every conservative on this board would have agreed with me.  And they'd have been leading the charge, really.

 

[GordonGekko]

I’m prepared to bet a lot of money Trump will be the nominee barring some health issue.  We are talking about the biggest delusional narcissist to ever hold office.  His only remaining goal in life is to avenge his humiliation.   

New money from big donors to Nikki Haley's Super PAC:

Cliff and Laurel Asness  Source of wealth: Money management 

Ken Griffin Source of wealth: Hedge funds

Bill Haslam Source of wealth: Gas stations

Chamath Palihapitiya Source of wealth: Facebook, venture capital

Daniel Loeb Source of wealth: Hedge funds

Edward Roski Source of wealth: Real estate

Paul Singer Source of wealth: Hedge funds 

William and Mary Stone Source of wealth: Software 

Sam Zell Source of wealth: Real estate, private equity 

Big level donors who jumped ship from Donald Trump to Nikki Haley:

- Miriam Adelson  Source of wealth: Casinos

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees (with husband Sheldon Adelson, d. 2021): $1.2 million

- Julianne Argyros, wife of George Argyros Source of wealth: Real estate, investments

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees: $100,000

- Melinda Hildebrand, wife of Jeffrey Hildebrand  Source of wealth: Oil

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees (with husband Jeffrey Hildebrand): $1.2 million

- Charles B. Johnson Source of wealth: Money management

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees (with wife Ann Johnson): $700,000

- Ken and Elaine Langone Source of wealth: Investments

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees (only Elaine Langone donated to Trump): $5,000

- Stephen Winn Source of wealth: Real estate services

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees (with wife Melinda Winn): $725,000

- Bernie and Billi Marcus Source of wealth: Home Depot

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees: $731,200

- H. Ross Perot Jr. Source of wealth: Real estate

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees: $660,000

- Ira and Ingeborg Rennert Source of wealth: Investments

Contributions to Trump campaign and supporting committees: $900,000

*****

Top tier political campaign donors aren't doing this for altruism. They want a return on their investment. They invested in Trump in 2020 and The Donald did not deliver. When you don't provide ROI, you make it clear that you are a bad future long term bet.

Which is why so many jumped ship to Nikki Haley.

Do you think these major players believe they have a better chance to install someone who can help them via political leverage and political pork who is

A) A minority woman who is battled tested in foreign policy, good resume, clean media optics, no scandal, operates like Teflon, has no COVID19 baggage, has no J6 baggage, does not have the "geriatric/too old" question lingering with Biden and Trump. Someone who will appeal to moderates, independents, working class minorities and can carry suburban women voters.

or

B) An exhausting aging 4th rate failed former reality TV star grifter who is a stone cold trolling narcissist who carries J6, COVID19, all previous legacy scandals, bad optics with women, has already created a massive number of enemies, has already lost a general cycle, risks having Republicans sit out the next election, is a high conflict personality type who sows chaos everywhere and on and on and on and on.

A LOT OF MONEY HAS ALREADY BEEN BET. IT'S BEEN BET ON NIKKI HALEY AND RON DESANTIS.

No amount of tribalism makes any of that just magically disappear.

 

[tymarsas]

Direct Headline: POLITICO Playbook: GOP donors privately pan Trump’s ‘horrible’ RNC speech

“It was horrible, it was long and negative,” one attendee with a donor in the room tells Playbook. “It was dour. He didn’t talk about the positive things that his administration has done.”...Instead, Trump used the final night of the retreat to talk about himself, his grievances and how he plans to enact retribution against those who voted to impeach him — which runs counter to the donors’ main objective of making sure their dollars go toward winning overall.

By TARA PALMERI and RACHAEL BADE  04/11/2021 11:47 AM EDT

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/playbook/2021/04/11/gop-donors-privately-pan-trumps-horrible-rnc-speech-492435

Direct Headline: ‘They have better things to do’ – Major Republican donors are staying away from Trump

“Big money, sophisticated people are just losing interest in this s--- show,” said an advisor to longtime Trump allies in Silicon Valley...“Donors don’t contribute out of the goodness of their heart. And right now they’re being asked to donate to an organization that has no other purpose than pumping cash into someone who doesn’t need it and isn’t using it,” said a Republican strategist who represents financiers on Wall Street. “They have better things to do.” 

Brian Schwartz Tue, Aug 31 202111:55 AM EDT

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/31/trump-gets-little-support-from-major-republican-donors.html

Direct Headline: Nikki Haley's new PAC steers clear of Trump brand

Stand for America PAC, a political iteration of Haley’s nonprofit of the same name, says it’s currently focused on the 2022 midterms, and will “recruit, advise, train and financially support strong conservatives to run in key House and Senate races to take back control of both chambers.”..Trump’s image has taken a major hit following the insurrection at the Capitol last week. He retains strong support among his core voters, according to a new Axios/Ipsos poll, but Republicans generally are starting to waver...According to that poll, independents largely reject Trump's efforts to overturn the results of the 2020 election...Neither the website nor the donation page mention Trump, Haley’s former boss, or feature a photo with him.

Lachlan Markay Jan 14, 2021

https://www.axios.com/nikki-haley-pac-avoids-trump-brand-ff6ed150-17bf-4eab-8e54-968f9c1650f1.html

Direct Headline: These 16 Billionaires Have Already Donated To Nikki Haley’s PAC Ahead Of A Possible 2024 Run

In the meantime, here are the 23 billionaire donors who have already opened their wallets for Haley’s PAC.... Within six months, 16 billionaires and 7 spouses of billionaires donated to her group, called Stand For America....Eleven of the billionaire donors who donated to Haley’s PAC had previously supported Donald Trump’s 2020 campaign.

Michela Tindera Oct 20, 2021,09:06am EDT

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michelatindera/2021/10/20/these-16-billionaires-have-already-donated-to-nikki-haleys-pac-ahead-of-a-possible-2024-run/?sh=7b6682df7fb0

*****

You can't win without money. How does Trump "control" the Republican Party without enough money to win back POTUS in 2024?

Do you think the massive defection in big donor dollars means nothing here? Do you think all these billionaires and major players are supporting Nikki Haley's Super PAC for no reason at all? So she can choose to not run for POTUS?

Some of you radical leftist zealots who just want to find another topic to beat down on Conservatives and Republicans and drive more Orange/Man/Bad and Smear The Cheeto narratives and can only do so if you can try sell the ridiculous story that Trump, who ran out of campaign money at the end of 2020, is going to magically look like a major contender while being silenced on major platforms and having a great deal of his former big time financial contributors walk on him.

