Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
I TIVO the game and just watched it again frame by frame. I could not agree more. The ball was bobbling in Gaffneys hands.
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Official "If You Think The Patriots Deserve An Asterisk" Thr (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Joe Bryant
- Start date
whole-show
Footballguy
Hey as I stated I am not a Pats basher. Could really care less about the Pats considering my team is in the NFC. I am just venting that the last drive was horrendous and I would probably also be arguing if the Ravens would of scored on the last drive because no penalty was called and Mason clearly tackled (can't remember who) the Ravens defensive player on that Clayton catch.
eom
Footballguy
I watched it, too, and so did the ref and you are wrong.keep hatin'.
CalmLikeABomb
Footballguy
He caught the ball and had control. You have to let go of the ball to move it from your hands to your body which he was doing.
No where in the rules does it state you can't reposition the ball in the endzone.
And per Brady, it was the best catch of his career. Don't try to take that from him.
No where in the rules does it state you can't reposition the ball in the endzone.
And per Brady, it was the best catch of his career. Don't try to take that from him.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
I thought the call should have been reversed, but it would have taken an act of god to keep the Pats out of the end zone after Scott's two personal fouls.
Houston turmOiler
Footballguy
We say that every week and yet, somehow, they pull another one out. I hate those guys as much as anyone and looking for silver linings really sucks. Here's my new one:
Pats go undefeated in the regular season, lose in the playoffs. The toll of trying to stay perfect exhausts them physically and mentally, and a solid playoff darkhorse finally makes the play in crunch time. Watch Rodney Harrison stare at the scoreboard in disbelief as the clock winds down.
It's probably not going to happen. Just indulge me and let me cling to my one little glimmer of hope until I have to watch guys I can't freaking stand (especially Harrison, I hate him more than anyone else in the league) hold the Lombardi Trophy again. It's gotten so bad that I might actually root for the 90's Cowboys over these guys. Still, I can't take away from what they're accomplishing. Gotta give 'em credit even though it makes me wanna
Pats go undefeated in the regular season, lose in the playoffs. The toll of trying to stay perfect exhausts them physically and mentally, and a solid playoff darkhorse finally makes the play in crunch time. Watch Rodney Harrison stare at the scoreboard in disbelief as the clock winds down.
It's probably not going to happen. Just indulge me and let me cling to my one little glimmer of hope until I have to watch guys I can't freaking stand (especially Harrison, I hate him more than anyone else in the league) hold the Lombardi Trophy again. It's gotten so bad that I might actually root for the 90's Cowboys over these guys. Still, I can't take away from what they're accomplishing. Gotta give 'em credit even though it makes me wanna
timschochet
Footballguy
The Patriots won tonight because the Ravens blew it, OK?
I just hate it when everyone wants to blame the referrees. The refs are human, they make mistakes. But the idea that they would conspire to help one team win or another team lose is just ridiculous.
Sadly, you hear this accusation more and more in sports, usually from losers. As a Steeler fan, I suffered through Mike Holmgren and a slew of Seattle fans make accusations like this. As a Los Angeles Laker fan, I saw the Sacramento Kings accuse the refs a few years ago of wanting the Lakers to win. And Mark Cuban made the same accusation about a year ago.
When your team loses, don't look for a conspiracy. There isn't one. The refs don't care if the Pats go undefeated, or if Dallas beats Green Bay, etc. Realize that by calling them out and accusing them of conspiracy you are not only questioning their competance but their integrity as well.
I just hate it when everyone wants to blame the referrees. The refs are human, they make mistakes. But the idea that they would conspire to help one team win or another team lose is just ridiculous.
Sadly, you hear this accusation more and more in sports, usually from losers. As a Steeler fan, I suffered through Mike Holmgren and a slew of Seattle fans make accusations like this. As a Los Angeles Laker fan, I saw the Sacramento Kings accuse the refs a few years ago of wanting the Lakers to win. And Mark Cuban made the same accusation about a year ago.
When your team loses, don't look for a conspiracy. There isn't one. The refs don't care if the Pats go undefeated, or if Dallas beats Green Bay, etc. Realize that by calling them out and accusing them of conspiracy you are not only questioning their competance but their integrity as well.
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
No question. It's pretty clear that the Ravens would have figured out a way to lose this game if that wasn't a TD. The time out, the tackling of Moss at the line by Rolle, etc. etc. ...and the capper were the two penalties on the TD catch. It was just plain ole stupid undisciplined football.Hell, they could have gotten Ed Reed a number of times for taking his helmet off on the field. I saw him do it twice in the fourth quarter when he wasn't happy with calls. So if they REALLY wanted to make calls go the Patriots way, why weren't those penalties called?
TheFanatic
Footballguy
Sorry bro, but the fix is in. The entire NFL is in on it. The Pats are "destined" to have a "perfect" season
GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
Footballguy
I speak for all Chicagoans when I say "It's Rex Grossman's fault."
nibbomydaets
Footballguy
WOW. Step back from that ledge my friend.
G
General Tso
Guest
And the FBI killed JFK.On, by the way, Elvis IS alive and working at a Walmart in Texas.Sorry bro, but the fix is in. The entire NFL is in on it. The Pats are "destined" to have a "perfect" season
Enforcer
Footballguy
Its not necessary to start a new thread with every thought or whim that strikes your fancy. Can you make an effort to post in existing threads instead of always starting a new one? TIA.
encaitar
Footballguy
I'm sorry, but refs are not infallible. They are human just like you. They make mistakes and sometimes those mistakes are HUGE. Sometimes those calls can make the difference between losses and wins. I don't think that was the case tonight, but it does happen and sometimes people have legitimate gripes.
Jack Burton
Footballguy
If you're going to assume that there was no td than those penalties wouldn't have happened because the td was what caused the players to lose it in the first place.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Realistically, if the Pats lose a regular season game does it really matter in terms of their chances of winning another title? They are all but assured of homefield advantage at this point, so in terms of the standings the games won't really matter.
whole-show
Footballguy
Nothing to see here this is all just a ploy to get Tatum Bell motivated
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Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
I think your confused. Most people who watched that Superbowl (outside of Pittsburgh) don't believe there was a conspiracy. They just thought that the refs really blew it, and unfortunately for Seattle most of the calls that the refs blew went Pitts way.
nibbomydaets
Footballguy
Im not a fan of the pats but you couldn't overturn that.
While the ball was moving, he had control of it. He caught it, held it with two hands and then moved the ball to a one handed position, having control of it.
The Raven's shot themselves in the foot when Rex Ryan called that TO. Having Kyle Boller at QB doesn't help.
While the ball was moving, he had control of it. He caught it, held it with two hands and then moved the ball to a one handed position, having control of it.
The Raven's shot themselves in the foot when Rex Ryan called that TO. Having Kyle Boller at QB doesn't help.
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
I was wondering more about the non-calls than the call. Throughout the game the Patriots defense was chucking Boller late. Never too blatant, but after one or two times the ref should have warned them and then started flagging the conduct. Very chippy and cheap play I thought.
Also I had to wonder on the pass to Maroney in the flat that got them back in the game. To me he was clearly sprung by a very egregious block in the back on the safety. This occured right out in front of God and everybody, yet was not called, maybe I just had a bad view of the play.
In the end these things even out, but the end may not come in any one game, or even season, and that delay leaves the currently offended team embittered. That, however, is part of the game and likely always will be. The Pats got another one. In the end anything else is just howling at the moon.
Also I had to wonder on the pass to Maroney in the flat that got them back in the game. To me he was clearly sprung by a very egregious block in the back on the safety. This occured right out in front of God and everybody, yet was not called, maybe I just had a bad view of the play.
In the end these things even out, but the end may not come in any one game, or even season, and that delay leaves the currently offended team embittered. That, however, is part of the game and likely always will be. The Pats got another one. In the end anything else is just howling at the moon.
Jayrod
Footballguy
But it was Jerome Bettis' homecoming!!!!
timschochet
Footballguy
That's not the point. It's one thing for the refs to make a mistake and call them out on it. It's another to accuse them of conspiracy to deliberately want one team to win or lose. That is what is so ridiculous.
Did you watch the Pittsburgh/West Virginia college football game? If you don't think refs try to affect the outcome of a game, pop in the tape of that game. The refs tonight did a slightly better job of giving New England the game.
The Man Who Met Andy Griffith
Footballguy
In general, I don't think the refs have been pro-Patriots this year. I've seen a number of horrid calls go against them.
However, I do think that the situation (undefeated season on the line) may have contributed to the call on the Gaffney play. I don't think he had control and I think the replay confirmed this.
And BTW, I generally root for the Pats although they are not "my" team.
However, I do think that the situation (undefeated season on the line) may have contributed to the call on the Gaffney play. I don't think he had control and I think the replay confirmed this.
And BTW, I generally root for the Pats although they are not "my" team.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
They were reacting to the play. If the refs had reversed the call, they still would've had lost their cool during the original play.
clinton_c
Footballguy
yeah because there has never been a ref that lacked integrity.
To be honest, I truly do not believe that the NFL or NBA could conspire to fix a game or championship.
However I think its a bit naive to think that it does not or cannot happen in professional sports. We just had a an NBA ref arrested for shaving points.
You said it yourself, refs are human...they make mistakes, but they can also hate and discriminate. Would a ref T up Rasheed Wallace quicker and for less than he would John Stockton? Is that not a bias?
Is it very possible that when the head umpire went under the hood to look at the last TD by the Pats he saw a little bit. but not enough to ruin their perfect season. However would that cal had been the same if it was the Jets?
To be honest, I truly do not believe that the NFL or NBA could conspire to fix a game or championship.