Some of you like to smear Conservatives as some kind of hillbilly zombie like cult for Trump but you fail to acknowledge that someone has to pay the light bill eventually. Even cults need running water and lights and garbage service and groceries and gasoline for their cars and insurance and on and on and on.

How unhinged does tribalism have to be to believe that you can win a major election without money?

Thanks. This is some really great information. It definitely makes me rethink my vote.

It would be nice if you stopped with the gross generalizations of anyone that disagrees with you.

 

[GordonGekko]

....Anywho, the predominant dynamic driving liberal and independent voting here is the deep-seeded fear of Trump, given documented fascist, narcissistic, mego-maniacal and psychotic behavior.  Think of Trump as the right wing equivalent of Al Sharpton, Jessie Jackson, Jerry Brown and Bernie Sanders all rolled into one.  His election campaign theme of draining the swamp had been used before...by Mussolini.  

The dynamic driving conservative voting is a combination of denial and "it's no big deal".  This works well for the Trumpies and those that like to hang out at patriots.win. ....

VIDEO: The Young Black Conservatives of Trump’s America Jan 24, 2019 VICE

In October of 2018, hundreds of young conservatives of color met up in Washington, DC, for the first ever Young Black Leadership Summit... and a rare chance for young, black Republicans to get together and network IRL. VICE’s Lee Adams went to the summit to talk firsthand with young, black conservatives about what drew them to the Republican party, along with what kind of backlash they’ve faced from the black community for going public with their political views.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWam9FSRvGI

VIDEO: Black Conservatives Debate Black Liberals on American Politics (Extended Version) Mar 3, 2019 VICE

By popular demand, this is an extended cut of the original version of this debate we published here on YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVIoC5ROaHk

VIDEO: Liberal Latinos Debate Conservative Latinos on Immigration, Trump, and Racial Identity (Part 1/2) Jun 13, 2019 VICE

VIDEO: Latino Conservatives Debate Liberals on the Wall, Amnesty, and Political Polarization (Part 2/2) Jun 14, 2019 VICE

Liberal and conservative members of the Latinx community duke it out at the VICE Miami office. What does it mean to be Latinx? Who voted for Trump, and why? How are his policies affecting the community? What should be done about the crisis at the border, should there be a wall? What does the American Dream look like for Latinx individuals?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9I6b1JEb2k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyymEC8FQHU&t=0s

*****

Where do young black Conservatives and Latino Conservatives fall into your tribalist spectrum?

Watch the videos. Do those people sound like unreasonable cultists? Or do they sound like regular people who see common problems solved differently? The "First Past The Post" system only gives two practical choices in any general cycle. The Republican Party is actually very vast, multi-layered and complex.

So my message is not really to you but for the silent moderates and independents whom lurk and don't post. If folks like SVBDS get their way, well all the Conservatives and Republicans will be wiped out. And then you become the new "right side of the aisle"

What happens when you get lumped into the fascist/narcissistic/mego-maniacal and psychotic category for the actions of a few? For reading the wrong books. For having the wrong opinion. For not declaring your loyalty fast enough. For not being "pure" enough.

I find it tragic that some of the most ardent identity politics driven self proclaimed liberals just pretend minority Conservatives don't exist. I guess it just makes it easier to hunt down those you've already dehumanized.

You've just declared the kind of world you want your children to inherit. And I pity you for it.

 

[The Z Machine]

Trump needs far less money than other candidates because of all the free publicity he gets in all media outlets.  Plus, he can raise boatloads from his base of non mega donors. We'll see if there are any serious candidates to oppose Trump in primary.  My bet is very few and they will get crushed.

 

[GordonGekko]

The last thing a king does is play king maker.  

Direct Headline: Trump kind of admits he might have cost Republicans the Senate

When Sen. Bill Cassidy (R-La.) said this week that he wouldn’t support Donald Trump for president in 2024, he noted that Trump has a rather dubious distinction. “President Trump is the first president [on] the Republican side at least to lose the House, the Senate and the presidency in four years,” Cassidy told Axios. “Elections are about winning.”

By Aaron Blake October 20, 2021 at 11:47 a.m. EDT

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/10/20/trump-senate-loss/

Direct Headline: Trump takes two punches from GOP

Trump's preferred candidate in a special House election in Texas lost on Tuesday to another Republican who was likely boosted by some protest votes against the former president. And on Wednesday, 17 Senate Republicans voted to advance a bipartisan infrastructure deal that Trump spent weeks railing against... the back-to-back blows have led some to question whether his influence may have started to wane since he left office....“Trump has not had a big win in quite a while,” Alex Conant, a Republican strategist, said. “I think without wins, his political capital is depleted... Trump does not have a post-presidential strategy...He is overexposed at the same time that he’s not getting enough attention. He’s giving lots of speeches and traveling the country, but other than his narrow base no one’s really paying attention and I think that limits his influence.” Trump’s grip over House Republicans remains solid, those close to the former president say...But the same cannot be said about the Senate, where Republicans appear more willing to move on from the former president....“Trump’s political support has never been transferable...In most cases, he’s tended to endorse candidates who were going to win anyway..."

By Max Greenwood and Brett Samuels - 07/30/21 06:00 AM EDT

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/565499-trump-takes-two-punches-from-gop

****

If you lose the kingdom, you aren't king anymore.

My Conservative brother, @BladeRunner is right. Some of the radical leftists in here and many out there have no real recourse if Trump does not win the 2024 RNC ticket.

He has a record of eating big losses, getting turfed from most of the major platforms and will endure massive campaign contribution losses. Kings actually need gold coins in the castle's treasury, they need enough foot soldiers and cavalry and the means to feed and house them, they need allies and some ability to communicate effectively with their people.

You can't spend years talking about how Trump is not politically viable and then when you need him to be a human punching bag to forestall a massive loss, suddenly switch the narrative so that what was said before magically stops being true.

When a specific political ideology by some zealots is built around hating Donald Trump and using him as a cheap proxy to try to tear apart all Conservatives and all Republicans as a bonus, and if that's been ramping up for years and years and one day it suddenly disappears, what exactly is left to hate for some of you here?

Bitterness is drinking the poison yourself and hoping the other person dies.

 

[dkp993]

The bottom line is this….

If Trump doesn’t run again and GG and Blade are correct we all win, even those of us that would be wrong.

If Trump does run and wins, GG and Blade will be wrong and we all lose, even those of us who would be correct.  

I for one am really rooting to be wrong. 

 

[ekbeats]

Top Republicans stand up for Rounds after Trump's attack: He 'told the truth'

 

[RavenFan]

Top Republicans stand up for Rounds after Trump's attack: He 'told the truth'

So a couple of R's have the audacity to mildly call out Trump's personal and juvenile comments, and that's somehow evidence that Trump doesn't control the republican party?  The tepid response to such pathetic comments is just one more example of the power Trump holds in the party.

Trump may not be the leader for every regular joe republican in the country, but his control over his base and the party's elected officials is complete. 

 

[Rich Conway]

Top Republicans stand up for Rounds after Trump's attack: He 'told the truth'

At some level, this is evidence that Trump does still control them.  Of those listed in the article:

Mitch McConnell: "I think Sen. Rounds told the truth about what happened in the 2020 election, and I agree with him."

Kevin Cramer: "I've always said I agree that the election was not stolen -- at least to the degree that it was illegal theft"

While the others all supported Rounds in a "he's not a jerk" way, none of them went as far as to state that the election was legit.  So all told, we have exactly one person quoted in that article, McConnell, who was able to unequivocally state the election was legit.  Cramer, of course, hedged.

 

[RavenFan]

At some level, this is evidence that Trump does still control them.  Of those listed in the article:

Mitch McConnell: "I think Sen. Rounds told the truth about what happened in the 2020 election, and I agree with him."

Kevin Cramer: "I've always said I agree that the election was not stolen -- at least to the degree that it was illegal theft"

While the others all supported Rounds in a "he's not a jerk" way, none of them went as far as to state that the election was legit.  So all told, we have exactly one person quoted in that article, McConnell, who was able to unequivocally state the election was legit.  Cramer, of course, hedged.

Trump can say and do anything with zero repercussions from republicans.  Yet Liz Cheney and others have been booted from the party for having the audacity to tell the truth.

But nah, Trump doesn't control the party or anything. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Top tier political campaign donors aren't doing this for altruism. They want a return on their investment. They invested in Trump in 2020 and The Donald did not deliver. When you don't provide ROI, you make it clear that you are a bad future long term bet.

Which is why so many jumped ship to Nikki Haley.

Do you think these major players believe they have a better chance to install someone who can help them via political leverage and political pork who is

A) A minority woman who is battled tested in foreign policy, good resume, clean media optics, no scandal, operates like Teflon, has no COVID19 baggage, has no J6 baggage, does not have the "geriatric/too old" question lingering with Biden and Trump. Someone who will appeal to moderates, independents, working class minorities and can carry suburban women voters.

or

B) An exhausting aging 4th rate failed former reality TV star grifter who is a stone cold trolling narcissist who carries J6, COVID19, all previous legacy scandals, bad optics with women, has already created a massive number of enemies, has already lost a general cycle, risks having Republicans sit out the next election, is a high conflict personality type who sows chaos everywhere and on and on and on and on.

A LOT OF MONEY HAS ALREADY BEEN BET. IT'S BEEN BET ON NIKKI HALEY AND RON DESANTIS.

No amount of tribalism makes any of that just magically disappear.

From a strategy angle, I'm super interested to see how Haley and DeSantis navigate the next couple of years. 

It's all anecdotal of course, but in my real life, I see DeSantis with momentum. He's far and away who my Conservative friends want to see get the nomination. Clay Travis' has the DeSantis t-shirt featured at the top of his newsletter email. I'll ask more how Haley fits into the mix. 

And yes, I fully understand that's a minority opinion in this forum.

Interesting stuff.

 

[Philo Beddoe]

From a strategy angle, I'm super interested to see how Haley and DeSantis navigate the next couple of years. 

It's all anecdotal of course, but in my real life, I see DeSantis with momentum. He's far and away who my Conservative friends want to see get the nomination. Clay Travis' has the DeSantis t-shirt featured at the top of his newsletter email. I'll ask more how Haley fits into the mix. 

And yes, I fully understand that's a minority opinion in this forum.

Interesting stuff.

I don’t think you are off on your assessment at all. The national media on DeSantis has been 100% negative. Once people hear him speak not entirely out of context, his stock will rise considerably.

 

[sho nuff]

Top Republicans stand up for Rounds after Trump's attack: He 'told the truth'

 Definitely a good start...hope it keeps up.  

 

[JIslander]

At some level, this is evidence that Trump does still control them.  Of those listed in the article:

Mitch McConnell: "I think Sen. Rounds told the truth about what happened in the 2020 election, and I agree with him."

Kevin Cramer: "I've always said I agree that the election was not stolen -- at least to the degree that it was illegal theft"

While the others all supported Rounds in a "he's not a jerk" way, none of them went as far as to state that the election was legit.  So all told, we have exactly one person quoted in that article, McConnell, who was able to unequivocally state the election was legit.  Cramer, of course, hedged.

 and its been over a year --

 

[BladeRunner]

So a couple of R's have the audacity to mildly call out Trump's personal and juvenile comments, and that's somehow evidence that Trump doesn't control the republican party?  The tepid response to such pathetic comments is just one more example of the power Trump holds in the party.

Trump may not be the leader for every regular joe republican in the country, but his control over his base and the party's elected officials is complete. 

Funny how the goalposts move again.  

Not far up in this thread you were all lamenting how NO ONE was defending him.  

And when it turns out you were wrong, NOW YOU'RE LAMENTING ITS NOT ENOUGH!!!

So just admit i was right.

 

[BladeRunner]

Trump can say and do anything with zero repercussions from republicans.  Yet Liz Cheney and others have been booted from the party for having the audacity to tell the truth.

But nah, Trump doesn't control the party or anything. 

This victim narrative you got going is impressive.  

Its like you think because you say it that makes it true. 

 

[CletiusMaximus]

Is it fair to say Republicans are as much or more afraid of Trump than democrats are? From a media perspective, he’s obviously a huge money trough that I’m sure they all want back.  If he runs, he’s heavily favored to win the nomination, possibly unopposed. At that point, any voter who is committed to the GOP has to vote for him over whichever communist the democrats find. I think he walks back into the White House without breaking a sweat. 

 

[GordonGekko]

....Speaking personally, the worst case scenario of Trump being allowed to resume political office is straight-up insurgency and replacement of the democratic republic with a police state.  And/or variations involving nuclear war, civil war, etc etc.  As such, Its hard for me to absorb a perspective where "the left scares me more than trump".  Help me understand that if you can.

Feel free to explain how someone withe power to turn our entire government into a police state could be forced out of office, against his own will?

If Trump had the kind of power you are talking about, he would have just stayed in the Oval Office and not left and no one could have done a single damn thing about it.

But go on, run the scenario for everyone here, if Trump, against all odds, wins POTUS 2024, how does he turn American into this nefarious "police state" that you discuss.

You sound like Christopher Moltisanti shouting to Meadow Soprano that he's going to take her to go get a Happy Meal.

 

[Chaz McNulty]

Feel free to explain how someone withe power to turn our entire government into a police state could be forced out of office, against his own will?

Mike Pence, Raffensperger, and others not willing to bend the knee to him.

 

[GordonGekko]

Is it fair to say Republicans are as much or more afraid of Trump than democrats are? From a media perspective, he’s obviously a huge money trough that I’m sure they all want back.  If he runs, he’s heavily favored to win the nomination, possibly unopposed. At that point, any voter who is committed to the GOP has to vote for him over whichever communist the democrats find. I think he walks back into the White House without breaking a sweat. 

Direct Headline: Evangelical voters help put Trump in the White House. They also helped deny him a second term.

According to exit polls, evangelical voters swung away from President Trump in large enough numbers across a handful of key states to decide the election. A New York Times' exit poll shows that Trump's nationwide support from evangelicals dropped from 81% in 2016 to 76% this year. Edison's exit poll indicates Biden received 24% of the evangelical vote, or about 4 million more votes than Hillary Clinton received in 2016. ...Key states like Michigan and Georgia saw a crucial number of evangelicals flip from Trump to Biden, helping put the Democrat over the top...Democrats and those who wish to see the end of Trumpism in our country must be willing to not make assumptions about constituencies like white evangelical Christians. THEY ARE NOT A MONOLITH, and as the numbers from this year's election show, they can be persuaded. But doing so requires taking the time to listen and demonstrate respect for their values. 

Doug Pagitt  Nov 20, 2020, 5:28 AM

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-loss-support-biden-evangelicals-election-polls-religion-2020-11

Direct Headline: Trump Is Losing Ground With Some — But Not All — White Christians

But Trump may have reason to worry about his level of support among white Catholics. Politicians and the media typically pay less attention to these voters during election season, but white Catholics are especially important to watch this year because they’re a sizable group — and they’re concentrated in Rust Belt swing states like Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania...Trump won white Catholics handily in 2016, but there are signs that his hold on this group is slipping. That’s doubly worrisome for the president because white Christians are declining as a share of the population overall.

By Amelia Thomson-DeVeaux Oct. 29, 2020, at 12:32 PM

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/trump-is-losing-ground-with-some-but-not-all-white-christians/

*****

Nothing you are saying has any basis in practical functional current political reality.

That's the diplomatic way of saying it. The undiplomatic way is telling you that you are repeating fabricated shock marketing hit and run radical leftist social media clickbait designed to incite zealots and low information voters.

My message to the moderates and traditional liberals who never post and were driven off by the radical leftists here years ago when I wasn't around, is that low information voters whom are prone to just repeat  things they hear on social media with no practical basis will also one day repeat the new world order mantra that your children need to be lined up against a wall for wrong think after all the Conservatives and Republicans have been purged in the future.

Practical political reality - Trump cannot run for President if he does not win the 2024 RNC ticket. He is losing ground with white evangelical voters, particularly Catholics. That's a massive negative leverage point in critical battleground states. This compounds the problem that he's bleeding out his financial base and has lost all social media power.

No one fears the widely unpopular. Do you remember Oliver Reed's last film role? "Listen to me. Learn from me. I was not the best because I killed quickly. I was the best because the crowd loved me. Win the crowd and you will win your freedom."

More critically, the first article points out that white evangelical Christians ARE NOT A MONOLITH.

The entire Republican Party is NOT A MONOLITH.

Only low information voters, zealots and propagandists try to sell otherwise. The story some of you radical leftists want to sell is that Trump will magically overcome being deplatformed, demonetized and de"based" just long enough to be a political pin cushion because your side of the aisle has created so much self inflicted chaos in just a little over a year that any other pathway is a road to being crushed to a pulp by the coming Red Tornado in the Mid Terms and the 2024 general cycle.

The actual current Republican Party is nuanced, multi-layered, tiered and highly complex.

I won't even call some of you bad storytellers. I will say some of you are unshockingly unskilled at repeating bad storytelling from the cooked activist complicit MSM and ham fisted Big Social Media. That's even worse. It's like taking a film franchise and then watching a bad remake get spun out of an already horrific reboot. Melissa McCarthy is a Ghostbuster and some of you want to put her into another sequel. It's the same kind of woke incomprehensible mindset.

I secretly suspect some of you radical leftists here were ghost writers for those Star Wars sequels. It's the only way to explain why geriatric Luke Skywalker was drinking green space cow milk from a bottle.

 

[dkp993]

Feel free to explain how someone withe power to turn our entire government into a police state could be forced out of office, against his own will?

If Trump had the kind of power you are talking about, he would have just stayed in the Oval Office and not left and no one could have done a single damn thing about it.

But go on, run the scenario for everyone here, if Trump, against all odds, wins POTUS 2024, how does he turn American into this nefarious "police state" that you discuss.

You sound like Christopher Moltisanti shouting to Meadow Soprano that he's going to take her to go get a Happy Meal.

GG, this is rich coming from the guy who claimed that if Newsom didn’t get recalled the world would starve.  
 

https://forums.footballguys.com/topic/795601-the-recall-of-gavin-newsom/page/7/

 

[Zow]

I don’t want it to be true as I’d love for a good moderate republican voice to rise in the party but the GOPs actions over the past 3ish years speak otherwise.  The RINO phenomenon is a perfect example.  

The amount of disrespect John McCain received from his own party neither the end of his life is an absolute disgrace and tragedy. 

To me, the fact that Trump was able to spearhead that progression and get McCain discredited shows the influence he at least had over the Republican party. My perception is that a lot of this influence remains which is why I voted "mostly agree." 

 

[GordonGekko]

Mike Pence, Raffensperger, and others not willing to bend the knee to him.

Direct Headline: Pence appears to set up a presidential run – can he win over Trump’s base?

“I think people are realising that he was an unlikely hero on January 6. In the end, even for people who disagree with him for many other policy positions he’s taken, whether it was as a governor or as a vice-president, he did the right thing when the pressure was on on January 6.”

David Smith Sat 11 Dec 2021 02.00 EST

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/dec/11/mike-pence-2024-election-donald-trump-republicans

Direct Headline:  “He’s Making Real Money for the First Time in His Life”: Mike Pence Is Already Cashing In on His Potential 2024 Run

The former veep and his wife are living their best lives: traveling widely, making bank on the speaking circuit, and residing in one of Indiana’s toniest suburbs. And in an unlikely trolling of Donald Trump, Pence remains a top contender for the GOP nod...Pence also continues to hold a strong base of support among evangelical voters and social conservatives.

By Tom LoBianco October 21, 2021

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/10/mike-pence-is-already-cashing-in-on-his-potential-2024-run

****

If Trump actually owned the Republican Party, his former 2nd in command, Mike Pence, wouldn't be a 2024 POTUS contender. But he is a contender, even if a fringe one.

For Pence to run, he will need to toe the line and cash in on this "unlikely J6 hero" narrative. Which smears Trump in the primaries.

If Trump had such grand sweeping power as some say here, then why does he face risk from a former loyalist who will drive the J6 narrative that will haunt The Donald's every step moving forward?

How do you "control" the Republican Party when you can't even control Mike Pence?

You are telling me I'm wrong by providing more evidence that I'm right. You sound like a jilted marriage counselor with an unshockingly bad Yelp rating.

 

[GordonGekko]

The amount of disrespect John McCain received from his own party neither the end of his life is an absolute disgrace and tragedy. 

To me, the fact that Trump was able to spearhead that progression and get McCain discredited shows the influence he at least had over the Republican party. My perception is that a lot of this influence remains which is why I voted "mostly agree." 

Direct Headline: CNN's Dana Bash: Trump loss in Arizona would be 'John McCain's last laugh'

Trump first attacked McCain during the 2016 primary season...."He’s not a war hero. He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured," Trump said of the Arizona senator...."There are many people in the White House right now tearing their hair watching Arizona returns right now saying: ‘I told you not to do that!’ ”

By Joe Concha - 11/05/20 07:55 AM EST

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/524584-cnns-dana-bash-trump-loss-in-arizona-would-be-john-mccains-last-laugh

****

If Trump "controlled" and "owned" the Republican Party, he would not have lost Arizona in the 2020 general cycle.

Because I'm familiar with your 4th tier lawyering,  let's move on and save time. You'll immediately talk about the censures on Doug Ducey, Jeff Flake and Cindy McCain. I'll say part of Ducey's pathway there was conflict over use of his emergency powers in the state and that censures carry no weight.

Trump still lost Arizona. Nothing you say can remove the reality that people in control and own, in the manner that the zealots here are shouting about, don't lose like this.

Your best counter then is to try to use "Agree And Amplify" but in 15 years I've never seen you show enough skill to actually pull that off. Which is tragic. I had higher hopes for you back then.

Trump lost. Kings who are deposed don't get to keep their kingdoms.

What remains? Trump lost 2020 in part because he lost part of his support structure from 2016. He's been deplatformed. He's taken massive financial hits thus is also demonetized. He's incited new enemies within his own regime. And now he's older to boot, which makes him even weaker and creates a multiplier effect on the counter narratives used against him.

Trump is in "control" in the same way David Carr was in "control" behind those early Houston Texans offensive lines.

 

[Zow]

Direct Headline: CNN's Dana Bash: Trump loss in Arizona would be 'John McCain's last laugh'

Trump first attacked McCain during the 2016 primary season...."He’s not a war hero. He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured," Trump said of the Arizona senator...."There are many people in the White House right now tearing their hair watching Arizona returns right now saying: ‘I told you not to do that!’ ”

By Joe Concha - 11/05/20 07:55 AM EST

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/524584-cnns-dana-bash-trump-loss-in-arizona-would-be-john-mccains-last-laugh

****

If Trump "controlled" and "owned" the Republican Party, he would not have lost Arizona in the 2020 general cycle.

Because I'm familiar with your 4th tier lawyering,  let's move on and save time. You'll immediately talk about the censures on Doug Ducey, Jeff Flake and Cindy McCain. I'll say part of Ducey's pathway there was conflict over use of his emergency powers in the state and that censures carry no weight.

Trump still lost Arizona. Nothing you say can remove the reality that people in control and own, in the manner that the zealots here are shouting about, don't lose like this.

Your best counter then is to try to use "Agree And Amplify" but in 15 years I've never seen you show enough skill to actually pull that off. Which is tragic. I had higher hopes for you back then.

Trump lost. Kings who are deposed don't get to keep their kingdoms.

What remains? Trump lost 2020 in part because he lost part of his support structure from 2016. He's been deplatformed. He's taken massive financial hits thus is also demonetized. He's incited new enemies within his own regime. And now he's older to boot, which makes him even weaker and creates a multiplier effect on the counter narratives used against him.

Trump is in "control" in the same way David Carr was in "control" behind those early Houston Texans offensive lines.

While I'm not going to dignify most of this with a substantive retort or response, I will say that I frankly do hope you're correct that my perception of Trump's influence is incorrect and I hope your last two paragraphs are particularly spot on. 

 

[GordonGekko]

GG, this is rich coming from the guy who claimed that if Newsom didn’t get recalled the world would starve.  
 

https://forums.footballguys.com/topic/795601-the-recall-of-gavin-newsom/page/7/

Direct Headline: Nate Silver: 'Calm down,' Donald Trump won't win the GOP nomination

Nate Silver, the founder and editor-in-chief of the data-journalism website FiveThirtyEight, told an audience at an event in New York on Wednesday he didn't think Trump would be the nominee because he was not conservative enough...But Silver, who was heralded for correctly predicting which candidate would win every state in the 2012 presidential election, isn't quite clear on how or when Trump's demise will occur....Silver also predicted that if Trump's support did not erode, the Republican Party establishment — which remains vehemently opposed to Trump — could still work overtime to make changes to the primary rules that would make it difficult for Trump to compete...

Maxwell Tani Sep 10, 2015, 9:48 AM

https://www.businessinsider.com/nate-silver-donald-trump-wont-win-2015-9

Direct Headline: Here's why Donald Trump won't win the Republican presidential nomination

But can Donald Trump really win the 2016 Republican presidential nomination? But more-knowledgable people think he won’t. They include the quants and geeks, some Republican consultants and operatives, and lots of political scientists. A trio of political data experts empanelled by FiveThirtyEight for a podcast earlier this month estimated Trump’s chances of snagging the nomination at 2%, 0% and minus-10%, respectively...“If Trump is nominated, then everything we think we know about presidential nominations is wrong,” ...Early polling is not very predictive. Especially polling more than 300 days out.

Tom McCarthy Sat 22 Aug 2015 07.43 EDT

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/aug/22/donald-trump-wont-win-republican-presidential-nomination

Direct Headline: More on Early Polls

The graph shows that polls 300 days [before the vote] have little predictive value at all... ( which covers the period 1956-2008)...The r-squared values increase sharply during the next 3 months or so—when the eventual nominees are becoming better known during the primaries—and then increase more sharply again in the 3 months before the election, when the general election campaign is underway.

By Greg Marx, CJR May 26, 2011

https://archives.cjr.org/the_kicker/more_on_early_polls.php

****

Trying to derail the topic is bad enough, but you make a limp wristed flailing attempt at it. If you are going to do something, at least do it right.

Crazy idea, I'm going to stay on topic, raise the level of discussion and set an example for all my Conservative brothers here on how to approach weak little jabs like yours.

A major part of the methodology to say Trump "owns" and "controls" the current Republican Party hinges on his ability to get the 2024 RNC ticket and retake POTUS. A lot of the leftist arguments on that will rely on current polling data.

Except the polling industry has shown that anything related to Trump can only be consistently described as non predictive. Polling data that anyone wants to drive forward this far out of the 2024 general cycle has no practical value.

It's just weak soft cover to try to change the narrative away from the failures of this current administration. ( Sound familiar? Cheap pathetic attempts at counter narratives built on ultra soft hijacking?)

What no one wants to discuss is that Trump wouldn't even be in the fringe contention window for 2024 if not for the catastrophic level face plant that this current Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice regime has inflicted on America in a little over a year's time. How bad do you need to fail to accidentally backdoor force a perpetual J6 headache like Trump forward?

Since the radical left refuses to discuss the juggernaut sized Red colored elephant in the room, the only thing left is to try to smear every single Republican in the country as some kind of blind zombie like Morlock slave to the Mar-A-Lago Empire.

 

[Stoneworker]

What no one wants to discuss is that Trump wouldn't even be in the fringe contention window for 2024 if not for the catastrophic level face plant that this current Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice regime has inflicted on America in a little over a year's time. How bad do you need to fail to accidentally backdoor force a perpetual J6 headache like Trump forward?

Amen brother. You and @BladeRunnerhave your fingers on the true pulse of the situation. 

 

[sho nuff]

Amen brother. You and @BladeRunnerhave your fingers on the true pulse of the situation. 

Calling it the Obama regime is not the true pulse of anything.    Nor is framing people here as radical leftists, low information, or zealots. 

 

[greenmountaingoat]

I hope you all are right. You all on the right, that is. 

Feels like "cult denial" to me but hey, I hope you're right.

I'm 100% sure I could be talked into voting for Haley. DeSantis feels a bit like he's got a bit of the Covid- denial and Trump stink on him. I know it will be ignored by certain posters but even though I definitely lean left,  I don't give one hot #### about Joe Biden. I thought he was a creepy weirdo but at least he isn't Trump. I voted for him but my allegiance (unlike some, seemingly) is to my country and to my fellow patriots. This fealty business is just insane. 

If it's Josh Hawley, I fear for our country's future. I think he's a hollow, opportunistic weasel. We'll all have to buckle up and hope democracy itself survives. 

 

[dkp993]

Direct Headline: Nate Silver: 'Calm down,' Donald Trump won't win the GOP nomination

Nate Silver, the founder and editor-in-chief of the data-journalism website FiveThirtyEight, told an audience at an event in New York on Wednesday he didn't think Trump would be the nominee because he was not conservative enough...But Silver, who was heralded for correctly predicting which candidate would win every state in the 2012 presidential election, isn't quite clear on how or when Trump's demise will occur....Silver also predicted that if Trump's support did not erode, the Republican Party establishment — which remains vehemently opposed to Trump — could still work overtime to make changes to the primary rules that would make it difficult for Trump to compete...

Maxwell Tani Sep 10, 2015, 9:48 AM

https://www.businessinsider.com/nate-silver-donald-trump-wont-win-2015-9

Direct Headline: Here's why Donald Trump won't win the Republican presidential nomination

But can Donald Trump really win the 2016 Republican presidential nomination? But more-knowledgable people think he won’t. They include the quants and geeks, some Republican consultants and operatives, and lots of political scientists. A trio of political data experts empanelled by FiveThirtyEight for a podcast earlier this month estimated Trump’s chances of snagging the nomination at 2%, 0% and minus-10%, respectively...“If Trump is nominated, then everything we think we know about presidential nominations is wrong,” ...Early polling is not very predictive. Especially polling more than 300 days out.

Tom McCarthy Sat 22 Aug 2015 07.43 EDT

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/aug/22/donald-trump-wont-win-republican-presidential-nomination

Direct Headline: More on Early Polls

The graph shows that polls 300 days [before the vote] have little predictive value at all... ( which covers the period 1956-2008)...The r-squared values increase sharply during the next 3 months or so—when the eventual nominees are becoming better known during the primaries—and then increase more sharply again in the 3 months before the election, when the general election campaign is underway.

By Greg Marx, CJR May 26, 2011

https://archives.cjr.org/the_kicker/more_on_early_polls.php

****

Trying to derail the topic is bad enough, but you make a limp wristed flailing attempt at it. If you are going to do something, at least do it right.

Crazy idea, I'm going to stay on topic, raise the level of discussion and set an example for all my Conservative brothers here on how to approach weak little jabs like yours.

A major part of the methodology to say Trump "owns" and "controls" the current Republican Party hinges on his ability to get the 2024 RNC ticket and retake POTUS. A lot of the leftist arguments on that will rely on current polling data.

Except the polling industry has shown that anything related to Trump can only be consistently described as non predictive. Polling data that anyone wants to drive forward this far out of the 2024 general cycle has no practical value.

It's just weak soft cover to try to change the narrative away from the failures of this current administration. ( Sound familiar? Cheap pathetic attempts at counter narratives built on ultra soft hijacking?)

What no one wants to discuss is that Trump wouldn't even be in the fringe contention window for 2024 if not for the catastrophic level face plant that this current Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice regime has inflicted on America in a little over a year's time. How bad do you need to fail to accidentally backdoor force a perpetual J6 headache like Trump forward?

Since the radical left refuses to discuss the juggernaut sized Red colored elephant in the room, the only thing left is to try to smear every single Republican in the country as some kind of blind zombie like Morlock slave to the Mar-A-Lago Empire.

That’s a whole lot of word salad when you could have just said, “you know you’re right dkp it was not cool of me to rag on someone for being hyperbolic when I’m prone to doing it myself”.   

 

[The General]

What no one wants to discuss is that Trump wouldn't even be in the fringe contention window for 2024 if not for the catastrophic level face plant that this current Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice regime has inflicted on America in a little over a year's time. How bad do you need to fail to accidentally backdoor force a perpetual J6 headache like Trump forward?

Amen brother. You and @BladeRunnerhave your fingers on the true pulse of the situation. 

It's the Dems that make Republicans vote for Trump. Oh ok!

 

[tymarsas]

It's the Dems that make Republicans vote for Trump. Oh ok!

Tbf. Trump made a lot of people vote for Biden.

 

[The General]

Tbf. Trump made a lot of people vote for Biden.

The Republican's had a list of people to pick from, settled on Trump. They will have a list of folks again in 2024. If Don runs, and he wins again, this is where they are. Zero to do with Dems.

 

[Stoneworker]

It's the Dems that make Republicans vote for Trump. Oh ok!

Congrats on sucking as bad as Trump.

President Joe Biden's approval rating dropped to 33% in a new Quinnipiac University poll, the lowest mark of any major public survey during his presidency...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/bidens-approval-rating-drops-to-new-low-of-33percent-on-concerns-about-his-handling-of-covid-economy-poll/ar-AASIfyI?ocid=mailsignout&li=BBnbfcL

 

[sho nuff]

Congrats on sucking as bad as Trump.

President Joe Biden's approval rating dropped to 33% in a new Quinnipiac University poll, the lowest mark of any major public survey during his presidency...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/bidens-approval-rating-drops-to-new-low-of-33percent-on-concerns-about-his-handling-of-covid-economy-poll/ar-AASIfyI?ocid=mailsignout&li=BBnbfcL

Ok.

What does Biden’s approval rating have to do with any of this?

 

[The General]

Congrats on sucking as bad as Trump.

President Joe Biden's approval rating dropped to 33% in a new Quinnipiac University poll, the lowest mark of any major public survey during his presidency...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/bidens-approval-rating-drops-to-new-low-of-33percent-on-concerns-about-his-handling-of-covid-economy-poll/ar-AASIfyI?ocid=mailsignout&li=BBnbfcL

Irrelevant to this discussion.

 

[Stoneworker]

Irrelevant to this discussion.

What no one wants to discuss is that Trump wouldn't even be in the fringe contention window for 2024 if not for the catastrophic level face plant that this current Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice regime has inflicted on America in a little over a year's time. How bad do you need to fail to accidentally backdoor force a perpetual J6 headache like Trump forward?

Quite relevant.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Top tier political campaign donors aren't doing this for altruism. They want a return on their investment. They invested in Trump in 2020 and The Donald did not deliver. When you don't provide ROI, you make it clear that you are a bad future long term bet.

Which is why so many jumped ship to Nikki Haley.

Do you think these major players believe they have a better chance to install someone who can help them via political leverage and political pork who is

A) A minority woman who is battled tested in foreign policy, good resume, clean media optics, no scandal, operates like Teflon, has no COVID19 baggage, has no J6 baggage, does not have the "geriatric/too old" question lingering with Biden and Trump. Someone who will appeal to moderates, independents, working class minorities and can carry suburban women voters.

or

B) An exhausting aging 4th rate failed former reality TV star grifter who is a stone cold trolling narcissist who carries J6, COVID19, all previous legacy scandals, bad optics with women, has already created a massive number of enemies, has already lost a general cycle, risks having Republicans sit out the next election, is a high conflict personality type who sows chaos everywhere and on and on and on and on.

A LOT OF MONEY HAS ALREADY BEEN BET. IT'S BEEN BET ON NIKKI HALEY AND RON DESANTIS.

No amount of tribalism makes any of that just magically disappear.

For what it's worth, I shared this with 3 of my conservative friends and 2020 Trump voters today and they all agreed. One in particular talked up the influence of Ken Langone. 

I asked all three who they wanted to run and two said DeSantis and the other said Haley. One said, "Either one before Trump".  The one who said Haley thinks she could be a star. 

Obviously a super small sample size. But these are very mainstream long time Republicans. 

 

[BladeRunner]

For what it's worth, I shared this with 3 of my conservative friends and 2020 Trump voters today and they all agreed. One in particular talked up the influence of Ken Langone. 

I asked all three who they wanted to run and two said DeSantis and the other said Haley. One said, "Actually anyone but Trump".  The one who said Haley thinks she could be a star. 

Obviously a super small sample size. But these are very mainstream long time Republicans. 

Ty.  

This basically proves my point that the ONLY people Trump controls are the Democrats.  They are dependent upon and influenced by Trump more than anyone else.

IMO, of course.

 

[Chaz McNulty]

Quite relevant.

So GG is the arbiter of what is relevant or not.  Damn, looks like I'll have to take him off ignore.

 

[Chaz McNulty]

For what it's worth, I shared this with 3 of my conservative friends and 2020 Trump voters today and they all agreed. One in particular talked up the influence of Ken Langone. 

I asked all three who they wanted to run and two said DeSantis and the other said Haley. One said, "Either one before Trump".  The one who said Haley thinks she could be a star. 

Obviously a super small sample size. But these are very mainstream long time Republicans. 

I agree with your buddy who thinks Haley would be a star.  She would smoke just about everyone the Dems could put forward.  

 

[BladeRunner]

So GG is the arbiter of what is relevant or not.  Damn, looks like I'll have to take him off ignore.

Shark move right there. 

 

[Philo Beddoe]

Quinnipiac
 

TRUMP IN 2024?

Nearly 6 in 10 Americans (59 - 33 percent) say they would not like to see Donald Trump run for president in 2024, similar to an October 19, 2021 survey. 

In today's survey, Republicans say 69 - 23 percent that they do want to see Trump run in 2024. 

In October, Republicans said 78 - 16 percent that they wanted to see Trump run in 2024.

 

[JIslander]

I agree with your buddy who thinks Haley would be a star.  She would smoke just about everyone the Dems could put forward.  

Meh, we'll see if she's even interested.  I've been in SC since 2012,  always thought she towed the R-line and wasn't genuine to herself; and over the last couple of years IMO hasn't really separated herself from Trump.  Did see her at the last PGA tournament in Kiawah which was cool.  I would consider voting for her if she is able to effectively cut the cord from Trump. 

 

[The General]

Quite relevant.

Republicans potentially picking Trump based on Biden’s popularity is not relevant. There are many candidates, you know what you are getting. They would be signing up for it. I can’t believe they would do it again.

 

[GordonGekko]

Republicans potentially picking Trump based on Biden’s popularity is not relevant. There are many candidates, you know what you are getting. They would be signing up for it. I can’t believe they would do it again.

Direct Headline: Biden References Trump 13 Times in Speech About Capitol Riot, but Never Mentions His Name

Biden never mentioned Trump by name in his speech, opting instead to reference him 13 times with only with the term "former president."...In one of his first mentions of the former president, Biden said Trump and Republicans who "fear his wrath" are perpetuating the "big lie" that the "real insurrection" took place on Election Day. By Jenni Fink On 1/6/22 at 10:56 AM EST

https://www.newsweek.com/biden-references-trump-13-times-speech-about-capitol-riot-never-mentions-his-name-1666335

Direct Headline: Who’s running, Joe? Biden says ‘Trump’ 24 times during Va. stump for McAuliffe

Biden mentioned Trump by name 24 times during a brisk, 17-minute speech in a park near the Pentagon in northern Virginia, attempting to use his predecessor’s legacy to bash Republican Glenn Youngkin, who is tied with McAuliffe in polls in a state Biden won by 10 points just a year ago....Trump has neither campaigned for Youngkin nor made an endorsement in the race. By Steven Nelson October 26, 2021 9:55pm

https://nypost.com/2021/10/26/biden-says-trump-24-times-in-virginia-stump-for-mcauliffe/

Direct Headline: Biden says the ‘buck stops with me’ — while pinning blame on Trump and many Afghans

“I am president of the United States of America, and the buck stops with me,” President Biden said toward the end of his address Monday on the debacle in Afghanistan....Biden contended that he had been hamstrung by former president Donald Trump’s agreement with the Taliban to withdraw the United States by May 1. Biden pushed back that deadline by a few months, to Sept. 11, but he said Monday that more of a delay would have required an escalation with an impatient adversary, thanks to its deal with Trump. By Aaron Blake August 16, 2021 at 6:46 p.m. EDT

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/08/16/biden-says-buck-stops-with-me-while-pinning-blame-trump-lots-afghans/

Direct Headline: Biden lays border crisis on Trump admin's refusal to cooperate

President Joe Biden blamed the Trump administration for ongoing problems at the U.S.-Mexico border, citing its failure to cooperate and share critical information during the presidential transition period...Biden said his administration inherited “one god-awful mess at the border” from former President Donald Trump. He said it’s the result of “the failure to have a real transition — cooperation from the last administration, like every other administration has done.” By Rebecca Shabad April 30, 2021, 6:08 AM PDT

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/one-god-awful-mess-biden-lays-border-crisis-trump-admin-n1265908

Direct Headline:  Welcome to Biden’s pandemic. It’s just as bad as Trump’s was.

President Biden’s competent, “adult in the room” approach to the pandemic has now killed nearly as many Americans as President Donald Trump’s pandemic infantilism. In the 326 days from Feb. 29, 2020, to Jan. 20, 2021, 402,269 Americans died of covid-19 on Trump’s watch. This past Sunday marked 326 days since Biden’s inauguration and that death toll is on the verge of being surpassed: By Sunday afternoon, there were 392,357 deaths under Biden. By Richard Morgan December 13, 2021 at 6:00 a.m. EST

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/12/13/biden-trump-covid-deaths/

Direct Headline: The Democrats’ Inflation Blame Game

Everyone and everything is responsible except the government spending that’s actually fueling it.... inflation report indicating that consumer prices have risen by 7% over the past 12 months and accelerated to 9.1% over the past three months, the president...remain firmly entrenched in a state of denial....But as American workers suffer declining real wages, Democrats and outside experts assure us that spending another $4.9 trillion to fully fund the Build Back Better plan is the key to ending inflation. This claim, which ... Mitch McConnell describes as Democrats’ “inflating their way out of inflation”...As in the late 1970s, inflation is punishing workers, consumers and savers. But the government is largely protected. More than half of the federal budget is composed of entitlements, most of which are automatically adjusted for inflation (with a one-year lag). The remainder of the budget is set at a “current services baseline” that assumes all government programs will be increased by at least the inflation rate....But if government and its beneficiaries are protected from inflation, who bears its brunt? The people who do the work, pay the taxes, and pull the wagon in America—especially blue-collar workers who have no automatic inflation adjustments in their employment contracts and who...will find no shelter in this storm. By Phil Gramm and Mike Solon Jan. 12, 2022 1:26 pm ET

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-democrats-inflation-blame-game-budget-carter-1970s-voters-denial-biden-powell-2022-midterms-11642008348

*****

Biden's lack of popularity comes from public policy failures, over and over again. Every time Biden blames Trump, he opens the door to the comparison on what would have happened if Trump was reelected. Biden refusing to mention Trump by name during the J6 speech was an intentional media optics decision. The more Biden mentions and blames Trump, the more it exponentially pushes the comparison basis in the national daily media cycle, and the more it raises Trumps 2024 profile despite being effectively demonetized and deplatformed. Biden tried to put the full blame from Afghanistan and the Southern Border on Trump, but the major failure point was Virginia. Where Biden tried to associate Youngkin as a carbon copy Trump while missing the bigger picture that the election was boiling down to enraged parents who didn't want their children indoctrinated into zealotry. So the plan now is to do a split narrative. Activist complicit propaganda outlets like The Washington Post will try to bridge the middle on Biden's failures by keep mentioning Trump and the official Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice regime will just not say his name. But what is the actual comparison basis that Biden wants to avoid? Like the inflation issue, the perception that Trump offered a better view of American life in what the average citizen sees everyday. You can't hide from what's in front of you at the grocery store and the gas pump.

You are saying Trump's political future ( what's left of it, it's pretty ugly at this point) should not be intertwined with Biden's record. Except Biden has done nothing but link his record to Trump to force the comparison. Thus part of picking Trump for the RNC ticket, if it happened, becomes a referendum on all of Biden's current failures.

Susan Rice decided the best media strategy was to turn Donald Trump into Voldemort. She made this all relevant all year long. Now she has to eat the whole meal on such an insanely stupid media optics decision. She cannot, and the radical woke leftists here cannot, simply decide when to turn that narrative on and off when it suits their enraged tribalism.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I would consider voting for her if she is able to effectively cut the cord from Trump. 

Thanks. 

And confession for me, it's so easy (at least for me) to get into a "assuming" things about other folks. I don't have a "notebook" but obviously, I see what's posted here and make assumptions. 

From what tiny bit of posting I've seen from you, I would have assumed you would not consider voting for a Republican. Obviously that's not the case. And that's 100% my fault for thinking something wrong like that. I'm sure you've never said you wouldn't vote for a Republican. But it was something I assumed. And I was wrong. 100% my fault. And it's a great example to not assume things of other posters that they haven't actually said. 

You provided a good reminder for. me there. Thanks.