However I think its a bit naive to think that it does not or cannot happen in professional sports. We just had a an NBA ref arrested for shaving points.
You said it yourself, refs are human...they make mistakes, but they can also hate and discriminate. Would a ref T up Rasheed Wallace quicker and for less than he would John Stockton? Is that not a bias?
Is it very possible that when the head umpire went under the hood to look at the last TD by the Pats he saw a little bit. but not enough to ruin their perfect season. However would that cal had been the same if it was the Jets?
Green and Gold
Footballguy
I thought that the refs called a poor game in favor of the Colts when the Pats and Colts played. I thought they made some ticky tack calls in the Pats favor in this one, particularly the illegal contact (or holding) on that 4th down play near the end of the game. As a Pats fan, I almost wish they lost this one so they could get on with the season without all the hype.
zoonation
Footballguy
I actually agree with Joe (in the game thread) that losing a game woud be better for their SB run.I think the Steelers do it, too....although your point about their road record is noted.NJY, MIA and NYG won't do it (NYG might if they need the game for the palyoffs, but they do have Eli who wiill find a way to choke when he needs to come up big)
Jack Burton
Footballguy
Jayrod said:Yeah, no way an official....like say an NBA ref....would do anything to effect the outcome of a game.No way, no sir.
Referee's CAN and DO have an impact on the outcome of every game. By the very nature of their job they are integral to the outcome. Why do you think we have booth reviews and coaches challenges? The league wants to prevent a bad call by a ref from determining the outcome.
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PatsWillWin
Footballguy
Cool, we needed another thread on this.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
IMO, part of the problem for the Pats is that even mediocre teams will be playing their best football to try to be the ones to knock them off, so some of these .500 or worse teams are playing like 8-2 teams.
timschochet
Footballguy
Are you actually suggesting that the head umpire considered the Pats undefeated season when he made that call? That the ramifications of taking the TD away passed through his head? You are making a very unwarranted accusation against a professional man's integrity.clinton_c said:
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Didn;t that ref get busted for betting on games he reffed? Sounds like a legit beef there. As for the SB, outside of Pitssburgh fans, a majority of people I know (and polls taken here on FBG) think the refs screwed the pooch on that game. Sometimes the refs blow something badly at a time when it's not recoverable. And those are the ones that are hard to take, like KII's TD that didn't count yesterday. If you have a chance to overcome the ref's mistake, it's not as bad. Like the Pats tonight would've 99.9% likely gotten a TD with 1st and goal from the 2 if the TD had been overturned. All it would've done was give Baltimore less time to try and scrounge up a miracle.timschochet said:
Statcruncher
Footballguy
I didn't see the game (no NFL network) but to those saying a TD was inevitable I have to disagree. I'm guessing that NE probably scores given a 1st and goal with 44 seconds and 1 timeout but earlier in the game the Ravens proved they could make a goalline stand:
1-1-BAL 1 (11:23) 12-T.Brady pass incomplete short right to 84-B.Watson (52-R.Lewis).
2-1-BAL 1 (11:18) 44-H.Evans right tackle to BAL 3 for -2 yards (97-K.Gregg, 57-B.Scott).
Timeout #1 by BAL at 10:37.
3-3-BAL 3 (10:37) (Shotgun) 12-T.Brady pass incomplete short middle to 84-B.Watson.
4-3-BAL 3 (10:28) (Field Goal formation) 3-S.Gostkowski 21 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-66-L.Paxton, Holder-6-C.Hanson.
1-1-BAL 1 (11:23) 12-T.Brady pass incomplete short right to 84-B.Watson (52-R.Lewis).
2-1-BAL 1 (11:18) 44-H.Evans right tackle to BAL 3 for -2 yards (97-K.Gregg, 57-B.Scott).
Timeout #1 by BAL at 10:37.
3-3-BAL 3 (10:37) (Shotgun) 12-T.Brady pass incomplete short middle to 84-B.Watson.
4-3-BAL 3 (10:28) (Field Goal formation) 3-S.Gostkowski 21 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-66-L.Paxton, Holder-6-C.Hanson.
timschochet
Footballguy
Again, I think people are misunderstanding me (including the moderators, becasue my thread was not really about New England.) I have no problem with complaining about the refs. It's the accusations of conspiracy that bother me.
BelichicksRevenge
Footballguy
This thread always makes me laugh.
Look at all the whiny tools!
Look at all the whiny tools!
ChrisHenrysDD
Footballguy
I know, Patriots fans can be annoying. Why doesn't everybody love them?!?!?!?! Haters.This thread always makes me laugh.
bostonfred
Footballguy
For what it's worth, the Eagles and Ravens were both, on paper, supposed to be a lot better than their respective records.
Steel Dillo
Footballguy
I noticed this myself. I thought it was obvious flag.Also, how many times did Moss get away with push offs tonight. There were at least 2.Ditkaless Wonders said:
